DEBATE: IS CLIMATE CHANGE A CON TO RAISE TAXES?

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Daily Express reports...

 

THE scientific consensus that mankind has caused climate change was rocked yesterday as a leading academic called it a "load of hot air underpinned by fraud".

 

Professor Ian Plimer condemned the climate change lobby as "climate comrades" keeping the "gravy train" going.

 

In a controversial talk just days before the start of a climate summit attended by world leaders in Copenhagen, Prof Plimer said

 

Governments were treating the public like "fools" and using climate change to increase taxes.

 

He said carbon dioxide has had no impact on temperature and that recent warming was part of the natural cycle of climate stretching over ­billions of years.

 

Prof Plimer told a London audience: "Climates always change. They always have and they always will. They are driven by a number of factors that are random and cyclical."

 

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

 

IS CLIMATE CHANGE BEING USED AS AN EXCUSE TO CHARGE MORE TAX?

 

DO YOU AGREE WITH PROFESSOR PLIMER'S VIEWS ON THE ENVIRONMENT?

 

HAVE YOUR SAY NOW!

 

Daily Express LINK

Edited December 5, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[ford-boy]

I'd like to get real, unbiased info as to the ACTUAL size of the polar caps... now as compared to recent past. Are they growing again, have they lost size??? Has the temp dropped by .5 degree in the last 5-8 years? My liberal friend is always lecturing me about how the North West Passage is ice free now and this is a SURE sign of GW. Lame stream media is useless in disseminating this type of info. I just don't see the weather changing any and as they say, politicians never let a crisis (real or imagined) go to waste. I think it's a con.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

I'd like to get real, unbiased info as to the ACTUAL size of the polar caps... now as compared to recent past. Are they growing again, have they lost size??? Has the temp dropped by .5 degree in the last 5-8 years? My liberal friend is always lecturing me about how the North West Passage is ice free now and this is a SURE sign of GW. Lame stream media is useless in disseminating this type of info. I just don't see the weather changing any and as they say, politicians never let a crisis (real or imagined) go to waste. I think it's a con.

 

Greenpeace's leader went on TV scaremongering about ice cap sizes, caps melting and was shot down in flames and was made to look clueless on the subject, he ended up admitting at the end of the interview that he was wrong and misinformed on subject. This organisation must have been brainwashing its membership with his lies, misinformation & exaggerations for years on the subject.

Edited December 5, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[jpd80]

Regardless of whether man made Global Warming is real or not, I think the US and rest of the world

should be very careful about signing up to CO2 and emission deals with Europe.

These guys have been working with high tax economies for ages and strong fuel taxes are engrained

in their strategies. Most Euro countries have transitioned away from CO2 based power units to nuclear

energy which gives them huge advantages in a carbon trading scheme.

 

High fuel taxes have forced the European population into smaller fuel efficient vehicles, something that

is gradually happening in the US, they are only just changing B,C and D Car production mix.

 

I'm just saying that the US and her population are not ready for the changes needed under a European

styled agreement and that going down that road before doing necessary pre steps could completely ruin

the US economy. Taxing fuels is part of it and I thing the US has to come to terms with that first.

Edited December 5, 2009 by jpd80

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Regardless of whether man made Global Warming is real or not, I think the US and rest of the world

should be very careful about signing up to CO2 and emission deals with Europe.

These guys have been working with high tax economies for ages and strong fuel taxes are engrained

in their strategies. Most Euro countries have transitioned away from CO2 based power units to nuclear

energy which gives them huge advantages in a carbon trading scheme.

 

I'm just saying that the US and her population are not ready for the changes needed under a European

styled agreement and that going down that road before doing necessary pre steps could completely ruin

the US economy. Taxing fuels is part of it and I thing the US has to come to terms with that first.

 

Gotta l agree with you 100% JPD what used to be called the weather is now being used to milk the motorist in the UK, the US would be much better off steering well clear of signing up to anything with Europe. It will end up a jobs bloodbath if you do.

 

This is one latest "Global Warming" tax grabs that the bankrupt British government is planning to milk from the British motorist cash. None of this tax revenue will ever be used to combat so called global warming it will all get spent elsewhere.

 

Daily Mail... The green car tax blitz: £3,300 ($5,500) levy on new vehicles as fuel duty soars

Motorist face a huge increase in fuel duty, and a £3,300 ($5,500) levy on new cars under plans that could see families' green tax burden soar.

 

A report unveiled today by experts including the Government's environment tsar will urge £150billion in taxes on households and businesses.

 

Petrol could cost £2 a litre by 2020, while a tax on new cars that would start at £300 would rise by £3,000 over the next 11 years.

 

The blitz is essential if Britain is to meet its target of cutting greenhouse gas emissions by a third by that time, according to the influential think-tank behind the proposals.

 

But critics said drivers were already over-taxed and But critics said drivers were already over-taxed and were being used as 'cash cows'.

 

LINK

Why should the Government get to keep the motorists revenue & spend it elsewhere else on everything except combating Global Warming, surely it should all given back to the Fords, GM's Airbus & Boeings of this world who will have to fix the problem at great expense to the companies who are already very cash strapped themselves at the moment, and the poor old motorist is a captive cash cow thats getting milked to death in Europe at the moment, and they are seeing nothing put back into combating "climate change" something we used to call the "weather" by these legalised looting governments.

 

Because car & aircraft makers won't see next to bugger all of the Global Warming tax revenue to help them combat global warming when they should be getting the lions share of any taxes raised from the motorist it will be spent elsewhere, l dont think governments give a toss about global warming they just want the money thats why l think "climate change" is just one big tax con.

Edited December 5, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[stephenhawkings]

I doubt the 'conspiracy' that is floating around in some circles over a few emails. But taxes are here to stay, and any excuse to raise them, like health care reform, war tax, fees, cap and trade, or what have you, seams like a no brainer.

So saddle up and get a better accountant, or shelter your money in a better spot.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

I doubt the 'conspiracy' that is floating around in some circles over a few emails. But taxes are here to stay, and any excuse to raise them, like health care reform, war tax, fees, cap and trade, or what have you, seams like a no brainer.

So saddle up and get a better accountant, or shelter your money in a better spot.

 

You don't mind if taxes are fair rather than legalized stealing that ends up destroying jobs that help pay for public services & schools etc.

 

Air Passenger Duty (APD) is a typical example that has been imposed on Airlines to help cut down on "Global Warming". APD went up 100% two years ago that is way out of line with inflation. Gordon Brown increased APD tax again this year by up to 112% as a result the cost of APD for a family of 4 will now find they have seen that a trip from the UK APD Tax has risen from £320 ($523) to £600 ($981) just since the new duty tax rise was imposed this year.

 

The APD 212% rise is greedy governments will end up destroying jobs on a massive scale these rises are totally out of touch with inflation.

 

This will end up making millions of airline workers redundant as airlines go bust worldwide. The Airbus/Boeings of this world will face a massive highly skilled jobs bloodbath as airlines cut back on orders, and in turn these folk wont buy cars or contribute to health & schools. Those that are in workers still in work will face the double whammy of loss of tax revenue to the country & will now have to pay folk to do nothing on the dole.

 

 

We had a survey on what Brits thought of Global Warming, only 7% thought it was a real, over 50% thought it was bunk yet this week we will be brainwashed by the tax pickpockets like Gordon Brown who will focusing on all the flood plains of the world where nobody should be living where there have been floods there for thousands of years. No doubt "Climate Change" activists most of who probably don't have a job will be their with the Gordon Browns & Greenpeace will cashing in on the flood plains of the world and poor folk misfortunes who should not be living there in the first place.

 

Air Passenger Duty 212% above inflation Global Warming taxes rises will not cut down on emissions one bit, it will put millions of Aviation workers on the dole queue worldwide, Boeings of this world orders will dry up so they will not be able to reinvest in making aircraft cleaner emissions lower.

 

FACT none of this Air Passenger Duty/Car Global Warming tax revenue goes back to Fords/GM/Airbus/Boeings of this to FIX so called "Global Warming" problem if it did you might believe Gordon Browns of this world that Global Warming really serious. Global Warning tax revenue goes into general pot that gets spent elsewhere.

 

When Gordon Browns of this world starts giving 100% of Global Warming taxes robbed from the motorists & air passengers back to the Boeing and Fords of this world to make develop cars aircraft with lower CO2 emissions then l will start believing in Global Warming taxation. Gordon Brown is using the revenu at the moment to prop up gold plated Government employee pensions & pay because he is to weak & wimpy to take on government employee unions.

This will come back to bite him in a massive double dip downturn as he picks up a massive unemployment welfare bill he will face as large numbers of auto & aviation worker hit the dole loooooooooooooooooog dole queue which will be a hole he wont be able to dig himself out of as he will find he wont have anybody left in a job to pay for government employee who work in health care & school it end up a doctor & teachers jobs bloodbath in the public sector

 

Still we will all be able to go live in a tree with swampy and all his unemployed climate change protesters who don't want to work when we get our Global - Global Warming tax at the Climate Change conference talks this week.

Edited December 7, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[RangerM]

You don't mind if taxes are fair rather than legalized stealing that ends up destroying jobs that help pay for public services & schools etc.

So long as you're willing to stand there and take it, it'll keep happening.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

So long as you're willing to stand there and take it, it'll keep happening.

 

Thanks for that Ranger M could not agree with you more, all these taxes raised from motorists & air passengers for so called global warming something we used to call the weather should all get put back into the auto & aircraft industry from where it came from to help them help fix the so called problem with vehicles & aircraft that are locked into seven year production cycles will cost the manufacturers billions to fix/change. Gordon Browns auto tax revenue linked to global warming is goes in general pot gets spent elsewhere bailing out our failed government thats why Gordon Brown does not give a toss about global warming he just wants your money.

 

Trouble is most of us have to work for a living don't get time to go on protests, l have signed a petition trying to stop the huge Air Passenger Duty Tax.

 

We paid £1.9 billion in road tax we pay annually to put our car on the UK roads each year, next year it cost $4.4 billions in 2010 as it becomes linked to C02 emissions big vehicles will be taxed off the roads.

LINK

 

Gordon Brown tax on car fuels is one of the highest in the world, he collects and milks £26 billions in fuel duty from the motorist most of this money will be used to pay out huge benefits, rather than combating "Climate Change" Brown does not give a toss about global warming.

LINK

 

Massive unjust APD taxes about to hit airlines

LINK

 

We just had some breaking news on the BBC saying the USA government were thinking about handing powers over to your EPA to make regulations on emissions, saying new regulations will not have to get passed by your government anymore the EPA will be able to set the standards themselves.

Edited December 7, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[lfeg]

Cap and trade is just a "politically correct" term for more taxes / higher costs. And global warming (it is happening, because the earth's climate is never static - it is either warming or cooling) is being used as a cover by the elitists to return the masses to serfdom, where they think the commoners belong.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Cap and trade is just a "politically correct" term for more taxes / higher costs. And global warming (it is happening, because the earth's climate is never static - it is either warming or cooling) is being used as a cover by the elitists to return the masses to serfdom, where they think the commoners belong.

 

EPA has jumped on the bandwagon today it has declared carbon dioxide a pollution as from today.

 

In the UK this means what we used to call the weather = Global Warming = means you paying more tax, tax and more tax to fix it = Government spends all the tax revenue on anything other than combating Global Warming.

 

 

 

 

Dec. 7 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency declared carbon dioxide a health hazard today, paving the way for new regulation of emissions from sources such as power plants, factories, cars and trucks.

 

The decision allows the agency to issue rules to govern heat-trapping pollution that many scientists say may lead to irreversible climate shifts. The EPA announced the decision in a statement that said the science “overwhelmingly” supports the finding.

 

The move, on the opening day of an international climate summit in Copenhagen, arms President Barack Obama with new regulatory powers that could help forge consensus in efforts to curb global warming.

LINK

Edited December 7, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[RaZor]

The news that a leaked set of emails appeared to show senior climate scientists had manipulated data was shocking enough. Now the story has become more remarkable still.

 

The computer hack, said a senior member of the Inter-governmental Panel on Climate Change, was not an amateur job, but a highly sophisticated, politically motivated operation. And others went further. The guiding hand behind the leaks, the allegation went, was that of the Russian secret services.

 

Or, did you all just get played by the Ruskies?

[RangerM]

Or, did you all just get played by the Ruskies?

Who got played, the GW believers or the skeptics?

 

The question of who the hackers is/are, has nothing to do with the validity of the arguments, or the authenticity of the leaked information.

 

If you recall, Phil Jones (former head of CRU) confirmed the authenticity of the emails at least in part (link to his statement regarding one of them).

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Looks like you will all be driving round in the 1L 1,000cc ecoboost global Ford Focus's only sooner rather than later now, whilst we get those massive 1.6 & 2.0L Motown Monster diesels in Europe. Big Al's awesome new Taurus will need to be hybrid on all models or it will be curtains. Good to see Ford will be ahead of game before new US EPA rules fall in line with small Euro-ecnoboxes

 

 

US to regulate greenhouse gas emissions

 

BBC NEWS 7th Dec..

The US government has declared that greenhouse gases threaten human health.

The move could allow the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) to order cuts in emissions without the approval of Congress.

EPA administrator Lisa Jackson said the agency was now "authorised and obligated to make reasonable efforts" to cut greenhouse gases.

 

Ms Jackson said that the scientific evidence surrounding climate change clearly showed that greenhouse gases "threaten the public health and welfare of the American people".

She said the EPA's so-called endangerment finding would "cement 2009's place in history as the year when the United States government began addressing the challenge of greenhouse-gas pollution".

Reports suggest the announcement, which had been in the pipeline for months, was timed to add weight to US President Barack Obama's position at the climate change talks in Copenhagen, allowing him to argue that the US is taking action to combat global warming.

LINK

Edited December 7, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Who got played, the GW believers or the skeptics?

 

The question of who the hackers is/are, has nothing to do with the validity of the arguments, or the authenticity of the leaked information.

 

If you recall, Phil Jones (former head of CRU) confirmed the authenticity of the emails at least in part (link to his statement regarding one of them).

 

What really annoys me is we are getting taxed to the hilt by the government in the UK in the name of global warming and bugger all of the tax revenue goes back into fixing to so called effect at all by greedy cash strapped governments. It the biggest scam the world has ever had. Now the EPA has classified it as a pollutant in the USA you will find you taxes will start to double as a result of it. Watch out for where the global warming taxes go Stateside, in the UK they go into a general pot and get spent elsewhere. Business will start to fail bigtime in the US from now on that you have recognized CO2 as a pollutant.

 

You can't help but notice the biggest hypocrites are 10.000's who jetted into Copenhagen for the "Climate Change" summit this week, the will show photos of dust bowls in Africa that have always been dry or low level Bangladesh flooding under water that has always been prone to flooding. In reality natural disasters are down like flooding & droughts are down 95% compared to the 1920"s, Something that won't be debated in Copenhagen.

 

Plants need C02 to survive without it they will die, bastard greenies want to kill off our plants.

 

Climategate scientists who got caught out fiddling the CO2 numbers and others will all face a long dole queue without their research funding if they told the truth and said nothing is really happening to the climate at all, its what we used to call the weather.

 

Last 3 summers in the UK have been the wettest & coldest in decades which is the total opposite to Global Warming is supposed to be, something Gordon Brown won't be mentioning this week at the climate change conference, will we get a massive Global Cooling tax rebate for the £1,000's we have paid in Global Warming taxation in the UK. No we wont get a rebate, the Global Warming taxes have already spent to fighting no weapons of mass destruction wars, to keep millions on benefits doing nothing etc.

 

In the UK Southern England is sinking by a few millimeters a year and parts of Scotland are rising up out of the sea a few millimeters a year as the earths plates moves, no doubt Global Warming scientists & Greenpeace will all be hanging out in Southern England to do their research to prove sea levels are rising to keep the funding coming in..

 

Biggest scam of the all is the the Air Passenger Tax that has gone up from £20 to £150 since 2007 on some routes to help cut down on global warming, aircraft spend most of their time up in the upper troposphere near the tropopause that remains a constant -51C any heat would get removed in a instant cooled down by the surrounding upper atmosphere stratosphere which remains a constant -57C, what a big con.

 

East Anglia in the UK where the Climategate lying cheating Scientist cooked the books on Global Warming is a flat area that was completely under water in 1236, early 1900's, millions have died in flooding there a long time before the start of the industrial revolution started or the car was invented it has always been prone to floodling.

 

What we used to call the weather is now known as "Climate Change" in Copenhagen this week which means TAX TAX TAX TAX TAX TAX

East Anglia FLOODS not caused by man made global warming.

 

1236 Large areas flooded and great loss of life (First recorded flood)

 

1287 More than 100 drowned at Hickling

 

1613 Severe flooding of Norfolk’s marshland

 

1762 Norwich flooded by a 12 ft rise in water level

 

1878 Severe flooding in Norwich

 

1912 Record rain fell. Crops were destroyed Norwich flooded and much of Norfolk damaged

 

1938 Reportedly the worst floods ever with great areas claimed by the sea

 

1953 Widespread floods and great loss of life along the east coast a total of 307 people were killed, 32,000 evacuated and many thousand head of livestock drowned. This flood has been referred to as the “greatest peacetime disaster that Britain has ever known”

 

Hottest year ever East Anglia - 1911 must have been all those horse and carts on our roads back then, l blame all that global warming back then on those Wright Brothers aircraft Stateside .

 

LINK

 

 

 

Global Warming is one big tax con, will we get $10,000's back in a tax refund when in 30 years time when it is proved that it was just the weather no we won't, will Godon Brown be around to be strung up & hanged no he wont he will be 6ft under the ground and their wont be 20 ft waves above him either, but Global Warming taxes will balance the books rather than make him look one huge failure that he is.(But he will of raped the motorist, killed off the airlines and the millions of jobs involved in it, just so he can keep a load of unemployed greenies on benefits that dont want to work), their will be no change at all.

Edited December 8, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[RangerM]

What really annoys me is we are getting taxed to the hilt by the government in the UK in the name of global warming and bugger all of the tax revenue goes back into fixing to so called effect at all by greedy cash strapped governments. It the biggest scam the world has ever had. Now the EPA has classified it as a pollutant in the USA you will find you taxes will start to double as a result of it. Watch out for where the global warming taxes go Stateside, in the UK they go into a general pot and get spent elsewhere. Business will start to fail bigtime in the US from now on that you have recognized CO2 as a pollutant.

 

At least for now. The CEI (Competitive Enterprise Institute), PCA (Portland Cement Ass'n), and EPRI (Electric Power Research Institute) will likely keep it on hold (in the courts) for at least a few years; at least until more reasonable heads prevail.

 

You can't help but notice the biggest hypocrites are 10.000's who jetted into Copenhagen for the "Climate Change" summit this week, the will show photos of dust bowls in Africa that have always been dry or low level Bangladesh flooding under water that has always been prone to flooding. In reality natural disasters are down like flooding & droughts are down 95% compared to the 1920"s, Something that won't be debated in Copenhagen.

That's the way government officials (and Al Gore) communicate with us: "Do as we say, not as we do"

Plants need C02 to survive without it they will die

Last time I checked.

Climategate scientists who got caught out fiddling the CO2 numbers and others will all face a long dole queue without their research funding if they told the truth and said nothing is really happening to the climate at all, its what we used to call the weather.

Many of these scientists no doubt started out as scientists, but were influenced by their benefactor to support a predetermined conclusion. The question as to WHY the politicians (appear to) want MMGW to be true it is the important one (to me).

Last 3 summers in the UK have been the wettest & coldest in decades which is the total opposite to Global Warming is supposed to be, something Gordon Brown won't be mentioning this week at the climate change conference, will we get a massive Global Cooling tax rebate for the £1,000's we have paid in Global Warming taxation in the UK. No we wont get a rebate, the Global Warming taxes have already spent to fight no weapons of mass destruction wars, to keep millions on benefits doing nothing etc.

In fairness, outliers are going to happen. It's not indicative either way. However, since we are asked to rely on models that are unreliable (at best), and misleading (at worst, intentionally?) as the basis of undermining our entire way of life, I'd at least HOPE that someone would finally ask the question, "Why?"

In the UK Southern England is sinking by a few millimeters a year and parts of Scotland are rising up out of the sea as the earths plates moves, no doubt Global Warming scientists & Greenpeace will all be hanging out in Southern England to do their research to prove sea levels are rising to keep the funding coming in..

If you Google-search "submerged ruins", you'll discover many settlements that were once above water. Somehow, the greens have taken the mantra of a static Earth. But this is the generation that smoked a lot of dope in their youth, so perhaps it's no surprise.

 

Global Warming is one big tax con, will we get $10,000's back in a tax refund when in 30 years time when it is proved that it was just the weather no we won't, will Godon Brown be around to be strung up & hanged no he wont he will be 6ft under the ground and their wont be 20 ft waves above him either, but Global Warming taxes will balance the books rather than make him look one huge failure that he is.(But he will of raped the motorist, killed off the airlines and the millions of jobs involved in it, just so he can keep a load of unemployed greenies on benefits that dont want to work), their will be no change at all.

Politicians are always solving small problems that create larger ones. Funny how they aren't around to suffer them, nor do they accept any culpability for creating them.

Edited December 8, 2009 by RangerM

[stephenhawkings]

So long as you're willing to stand there and take it, it'll keep happening.

don't you mean sit there?

[ford-boy]

Does anyone know of a website that has updated (accurate) total square miles of polar caps and/or global average temps by year? Something simple so one doesn't have to sift through dozens of technical papers, etc.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

don't you mean sit there?

 

You have a new website Stateside that might just get the ball rolling.

 

SpeakOutForAmerica.com to draw international attention to Steward's concern is that the world will cut CO2 too much, which he says will starve plants and eventually lead to food shortages. In a statement to U.S. News this morning, Steward said, "The participants that are showing up at Copenhagen or COP-15 negotiations seem very excited that they may soon reap the benefits from the United States in having to pay for their past sins of burning fossil fuels, causing carbon dioxide. The irony is that CO2 that has been emitted into the atmosphere has caused a rise of 12 percent food growth of the world's agricultural industry."

LINK

Edited December 8, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[RangerM]

don't you mean sit there?

Not necessarily.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

They had a cheek to complain about Big Al, l got my head in the sand, l'm not looking Henderson, and not a clue Nardelli biz jets at the auto bailouts.

 

 

Daily Express...

 

A load of hot air!

 

Climate change talks are a '£130m waste of time'

 

15,000 delegates will attend the 12-day conference.

 

40,500 tons of Co2 will be generated - equivalent to York, Portsmouth or Malawi over the same period

 

£20m hotel bill for delegates

 

£6.4m cost of flying in delegates from 192 countries

 

£54.5m salary of the delegates during the conference

 

140 private aircraft used to fly in 105 leaders

 

1,200 limousines, many driven from Germany and Sweden

 

£37m contribution from the Danish government

 

45,000 eco-warriors will play a supporting role

 

£130m estimated total cost of the event

 

5,000 journalists will cover the event

[RangerM]

Does anyone know of a website that has updated (accurate) total square miles of polar caps and/or global average temps by year? Something simple so one doesn't have to sift through dozens of technical papers, etc.

If you're hoping for an Excel spreadsheet that shows the raw temperature readings, you're out of luck.

 

The problem is anything you'd (we'd) see would have already been filtered for obvious outliers and weighted for variances. Data would have already been subjected to whatever "smoothing" algorithms that the scientists deemed necessary.

 

That is the problem with the "Climategate" scientists. The methods they used to manipulate the data (when they've shared them at all) have been demonstrably flawed, and in some cases, intentionally.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

If you Google-search "submerged ruins", you'll discover many settlements that were once above water. Somehow, the greens have taken the mantra of a static Earth. But this is the generation that smoked a lot of dope in their youth, so perhaps it's no surprise.

 

LOL Copenhagen "Global Warming" summit has 1,400 Prostitutes that are willing to offer "Climate Change" delegates all the FREE LOVE they want on tap, you only gotta show them you delegate pass to get it. Maybe dope as well.

 

I hope Michelle keeps her man at home we don't want anymore Tiger Woods type incidents in Copenhagen.

 

 

 

1400 prostitutes on tap, just flash your Global Warming pass to get it.

LINK

 

 

Let hope Obama stays at home on a higher moral ground Stateside and takes no part in huge 40,500 ton carbon footprint festival in Copenhagen, hope he looks after the USA interests first telling them from maybe via a videolink that the US will be using cleaner green technology to cut improve the environment which won't involve taxing taxpayers on mass to death which will help destroy millions of jobs just as the worlds economy is at its most fragile.

 

Hope he mentions the lions share of Global Warming taxes should be ploughed straight back into the Ford, GM's & Boeings of this world who will have to pick up the massive bill to help fix the greenies problems with new technology.

 

I really do hope he condems those like the one eyed scot idiot (Clarkson was 100% right), by saying that not one dime of Global Warming tax revenue should be used to bail out failed governments. Tax looting UNELECTED Gordon Brown just wants to tax cars off the roads, and aircraft out the sky just in order to raise tax revenue that ends up in a general tax pot in the UK just to make himself look good as thousand lose their jobs, the massive UK Global Warming tax revenue we already pay for like various cars & APD gets spent else where on any thing other than combating so called climated change something we used to call the weather in the past which is nothing more than a massive tax scam.

Edited December 11, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[ford-boy]

If you're hoping for an Excel spreadsheet that shows the raw temperature readings, you're out of luck.

 

The problem is anything you'd (we'd) see would have already been filtered for obvious outliers and weighted for variances. Data would have already been subjected to whatever "smoothing" algorithms that the scientists deemed necessary.

 

That is the problem with the "Climategate" scientists. The methods they used to manipulate the data (when they've shared them at all) have been demonstrably flawed, and in some cases, intentionally.

 

I don't get it. For as long as I can remember, the USA has SHARED everything with the rest of the world. Medical knowledge, space sciences, physics, and on and on. Now we can't see what the satelite images are showing????? or the temperature radiosonde data all over the world. This data (size of the polar caps and temps) is not rocket science. What conclusion can you make when the actual data is withheld other than "THEY" have something to hide. The image I get when I think about this is......... from the wizard of Oz ........."disregard that man behind the curtain"

[DUCKRACER]

Cap and trade is just a "politically correct" term for more taxes / higher costs. And global warming (it is happening, because the earth's climate is never static - it is either warming or cooling) is being used as a cover by the elitists to return the masses to serfdom, where they think the commoners belong.

 

+1,000