Charlotte International Auto Show

[Watchdevil]

I went to the International Auto Show today in Charllotte, NC. I can see why Ford might kill Mercury. They don't want people to know that the Milan is every bit as stylish and tasteful as an MKZ for a lot less money. I really liked the interior of the Milan. There is a quality to the dash and interior that is close to the new VW's. I checked out the Fusion, Milan & MKZ. The interior of the Fusion seemed intentionally boring although the quality was good. The Milan had a nice mix of color and trim. The interior of the MKZ suffers from that dual pod squared-off dash (which looks like it was styled for a Fairmont) that sits too high at the top where the Fusion/Milan dash is lower and more comfortable to look over. Generally I like the dual pod Lincoln dash theme but its too upright and blocky in the MKZ and I prefered the one in the MKX. Also the center stack was uncomfortably too close to the shifter. What really disappointed me was all the bright trim inside the MKZ looked exactly what it was... Cheap metallic spray paint. Not only that it looked like dull base color coat paint that someone forgot to spray a clear over. It lent a chintzy quality in a class of cars that should be using real bright metal/aluminum trim, wood or piano black. I actually found the bright trim accents in the Milan more tasteful. The MKZ looked really good in black and is my choice of the trio. I also found myself wanting the Milan interior in the MKZ. I really love the MKZ front and rear styling. The Trio has a really BIG trunk space and I was comfortable in the roomy rear seat area. Makes me wonder why there is a Ford Five Hundred other than offering the extra large interior and trunk room.

 

My only wish.. That the Fusion/Milan/Zephyr trio was offered as a personal coupe because I was REALLY drawn to those models at the show but a coupe is what I wanted. A Thunderbird is what I wanted. I am almost willing to accept a Thunderbird as a sleek specially styled AWD Coupe version based on the Fusion/Milan/MKZ trio. I'll hold out for V8 and RWD. Don't tell me no one wants coupes. People were flocking to examine import coupes in the luxury makes. Make an outstanding and exciting statement in Thunderbird style as a four seat coupe form and people will flock to it.

 

 

The Lincoln-Mercury displays were getting a lot of attention. People seem more interested in their cars than the Fords they are based on. The new Mariner looks good in person. The Edge and MKX were what I expected, but the interiors of most of the FoMoCo vehicles suffer from flimsy plasticky quality. The Lincoln The Edge grille really annoyed me. But the 3-bars looked much more sophisticated and technical in brushed nickel on the Bronco concept. I did however love the MKX grille.

 

There were a lot of people looking at Mustangs but not many of the other passenger cars. As much as I love the Mustang I am dismayed at the hard plasticky quality of the dash and door panels. Also, I am convinced the steering wheel is too big and the rim too thin. I wish the interior was as good as a GTI (BTW my favorite steering wheel is the VW GTI, perfect size, shape and feel.) The bulky mass of the dashboard of the Mustang is overwhelming in front of you when you sit in it and the top too high. I am sick of the bright silver dash accents as an option that looks like it was sprayed from a cheap can of paint. The Mustang deserves a real brushed metal finish and trim accents. The dash and console needs restyling as to me it looks like they took an old 80-82 Tbird dash and gave it gauge faces and a dash pad that mimicks the 1967 Mustang. However I was delighted that they used a chocolate brown (not black) with beige to coordinate the interior on a GT/CS convertible. After seeing the Mustangs at the show I was underwhelmed and not as enthusiastic about them as I initially have been since it was introduced.

 

The new Super duty is even more hideous in person.

 

Two Ford concept vehicles were at the show. The Bronco and Silver Cobra something or another exotic two seat supercar. They were knock outs. People were basically making comments that Ford is good at building dreams but not actual vehicles that exciting to buy. There was the pitiful Focus with the factory ricer body kit on display, a boring Five Hundred, a Fusion but curiously no Crown Vic. Guess they figured no one would want to look at one.

 

I had been checking out a lot of cars today and there are a lot of import cars that I took note that have interior quality, trim and ergonomics mastered. Most notably VW consistantly in all it's vehicles except the Beetle. This important point is still something that Ford, GM and Chrysler has not mastered yet. They still create the illusion of interior quality and looks but not actual quality.

 

I was blown away how good the Saturn Aura is... Interior trim, colors and quality. I liked the saddle trimmed interior very much. I lit up with excitement over the Solstice and Sky which in every aspect are design knockouts and noticed that they are very good quality inside and out.

 

The winner for me for the best exterior color of the show is Orange Sunburst Metallic as displayed on a few GM vehicles such as the HHR and Avalanche. Unfortunately, the interior of the HHR was as cheap and plasticky as a Cobalt and that was a turn-off. The poor Monte Carlo was ignored even in SS trim black with silver stripes. It's such a NASCAR cliche' that they should have left it out the show. Pitiful too was the current Malibu generating no attention.

 

I examined a Toyota Tacoma and realized why one of many reasons Ford Rangers don't sell and the extent they are neglected. It was a $15,000 truck and the quality was outstanding for a vehicle this price. For a base truck with no power windows the dash was stylish and the quality supurb. I rolled the windows up and down by hand crank and it was such tight, smooth and effortless operation. The doors closed with a quality and sound I could not believe.

 

Volkswagen.... I cannot say enough good about all of its newly redesigned models. Great looks, great interiors and great quality.

 

Dodge - The Challenger Concept was there and it was stunning. Much more interesting and detailed than the Mustang. I examined a Dodge Charger as well. Love/Hate with that car but that is the type car Ford should be building instead of the Passat/Volvo...

 

How many more Jeeps models do they need?

 

I was bored to death with most of the asian and european offerings. Sure most of them are all good, just uninteresting for me. I am a domestic car guy at heart, but I can't help but love the VW GTI. Lots of ultra-expensive import luxury cars on display but I just can't buy into the image of wealthy pretension and I would not even if I won the lottery. I have to stay true to my roots and have a car that I love.

 

However, I wonder if I will find the perfect Ford or find something I like elsewhere...

Edited November 19, 2006 by Watchdevil

[waymondospiff]

What really disappointed me was all the bright trim inside the MKZ looked exactly what it was... Cheap metallic spray paint. Not only that it looked like dull base color coat paint that someone forgot to spray a clear over. It lent a chintzy quality in a class of cars that should be using real bright metal/aluminum trim, wood or piano black. I actually found the bright trim accents in the Milan more tasteful.

Apparently, to get the genuine wood trim into the MKZ's cabin they designers had to agree to less pricey trim elsewhere. Count me among those unimpressed by that slab of silver-painted trim on the dash of the MKZ.

My only wish.. That the Fusion/Milan/Zephyr trio was offered as a personal coupe because I was REALLY drawn to those models at the show but a coupe is what I wanted. A Thunderbird is what I wanted. I am almost willing to accept a Thunderbird as a sleek specially styled AWD Coupe version based on the Fusion/Milan/MKZ trio. I'll hold out for V8 and RWD. Don't tell me no one wants coupes. People were flocking to examine import coupes in the luxury makes. Make an outstanding and exciting statement in Thunderbird style as a four seat coupe form and people will flock to it.

But then how many people actually buy those cars? Any new Thunderbird would be like the Monte Carlo, unloved and unsold. If you really want V8 & RWD, go for the Mustang...it's the same size as the old Thunderbirds. Cheap interior, but cheaper sticker price too.

I had been checking out a lot of cars today and there are a lot of import cars that I took note that have interior quality, trim and ergonomics mastered. Most notably VW consistantly in all it's vehicles except the Beetle. This important point is still something that Ford, GM and Chrysler has not mastered yet. They still create the illusion of interior quality and looks but not actual quality.

Well, if I paid $30,000 for a Cobalt I'd want a nicer interior too. I know VW fans can be a rabid bunch, but I just don't see how anyone justifies paying so much extra for a VW. Lots of money, but not a lot in return.

 

The poor Monte Carlo was ignored even in SS trim black with silver stripes. It's such a NASCAR cliche' that they should have left it out the show.

If it doesn't get any attention in Charlotte...

Dodge - The Challenger Concept was there and it was stunning. Much more interesting and detailed than the Mustang. I examined a Dodge Charger as well. Love/Hate with that car but that is the type car Ford should be building instead of the Passat/Volvo...

Well, when the Challenger arrives with V8-only power and pricing in the mid- to upper-$30Ks...I'll still take the good ol' Mustang with a V8 for $26K. And the Charger? That's been such a slow seller for Chrysler, I'd (again) stick with the D3s. Give the D3s a nicer exterior, nicer interior, and nicer motor and they'll be much more attractive.

 

Thanks for sharing your experience at the auto show. I go to NAIAS every year but I still like to go to the "regional" auto shows (Although why "my" auto show is held over Thanksgiving when I'm not here, I'll never know...) because it is so much easier to get around - less people, less shoving, no waiting for cars...

 

I'd be interested in your impression - how were people responding to the Edge & MKX? Were their a lot of people around it, sitting in it, talking about it? Hopefully for Ford it's getting a buzz.

 

Scott

[Watchdevil]

I see all of your good points too.. thats what pro and con discussion is all about...

 

Apparently, to get the genuine wood trim into the MKZ's cabin they designers had to agree to less pricey trim elsewhere. Count me among those unimpressed by that slab of silver-painted trim on the dash of the MKZ.

I am tired of Ford's Bean Counter Excuses. The Lincoln was not worth a few extra dollars to even offer real metal a convincing bright trim? Even test tube wood looks better than silver paint. I'd rather see molded-in black than silver paint. The glossy carbon fiber look on the Milan center stack is far more tatesful than dull silver paint. It's really horrible that even the sound system is painted that too. I'd rather see black with chrome accent or knobs. Lincoln is getting quite a premium for the Fusion/Milan and not much of it shows other than alternate styling and maybe a few luxury and sound insulation extras. Oh yeah and people would PAY for a real metal and wood trim combination over something base so Ford wouldn't loose money. They make interior upgrades and trim optional on the Mustang, why not the MKZ.

 

But then how many people actually buy those cars? Any new Thunderbird would be like the Monte Carlo, unloved and unsold. If you really want V8 & RWD, go for the Mustang...it's the same size as the old Thunderbirds. Cheap interior, but cheaper sticker price too.

 

It's hard to tell because large stylish new roomy coupes have been neglected or abandoned so long. No choices, nothing fresh so who would possibly be interested. But people did buy the new Mustang. I would like a new Thunderbird that is larger with rear seat room. Or I would take a Thunderbird based on a Mustang convertible with all different styling in a luxury oriented definition and no back seat. Luxury makes still make BMW, Audi and Mercedes coupes as well as Infiniti. Why not have a luxury sport coupe that gives you the same zest for less money. The Thunderbird is special with its legendary mystique and style in a way all its own that is every bit special as a Mustang but different. I would buy a four door Tbird, so maybe pulling a Charger senario would work, maybe with short quad rear doors for rear seat entry which is something never offered in a car of this class. Ford could use a muscle performance luxury sedan with RWD and V8, with a V6 option for a lower cost alternative.

 

If I had my way, the Five Hundred and Crown Vic would be gone. Offer a RWD V6/V8 performance/luxury sedan a notch above the Fusion in size, but offer a stretch wheelbase option like Ford of Australia does for the Falcon/ Fairlane LTD series. The Fusion would stay FWD in its class for those Camry types and still compete with the Malibu. The point is to align Ford in the same direction as Chrysler and Chevrolet are going.

 

Well, if I paid $30,000 for a Cobalt I'd want a nicer interior too. I know VW fans can be a rabid bunch, but I just don't see how anyone justifies paying so much extra for a VW. Lots of money, but not a lot in return.

VW has it right and the GTI is worth the money just to get the content, quality and excecution of design. VW also offers the Rabbit nicely equipped with the same bodystyle, same quality and same parts, just dumbed down from a GTI in options and they sell it starting at $16,000 up to $20,000. I also have that car in consideration as a lower priced alternative. I just cannot say enough.. The interior, parts and feel is just perfect, perfect, perfect and thats what the Mustang needs.

 

I am living with a Cavalier for a while which I find the general quality of the car surprisingly good. The styling is very dated inside and out, some ergonomics are poor like the HVAC controls too low in the panel but the only glaring quality issue i have is just the plastic dash board parts creak and moan. Nothing in the rest of the car is so much an issue, not even the rest of the interior parts creak and moan. The car rides quiet with the windows up. The the ride quality and handling could be better but its an LS without a sports handling package. The body is very solid, the doors shut nice and the seats are comfortable. The ABS brakes with traction control are excellent. I am very comfortable with the size of the car and positioning while sitting in the cabin, something that I have trouble with in the new Mustang, an issue I never had with the old Mustang.

 

With my next car I want something is a legend I adore like similar models offered in the past. I want the right style, comfort, balance of good performance and level of high quality that can make me feel good about my purchase. I don't buy to impress anyone but myself. I want another car I can love.

 

For me I am down to a few considerations for my next purchase. Mustang, a Thunderbird (revived or used), GTI/Rabbit, Sky or Solstice (the only new nameplates that are on a car exciting enough to me to become legends in the future), Charger or possibly one of the Fusion/Milan/MKZ trio.

 

It's hard deciding on the perfect car.

 

If it (The Monte Carlo) doesn't get any attention in Charlotte...

 

Yep it's tired clique. It has a red neck trailer trash connotation that most people don't wanna be identified with... Something the Thunderbird name and image has never been as affected by dispite being raced as a body style and nameplate in NASCAR. Mostly because the styling and package has been neglected and not enough to make it exciting and fresh. Plus it's FWD and everyone knows a new Camaro is coming soon. Also, they are embracing the more powerful and recognizable Impala name with a longer richer history.

 

Well, when the Challenger arrives with V8-only power and pricing in the mid- to upper-$30Ks...I'll still take the good ol' Mustang with a V8 for $26K. And the Charger? That's been such a slow seller for Chrysler, I'd (again) stick with the D3s. Give the D3s a nicer exterior, nicer interior, and nicer motor and they'll be much more attractive.

If the pricing of the Challenger is going to be that overpriced and skewed they can keep it. The Mustang is the better bargain. I have a feeling the Challenger is going to end up like a short lived retro fantasy like the Prowler and last Thunderbird because they are making it exclusive and out of the target customers price range. The same could happen for the next Camaro, I dunno.

 

The Charger was a candle that burned quick. I guess people that wanted them bought them right away. What Chrysler has to do now is keep them fresh and try to also appeal to the people who also buy V6 family cars. Not everyone wants a Hemi. Some people just want a well balanced family or personal car and are not concerned about the testoterone level. This can be done by offering the right quality and style interiors and content people are interested in who would normally consider a Camry, Accord or Impala. But Dodge appeals to a manly image. It probably puts off female and conservative buyers, but the Chrysler 300 balances that. I think what puts off a lot of people is that they are still not confident enough in Chrysler quality to take the risk. Many people don't care what wheels drive a Mercedes or BMW yet they buy them for style and status. Plus there are a lot of choices on the market that target the same audience so it's not really important that any RWD sedan make sales records. They just have to sell enough to justify its existance while mainatining a market for those who really want thhat type of car. I guarentee you though, if Ford or Chevy offered a Charger-like car first, there would less likely be a Charger. Chrysler saw a market that people desired but did not exist and they made it happen.

 

I could accept the D3's if they were styled right. I really don't have an adversion to FWD or AWD. I could even accept a Thunderbird variant if they offered power to the rear wheels and a V8 option.

 

Thanks for sharing your experience at the auto show. I go to NAIAS every year but I still like to go to the "regional" auto shows (Although why "my" auto show is held over Thanksgiving when I'm not here, I'll never know...) because it is so much easier to get around - less people, less shoving, no waiting for cars...

 

I went in the evening on Saturday Night. We are still small town in some ways where "uptown" is more quiet on the weekends than during the work week.

 

I'd be interested in your impression - how were people responding to the Edge & MKX? Were their a lot of people around it, sitting in it, talking about it? Hopefully for Ford it's getting a buzz.

 

Well, like I said all the Lincolns were on the floor and everyone was looking at them, including the MKX. I liked it. The Edge was on a turntable so no one could examine it. Bad Move instead of a Bold Move. I think Ford did everything they could to neglect Ford in this show. Sure lots of Mustangs, Trucks and SUV's (all Fords that sell themselves) but the rest of the Ford brands were unexciting. The Ford displays were in the corner just before the Lincolns and Mercurys. I actually was more excited over some the Lincoln-Mercury offerings than the equivalent Fords.

 

 

I was thinking about the Thunderbird name.... Thunder... a powerful force... Bird... Graceful, beautiful freedom...

Edited November 19, 2006 by Watchdevil

[waymondospiff]

I am tired of Ford's Bean Counter Excuses. The Lincoln was not worth a few extra dollars to even offer real metal a convincing bright trim? Even test tube wood looks better than silver paint. I'd rather see molded-in black than silver paint. The glossy carbon fiber look on the Milan center stack is far more tatesful than dull silver paint. It's really horrible that even the sound system is painted that too. I'd rather see black with chrome accent or knobs. Lincoln is getting quite a premium for the Fusion/Milan and not much of it shows other than alternate styling and maybe a few luxury and sound insulation extras. Oh yeah and people would PAY for a real metal and wood trim combination over something base so Ford wouldn't loose money. They make interior upgrades and trim optional on the Mustang, why not the MKZ.

Agreed. I see no reason why the MKZ doesn't have a nicer interior. I consider the MKZ's interior materials adequate for a Fusion-priced model, not a wanna-be luxury sedan. The plastics, vinyls, leather, and finishes need to be moved up-market.

 

 

Luxury makes still make BMW, Audi and Mercedes coupes as well as Infiniti. Why not have a luxury sport coupe that gives you the same zest for less money.

Yeah, but what are the sales? Not much. One of the reasons BMW invested in separate sheetmetal for the new 3-Series Coupe - to charge more to increase the margin on the lower sales. The only realistic option for a moderately priced coupe from Ford would be a Fusion/MKZ-based coupe. But it would be roughly the same price as a Mustang, so what's the point?

 

[speaking of the GTI] The interior, parts and feel is just perfect, perfect, perfect and thats what the Mustang needs.

I know everyone oozes over VW interiors. I think they're okay, but I don't appreciate some of the ergonomic details, such as itty-bitty buttons. Plus the interiors are so tiny it's hard to carry people. I don't know...I'm just not on board with all of the VW lovers. I just don't see it.

 

For me I am down to a few considerations for my next purchase. Mustang, a Thunderbird (revived or used), GTI/Rabbit, Sky or Solstice (the only new nameplates that are on a car exciting enough to me to become legends in the future), Charger or possibly one of the Fusion/Milan/MKZ trio.

Living legend: MX-5 Miata.

 

And I take it you like the Thunderbird? I know you like it, but I just don't see a market for large, RWD personal coupes. The larger sports cars, like the Mustang & Challenger, give you the interior room these older coupes offered, give you higher performance, and, often due to improved technologies & design, offer better ride & handling despite the performance increases.

 

Like I said, the most likely new coupe from Ford would be a CD3-based two-door. But, with Hermosillo operating at full capacity just making sedans, Ford would need to add another factory to make enough vehicles. And still, it would cost the same as a Mustang, so what would be the point?

 

Thanks for your insights though. I'm excited for the Detroit show this year. Lots to see, lots to see.

 

Scott

[RichardJensen]

If the MKZ interior were THAT bad, would it have won the Ward's sponsored industry & journalist surveys as best interior in a luxury car for '06?

 

I mean, I don't give a crap for surveys like that, but if the interior were truly bad, wouldn't the Mercedes S-Class interior have won instead?

 

I mean, you can't get real wood in the Lexus ES or Acura TL, and it's optional on the CTS & Infiniti G-, so perhaps some contextualization is in order.

 

But I do think the nickel on the Milan looks better. In fact, of the three, the nickel Milan interior is my favorite--with black on black interior trim and upholstery.

Edited November 20, 2006 by RichardJensen

[Watchdevil]

If the MKZ interior were THAT bad, would it have won the Ward's sponsored industry & journalist surveys as best interior in a luxury car for '06?

 

I mean, I don't give a crap for surveys like that, but if the interior were truly bad, wouldn't the Mercedes S-Class interior have won instead?

 

I mean, you can't get real wood in the Lexus ES or Acura TL, and it's optional on the CTS & Infiniti G-, so perhaps some contextualization is in order.

 

But I do think the nickel on the Milan looks better. In fact, of the three, the nickel Milan interior is my favorite--with black on black interior trim and upholstery.

 

You know I have seen silver and charcoal paint used as an accent in other makes before and it looks much better. But the silver paint they are using for the trim in the Mustangs and Lincolns suck ass!

 

The interior of the MKZ I saw was all black leather with the dash pad black as well. It's the cheap silver paint finish as an accent that I had the problem with. With optional wood it's fine. The interior in a lighter color shows style off a little better too.

 

But yeah I loved the Milan interior.

[Watchdevil]

Yeah, but what are the sales? Not much. One of the reasons BMW invested in separate sheetmetal for the new 3-Series Coupe - to charge more to increase the margin on the lower sales. The only realistic option for a moderately priced coupe from Ford would be a Fusion/MKZ-based coupe. But it would be roughly the same price as a Mustang, so what's the point?

The point is the Mustang has NO rear seat legroom and a small trunk. The new Mustang feels like you are sitting too low looking over a high dash cowl like an old Camaro. The Fusion is a roomier larger car and it would be nice to have one that is a 2-door with nice rear quarter window and rear end styling.

 

I know everyone oozes over VW interiors. I think they're okay, but I don't appreciate some of the ergonomic details, such as itty-bitty buttons. Plus the interiors are so tiny it's hard to carry people. I don't know...I'm just not on board with all of the VW lovers. I just don't see it.

 

I worked for a VW and Audi dealer selling parts for five years. I knew all about the shortcomings in the last generation cars. VW has their new cars right now. The new GTI is much much better, as are the other models just redesigned in thier lineup.

 

My best freind now has a new white 07 GTI. It was $25,000 not $30,000. I paid $24,0000 for my former 2003 Ford Escape and $21,000 on my 1994 Mustang convertible when they were new. So for what u get in the GTI I don't think it's out of line in price since most cars in the same size and class are crap boxes with low quality, no feautures and no performance. He traded a 07 Honda Civic on it. The interior of the Honda Civic was cheap crap. Sure it was a much cheaper car but they actually took some quality out of it compared to previous generations. The interior of the GTI exceeds it by a longshot and they give EXACTLY the same quality interior on the much cheaper Rabbits and Jettas. The interior has plenty of room and the buttons are large and properly placed. I have driven the car on more than one occasion for a good amount of time and I definitely love it. There is a lot about it that you don't experience in a Mustang.

 

I also love the way that VW sends you a gift called a "Fast" when you buy a GTI. Basically it's a black grimicing plastic Rabbit mascot with a grin outlined in a red "V" stripe just like the car's grille. It has detachable tails of four different shapes: a regular ball, a golf ball, a lightning bolt and a pointed bent pitchfork kinda tail. It is supplied with an "owners manual" and comes in a black square box with the interior lined with the plaid GTI seat design printed inside the box.

 

Living legend: MX-5 Miata.

Sure the Miata is a legend. I like the original one okay but not any of the subsequent generations. I respect it but for me I don't care for the soft featureless style and none of them really WOW'ed me. I also don't like the toilet seat hood opening on the new one. I sat in them and they feel cramped. I was comfortable in the Solstice/Sky because the car seems wider.

 

 

And I take it you like the Thunderbird? I know you like it, but I just don't see a market for large, RWD personal coupes. The larger sports cars, like the Mustang & Challenger, give you the interior room these older coupes offered, give you higher performance, and, often due to improved technologies & design, offer better ride & handling despite the performance increases.

 

I already said it. The Mustang does not offer the same interior room as the older Thunderbirds. I have had both the 94 & 99 Mustang and 85 & 89 T-bird in my lifetime and I always had more rear seat room and trunk space in the Thunderbirds than the Mustangs.

 

Like I said, the most likely new coupe from Ford would be a CD3-based two-door. But, with Hermosillo operating at full capacity just making sedans, Ford would need to add another factory to make enough vehicles. And still, it would cost the same as a Mustang, so what would be the point?

 

Someone is not listening. A CD3-based two door would be bigger and more roomy, more luxurious in a way that the Mustang cannot be. A Fusion based coupe would also offer more of a 2-door sedan seating position rather than sitting low in the floor like an old Camaro. Ford doesn't need a whole other plant to add a coupe to the mix. It's not like they are producing equal numbers each of 4-door Fusions, Milans and MKZ's as max capacity. They could easily make a run of coupes as needed.

 

Where Ford is wasting money is tooling up for a new Focus coupe that is gonna look like cheap ass. I would rather have the 3-door which could compete with a GTI. No one will care about the new Focus coupe except the people that just insist they buy a Ford in this size and class over a Cobalt or Civic coupe out of shear loyalty or a "great deal" at the right time with incentives and rebates.

Edited November 20, 2006 by Watchdevil

[RichardJensen]

You know I have seen silver and charcoal paint used as an accent in other makes before and it looks much better. But the silver paint they are using for the trim in the Mustangs and Lincolns suck ass!

 

The interior of the MKZ I saw was all black leather with the dash pad black as well. It's the cheap silver paint finish as an accent that I had the problem with. With optional wood it's fine. The interior in a lighter color shows style off a little better too.

 

But yeah I loved the Milan interior.

????? Are you talking the stuff around the center stack, or the stuff that's available instead of the wood?

 

One's a spray-on finish, the other's the real thing.

[Watchdevil]

????? Are you talking the stuff around the center stack, or the stuff that's available instead of the wood?

 

One's a spray-on finish, the other's the real thing.

 

 

Okay to clarify.... The Milan has optional bright center stack bezel trim that looks convincingly like real aluminum, same as the silver spokes on the steering wheel of the Mustang. This is a solid shimmery color with no metal flakes.

 

The ceneter stack on the MKZ has a silver spray painted finish with metal flakes. The finish is course like paint applied with no clear coat. It has no sheen or quality to it. It just looks like cheap paint and the silver center stack trim paint is used in other areas and parts as well. Some of the silver painted dash trim can be replaced with wood as an option, but not on the center stack.

 

BTW, They got the instrument panel quality on the Fusion and Milan equal to VW in fit and finish plus quality of materials. I noticed that the upper dash padding feels like the vinyl is backed in "firm rubber" as apposed to regular foam rubber. That adds a solidness and feel I have not seen in a long time. VW has this now too on the dash pads and upper door trim. If they can make the inside of the Fusion/Milan this good why not the dash and interior trim on the Mustang?

[RichardJensen]

Some of the silver painted dash trim can be replaced with wood as an option, but not on the center stack.

Actually the wood can be replaced by nickel as an option, not the other way around....

 

And you'll notice that they've lacquered the nickel trim here. Don't know why they didn't lacquer the center stack and assorted other bits on the existing MKZ. I would attribute that more to the technical difficulties of getting a lacquered finish on all the different controls, than to strictly cheaping out. You'll notice on the Milan that neither the head unit nor the HVAC controls have that nickel finish on them. They're just black. You couldn't do that on the MKZ without causing its own problems, and putting a lacquered finish on those stereo controls would be difficult.

[Edgey]

Great review of the Milan/MKZ, I have the EXACT same opinion of the CD3 designs. The Milan is by far the best looking of the three IMO, especially on the interior. The Milan has the looks, style, and features of an MKZ...but damn that D30!

 

If I could get a Milan with a D35 and HID headlights, I would have exactly what I want. The THX II system is not so great in the MKZ, it is MUCH better in the Aviator.

 

Some advice for Lincoln, concentrate on overall material quality, not just genuine trim materials. I would gladly give up gigantic slabs of wood and aluminum in my car if it means the plastics are a much higher grade. And please loose the retro dash design! It looks great in photography, but it's very unpleasant to sit behind. I'm 6'3" but I feel like I'm peering over the dash like an old man. Is it really necessary for Lincoln to chase away people younger than 60 with designs like this?

Edited November 21, 2006 by Edgey

[RichardJensen]

Your Aviator doesn't have THX II, it has THX, and your Aviator listed for about $10k more than a MKZ, so it dang well better have had a quality stereo.

 

Life is just full of compromises, ain't it?

 

If I were you, I'd get the Milan.

 

If I were me, and in a position to do so, I'd get the Milan too. 4-cylinder/automatic with the interior package.... $20k heckuva deal.

[Edgey]

Your Aviator doesn't have THX II, it has THX, and your Aviator listed for about $10k more than a MKZ, so it dang well better have had a quality stereo.

 

Life is just full of compromises, ain't it?

 

If I were you, I'd get the Milan.

 

If I were me, and in a position to do so, I'd get the Milan too. 4-cylinder/automatic with the interior package.... $20k heckuva deal.

 

I'm actually investigating Volvos right now, although I have yet to drive them and I'm concerned about Volvo quality (not that my LS has been a flawless ride). The nearest Volvo dealer isn't very convenient and I don't want to deal with that if I have troubles. Volvo certainly doesn't price out as the value option, they seem to place a premium on their badging . But I'm looking for something a little more unique and Lincoln is about as exciting as Buick.

 

The Aviator has a 5.1 THX system for the rear-seat DVD player and it is a brilliant sounding system. I never thought I'd finally hear something coming out of a Ford car that sounded that good.

[waymondospiff]

I'm actually investigating Volvos right now, although I have yet to drive them and I'm concerned about Volvo quality (not that my LS has been a flawless ride). The nearest Volvo dealer isn't very convenient and I don't want to deal with that if I have troubles. Volvo certainly doesn't price out as the value option, they seem to place a premium on their badging . But I'm looking for something a little more unique and Lincoln is about as exciting as Buick.

 

The Aviator has a 5.1 THX system for the rear-seat DVD player and it is a brilliant sounding system. I never thought I'd finally hear something coming out of a Ford car that sounded that good.

I'm not sure if a CUV is in your line-of-sight, but the new CX-7 & CX-9 (especially CX-9) are quite nice. Quality interior with design flair & it appears to use decent materials. While I like the S40/V50, for $30K it'd be hard to pass up the CX-9.

 

I'm really looking forward to an Edge & CX-9 comparison. Should be very enlightening.

 

Scott

[Edgey]

I'm not sure if a CUV is in your line-of-sight, but the new CX-7 & CX-9 (especially CX-9) are quite nice. Quality interior with design flair & it appears to use decent materials. While I like the S40/V50, for $30K it'd be hard to pass up the CX-9.

 

I'm really looking forward to an Edge & CX-9 comparison. Should be very enlightening.

 

Scott

 

I have never been drawn to Mazda, something about it seems tuned too obliquely to the sporting-side of the spectrum. I'm looking for a better compromise, something a little more sophisticated and understated.

[RichardJensen]

I have never been drawn to Mazda, something about it seems tuned too obliquely to the sporting-side of the spectrum. I'm looking for a better compromise, something a little more sophisticated and understated.

What was that Alfred P. Sloan said?

 

Brand Management works: IF you are consistent, IF you understand your 'consumption consumer' and your 'target consumer', and IF the gap between the two can be bridged.

[NickF1011]

Personally I think the Milan is my LEAST favorite of the trio. Something about that Mercury grille just doesn't look right anymore. I think it's the surround on the bottom and sides. I think it would look nicer if only the "waterfall" vertical slats on the grille had the metallic look to them.

[Edstock]

Here's an interesting take on the Z, especially considering what the writer was driving before he got into the Z.

 

http://www.luxurycarcanada.com/features/fe...20Lincoln%20MKZ

 

Price quoted in Canuck bucks.

 

"Somewhere in Tennessee - It wasn't that long ago that the definition of a luxury vehicle was simple and straightforward: leather guts, power doo-hickeys, and swoopy dashboard script were all that was required to eclipse the Joneses in middle-suburbia. Throw in whitewalls, wire wheel covers, and a Landau roof, and some neighbours may have thought you were hobnobbing with heads of state. For vehicles of North American origin, that meant Cadillacs, high-end Chryslers, and Lincolns. And it usually meant Grampa was visiting.

 

These days, those former features of traditional luxury are available on Honda's and Hyundai's. Heated seats, silky sound systems, and navigation systems are no longer upper echelon; the masses are demanding them. Entry-luxury is a bit of a misnomer; to be cool, hip, and 45-ish in age and price, you're expected to be in a sport sedan that you would drive like a maniac (if you were a professional driver on a closed course, of course).

 

There has to be a happy medium between these two camps. Who would have thought that the solution might come from Lincoln. With the possible exception of the Navigator, the experience for most bystanders in Ford's luxury marque was in the backseat of a Town Car airport shuttle. The Explorer-based Aviator quickly tanked, the Mark Series has gone from coupe to four-door pick-up, and the LS is the definition of drab slab. One has to wonder if an itchy ‘Way Forward’ trigger finger was being pointed at the nameplate.

 

One of the reprieves is courtesy of the MKZ sedan (pronounced MKZed in Canada and MKZee in America). MKZ is the new tag for the outgoing Zephyr badge, keeping in line with the brand's new anti-naming policy. It's a Ford Fusion that's gone to finishing school. The End. Now I can do some laundry and, um, wait a minute...(SFX: sound of press kit rustling..) it appears I might have been a little hasty. Let's meet the new MKZ, and let's hope that I still have some emergency BVDs in the bureau.

 

The outgoing Zephyr already has the nod for the best Premium Car interior from the 2006 Auto Interiors Show, so there's no need to mess with a good thing. Fit, finish, and tactile feel is spot-on, or what used to be called 'Japanese'. The corporate Ford switches have received a satin finish, and the real wood trim rivals that of the new Jaguar XK. This means either Lincoln is getting really good at this, or the Coventry cat plant has Glenmorangie running through the water fountains. Front seats are heated and cooled, with three-step comfort. Audiophiles will appreciate the optional THX II-Certified Audio System, and the map-impaired will applaud the available DVD-based savvy navi screen. A teaser MKZ concept was in attendance, with dual rear seat headrest screens that have separate media feeds and wireless headphones. You'd have to pull over every couple of hours to make sure the kids are still there.

 

The MKZ is the new Hot Rod Lincoln, thanks to the arrival of the 3.5-litre V6. Fresh on the heels of its launch in the Ford Edge, this mill is tuned to 263 horsepower and 249 foot-pounds of torque. Also borrowed is the new six-speed automatic, and available all-wheel-drive system. Lincoln has tweaked the suspension, with thicker anti-roll bars, spring rates, increased damping, and revised power steering boost. Wheels are 17-inchers, with the same size available in optional chromed aluminum. The rest of the options sheet is understandably short, with a power moonroof and HID headlamps rounding out the list. Exterior trim receives minimal updates, such as grille revision and the new nomenclature.

 

I had the opportunity to fling the MKZ around the track at this year's AJAC TestFest, however I had just exited a BMW M Coupe before I did. This would have put my adrenalin somewhere North of crystal-meth, so I was looking forward to a scenic country drive for some real-world evaluation. Something like the Tail of the Dragon, a stretch of US 129 that straddles Tennessee and North Carolina. 318 perfectly sculpted curves in a mere 11 miles of flawless blacktop. It's a favourite with sports car nuts and motorcyclists alike; you should go. The MKZ never felt out of place as it churned up the crispy fall leaves. The 3.5 is exactly what the MKZ needed to distinguish itself from the so-so 3.0 in the old Zephyr. The six-speed auto is one smart arrangement of gears and clutches; you won't miss the manu-shift gate, because you just plain don't need it. Throw some snow skins on with the AWD version, and you'll never be late this winter to your upscale cubicle.

 

Fusion DNA aside, the MKZ is worthy of your 40-something thousand budget. It's got the power, the handling, and something few cars in this class seem to understand or appreciate: it's comfortable. Smart move. Maybe even a Bold Move.

[Watchdevil]

Actually the wood can be replaced by nickel as an option, not the other way around....

 

And you'll notice that they've lacquered the nickel trim here. Don't know why they didn't lacquer the center stack and assorted other bits on the existing MKZ. I would attribute that more to the technical difficulties of getting a lacquered finish on all the different controls, than to strictly cheaping out. You'll notice on the Milan that neither the head unit nor the HVAC controls have that nickel finish on them. They're just black. You couldn't do that on the MKZ without causing its own problems, and putting a lacquered finish on those stereo controls would be difficult.

 

My issue is the quality of the paint they used. But for a car in this class, it's unexcusable expecially since you are paying a premium over the Fusion and Milan. The Milan manages attractive bright trim without looking cheezy and low quality.

 

I wasn't aware the bright trim in place of wood was laquered in those areas aside of the sidestack bezel and other trim. Pictures can't reveal the different in application on brightwork, so I assumed it was the same painted silver crap. I didn't get to see an example in person with the laqured bright trim.

 

As far as the radio goes, I am not too crazy about an all bright radio either. Maybe its the design of the radio itself that I don't like. But it looks like cheap spray paint as well. I'd rather see a radio in balck with bright or crhome knobs. The radios in VW's look good to me in black with brushed aluminum knobs and buttoms. You can use black it if it done appropriately. But if something looks like a huge expanse of black lastic with no accept or detailing then it tends to look cheap, as does a vast expanse of silver paint.