Monoman

Not true in my case. I prefer to shop local and small if the price is fair. I tried to work with my local dealers to meet in the middle somewhere. They would not budge which was well within their right. They shouldn't complain to Ford but they probably are.

It is neither and both at the same time. :-) Call it corporate socialism maybe? Manufacturers historically needed dealerships to handle sales, delivery, service/warranty, etc. for an area. Some areas overlapped if people were willing to shop around but it really wasn't too much of a problem. This changed during the pandemic with dealers like Granger and Chapman offering below invoice pricing while most others are charging MSRP or more. Low, not haggle pricing from a seemingly competent dealer was a big enough difference for some people to travel hundreds (even thousands) of miles. How many dealers are between me and Granger? I don't know and I don't care. I had spent too many hours over too many days working with local dealers. It was frustrating to dealing with incompetent sales people and many were charging thousands over MSRP just to take my order. I found out about Granger and less than a day after contacting them I had a signed order far cheaper than any local dealers and a confirmation email from Ford. How many sales are being lost to dealers like Granger in my area? It can't be many. The car business is changing and companies like Ford are trying to figure out how to adapt. Many dealerships seem to be fighting it. I think dealerships make a lot of money and they are feeling threatened. Some have huge investments in large properties and don't see how they can change. In my opinion, they would do just fine with factory pricing on new vehicles if the factories can deliver orders fast enough. Dealerships can make plenty of money on service, warranty, parts, accessories and used vehicle sales..

I don't disagree but dealerships wind up with more allocations because they are selling more. Hasn't that always been the case? Dealers are just annoyed now because some consumers are finding other options. Honestly, I don't think dealers in my area are losing many sales to Granger, Chapman, and others. Factory pricing would be level much of the playing field. Dealers could then focus on competing by adding value.

As always, I thank you for your reply. I do however disagree that Granger and the other lowballers are causing Ford to go back to their normal allocation formulas. The number of lowballers is not very high. However, there are plenty of dealerships mismanaging their queues, adding markup over MSRP, not honoring price lock, etc. From all accounts I have read it sounds like dealerships are doing better than ever but Ford is losing out because they can't build enough vehicles to meet demand. Customers are losing out because Ford can't meet demand and prices just keep going up. Yeah I know it is all about supply & demand, and the free market ... but it isn't really? There's a dealership model and if Ford is "trying to treat dealers fairly and keep them in business" then it really isn't a free market for the consumers. I do not pretend to have all of the answers, but I have no problem asking questions and pointing out things I do not think are working well.

That and once Ford picks up your order for scheduling we really don't know the full selection process. Even if all things are equal and the resources are available we still don't know exactly why orders are selected to be built. Let's say there are 1,000 Super Duty orders sitting at Priority 02 and Ford needs to select 500 for their next batch. I suspect Ford groups them together based on some other factor that is unknown to us. It could be trim line, it could be geographic reason for transportation reasons, it could be exterior colors, engines, etc etc. Even if they have everything they need there may be processing decisions that come into play for reasons unknown to us. One would think that order date is a big factor but that may not be the case. It is a bit annoying to see some dealers getting fleet/stock orders (blue window stickers) that are close matches to my order. I would consider buying one but they dealers in my area want at least $5K over MSRP. I'm fine with Granger. I'm just a bit disappointed with Ford because that the order I placed last December for a Platinum F-250 with an estimate of 4-6 months wasn't built and it may be over 18 months before I actually get a truck. I chose to go with Ford for this truck purchase for a variety of reasons and I will remain patient for now. tldr; it's complicated. :-)

Yes I misspoke about Ford filling orders on a "First come, first served" basis. The only knowledge we seem to have about Ford's order selection process is that it depends on parts availability (makes perfect sense) and a range of priority levels managed by Ford and each respective dealership. My 2023 order has been placed by Granger and i have received the confirmation email from Ford.

Ford has done nothing so far. No email saying they can't fulfill my 2022 order, no PCO while waiting for a year, no PCO to help cover the $10K price increase, nothing. I have been fortunate enough to be working with one of the more competent dealers (Granger). Unfortunately, Ford (and other auto manufacturers) seem to be incapable or unwilling to fulfill COVP orders on a first come, first served basis like they indicated they would. I understand there are a lot of variables but when you some people with similar order specs getting trucks in a few months and others waiting over a year then you have to question what is actually happening. Ford (and other manufacturers) should institute better communications instead of relying on their dealerships. Too many dealerships are lazy or incompetent which is putting it nicely in some cases. I have a Platinum on order which Ford won't start building until Job 2 sometime in Spring. It is likely it will be 18 months by the time I get the truck.

My hopes of a MY22 are gone. Granger reached out to me and submitted a MY23 order to replace my order for a MY22.

Your dealer didn't contact you to tell you you should place a MY23 order? Granger reached out to me to let me know that they would be placing a new MY23 order for me to carryover my MY22 order.

I hope that isn't the case when I get ours. I will say the vented seats on my current 4Runner are terrible too. They work fine if you are under 200Lbs. Anyone heavier just blocks the airflow.

It sounds like a loose connection. Take it to a competent dealer. Good luck and let us know the cause once it gets fixed.

Yeah that's where I sit. Still waiting to see if I'm getting the MY22 I ordered last December but if that isn't going to happen I want to be in the front of the line for a MY23.

Do we know the date when Ford will stop assigning VINs for MY22?

Oh I know it is a mystery. I have tried all of things that supposedly will work but no luck yet. I'll keep playing the lottery and keep my fingers crossed.

I did that almost a year ago. No PCO yet.

That's sad. The big guys are all about competition and a free market until someone else beats them. In the end, the losers are Ford's customers. Yeah, yeah, I know we're not really Ford's customers. We're the dealership's customers.

Very good point. The postings here and other places suggest Ford (and others) still haven't figured out how to adjust their existing systems to consistently build and deliver vehicles in the order they (the orders) were received. Dealers get incremented allotments for COVP orders so build & delivery time should not be affected by the dealer choice. The only factors should be priority, order date, and the availability of parts which is easier said than done because the system wasn't designed to operate that way. I think this has also been compounded by dealerships that haven't bothered to correctly submit and manage their orders.

Agreed. I was only adding to the conversation because it matched Granger's pricing exactly and haven't heard of any others. Sometimes people confuse Invoice and MSRP. Perhaps they were thinking Ford was allowing a specific amount over MSRP ...we will need for them to reply to be sure.

Granger Ford announced they are pricing MY23 Super Duties at $1500 over invoice which should be well under MSRP.

The lighting is definitely making it appear lighter. It almost looks like the Area 51 color on the Bronco and Maverick.

I was only talking about the process in general. I don't know any specifics about Ford's systems. Please excuse my ignorance.

Fair enough. The dealership is still basically powerless to change the situation.

Silly question. Why are the order guides not released before the order bank opens? It seems like that would potentially cause ordering errors.

My understanding based on previous discussions on this subject is that the the dealership has no control. Ford still 'owns' the truck and is responsible for delivery to the dealership. I would be asking the dealer and Ford to find to match or beat the interest rate.

We agree on the issues but have a different conclusion is all. You say the model isn't broken and then point of how some dealerships are screwing up things for the customers. IMO the current dealership model is broken but it could be fixed. Stronger policy enforcement from the auto makers and better customer support channels to deal work around bad dealers would be a big help.