Union Tampers With Chairperson Election: STAP CAW 1520

[inyourbestinterest]

The Union at CAW local 1520 in collusion with Whitey mc Donald has vied to install it’s next plant chair against the popular vote of the members of CAW 1520.

 

It all started when two weeks ago the union had a closed door meeting. Mr. Mc Donald told the inplant committee and all the union reps; including the alternate plant chair NOT to run for the plant chair position. Whitey Mc Donald was resigning and would go to the CAW Chrysler National. He wished to have his family friend Scott Smith installed as the new plant chair. Scott is related to Peter Hertline (Retired 1520 Union Rep ) an old boy from the old school union and friend of Mr. Mc Donald. Scott Smith received his job at STAP from his family friends in the union and fast tracked his way into the Production Standards Job having worked less than a year on the line. A qualified person for the job was brushed aside. Scott Smith has never been on any committee’s or trained in any union related courses or educationals or been on a strike line. While working in Production Standards at Ford ; Scott Smith has time and time again referred to the workers as “Lazy and Overpaid”….

 

How could someone like this be a candidate for STAP Plan Chairperson…Easy voter tampering …All the union reps are campaigning for him while they do there rounds as per there instructions . last Thursday STAP went short due to a parts shortage. Scott Smith had FPS union hourly personnel putting up flyers for him on company time as they had to stay behind anyway.

 

Scott was short sighted recently in telling his buddies who came to STAP from Oakville that they would get there sonority reinstated when he gets into office. His buddies had big mouths and word got out to the floor. In the 90’s there was a large lay-off and some STAP employees went to Oakville …they were not suppose to ever return…but they did three years later but without the sonority. All SAP employees were told they would never get to return if they went to Oakville…well…Kenny Mc kay; another Union Rep from CAW 1520 had that changed so his family member could return to SATP…hmm what about the seniority…??? In the 80’s members left STAP for Windsor and returned and also received there seniority as well????....after a lot of trouble over this in the 80’s there were some bylaws put into place at STAP to prevent this and also mention of it in the collective agreement. Scott Smith seems to think he can overturn this with a small print clause that Whitey Mc Donald put into place in the 90’s when the Oakville (Kenny Mc Kay crowd) came back.

 

This brings us to the present…

 

CAW 1520 union reps campaigning for one candidate while there were 6 people on the ballot. This split the voters and 2/3 of the votes went candidates other than Scott Smith.

Scott Smith and Darin Tucker were 1st and 2nd in the popular votes. A run –off election is to happen this Monday sept.17. Scott Smith in co-operation with union benefit reps and union reps printed an unsigned memo stating that “Windsor employees coming to STAP would not keep there seniority”…Okay but what about Scott’s buddies from Oakville the original question on everyone’s minds????...and how can the union print up bogus unsigned document on Union letterhead to have union reps distribute on behalf of a campaign delegate?????

 

Something is very very wrong here!!!!

 

Even the last results are in question with over 8o% voter turn out..geesh..STAP doesn’t even get those numbers when it has a ratification meeting….something stinks and it stinks big!!!!!!

 

It is a sham that the union has interfered with a democratic process when the CAW touts democracy as its base.

 

There were several viable candidates that have suffered from the unions biased involvement in the election process.

 

The top three candidates from a poll of the works were:

 

#1- Kurt Smith 7yrs seniority extensive Union background before SATP

#2- Darin Tucker 7yrsunion rep. 22 yrs senority.extensive union experience.

#3- Brian Proudfoot. 26 yrs seniority alt union rep and several union courses.6yr alt rep.

 

Scott Smith has7 yrs at STAP and has never worked on the line given Production Standards job.On Blue Oval he was listed as being the winner of this election by a landslide..er uhm before STAP even went to the polls???....hmm might want to wait before you make an announcement or stuff the ballots a little better next time????

 

So this is the talk on the shop floor at Ford St. Thomas Assembly. It is disappointing and looks bad for all CAW members. The workers have lost a lot of confidence in its union leaders after seeing all the election antics going on. Why have an election ? How can we trust our leadership? Kurt Smith ; Darin Tucker and Brian Proudfoot could be trusted to uphold our CAW standards..alas we may never know if this continues on to the polls this Monday.

 

Darin Tucker is the best candidate left. Unless we want to be told who to vote for by our union…like they did in the 90’s with the NDP..maybe they could even suggest a religion we should all join???....

 

Vote for Darin Tucker and bring back the democracy!!!

[bodyman]

Where were you last week. Sounds like a last ditch effort to thwart Scott. Scott will do fine, trust our Union, whoever gets in. Spouting in the last hour is a sign of a cowardness. You sound like a bitter man that hasn't gotten his way.

Edited September 16, 2007 by bodyman

[OAC_Sparky]

Scott was short sighted recently in telling his buddies who came to STAP from Oakville that they would get there sonority reinstated when he gets into office. His buddies had big mouths and word got out to the floor. In the 90’s there was a large lay-off and some STAP employees went to Oakville …they were not suppose to ever return…but they did three years later but without the sonority. All SAP employees were told they would never get to return if they went to Oakville…well…Kenny Mc kay; another Union Rep from CAW 1520 had that changed so his family member could return to SATP…hmm what about the seniority…??? In the 80’s members left STAP for Windsor and returned and also received there seniority as well????....after a lot of trouble over this in the 80’s there were some bylaws put into place at STAP to prevent this and also mention of it in the collective agreement. Scott Smith seems to think he can overturn this with a small print clause that Whitey Mc Donald put into place in the 90’s when the Oakville (Kenny Mc Kay crowd) came back.

While I can't comment about all the other points, those people that came from STAP and Windsor to Oakville in the early '90s (because both locations had layoffs), were allowed to go backin '93 because OTP was going to one shift. Because even though OAC was retooling for the Windstar, the layoff was still considered an "indefinite layoff". I know, I was there, I was from Windsor and opted NOT to go back. One of my best friends DID go back and regained his Windsor seniority, because it was his "base location".

 

So your source of "people not being allowed to return" is erroneous. An indefinite layoff in Oakville allowed people to return to their base location. Your assertion that people were "allowed to go back because of nepotistic favour" is also unfounded. There are people in Oakville from Windsor that are related to Union officials in Windsor who elected not to return as well.

 

So, if you are going to make allegations about Union corruption, at least get your facts from a valid source, because it tarnishes the credibility of the rest of your claims.

[GuyfromSTAP]

While I can't comment about all the other points, those people that came from STAP and Windsor to Oakville in the early '90s (because both locations had layoffs), were allowed to go backin '93 because OTP was going to one shift. Because even though OAC was retooling for the Windstar, the layoff was still considered an "indefinite layoff". I know, I was there, I was from Windsor and opted NOT to go back. One of my best friends DID go back and regained his Windsor seniority, because it was his "base location".

 

So your source of "people not being allowed to return" is erroneous. An indefinite layoff in Oakville allowed people to return to their base location. Your assertion that people were "allowed to go back because of nepotistic favour" is also unfounded. There are people in Oakville from Windsor that are related to Union officials in Windsor who elected not to return as well.

 

So, if you are going to make allegations about Union corruption, at least get your facts from a valid source, because it tarnishes the credibility of the rest of your claims.

 

Exactly Spark...this bonehead doesn't know what he's talking about.All this bs is coming from Tucker's supporters trying to influence the younger person's vote.They tried telling people last week that the soon to come Windsor employees would keep senority and jump our junior members at STAP if Smith was elected.It shows what they are trying to do and also shows their smarts as this transfer from plants is spelled out in our contract.I'll be glad when Monday is over and these goof's moment is over.Heck this poster joined today...that doesn't look like a last ditch effort to spread the bullshit does it.They are a bunch of smarty pants in Tucker's camp.

[OAC_Sparky]

Exactly Spark...this bonehead doesn't know what he's talking about.All this bs is coming from Tucker's supporters trying to influence the younger person's vote.They tried telling people last week that the soon to come Windsor employees would keep senority and jump our junior members at STAP if Smith was elected.It shows what they are trying to do and also shows their smarts as this transfer from plants is spelled out in our contract.I'll be glad when Monday is over and these goof's moment is over.Heck this poster joined today...that doesn't look like a last ditch effort to spread the bullshit does it.They are a bunch of smarty pants in Tucker's camp.

To be completely honest I have not checked the current language to confirm that it is the same from when I was a preferential hire; however, when I hired in at Oakville I kept my Company seniority ONLY so far as pension, callback and vacations were concerned. I was issued a new in-plant seniority date (specifially, "date of entry") that pertains to bidding and bumping rights, as well as layoffs. The ONLY circumstance that I heard of that specifically contradicted this is in the case of Niagara Glass (RIP) employees whose plant closure was announced far enough in advance; in this case their date of entry was locked in on (or around) the announcement date so that new hires AFTER THE PLANT CLOSURE ANNOUNCEMENT were junior to those Niagara employees.

[Half Full]

You have to laugh at what some candidates, or their spouse, will post when they realize they have no chance of getting elected. The crap posted as a twisted history of our local is evidence again of the type of slanderous campain run by Darren, run on your own credentials, not what you perceive as other candidate's weaknesses. Now you go so far as to accuse an election committee, elected by the membership, of "fixing" an election. "Union reps campaigning for a candidate", how absurd, of course they are campaigning for Scott, these people have worked closely with both of these candidates for several years, you do the math.

 

Peter Hertlein, Whitey MacDonald, old buddies? That has got to be one of the funniest, but then again you probably figure water and oil mix as well.

 

If an individual is told not to run, and they don't, based on another person's say so, is not the type of plant chairperson I want to represent our local. This letter from the leadership informing the members of the scheduled arrival our laidoff brothers and sisters from Windsor has nothing to do with either candidate, and was distributed for the benefit of those members involved, but what the heck, it's possible to put a slant on everything. Union educationals are a method for those of us to learn, that are not in a position to gain experience first hand. Educationals do not override common sense and the ability to learn from real life experiences, as Scott has.

 

"The workers have lost a lot of confidence in its union leaders after seeing all the election antics going on" This must be why the voter turnout has been one of the best for some time, we know who is spouting "antics" and that is why we are turning out and voting for Scott Smith. This is one of the most important elections in our History, how we vote will determine the direction of local for some time to come.

[fastime]

Does anybody know if Scott Smith goes back to the line if he isn't voted in?

[GuyfromSTAP]

Does anybody know if Scott Smith goes back to the line if he isn't voted in?

 

Yes he does...people have already put their names in for his job.Tucker would also go back to the line if he loses.

[Half Full]

Does anybody know if Scott Smith goes back to the line if he isn't voted in?

 

 

He will return to the line. Each candidate must resign from any elected or appointed position they hold to be eligible to place their name forward for nomination.

[DSenstad]

You have to laugh at what some candidates, or their spouse, will post when they realize they have no chance of getting elected. The crap posted as a twisted history of our local is evidence again of the type of slanderous campain run by Darren, run on your own credentials, not what you perceive as other candidate's weaknesses. Now you go so far as to accuse an election committee, elected by the membership, of "fixing" an election. "Union reps campaigning for a candidate", how absurd, of course they are campaigning for Scott, these people have worked closely with both of these candidates for several years, you do the math.

 

Peter Hertlein, Whitey MacDonald, old buddies? That has got to be one of the funniest, but then again you probably figure water and oil mix as well.

 

If an individual is told not to run, and they don't, based on another person's say so, is not the type of plant chairperson I want to represent our local. This letter from the leadership informing the members of the scheduled arrival our laidoff brothers and sisters from Windsor has nothing to do with either candidate, and was distributed for the benefit of those members involved, but what the heck, it's possible to put a slant on everything. Union educationals are a method for those of us to learn, that are not in a position to gain experience first hand. Educationals do not override common sense and the ability to learn from real life experiences, as Scott has.

 

"The workers have lost a lot of confidence in its union leaders after seeing all the election antics going on" This must be why the voter turnout has been one of the best for some time, we know who is spouting "antics" and that is why we are turning out and voting for Scott Smith. This is one of the most important elections in our History, how we vote will determine the direction of local for some time to come.

After 20 years watching local elections I can see this one is the one where the candidate or spouse is involved, it is a wonderful piece of spin doctoring.

 

Not being involved in this race it is simply interesting reading. I will say that people can be present at the polling for a candidate. If people are really concerned have someone present with a clicker and they can count every time someone drops a ballot into the ballot box. If the bow is stuffed the count will be way off, if it isn't then you can assume the count is fair. Also by having people watching, I would suggest one inside the voting place to verify how many votes their are, one outside to verify no arm twisting immediately prior to entering the polling place, and one at the work exit again to verify no strong arming. After which both parties should be comfortable that the vote is accurate whether you like the results or not.

[Tied to the line]

After 20 years watching local elections I can see this one is the one where the candidate or spouse is involved, it is a wonderful piece of spin doctoring.

 

Not being involved in this race it is simply interesting reading. I will say that people can be present at the polling for a candidate. If people are really concerned have someone present with a clicker and they can count every time someone drops a ballot into the ballot box. If the bow is stuffed the count will be way off, if it isn't then you can assume the count is fair. Also by having people watching, I would suggest one inside the voting place to verify how many votes their are, one outside to verify no arm twisting immediately prior to entering the polling place, and one at the work exit again to verify no strong arming. After which both parties should be comfortable that the vote is accurate whether you like the results or not.

 

On voting day prior to recieving a ballot, the voter must appear on the Alpha list that the election committee receives from the company. Their name is then marked as having received a ballot ensuring that the number of ballots cast is recorded. The election committee counts the number of ballots cast to the number recorded as per the Alpha list. Each candidate may have their scrutineer check the numbers and the Alpha list. The election committee is elected from the membership, therefore that being said, they have put their trust into these people, in my opinion there is absolutely noway these CAW 1520 members would ever do anything distrusting in this or any election. People making these accusations should be ashamed of themselves accusing these hard working people of such a thing.

[ute]

I can confirm that a meeting was held by Whitey and that Barny and Tucker were asked not to run

 

as to the rest ...i cannot say

 

why Whitey would not let "due proses" take place shows that Scott could not win the election on his own merit

 

again i say think before you vote

[Half Full]

I can confirm that a meeting was held by Whitey and that Barny and Tucker were asked not to run

 

as to the rest ...i cannot say

 

why Whitey would not let "due proses" take place shows that Scott could not win the election on his own merit

 

again i say think before you vote

 

What a crock of crap that is, Whitey wouldn't waste his time trying to convince either one of these individuals. Their past performance is proof of their inability to make a reasoned judgement on any challenging issue, based on the number of years of involvement with the local, neither of these two stand out as leadership quality. You must be listening to those that try to impress others with their images of granduer; "Whitey tried to talk me out of it, but I spit in his eye, the local needs me!" I laughed so hard I never figured my pants would dry. Try something else, as I said before; lets see what crap sticks to the wall.

[ute]

Well i can say you my friend are dead wrong ...remember i have no vested interest in this election as i am a retiree

 

but i am in contact with union reps that are my friends and when 2 of the 3 i know confirm this meeting i take it as the truth

 

i just want the young ones left at our plant to make an informed decision

 

 

i only found out about this Friday ... if i had know earlier i would have posted it myself ....so if you want to jump off the cliff with the other lemmings ....go ahead

 

i hope some will be informed

 

again i cannot say anything for or against Tucker as i have had no dealings with him ....but as for Scott .......he has no experience line or union ( and don't tell me he controlled the bid proses when we left ..any swinging dick could do that )

 

be a informed voter

[GuyfromSTAP]

[quote

 

be a informed voter

Ute read these posts...you don't know what you are talking about here.This garbage has been spewed all last week on the floor.We are making an informed vote.Tucker has shown himself to be dishonest by his camp(his wife)saying this nonsense.With all due respect you are out of touch on what an informed opinion is on this topic.Myself I did vote for Scott...came close to voting for Tucker but decided I've trusted Whitey this long I don't believe he'd do something that he didn't believe was the best for STAP.After this past week I definately voted for the right guy.Smith hasn't said much but he needs not to when his competition is shooting himself in the foot.

[Half Full]

Well i can say you my friend are dead wrong ...remember i have no vested interest in this election as i am a retiree

 

but i am in contact with union reps that are my friends and when 2 of the 3 i know confirm this meeting i take it as the truth

 

i just want the young ones left at our plant to make an informed decision

i only found out about this Friday ... if i had know earlier i would have posted it myself ....so if you want to jump off the cliff with the other lemmings ....go ahead

 

i hope some will be informed

 

again i cannot say anything for or against Tucker as i have had no dealings with him ....but as for Scott .......he has no experience line or union ( and don't tell me he controlled the bid proses when we left ..any swinging dick could do that )

 

be a informed voter

 

You missed my point, there may have been a meeting, a one on one with each of these two at separate times with Whitey, no union reps., it is part of the process of any candidate to ask for support in their election bid from those in positions within the leadership. They were more than likely told, by Whitey, who he was supportting, so to save face with others, they claim to have been asked to back off. This senario makes alot more sence than "union reps. told me so" :shades:

 

As for lemmings, I can use logic to sort through the crap, not rely on two or three union reps. to supposedly lead me around blindly.

[ute]

True i am out of the daily loop ... as for Laurie doing whatever ...well i did work with her and would not be surprised

 

the thing I'm pi**ed about is how the union "pushed " a untested/untried person for the chair spot

 

am i biased because when i went to go for the time study position i was told "don't bother we have someone else for that position"...(ie. scott).....NO....(but this is the same situation where due proses is not followed)

 

the guy i wanted to see win is out Barney......so its a moot point

 

i just want the membership informed as to what is going on the 3 committeemen i talked to i trust and have know for a long time

 

they would not exaggerate about the meeting

[GuyfromSTAP]

I think the thing that hurt Barney was having 27 years senority.The young people just didn't know him well enough to trust he'd go to bat for their worries(IMO).For me...he told me he was planning to work for another 7,8 years atleast and personally I don't think anyone that has 30 years in should hold a union position.If I thought this position was truly important to our immediate future I would have voted for Barney but if our future isn't in stone yet it'll be the national that has the pull in contract negotiations and not a newly elected chair.Once again just MHO,I don't pretend to know anything about the future of our plant.The young people have alot of pull now since we went back to one shift.Just a guess but I'd think there's probably 500-600 people with 8,9 years or less so seeing Scott get 450 votes isn't very surprising to me.I think the older guys split their votes between Barney,Tucker and Scott with those that voted for Scott moreso showing support of Whitey then Scott per se.

[ute]

great reply

 

i agree with all that you said

 

to the next chair ..good luck in the next 2 years

[xstapr]

As for the positions left vacant by Tucker and Smith. Have they already been filled (unofficially of course)?

Is the application process a charade or legit?

[Aces]

As for the positions left vacant by Tucker and Smith. Have they already been filled (unofficially of course)?

Is the application process a charade or legit?

 

From your previous posts we all thought you knew everything.

[ute]

My advice apply for the post's ...you will find out as i did

[Tied to the line]

As for the positions left vacant by Tucker and Smith. Have they already been filled (unofficially of course)?

Is the application process a charade or legit?

 

The process was a charade. Benefit rep; two applications, one with four years experience as alternate benefit rep. overlooked for the second time (lost out to Tucker last April). Leadership made selection today in short meeting before membership meeting, and rubber stamped Dennis's selected person with eight months as alternate benefit rep. try and make any sense of that selection.

 

The same goes for alternate benefit rep. several qualified and involved members whom have worked hard for the local, over looked, selection made... Shane McPherson's girl friend, minimal involvement, appeared out of nowhere, have them justify that selection.

 

Chris Huber, time study, well versed, long time alternate, hard to screw that one up, they must have run out of girl friends.

 

alternate time study, Morningstar was the brothers last name, fairly unknown.

 

Only my opinion, what have others to say?

[youngSTAP]

I thought Ron Cooke was the alternate time study rep. or did he get fired?

 

yS

 

The process was a charade. Benefit rep; two applications, one with four years experience as alternate benefit rep. overlooked for the second time (lost out to Tucker last April). Leadership made selection today in short meeting before membership meeting, and rubber stamped Dennis's selected person with eight months as alternate benefit rep. try and make any sense of that selection.

 

The same goes for alternate benefit rep. several qualified and involved members whom have worked hard for the local, over looked, selection made... Shane McPherson's girl friend, minimal involvement, appeared out of nowhere, have them justify that selection.

 

Chris Huber, time study, well versed, long time alternate, hard to screw that one up, they must have run out of girl friends.

 

alternate time study, Morningstar was the brothers last name, fairly unknown.

 

Only my opinion, what have others to say?

[stap1520]

Scott Smith won the run off and is our new plant chairman.

good luck to him ...hes going to need it in 08 bargaining...as we all are