Rank and File meeting on second Tier pay

[lquidspine]

I really dont understand why you continue to ignore the fact that the higher the entry level the lower out labor rates to gain job security and the fact we have nearly 3,000 entry level waged members now.

 

As stated below we are pattern with GM and Chrysler on hourly rate of pay and health benefits yet their labor rates are much lower than ours. (not healthy)

 

Why???? Because they are in the hiring mode bringing shifts of entry level on and blowing us out of the water on wages and investment. Ford is high on labor rates..... $58 per hour is troublesome, yes better than $70 per hour but I am hopeful the IUAW will negotiate more product and investments based on hiring more entry level to get us competitive with GM and Chrysler. An impossible task to even hit 20%.( A hiring frenzy of 7,500 new people will not happen in 4 years to hit the 20% anyways)

 

Also add the shift at TCAP to the numbers below that are mostly reloaded temorary full timers. You will quickly see that we are closer to 3,000 people at entry level wages. A benefit to gain a lower wage rate. The current $58 per hour is not attainable by VEBA alone. The close to 3,000 Entry Level waged currently working knocks down our labor rates substantionally.

 

 

 

_________________________________________

 

 

Current labor rates for product and investments in USA/UAW facilities

 

Chrysler $51 per hour - Higher entry level utilization than Ford entry level

 

GM $55 per hour - Higher entry level utilization than Ford entry level but less than Chrysler

 

Ford $58 per hour - Entry Level just under 100 members, LTS negotiated in 2007 around 800. Dropped our labor rates substantially from the 2007 $70 per hour rate as well as the VEBA and COLA.

 

_________________________________________

 

Transition ALL LTS to entry level plus fill the CAP 3rd shift ( 1,100 people), LAP shortages with 3 shifts (1,200 people), MAP 3rd shift (manning shortfall 200 people).

 

Once the 2007 investment windfall takes full effect these entry level needs will be hired ------> 2,500 new jobs>>>>>> Lowering our rates (closer to GM and Chrysler) again to get even more product in our under utilized Engine, Transmission and Stamping plants with another 4 year commitment of assembly cycle plans.

 

I am thoroughly impressed with the vision of the UAW and the ultimate success in job security for our entire UAW-Ford membership in the worst economic conditions this country has ever seen.

Just as I do not understand why you continue to ignore the fact that as soon as VEBA took over retiree health care our labor rates droped $30 per hour, there have always been temps to varrying degrees. The entry level has not droped our hourly labor rate Yet, Not saying it wont but it has not yet what part of that do you not understand ?

Edited July 24, 2011 by lquidspine

[Dale143]

Tier One employees could take a pay cut. Why does all of the sacrifice have to on the part of the entry level workers? It's really hard to make it on 14.00. You guys could spare 3.00 and hour and bring us up to 17.00 or 18.00 an hour- Brother.

 

(Deep breath)

 

"Why does all of the sacrifice have to be on the part of the entry level workers? "

 

Excuse me! And just what sacrifices did YOU make?.Didn't you agree to your wages and benefits when you hired in?You could have said "no ...I'm not satisfied with what you have to offer...I think I'll look else wear .But you didn't.You excepted the terms of your employment and you hired in. You made no sacrifices! ALL sacrifices have been made by legacy employees.WE made our lives on our pay scale, We bought our homes ,cars,furniture,took our vacations and even chose how many children we would have all based on our pay rate. As our pay grew we grew a little more,got to do a little more,raised our 401k contributions a little more put a little more in savings for our future .

Then the bottom fell out.How long has it been since we had a raise ,cola,etc.! What happened to our benefits?Vacation? what vacation ,i cant afford a vacation.Last place i went to was main...main part of my back yard.Good thing my kids are all grown and have there own cars because i cant afford to take them anywhere.That second car that took them to school and Dr.appointments is long gone and not replaced. We are loosing everything we worked our lives for.401k is down to practically nothing do to hardship withdrawals.Savings has depleted do to supplementing needed monthly expenditures.It goes on and on.For me more concessions is out of the question!

You hired in at a certain rate so you need to base your life on that.I guarantee you can find a house as nice as mine at half the cost do to drop in value because of a foreclosure or something.Who knows..it may be mine because I'm pretty darn close to losing it.The economy has gotten worse for those who are established and better for those who are just starting out.

Exodus 20:17

THOU SHALT NOT COVET: thy neighbor's house - wife, etc. - Covet signifies to desire or long after, in order to enjoy as a property the person or thing .

This one is for you and me brother.

Psalm 118:24 This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

[Empire]

Just as I do not understand why you continue to ignore the fact that as soon as VEBA took over retiree health care our labor rates droped $30 per hour, there have always been temps to varrying degrees. The entry level has not droped our hourly labor rate Yet, Not saying it wont but it has not yet what part of that do you not understand ?

 

 

First I would like to ask how $70 - $30 = $58

 

Second I understand we only have around 100 entry level now. Hardly enough to lower 40,000 of our master level wages.

 

Please read my post again cut and paste below

 

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

 

"I really dont understand why you continue to ignore the fact that the higher the entry level the lower out labor rates to gain job security and the fact we have nearly 3,000 entry level waged members now."

 

I said entry level waged----- Understand??? That's 3,000 members that earn entry level type wages. That is a significant amount of people to substantially lower our rates to the current $58 per hour. The VEBA and COLA included with the 3,000 lowered our rates to $58.

 

Is that so hard to understand???

 

I'm trying to be polite, but please read and understand the posts before you respond.

[lquidspine]

First I would like to ask how $70 - $30 = $58

 

Second I understand we only have around 100 entry level now. Hardly enough to lower 40,000 of our master level wages.

 

Please read my post again cut and paste below

 

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

 

"I really dont understand why you continue to ignore the fact that the higher the entry level the lower out labor rates to gain job security and the fact we have nearly 3,000 entry level waged members now."

 

I said entry level waged----- Understand??? That's 3,000 members that earn entry level type wages. That is a significant amount of people to substantially lower our rates to the current $58 per hour. The VEBA and COLA included with the 3,000 lowered our rates to $58.

 

Is that so hard to understand???

 

I'm trying to be polite, but please read and understand the posts before you respond.

That $30 per hour labor rate was based on 54,000 employees, not the 40,000 we currently have. Did you not even read either of the links I provided ?

Also we use to have these things called TPT's, you know the temporary part timers that would only work on mondays and fridays. So you could almost call that a wash with current entry level waged employment numbers.

 

Again I am not arguing the long term labor cost when entry level get more around the 20% cap I am talking about right now, I will repeat the single biggest item that has helped close the gap between foreign auto's and the D3 is when retiree health care droped off the companies books.

 

 

Too answer louie; there really is no good resolution that can come from this meeting, unless this country reworks its trade agreements to truely be fair, otherwise we will continue to compete with workers around the world that live in poverty and the working class will be sucked down to whoever is the cheapest all over the world.

[americanmade]

The big difference is I have spent 20 years working here at ford, and hired in at full wage you knew what you were going to get and took the job. Stop your whining.

Amen Brother!

[snoopy]

Tier One employees could take a pay cut. Why does all of the sacrifice have to on the part of the entry level workers? It's really hard to make it on 14.00. You guys could spare 3.00 and hour and bring us up to 17.00 or 18.00 an hour- Brother.

DO your time and give your sweat and blood as other high seniority people have and then we will talk about bring you to our rate. The Corporate America would love nothing more then to have us slaves to them. Since when to we digress in this country. We should always progress. Corporate America should bring the Asians to our standard of living instead of us going back in time to the days of oppress sweat shops and depressed pay. Take your head out of your ass so you can see what is going on here. In a capitalist society, every year the company needs to make more then the previous year. Since when do they progress and expect the worker to digress? I urge everyone to tell BOB KING that he is out of touch with the worker and that he needs to remember who pays the union dues around here. He also needs to be reminded of the boos he received at the hands of the workers at the birth place of our union, Local 600. The workers are together on this and we will vote NO to this bullshit contract. We have not had a raise in 8 years and we gave about 15000+ per man backed to the company who bull shited there way out of equal sacrifice. And in addition, the line of crap about our equal sacrifice grievance is yet to be revealed. I say No to anything less then a raise and profit-sharing bonuses. GIVE US OUR COLA back.And settle the equal sacrifice grievance NOW. Down with BOB KING and Down with Corporate Greed.

[Empire]

DO your time and give your sweat and blood as other high seniority people have and then we will talk about bring you to our rate. The Corporate America would love nothing more then to have us slaves to them. Since when to we digress in this country. We should always progress. Corporate America should bring the Asians to our standard of living instead of us going back in time to the days of oppress sweat shops and depressed pay. Take your head out of your ass so you can see what is going on here. In a capitalist society, every year the company needs to make more then the previous year. Since when do they progress and expect the worker to digress? I urge everyone to tell BOB KING that he is out of touch with the worker and that he needs to remember who pays the union dues around here. He also needs to be reminded of the boos he received at the hands of the workers at the birth place of our union, Local 600. The workers are together on this and we will vote NO to this bullshit contract. We have not had a raise in 8 years and we gave about 15000+ per man backed to the company who bull shited there way out of equal sacrifice. And in addition, the line of crap about our equal sacrifice grievance is yet to be revealed. I say No to anything less then a raise and profit-sharing bonuses. GIVE US OUR COLA back.And settle the equal sacrifice grievance NOW. Down with BOB KING and Down with Corporate Greed.

 

 

HHHHHhhhhmmmmm...................

 

Negotiations haven't even started yet.

 

You are already voting no????

 

I hope you are not in a leadership position with the Jim Jones Kool aide you're serving up.

[louie]

HHHHHhhhhmmmmm...................

 

Negotiations haven't even started yet.

 

You are already voting no????

 

I hope you are not in a leadership position with the Jim Jones Kool aide you're serving up.

 

Exactly...........

 

These "vote no" on a contract people, on a contract that has not been negotiated shows that the ability to lead people and make rational decisions is beyond their scope of proper decision making and negotiating skills.

 

Follow groups like this and we will all be unemployed sooner or later.

[lquidspine]

Exactly...........

 

These "vote no" on a contract people, on a contract that has not been negotiated shows that the ability to lead people and make rational decisions is beyond their scope of proper decision making and negotiating skills.

 

Follow groups like this and we will all be unemployed sooner or later.

While I can agree they are not always right or offer solutions to our problems. You can not deny the fact if not for the efforts of groups like Autoworkers Caravan, Ford workers would be under the same restriction GM and Chrysler are going into this years negotiations.

[snoopy]

Exactly...........

 

These "vote no" on a contract people, on a contract that has not been negotiated shows that the ability to lead people and make rational decisions is beyond their scope of proper decision making and negotiating skills.

 

Follow groups like this and we will all be unemployed sooner or later.

 

 

Louie, your a jackass. They have been talking in the press for over two years what they will be negotiating. So piss off jackass and get back under the desk.

[Empire]

Louie, your a jackass. They have been talking in the press for over two years what they will be negotiating. So piss off jackass and get back under the desk.

 

 

Louie tells it like it is............No spin but the truth

 

Most of the sheep that listen to the wafflewitz dribble cant fathom the truth so they hate on him like you joker

 

 

You want the truth????? Louie dishes out the truth -----------You cant handle the truth

[lquidspine]

Louie tells it like it is............No spin but the truth

 

Most of the sheep that listen to the wafflewitz dribble cant fathom the truth so they hate on him like you joker

 

 

You want the truth????? Louie dishes out the truth -----------You cant handle the truth

Ok lets get on with the truth then shall we? The same guy that is being bashed in this thread ( Gary), made a motion at the 2010 Con Con , but most of the sheep followed the heard and voted down a resolution that would tie in executive UAW pay with what they negotiate for the members. Simply put if they where able to make gains on negotiated contract they themselves would get a pay raise, instead that resolution had a few supporters and the sheep outvoted the Delegates that where asking for what the employees want.

 

When the Executive pay raise came to vote , well that passed rather easily with only a handfull of people speaking out. Like Spring already said in another thread, the sucking sound could be heard on the Detroit river at that convention.

[lightsout]

All I am saying is that we are now a house divided. Tier One has their own interest and Tier Two has their own interest. We are fighting amongst each other about who is sacrificing what and forgetting that the Union was founded on Solidarity. Sticking together but we can't now because we have different interest.

[paintengr]

A little Justice for all, some of us LTS have been here quite a while waiting for our chance.Took pay cuts and did good work for the company and the union.When I hired in as a TPT, Temp, Super temp, now LTS it was for a traditional job and wages that was the offer back then. 7 years ago. Took a $ 10.00 pay cut and holidays too.I'm still waiting as there is nothing better now. I'm working good and making ends meet, just think of us LTS temps as people too with families we ARE paying our dues too and have been.