Detroit News Article

[DTP Nick]

Stang you have stated on here before that you are salaried??? What the hell does me using Education funds from the company have to do with this thread? Once again you underestimate someone and assume they have no education as you (allegedly) do...Cmon buddy im just a realist and maybe can understand the big picture of the domestic autoindustry better than you...You seem to have problems thinking objectively...maybe you should take some more classes LOL

Edited July 19, 2011 by DTP Nick

[trailfndr]

2. Divided our ranks further by selling everyone on 2nd Tier (again sold as the only alternative by the UAW)

The BIG selling point here was that 2nd Tier would be limited to only 20% and that they would have a chance to move up

to 2nd tier as people retired.

 

 

 

You do realize that even if the cap on entry level employees was raised Ford would literally have to double the amount of employees to outnumber us right??

 

 

Unfortunatly, with the way the UAW voting typically goes, It will only take about 30-40% being 2nd tier to kill us, as so many simply don't give feel that they can spare the time it take to drive from work, over to the local hall and cast a vote.

 

If you look at history, its very rare to see a turnout any higher than about 50-60 % of our membership

 

Two Tier WILL be the death of current workers. If not now...then in the future, and they WILL in time effect us all after we retire. Remeber, a new contract effects retierees, even though they can not vote for or against it.

[DTP Nick]

You are a condescending IDIOT!

Let me guess..u live in adrian?

[4600]

 

DTP Nick, use the education funds that Ford so graciously gives you and take some classes.

 

 

I take exception with your statement Stang. Ford never graciously gave us anything!

[jjt4433]

ps in case you never read a business section or just basically dont know shit about wall street or profit projections Ford is supposed to make MORE this year than last when you got 5k....What id say you got 7k with an improved profit sharing plan along with 3k for a signing bonus in sept?....That is great for us as union members and great for the company in that they dont add FIXED costs to their labor pool...If the econmy goes down the toilet and the company isnt making money then you get your 30 bucks an hour and benefits...other jobs and indistries would KILL for that. But not the UAW spoiled babies

 

I would say you were dreaming! The company stated that they gave us more for money for the last profit sharing than the formula came up with. They are so nice to us.(sarcasm there)

[louie]

I would say you were dreaming! The company stated that they gave us more for money for the last profit sharing than the formula came up with. They are so nice to us.(sarcasm there)

 

Yeah..... They claimed that the historical formula procedure was not interpreted the same as in years past. This is not the Ford Credit deduction but the company wanted to challenge the historic formula calculations to shaft us............. Once King reported it out in the news, the company back pedaled and stuck with the historic formula calculations (minus the Ford Credit variable). In short they were trying to twist the unchanged contractual language.

 

Thank God for this great union.....

 

King also knows that we can not gain higher rates of pay. Our current $28 to $33 per hour with full benefits will get us product and investment. To add any more cost to our labor rates will send work and jobs to Mexico and/or Canada.

 

Just a boarder away in either direction.

 

I will be quite happy if King gains even more product and investment, keeps may pay and benefits and gets another bonus calculated on targets we actually have control over and can manage.

 

Keep the profit sharing the same plus add Ford Credit back and a new bonus opportunity for quality and other measurable will keep our base labor rates competitive and ensure job security.

 

Our labor rates are competitive now, to add more cost to them will just push work to other countries and our numbers will continue to decline. Its a fine line to walk but the UAW is being proactive and protecting us and for that I am thankful

[louie]

Has hell frozen over??? I agree with Louis!!! LOL

 

Hey Nick............... Great minds think alike.

 

We are realists and to demand ALL concessions back this time around is just suicidal and will put us right back at $70 per hour and jobs, investments and security will go to Canada and Mexico.

 

Now, over years of collective bargaining we attained all of the things we gave up, it will be many contracts to get all of these items back

 

It ain't happening this time, I am sure we will get a good contract that protects 40,000 of us with job security and our golden wages and benefits.

[el norte]

Let me guess..u live in adrian?

!?!? Grand Blanc, thank you! Your point, self proclaimed genius?

[theunionisforever]

Hey Nick............... Great minds think alike.

 

We are realists and to demand ALL concessions back this time around is just suicidal and will put us right back at $70 per hour and jobs, investments and security will go to Canada and Mexico.

 

Now, over years of collective bargaining we attained all of the things we gave up, it will be many contracts to get all of these items back

 

It ain't happening this time, I am sure we will get a good contract that protects 40,000 of us with job security and our golden wages and benefits.

 

The only way you can call our wages and benefits 'Golden' is if you compare them to the other blue collar wages that have hit bottom. I would call them "tarnished wages and benefits" in comparison to what we once had. I would agree with you that we won't get our concessions back in the contract. The alarm bell that I'm trying to ring (and will continue to ring for anyone that will listen) is that we need to throw a wrench into the company's plan to destroy what we have left. By no means should we accept a contract that sets us up to be crushed a few years down the road.

 

Here's how I see this playing out..

 

• The Union started playing a psychological game with the membership by filing a bogus and worthless grievance against the company, claiming to be trying to get our concessions back. This was triggered by the company giving back bonuses to salaried employees along with other perks that they "temporarily suspended" when they suckered the UAW membership into accepting needless concessions right before announcing massive and record profits. The IUAW knows full well that when we signed on to having an 'arbitrator' settle any violation of the 'Parity of Sacrifice' clause in the concessions agreement that we lost any legal footing and that they will always side with the company. This is all just a BS head game that they are playing with the membership.
  

• Now comes the contract negotiations.. We already know that the company spit in our face by violating the 'Parity of Sacrifice' clause that we ALL agreed to when we 'pretended' to save our dieing company. Ideally, the concessions should not be used as any part of the contract negotiations, Why? Because by all accounts Ford is a healthy, profitable and thriving company and our concessions should be returned to us before any contract negotiations begin BUT reality tells us that this is not what will happen.
  

 

• Bob King will emerge from contract 'negotiations' with a big smile and a breathtaking announcement:
   
  "Not only have we been able to preserve your current wages and benefits but we even got back a couple of the more affordable concessions that you gave up! (10 minutes of break time, dependent ETAP maybe?) PLUS instead of raises, that you would see in each and every pay check, we came up with a profit sharing scheme that you will never be able to figure out and the company can manipulate at will. This profit sharing scam will be based in part on the following..
   
  PRODUCTIVITY: Productivity = Profits = More money in your pockets! This means you should NEVER complain about any unreasonable request to add more work to your job station. If you complain or refuse any additional tasks you are in effect "stealing" money from the pockets of your fellow Union brothers and sisters.
  QUALITY: Quality = Better Product = Happy Customers = Increased Sales = More money in your pockets! Even though 99% of quality issues in our final product come from things out of our control such as over loaded jobs, non-conforming parts, bad engineering, ergonomics etc. You will still be penalized on your profit sharing.
  ATTENDANCE: Poor Attendance = Down Time = Less Productivity = Less money in your pockets! Profit sharing will be effected by our collective attendance records. Even though our aging 1st tier workers are being herded into assembly plants and forced to work on over loaded jobs (see productivity above) Don't let those aches and pains get in your way of making it to work!
  

 

• What will you have to sacrifice for all this?? Nothing really.. All You have to do is agree to lifting that pesky little 20% limitation on 2nd tier hiring. Hell! The company even sweetened the deal with a (((SIGNING BONUS)))!! This is a great day for our membership and I encourage everyone to get behind this agreement and vote YES!"
  

 

FAST FORWARD TO THE NEXT CONTRACT IF NOT SOONER:

"Unfortunately, due to lackluster sales and a general down turn in the American economy, profit sharing has turned out to be.. "not so profitable" for our membership. The good news is that our willingness to allow the company to hire an unlimited amount of 2nd tier workers has lead to a massive hiring spree! In fact, 2nd tier workers now outnumber our 1st tier "legacy cost" workers. Unfortunately the company can no longer afford the burden of paying these higher wages and benefits to these "legacy cost workers" and our new majority of 2nd tier workers can no longer tolerate working next to people making more money to do the same jobs. SO, we will be offering a pay increase of $2/per hour to our 2nd tier workers. All you have to do is vote to "EQUALIZE" the pay and benefits of the "legacy cost" 1st tier workers. Unloading this financial burden from the company could also lead to an increase in the profit sharing scheme (That you have never been able to figure out and have never profited from). SO VOTE YES! IT'S A NO BRAINER!! :D

 

Am I painted a pessimistic picture? Is that the reality that we are facing? Do I have a crystal ball?? No I do not BUT I don't think it takes a Nostradamus to see the direction this is heading. I am asking, begging, PLEADING with my Union Brothers and Sisters. If you draw the line in the sand on nothing else, draw it on lifting the 2nd tier hiring restrictions! I believe that anything else that can be offered to you at contract time is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. The company will always look at the long term effects of any contract agreement and push for what is in the share holders best interest. It's time for our membership to do the same!

[louie]

The only way you can call our wages and benefits 'Golden' is if you compare them to the other blue collar wages that have hit bottom. I would call them "tarnished wages and benefits" in comparison to what we once had. I would agree with you that we won't get our concessions back in the contract. The alarm bell that I'm trying to ring (and will continue to ring for anyone that will listen) is that we need to throw a wrench into the company's plan to destroy what we have left. By no means should we accept a contract that sets us up to be crushed a few years down the road.

 

Here's how I see this playing out..

 

• The Union started playing a psychological game with the membership by filing a bogus and worthless grievance against the company, claiming to be trying to get our concessions back. This was triggered by the company giving back bonuses to salaried employees along with other perks that they "temporarily suspended" when they suckered the UAW membership into accepting needless concessions right before announcing massive and record profits. The IUAW knows full well that when we signed on to having an 'arbitrator' settle any violation of the 'Parity of Sacrifice' clause in the concessions agreement that we lost any legal footing and that they will always side with the company. This is all just a BS head game that they are playing with the membership.
  

• Now comes the contract negotiations.. We already know that the company spit in our face by violating the 'Parity of Sacrifice' clause that we ALL agreed to when we 'pretended' to save our dieing company. Ideally, the concessions should not be used as any part of the contract negotiations, Why? Because by all accounts Ford is a healthy, profitable and thriving company and our concessions should be returned to us before any contract negotiations begin BUT reality tells us that this is not what will happen.
  

 

• Bob King will emerge from contract 'negotiations' with a big smile and a breathtaking announcement:
   
  "Not only have we been able to preserve your current wages and benefits but we even got back a couple of the more affordable concessions that you gave up! (10 minutes of break time, dependent ETAP maybe?) PLUS instead of raises, that you would see in each and every pay check, we came up with a profit sharing scheme that you will never be able to figure out and the company can manipulate at will. This profit sharing scam will be based in part on the following..
   
  PRODUCTIVITY: Productivity = Profits = More money in your pockets! This means you should NEVER complain about any unreasonable request to add more work to your job station. If you complain or refuse any additional tasks you are in effect "stealing" money from the pockets of your fellow Union brothers and sisters.
  QUALITY: Quality = Better Product = Happy Customers = Increased Sales = More money in your pockets! Even though 99% of quality issues in our final product come from things out of our control such as over loaded jobs, non-conforming parts, bad engineering, ergonomics etc. You will still be penalized on your profit sharing.
  ATTENDANCE: Poor Attendance = Down Time = Less Productivity = Less money in your pockets! Profit sharing will be effected by our collective attendance records. Even though our aging 1st tier workers are being herded into assembly plants and forced to work on over loaded jobs (see productivity above) Don't let those aches and pains get in your way of making it to work!
  

 

• What will you have to sacrifice for all this?? Nothing really.. All You have to do is agree to lifting that pesky little 20% limitation on 2nd tier hiring. Hell! The company even sweetened the deal with a (((SIGNING BONUS)))!! This is a great day for our membership and I encourage everyone to get behind this agreement and vote YES!"
  

 

FAST FORWARD TO THE NEXT CONTRACT IF NOT SOONER:

"Unfortunately, due to lackluster sales and a general down turn in the American economy, profit sharing has turned out to be.. "not so profitable" for our membership. The good news is that our willingness to allow the company to hire an unlimited amount of 2nd tier workers has lead to a massive hiring spree! In fact, 2nd tier workers now outnumber our 1st tier "legacy cost" workers. Unfortunately the company can no longer afford the burden of paying these higher wages and benefits to these "legacy cost workers" and our new majority of 2nd tier workers can no longer tolerate working next to people making more money to do the same jobs. SO, we will be offering a pay increase of $2/per hour to our 2nd tier workers. All you have to do is vote to "EQUALIZE" the pay and benefits of the "legacy cost" 1st tier workers. Unloading this financial burden from the company could also lead to an increase in the profit sharing scheme (That you have never been able to figure out and have never profited from). SO VOTE YES! IT'S A NO BRAINER!! :D

 

Am I painted a pessimistic picture? Is that the reality that we are facing? Do I have a crystal ball?? No I do not BUT I don't think it takes a Nostradamus to see the direction this is heading. I am asking, begging, PLEADING with my Union Brothers and Sisters. If you draw the line in the sand on nothing else, draw it on lifting the 2nd tier hiring restrictions! I believe that anything else that can be offered to you at contract time is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. The company will always look at the long term effects of any contract agreement and push for what is in the share holders best interest. It's time for our membership to do the same!

 

Todays Free Press

 

UAW President Bob King is preparing to enter negotiations with GM, Ford and Chrysler next week with a clear bargaining position: No new concessions.

 

King said he understands domestic automakers' need to maintain competitive labor costs.

 

Still, UAW members have made sacrifices in recent years, King said, and the union plans to resist any effort to raise members' health care contributions or cut wages and benefits.

 

"I've said a number of times, there is no justification for any further concessions in this round of bargaining," King said.

 

King, 64, will lead the UAW's first contract talks with the Detroit Three since Chrysler and GM emerged from their gut-wrenching, government-backed restructurings in the spring and early summer of 2009.

 

The negotiation of a four-year contract to replace the one that expires Sept. 14 is being watched closely from Wall Street to the White House.

 

The talks will test King's ability to meet members' expectations of winning back concessions made since 2007.

 

Under the 2009 deal brokered with the Obama administration's automotive task force, the union agreed to keep GM's and Chrysler's labor costs competitive with U.S. plants operated by Asian automakers. The UAW also agreed not to strike Chrysler or GM through 2015.

 

In return for keeping labor costs competitive, King said it is reasonable for the union to ask for a higher wage for entry-level workers as they replace older workers who retire.

 

He also wants permanent seats on the companies' boards of directors, no increased contributions to health care insurance and tweaks to a profit-sharing formula so workers share more in each company's financial success.

 

For the first three months of the year, GM earned $3.2 billion, Ford earned $2.6 billion and Chrysler earned $116 million.

 

"What the companies are asking our members to do this time -- and that is not to raise fixed costs -- is a huge ask," King said.

 

In 2010, the average hourly labor cost per worker in the U.S. was $58 for Ford, about $56 for GM and $49 for Chrysler. That puts domestic automakers near or below labor costs for Toyota ($55) and Honda's ($50) U.S. plants, but higher than Hyundai's $44-per-hour labor cost, according to the Center for Automotive Research.

 

"It doesn't do our members any good if we raise fixed costs, and that means our vehicles cost more and we lose market share and then job security is in jeopardy again," King said.

 

Still, King said the UAW wants higher wages for entry-level workers.

 

In 2007, the UAW agreed to allow each Detroit automaker to hire new workers at a starting wage of $14 to $16 per hour, about half of the $28 traditional wage rate. That works out to about $30,000 per year.

 

"It is a very legitimate goal that everybody working in the auto industry should be at a middle-class standard of living," King said. "Entry-level, for a family of four, is barely there."

 

King also downplayed concerns that UAW leadership is not in tune with members who are expecting to win back concessions such as annual cost-of-living increases.

 

"Of course people would like to see raises and increases in wages," King said. "But more than that, they want long-term security."

 

end.

 

 

Seems to me no more concessions means not raising the 20% cap. Job security is our future.

 

Keeping rates of pay and benefits and gaining more investments to increase jobs is very proactive and without job security everything is gone, our jobs, pay, benefits----- everything. I'm glad King is concerned for all 40,000 of us and our future. unlike your strategy where you put all of our futures and jobs in jeopardy. God I hope you are not a elected official.

 

 

Nobody including me likes entry level. The fact of the matter is it was one of the items that lowered our labor rates to gain our coveted job security.

 

In fact sounds like King is going to raise the base wages of entry level which is a great strategy

 

I dont even think they started negotiations yet,, have they??

[DTP Nick]

Todays Free Press

 

UAW President Bob King is preparing to enter negotiations with GM, Ford and Chrysler next week with a clear bargaining position: No new concessions.

 

King said he understands domestic automakers' need to maintain competitive labor costs.

 

Still, UAW members have made sacrifices in recent years, King said, and the union plans to resist any effort to raise members' health care contributions or cut wages and benefits.

 

"I've said a number of times, there is no justification for any further concessions in this round of bargaining," King said.

 

King, 64, will lead the UAW's first contract talks with the Detroit Three since Chrysler and GM emerged from their gut-wrenching, government-backed restructurings in the spring and early summer of 2009.

 

The negotiation of a four-year contract to replace the one that expires Sept. 14 is being watched closely from Wall Street to the White House.

 

The talks will test King's ability to meet members' expectations of winning back concessions made since 2007.

 

Under the 2009 deal brokered with the Obama administration's automotive task force, the union agreed to keep GM's and Chrysler's labor costs competitive with U.S. plants operated by Asian automakers. The UAW also agreed not to strike Chrysler or GM through 2015.

 

In return for keeping labor costs competitive, King said it is reasonable for the union to ask for a higher wage for entry-level workers as they replace older workers who retire.

 

He also wants permanent seats on the companies' boards of directors, no increased contributions to health care insurance and tweaks to a profit-sharing formula so workers share more in each company's financial success.

 

For the first three months of the year, GM earned $3.2 billion, Ford earned $2.6 billion and Chrysler earned $116 million.

 

"What the companies are asking our members to do this time -- and that is not to raise fixed costs -- is a huge ask," King said.

 

In 2010, the average hourly labor cost per worker in the U.S. was $58 for Ford, about $56 for GM and $49 for Chrysler. That puts domestic automakers near or below labor costs for Toyota ($55) and Honda's ($50) U.S. plants, but higher than Hyundai's $44-per-hour labor cost, according to the Center for Automotive Research.

 

"It doesn't do our members any good if we raise fixed costs, and that means our vehicles cost more and we lose market share and then job security is in jeopardy again," King said.

 

Still, King said the UAW wants higher wages for entry-level workers.

 

In 2007, the UAW agreed to allow each Detroit automaker to hire new workers at a starting wage of $14 to $16 per hour, about half of the $28 traditional wage rate. That works out to about $30,000 per year.

 

"It is a very legitimate goal that everybody working in the auto industry should be at a middle-class standard of living," King said. "Entry-level, for a family of four, is barely there."

 

King also downplayed concerns that UAW leadership is not in tune with members who are expecting to win back concessions such as annual cost-of-living increases.

 

"Of course people would like to see raises and increases in wages," King said. "But more than that, they want long-term security."

 

end.

 

 

Seems to me no more concessions means not raising the 20% cap. Job security is our future.

 

Keeping rates of pay and benefits and gaining more investments to increase jobs is very proactive and without job security everything is gone, our jobs, pay, benefits----- everything. I'm glad King is concerned for all 40,000 of us and our future. unlike your strategy where you put all of our futures and jobs in jeopardy. God I hope you are not a elected official.

 

 

Nobody including me likes entry level. The fact of the matter is it was one of the items that lowered our labor rates to gain our coveted job security.

 

In fact sounds like King is going to raise the base wages of entry level which is a great strategy

 

I dont even think they started negotiations yet,, have they??

most people dont read the article Lou..cmon that asking too much...They just wanna vote NO no matter what...mental midgets

[lquidspine]

In return for keeping labor costs competitive, King said it is reasonable for the union to ask for a higher wage for entry-level workers as they replace older workers who retire

This is unreasonable at GM and Chrysler, without risking sending those two departments to arbitration.

Ford department could attempt this without the same risks, but considering we have none lets consentrate on hireing the LTS's first.

 

My problem with the profit shareing deal is what matrix's will be used to calculate ?

Will it be goals set per individual or something set for the entire membership ? Both have their drawbacks

 

Obviously we do not want to outprice ourselves , but our sacrafices over the last 6 years must be compensated in some form. We still do make a good living but the concerns of the US economy going further down are real, cost of living is going up. It is a tough balance right now to keep the company profitable while taking care of the workforce.

 

This is Bob Kings first real attempt at running the show I am willing to see what he and the national negotiators have in store before passing judgment, but the above issue will need to be addressed.

[theunionisforever]

 

Seems to me no more concessions means not raising the 20% cap. Job security is our future.

 

Keeping rates of pay and benefits and gaining more investments to increase jobs is very proactive and without job security everything is gone, our jobs, pay, benefits----- everything. I'm glad King is concerned for all 40,000 of us and our future. unlike your strategy where you put all of our futures and jobs in jeopardy. God I hope you are not a elected official.

 

 

Nobody including me likes entry level. The fact of the matter is it was one of the items that lowered our labor rates to gain our coveted job security.

 

In fact sounds like King is going to raise the base wages of entry level which is a great strategy

 

I dont even think they started negotiations yet,, have they??

 

You hope I'm not a elected official? Why? Because I don't want to see what's left of our pay and benefits to go down the toilet? What good is job security for a crap job with low pay and benefits?

If you kill someone and then confess, you can be secure in the fact that they will hold a prison cell for you but that doesn't mean you want to be there! The real question is how low will you go?

The company will keep chipping away at our pay and benefits in the name of job security as long as we are willing to play that game!

I don't expect to double our wages or get a million dollar bonus in this contract and I won't vote no when it's not offered. All I'm saying is vote NO on any suggestion of lifting the 2nd tier hiring restrictions. I firmly believe that lifting that 20% limit will spell the end of what we have left.

The article you posted here is just a article and not some hand written blue print on Bob Kings intentions on this contract. I would be shocked to read an article where King states that he would love to give the company wage and benefits cuts. In other words, He's not going to lay his cards out on the table for a newspaper or anyone else.

What he does say in the article is that he wants wage increases for 2nd tier (possibly to make it more reasonable when they make their move to equalize the wages of 1st tier?)

Ask yourself why is he so concerned about the wages of the 2nd tier new hires and not restoring the concessions of the 1st tier? Both cost the company money and by their logic, make them less competitive. The article also DOES NOT state that they won't seek to remove the 20% clause. Why do you assume that he would consider that a concession? They will just claim that it will allow additional hiring and therefore JOB SECURITY that King thinks is the only thing the membership will strike over. (He's wrong on that)

I hope to God you are right and they don't attempt to do what they are, in my opinion, obviously shooting for.. Lifting the 20% cap, flooding the system with 2nd tier and then equalizing our pay and benefits in the not so distant future. I will be watching the language closely and sounding the alarm bells if and when they try it. I will vote NO and go on strike if I have to. Let's hope it doesn't have to come to that.

[louie]

This is unreasonable at GM and Chrysler, without risking sending those two departments to arbitration.

Ford department could attempt this without the same risks, but considering we have none lets consentrate on hireing the LTS's first.

 

My problem with the profit shareing deal is what matrix's will be used to calculate ?

Will it be goals set per individual or something set for the entire membership ? Both have their drawbacks

 

Obviously we do not want to outprice ourselves , but our sacrafices over the last 6 years must be compensated in some form. We still do make a good living but the concerns of the US economy going further down are real, cost of living is going up. It is a tough balance right now to keep the company profitable while taking care of the workforce.

 

This is Bob Kings first real attempt at running the show I am willing to see what he and the national negotiators have in store before passing judgment, but the above issue will need to be addressed.

 

 

Hey Spine,

 

The way understand the profit sharing will stay exclusive to itself.

 

The other bonus on quality, attendance, scrap or whatever else has been reported needs to be jointly managed to be successful. We need to have our say in these decisions. It must be equal and jointly driven.

 

Yes we can also agree that we should wait before we pass judgement

[louie]

You hope I'm not a elected official? Why? Because I don't want to see what's left of our pay and benefits to go down the toilet? What good is job security for a crap job with low pay and benefits?

If you kill someone and then confess, you can be secure in the fact that they will hold a prison cell for you but that doesn't mean you want to be there! The real question is how low will you go?

The company will keep chipping away at our pay and benefits in the name of job security as long as we are willing to play that game!

I don't expect to double our wages or get a million dollar bonus in this contract and I won't vote no when it's not offered. All I'm saying is vote NO on any suggestion of lifting the 2nd tier hiring restrictions. I firmly believe that lifting that 20% limit will spell the end of what we have left.

The article you posted here is just a article and not some hand written blue print on Bob Kings intentions on this contract. I would be shocked to read an article where King states that he would love to give the company wage and benefits cuts. In other words, He's not going to lay his cards out on the table for a newspaper or anyone else.

What he does say in the article is that he wants wage increases for 2nd tier (possibly to make it more reasonable when they make their move to equalize the wages of 1st tier?)

Ask yourself why is he so concerned about the wages of the 2nd tier new hires and not restoring the concessions of the 1st tier? Both cost the company money and by their logic, make them less competitive. The article also DOES NOT state that they won't seek to remove the 20% clause. Why do you assume that he would consider that a concession? They will just claim that it will allow additional hiring and therefore JOB SECURITY that King thinks is the only thing the membership will strike over. (He's wrong on that)

I hope to God you are right and they don't attempt to do what they are, in my opinion, obviously shooting for.. Lifting the 20% cap, flooding the system with 2nd tier and then equalizing our pay and benefits in the not so distant future. I will be watching the language closely and sounding the alarm bells if and when they try it. I will vote NO and go on strike if I have to. Let's hope it doesn't have to come to that.

 

Yes thats exactly why I hope you are not a rep. Supposition, rumors are no way to spread lies and half truths to our friends and co workers. We have enough stress without rumor mongers spreading bs at every turn.

 

As far as I know negotiations haven't even started yet and in your mind the sky is falling.

 

Chill out------ Lets give the negotiators a chance to do whats best for 40,000 UAW Members

[theunionisforever]

Yes thats exactly why I hope you are not a rep. Supposition, rumors are no way to spread lies and half truths to our friends and co workers. We have enough stress without rumor mongers spreading bs at every turn.

 

As far as I know negotiations haven't even started yet and in your mind the sky is falling.

 

Chill out------ Lets give the negotiators a chance to do whats best for 40,000 UAW Members

 

If you call raising awareness of a potentially fatal pitfall in the contract negotiations starting a rumor then I am guilty as charged. If you are so concerned about the well being of our 40,000 union brothers and sisters then stop trying to censor the discussion board. I'm not even sure why you are being defensive about it? I've been at Ford long enough to see a steady decline in our way of life and I'm not willing to stand by and watch the rest slip away without a fight. Part of that fight is making sure people are aware of what can and will happen if that 20% cap is lifted in this contract. Bob King and the rest of the negotiators need to know that we are aware and watching their every move on this. Excuse me if I don't have 100% confidence in Bob King but when he pushed for more concessions including giving up the right to strike over wages and benefits, that did it for me. You would be hard pressed to find anyone on the floor that didn't lose some respect on that move.

[louie]

If you call raising awareness of a potentially fatal pitfall in the contract negotiations starting a rumor then I am guilty as charged. If you are so concerned about the well being of our 40,000 union brothers and sisters then stop trying to censor the discussion board. I'm not even sure why you are being defensive about it? I've been at Ford long enough to see a steady decline in our way of life and I'm not willing to stand by and watch the rest slip away without a fight. Part of that fight is making sure people are aware of what can and will happen if that 20% cap is lifted in this contract. Bob King and the rest of the negotiators need to know that we are aware and watching their every move on this. Excuse me if I don't have 100% confidence in Bob King but when he pushed for more concessions including giving up the right to strike over wages and benefits, that did it for me. You would be hard pressed to find anyone on the floor that didn't lose some respect on that move.

 

Your spewing rumors and supposition to a contract that hasn't even been negotiated yet, let alone I dont even think the parties have even started the process.

 

Yet with you, the following lies and nonsense has been written by you;

 

- Entry level cap is going to be lifted to 50%

 

- Our wages will be cut

 

-We will lose benefits

 

-We need everything back in this contract

 

-Job security is crap with no pay and benefits

 

-Add more work to your job station

 

-If you complain or refuse any additional tasks you are in effect "stealing" money from the pockets of your fellow Union brothers and sisters.

 

-You will still be penalized on your profit sharing.

 

-All You have to do is agree to lifting that pesky little 20% limitation on 2nd tier hiring.

 

- Hell! The company even sweetened the deal with a (((SIGNING BONUS)))!! This is a great day for our membership and I encourage everyone to get behind this agreement and vote YES!"

 

-Willingness to allow the company to hire an unlimited amount of 2nd tier workers has lead to a massive hiring spree!

 

- In fact, 2nd tier workers now outnumber our 1st tier "legacy cost" workers.

 

-Unfortunately the company can no longer afford the burden of paying these higher wages and benefits to these "legacy cost workers" and our new majority of 2nd tier workers can no longer tolerate working next to people making more money to do the same jobs.

 

- We will be offering a pay increase of $2/per hour to our 2nd tier workers. All you have to do is vote to "EQUALIZE" the pay and benefits of the "legacy cost" 1st tier workers. Unloading this financial burden from the company could also lead to an increase in the profit sharing scheme

 

 

You are hideous, and the negotiations haven't even started.

 

I personally put in a resolution not to lift the 20%. I know we cant get away from entry level but the IUAW should be able to hold the line on 20%

 

BTW Chicken Little to go over 20% the company would have to hire 8,000 new people above the 3,000 in ACH, an 11,000 new jobs swing, merely impossible in a 4 year agreement.

 

I am only being fair to the others on this board when you are called out on your supposition and rumors.

 

If the negotiators did lift the 20% (doubt it) I will stand by your side on this board and agree it is wrong. But now it is supposition and rumor to a negotiation process that hasn't even started yet.

If you want to contact a Negotiator, contact your Chairman or President. They should know at least one of the negotiators and they can pass on your support of not lifting the 20%

[theunionisforever]

You are hideous, and the negotiations haven't even started.

 

I personally put in a resolution not to lift the 20%. I know we cant get away from entry level but the IUAW should be able to hold the line on 20%

 

BTW Chicken Little to go over 20% the company would have to hire 8,000 new people above the 3,000 in ACH, an 11,000 new jobs swing, merely impossible in a 4 year agreement.

 

I am only being fair to the others on this board when you are called out on your supposition and rumors.

 

If the negotiators did lift the 20% (doubt it) I will stand by your side on this board and agree it is wrong. But now it is supposition and rumor to a negotiation process that hasn't even started yet.

If you want to contact a Negotiator, contact your Chairman or President. They should know at least one of the negotiators and they can pass on your support of not lifting the 20%

 

Wow! If you take everything out of context it does sound like supposition and rumor BUT if you read it as I wrote it AS A POSSIBLE SCENARIO then you would understand what I meant.

[louie]

I

The ach plants that are closed down, and just sitting there, let small business owners go in and use those plants for free to start up their businesses. Closed plants in the US do our country no good.

 

 

Yes,,,,, I would like to see those Chinese Sun Glass factories move in to old ACH locations

[Ford16]

This along with all of the posts I just read shows the "Head buried in the sand" or "Tunnel vision" that years of UAW coddling have done to UAW members. Would you rather make 30 bucks and hour...get no raise during what I believe will be a two or three year contract yet gain job security through the fact that Ford has to be able to compete globally with ALL automakers foreign and domestic? Cmon folks its a global economy now and like it or not this union has to evolve along with the changing world or it WILL DIE...This country is still in a recesssion no matter what anyone says...The economy only grew 1.8percent in the first half of the year and is only expected to be growing at between 2 to 3% by 2015(Normal growth that grows along with population growth is 5%) according to yesterdays USA today....This economy is soooo fragile and Ford could slip back into the abyss very easily. I understand all the talk of executive bonuses etc and agree they need to be checked but you people are as high as those Chrysler workers if you think you have even a slight chance of getting a raise...I think a profit sharing plan that includes Fords WORLDWIDE GLOBAL OPERATIONs profits is in order along with a clear mechanism that is easy to figure out what we are at bonus wise is in order....Bonuses are the wave of the future whether we like it or not

 

OMG.....I CAN'T BELIEVE THAT NICK A LIE IS WRITING THIS BS!....REMEMBER PEOPLE THIS IS THE CHAIRMAN THAT VOTED YES. NO, YES, NO, YES FOR THE CONCESSIONS, SO BY ALL MEANS BELIEVE WHATEVER HE SAYS IN ALL POSTS....

[lquidspine]

OMG.....I CAN'T BELIEVE THAT NICK A LIE IS WRITING THIS BS!....REMEMBER PEOPLE THIS IS THE CHAIRMAN THAT VOTED YES. NO, YES, NO, YES FOR THE CONCESSIONS, SO BY ALL MEANS BELIEVE WHATEVER HE SAYS IN ALL POSTS....

For the Record the Nick you are talking about (assuming the Nick that posts here is not the same Nick) admited he supported the March 2009 modifications and was rather outspoken and shunned by everyone from the Local to IUAW for how open he was against the October Mods.

 

Please keep the facts strait.

 

I too will admit I spoke out against both the 2009 modifications, I can look back and also admit I was wrong about the March mods, like it or not we helped set the groundwork for our brothers and sisters at GM and Chrysler who if the general public had their way would not have jobs today. The October Mod's I stand firm in that they where wrong and the membership spoke out and made the right choice once again when they came back to us in October.

[DTP Nick]

I wont be voting yes on anything Bob Spits out..

 

Allan needs to start finding other ways to save this company money instead of trying to take it out of the backs of the workers.

 

Start selling more vehicles also over in China and lobby for more and higher terrif taxes from china to the US. When it comes to the auto industry the US does not have a level playing field with these other countries.

 

Instead of closing factories down, start making other things in those factories and create jobs.

 

The ach plants that are closed down, and just sitting there, let small business owners go in and use those plants for free to start up their businesses. Closed plants in the US do our country no good.

Ya you wont be voting yes because you dont work for Ford anymore chucky....go to Burger King forums and post please

[dtpm]

OMG.....I CAN'T BELIEVE THAT NICK A LIE IS WRITING THIS BS!....REMEMBER PEOPLE THIS IS THE CHAIRMAN THAT VOTED YES. NO, YES, NO, YES FOR THE CONCESSIONS, SO BY ALL MEANS BELIEVE WHATEVER HE SAYS IN ALL POSTS....

 

Wow I guess you wanted your statement to really stand out. Almost looks to me like your trolling the site. Let's put something in place shall we. TWO times in a row he has been voted in as chairman. Obviously he is liked to the point where he is put in a position to speak for us. Let remember that during the time he has came in to the plant we have had Buyouts, Transfers, etc so it is not like the same people have been in the plant so obviously with all the churning something is connecting. As long as you have a team that is willing to work together and not go against one another we all win. FOCUS NEEDS TO BE WHERE IS HAS TO BE, NOT WHERE SOME CHOOSE IT TO BE....

 

FS

[gatorman925]

You also state that"new fuel standards etc will eat into profits etc........Maybe you should stop being a mindless robot and voting a straight Democratic ticket because they are the "greens" that want all of these crazy expensive fuel standards in place within ten years(Thank Obama too as he is a big proponent of this which hurts automakers and in effect UAW members) Its funny how people will all of the sudden care about the companies costs when their compensation is tied to its performance...Think people...be objective....Like Bob king is preaching this is the new UAW not your father or grandfathers union that held the company hostage for decades

Ya great lets give in and give ford what they want! We need what we gave up back or a no vote for me! You guys are ridiculous. Quit sucking ass and grow some balls. Alan gets millions and we get nothing but some silly maybe profit sharing bonus. If thats the case a no vote is in store. We need to stick up for what we deserve! If we give in now we are done for any respect in the future.

[dtpm]

Ya great lets give in and give ford what they want! We need what we gave up back or a no vote for me! You guys are ridiculous. Quit sucking ass and grow some balls. Alan gets millions and we get nothing but some silly maybe profit sharing bonus. If thats the case a no vote is in store. We need to stick up for what we deserve! If we give in now we are done for any respect in the future.

 

What really needs to happen is Long Term. Back 20 or so years ago the UAW sat on it's butt thinking they did not need the southern states to become part of the UAW. Look at how the economy is today and why it is as far as wages and understand that the Transplants used this against us and sure it took the collapse of the auto industry to push it down our throats. Flip it around and say the UAW organized the southern states 20 years ago and kept pushing the meaning of the Union into families everywhere. You have two things that could have happend: 1. the Transplants might not have built products or plants in those southern states and if they did the wages would not be so far apart. 2. The big 3 could have expanded into those states along with the union to keep up with demand. Why do you think they built plants here, hire workers at a way lower wage, threaten to close a plant if they do side with the UAW.

 

Everyone has to understand that if those plants wages were close to what they should be our own pay would never be an issue. These contracts that are about to be settled will either make is easier to organize southern plants or make it difficult. We need those plants to come into the UAW to help us all. I hope that because of the situation Chrysler and GM are in will force a modest gain at best because they do not want an arbitrator doing it. Whatever we get hopefully it sparks a light into the southern plants employees and gets them thinking they are better off. Well see as Wall Street watches as with the whole world...