fastime Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Even if they vote in favour of the contract FORD can still move production to some other country. I don't know weather to transfer or buy my own garage and start fresh .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guilt trip Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Well I guess the CAW members have no balls unlike the UAW. Bring the UAW back their members have BIG ONES!!!! Two totally different contracts. Can't compare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edsel Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Canadian Auto Workers OK concessions by 83 pct Ford to post quarterly results on Monday SURPRISE! Tommy would be ashamed to be associated with such naivety. Ed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gocash Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Two totally different contracts. Can't compare. Its because of the UAW giving concessions in March,is what forced the CAW back to the table.Quit kidding yourself about who has the balls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ute Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 WTF STAP ?????? why the hell did you guys vote for this ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuyfromSTAP Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 No idea Ute...obviously 4 out of 5 people I work with are idiots.Sadly their boneheadness took down the other 20% of us.Why we settle for less then what GM gave to Windsor is assinine.I guess they didn't want Ford spending that billion they announced today.Sadly the 80% were born without spines,good little CAW sheep to the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roggie13 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 No idea Ute...obviously 4 out of 5 people I work with are idiots.Sadly their boneheadness took down the other 20% of us.Why we settle for less then what GM gave to Windsor is assinine.I guess they didn't want Ford spending that billion they announced today.Sadly the 80% were born without spines,good little CAW sheep to the end. It's funny... I voted No and others I worked with said they were voting no. Ken came off as a real dick saying we had better take it or else guess he scared everyone into saying yes...pretty sad. I would have taken the contract we already had in place or at least demanded what GM got we got screwed royally, no poggy,no sub if we take the buyout just a hell of alot of tax, oops screwed again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cocheese Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 WTF STAP ?????? why the hell did you guys vote for this ? Because the CAW divided and conquered it's members. It pitted anyone with enough time in to retire Vs those who didn't. Of those who wouldn't be able to retire, they scared them into thinking $100,000 was as good as it was going to get before they realized GM and Chrysler guys did in fact get it better. Had the members been given more time to go over the proposal and talk amongst themselves after their emotions had settled, they would have voted differently. I talked with someone high up in Ford HQ Canada, and he basically said STAP got the raw end of the deal. The CAW sold someone at Ford on OAC, and neither the CAW or the guy who made that decision were willing to admit their mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roggie13 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Because the CAW divided and conquered it's members. It pitted anyone with enough time in to retire Vs those who didn't. Of those who wouldn't be able to retire, they scared them into thinking $100,000 was as good as it was going to get before they realized GM and Chrysler guys did in fact get it better. Had the members been given more time to go over the proposal and talk amongst themselves after their emotions had settled, they would have voted differently. I talked with someone high up in Ford HQ Canada, and he basically said STAP got the raw end of the deal. The CAW sold someone at Ford on OAC, and neither the CAW or the guy who made that decision were willing to admit their mistake. Yeh our union fucked us over royally 3:)) on Thursday info meeting maybe a vote 10am on Friday info meeting maybe a vote 2pm Friday a vote our union didn't have the balls to even inform us what was being offered in the contract until we were already at the meeting, no time to think it over that is why guys with 18 to 25 years got fucked they got the same as guys with 8 years. If that's how a union looks out for their members they can kiss my ass, Ken sold us out months before and he knows it so he can go straight to hell for all I care.......And Edsel if you don't like what I am saying you can FUCK-OFF too!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xstapr Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 The plant was united "No Product No Concession Vote No" right up until saturdays vote. Fuckin chicken shits. New slogin "No product, No Job, No Balls" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ute Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Well all i can think to say is ...to all that did get the full retirement package ...( alot of you had the chance to retire when i did ) i hope you didn't vote yes just to line your own pockets you screwed your own friends ( alot of you had the chance to retire when i did ) to those 500 or so that are in the screwed bunch ...why why why ...you got nothing my advice to you guys look for and get a job now ...because when they close the plant there will be slim pickings for any job in the London /St Thomas area at least 700 other peeps will be doing the same thing hey can you imagine if they had 500 peeps quit before the 2 years is up .....HIRING at STAP .....lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roggie13 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 The plant was united "No Product No Concession Vote No" right up until saturdays vote. Fuckin chicken shits. New slogin "No product, No Job, No Balls" I agree with you totally xstapr, what the fuck! Even Scott Smith said no product,no concessions,vote no, either they padded the yes votes or Ken really laid it on thick! Everyone in the meeting looked totally pissed I still can't believe the vote was so one sided. I bet when I return to work next week everyone will say they voted no. Strange how Ken said it would pass with flying colors and it did! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guilt trip Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 (edited) I talked with someone high up in Ford HQ Canada, and he basically said STAP got the raw end of the deal. The CAW sold someone at Ford on OAC, and neither the CAW or the guy who made that decision were willing to admit their mistake.That's the biggest bunch of bullshit yet. There was absolutely nothing that could be done to save STAP...ask your sellout reps.....they were told to their face there's nothing you can do, it's in the books. I have people in places to. Know what tho, think what you want. Edited November 3, 2009 by guilt trip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trufflebuns Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 That's the biggest bunch of bullshit yet. There was absolutely nothing that could be done to save STAP...ask your sellout reps.....they were told to their face there's nothing you can do, it's in the books. I have people in places to. Know what tho, think what you want. I have people also and they said what your people told you was correct. You, collectively, are bigger than the lying reps and company boys. We/you are the union. One vote, One voice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cocheese Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 hey can you imagine if they had 500 peeps quit before the 2 years is up .....HIRING at STAP .....lol It's already been discussed and agreed upon. Temporary workers will be brought in from a hiring agencies if the need arises That's the biggest bunch of bullshit yet. There was absolutely nothing that could be done to save STAP...ask your sellout reps.....they were told to their face there's nothing you can do, it's in the books. I have people in places to. Know what tho, think what you want. Considering some of the things I've seen you write, you clearly don't have "people in place". The CAW sold someone at Ford (not last week, or last month, but years ago when the decision was made to invest) on OAC, and that person wasn't willing to admit they made a mistake in deciding where the invest went. And because of that, OAC was in a better position then STAP was. And at the end of the day, from a financial stand point, Ford had to stick with the decision to stay in Oakville and lose St Thomas I know it's hard for you Oakville lads to realize how inferior you are, but it is a reality. Had the CAW sold Ford on investing at STAP, or had this person admitted his mistake and agreed to spend the money to move equipment down the 401, it wouldn't have been 1520 members out of a job right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noimports Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 And all them DICKS on the stage get to keep their jobs when the rest of us are screwed. And by the way I voted NO.I want to donate my union dues to a charity, like myself because the union is USELESS!!!!!!! :slap: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastime Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 The plant was united "No Product No Concession Vote No" right up until saturdays vote. Fuckin chicken shits. New slogin "No product, No Job, No Balls" On a more serious note , I seriously think the CAW fixes the numbers , same reason Darren Tucker didn't win the chair ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shamrock157 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 I agree with you totally xstapr, what the fuck! Even Scott Smith said no product,no concessions,vote no, either they padded the yes votes or Ken really laid it on thick! Everyone in the meeting looked totally pissed I still can't believe the vote was so one sided. I bet when I return to work next week everyone will say they voted no. Strange how Ken said it would pass with flying colors and it did! It was basically a scare tactic , people were voting before the question period was even started . The entire membership was still in a semi state of shock from the news and not one person at the vote was able to make an educated decision , myself included . The CAW absolutely needs to allow time for the membership to review the tentative offer like the UAW . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cocheese Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 On a more serious note , I seriously think the CAW fixes the numbers , same reason Darren Tucker didn't win the chair ..... Meh. I really don't think Tucker had that much support. I even think some of his friends who said they voted for him probably didn't (I like the guy, just don't think he would have been a good choice for that position). I believe Kurt Smith had some votes not counted for him, just to make sure he didn't get into the run off with Scott. But if you want proof the CAW does indeed fix numbers, ask the guys from Body who voted yes to 11 hours. Yet according to them, it was "overwhelmingly in favour". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stap1520 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Meh. I really don't think Tucker had that much support. I even think some of his friends who said they voted for him probably didn't (I like the guy, just don't think he would have been a good choice for that position). I believe Kurt Smith had some votes not counted for him, just to make sure he didn't get into the run off with Scott. But if you want proof the CAW does indeed fix numbers, ask the guys from Body who voted yes to 11 hours. Yet according to them, it was "overwhelmingly in favour". I voted NO alot of guys who said no but voted yes but i sat there and thought what is there in this contract for me after my seniority ends in 2011 ? nothing compared to the gm deal so i voted no hoping for better closure agreement i accept that stap is closing writing on the wall for a long time but they should have got us 25 years with a pension and some cash to get young guys/women jobs in oac and windsor now all the high seniority people will try to go to those plants and its going to be ugly i bet on the worst jobs on the line.... i hope ford is ready for more comp cases lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BT Posted November 3, 2009 Author Share Posted November 3, 2009 The plant was united "No Product No Concession Vote No" right up until saturdays vote. Fuckin chicken shits. New slogin "No product, No Job, No Balls" AGREED!!!!! "No product, No Job, No Balls" YOU FUCK'N IDIOTS!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastime Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 AGREED!!!!! "No product, No Job, No Balls" YOU FUCK'N IDIOTS!!! Don't be so sure ... I have this sneaky suspicion the union had this fixed ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BT Posted November 3, 2009 Author Share Posted November 3, 2009 (edited) It was basically a scare tactic , people were voting before the question period was even started . The entire membership was still in a semi state of shock from the news and not one person at the vote was able to make an educated decision , myself included . The CAW absolutely needs to allow time for the membership to review the tentative offer like the UAW . You wheren't give time to make an informed decision because if you had time figure it all the ramifications you would have told them to got fuck themself. NOONE hired since Ford moved the C.V. to STAP and started production in April 1983 will be eligable to retire unless you they are 50 years old. Back then Ford could discriminatate against almost anyone and age discrimination wasn't consided a crime but it is today. I'm not sure that the launguage in the contract can't be challenged. Some might need a lawyer? Edited November 3, 2009 by BT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grump Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Correct me if I am wrong but our provincial guberment was going to pay the cost of conversion to another model and Ford said; No thanks. Let's face it we at STAP are out of a job in 2011, weather this contract passed or not. Now what would be the buyout in September of 2011 when our previous contract expired? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaah Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 I have been a big proponent of a no vote based on "No Product? No Concessions! Vote No." all along. I voted Yes. You can ridicule me if you like maybe I deserve it but for me it came down to one issue, with STAP closing is the closure language better as is or is it better in the proposal. I agree it was a low move by the CAW to rush this through and it was asked by many to delay the vote but that did not happen and so a choice had to be made. Based on the information I had it was obvious the closure language was better, not great, not even good but just better. I stood with ballot in hand for a long time pondering the ramifications of YES or NO, it was agonizing and in the end I just had to put my faith in the bargaining committee and leadership as I had no other resouce available to me nor the time to find any. Did I make a mistake , maybe. Did I make an informed decision, not really. Am I happy about it, definitely not. To be told there was an agreement Friday at 2:00pm and be handed the highlights Sat at 10:00am and forced decide my future after a short meeting is probably lowest thing I have seen the CAW do in all my years here. Hopefully there will be better times ahead for everyone but it won't be at STAP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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