jpd80

Is it A Dodge? 2006 Ford Falcon XR8 Cop Car 2006 VZ Commodore SS Cop Car (Model before Zeta) A bit of a photoshop.....

What's the internal room like, wider than a Crown Vic? More legroom as well?

So an an "uneducated Aussie" which car market is the Interceptor aimed at, the 300C? Or is it more a toe in the water Crown Victoria replacement? Or is it something completely different again?

Stop the blame game. Find the bottle necks, streamline the process. Develop a feed back loop between the design engineers and production team leaders, that way what works stays and what doesn't is engineered out. More likely, the overall problem, a claimed 43% extra in "labor costs" is an accumulation of small hiccups and delays throughout the entire process from design to finished product. This is where Mulally's questioning mind is needed most. This is not an easy process but it's vital to stay with Toyota.

Honeycomb grille, another 35 year old idea. Suits the car's styling though.

That makes sense, the VE Commodore was released august 2006 so by the end of 2008 it would have panel changes for a newer VF Commodore to answer Ford AUS 2008 Orion Falcon.

I can understand the lengthening and widening of the Mustang shell on the interceptor. If that works it will be a huge coup as I think GM's Zeta is locked into wheel base only variations. This Interceptor is a concept and still no where near ready for production. I see it as a whole heap of styling effots meerly as a teaser to see if they get a WOW and inwhich areas. When the Mustang boys have something ready for production I'm sure FOA will be waiting open armed to greet them.( jlsaylor, You took my comment on Broadmeadows the wrong way.) Using a double wishbone front end and a double wishbone alloy IRS in a D2C base is a welcome but big change don't you think? Perhaps Mustang now has access to different suspension parts or maybe the floorpan and suspension were surplus from another cancelled concept, this would explain the non use of the control blade IRS, a much cheaper and more effective rear end. Perhaps the Mustang team have thrown out a lot of engineering WOW as well to see what comes back from several divisions' engineers saying we can build that. What a perfect thought starter for Ford's engineering groups to turn this idea into one of the most economical and viable production ready models on the runway. We still have some barriers to break down but the walls aren't that high. I'm thinking, Mustang, Falcon, Thunderbird, Galaxie plus a bunch of Lincoln and Mercury variations. That's before we start talking about derivatives like SUVs and half-chassis light commercials. jlsaylor, No where in my posts in "Mulally Fords Most Important Model" or this forum did I say or insuate that the falcon platform was superior to D2C. Please re read all of our posts and you'll see it 's true. The Mustang was offered many years ago it the 1990s?. It wasn't dismissed out of hand by FOA, seems F NA wanted all the costs of development dropped on FOA and the sums didn't add up. Btw, Loved the "taste Kangaroo" bit , LOL!

It's easy to sucker punch when things are tough but, if you have the right equipment in a good package , persistance pays off. Getting that flywheel of loyal return consumers, guaranteed sales is money in the bank - something ford needs now.I hope they stick with efficient engines even though horsepower may not be quite there, the torque sure is. I think some competitor's engines are about to run foul of the new EPA regulations. Some of that cheaper and older power shortcuts GM and Chrysler have may be a blind alley.

So what are the right move to do between now and 2009? How do you consolidate and improve that segment? Boost sales by a limited option pack of a 6-speed auto as fitted to your 5.4 in Expedition(?) and maybe some other extras at a small premium? Some good advertising campaigns?

Those G8s may be a "loss leader" to sweeten the patch before the arrival of Camaro and GTO. Previously in Australia, Holden would offer their Commodores to large fleets at 40% discount of retail price and theres every chance FOA did the same. During 2006 Holden trimmed this back to 22% discount off retail so bare with me as I show you the math: Holden SS-V / Pontiac G8 RRP = AUS$46,000 or US$35,800 Assume 40% Discount for USA = AUS$18,400 or US$14,352 Our new Landed Price for USA = AUS$27,600 or US$21,528 These prices don't include shipping prices or OTR Charges but I think you get the Idea. I don't think they would settle for the 22% discount as the price would end up around US$28K to US$30K and probably stagnate sales. If Lutz is to believed, you guys are about to get the deal of a lifetime.

FoA has already stated they had no input. Perhaps this is something beyond D2C and Falcon with all the benefits of both and no drawbacks. With the ability to style to local tastes, there would be no complaints and release smaller markets from a ton of financial burden.

I'm just curious, given the Interceptor is Mustang D2C based, why have they used a double wishboned front end? Would this be a durability issue or is it more likely pinched from a Crown Victoria with a similar width track to make the concept more easily ? Suspension Front....................... Double wishbone-independent Rear.........................3-Link Design with Panhard Rod I'm not being a wise guy, I'm just curious as to how they actually developed such a big car from a compact coupe. If the roof was raised a bit and a companion intermediate length chassis (114") developed, it might have a real chance outside the USA

Exactly

D2C was a cheap platform developed to kick start the all New / Retro Mustang - well done! How many parts remain common to the Mustang after you finish making your 4-Door. You have no idea of the engineering you're speaking of and the funding needed to make the changes to D2C. If it's below a certain percentage the Engineering and Finance Departments would call it a new platform and bang, there goes your finance for the project. That's how it was until recently. All I can tell you is there is another side to the story you've been told and things aren't what they seem. Back in 2003 Ford AUS approached Jac Nasser (an Aussie) then in charge of Ford North America about basing the next mustang on a BA Falcon. The Americans flatly refused and said "Not with our Mustang" and I guess rightly so, i't not right to fiddle with icons. Ford NA then quickly developed an "economical version" of a current platform to stop any further unwanted incursions. OK, You win Your whole arguement is a moot point. This is supposed to be a place where we share constructive criticism but I find your tone agressive and adversarial towards Ford Australia and frankly, I cannot be a participant. This is the last post I will make on this subject.

LOL, Maybe old Lutzy has dyslexia of the mouth. Anyway we'll have to wait for Chicargo.....or anothe Lutz interview If true, it means a new round of Car Wars, now that's gotta be good for sales. BTW, Also, Ford Australia insiders have said that we "shouldn't be surprised" if we see the E8 Falcon platform under a production version of the Interceptor so personally I think we'll see the Falcon platform in the USA although Ford, as usual, is keeping all of their cards close to their chest.

Insiders at Ford Australia have said that we "shouldn't be surprised" if we see the E8 platform under a production version of the Interceptor so personally I think we'll see the Falcon platform in the USA although Ford, as usual, is keeping all of their cards close to their chest.

Remember, this is Bob Lutz letting information slip before he should. The model he spoke of and confirmed by Holden Australia chief Denny Mooney is the Commodore SS-V, a luxury version of the V8 SS sports Commodore. This is the only model slated and the exports will come from South Australia's Elizabeth plant which is already producing these LHD models badged as Chev Luminas for the Middle East. The hold-up is for Federalisation (US$15 Million & red tape) Bob Lutz indicated two volumes - 30,000 and if they get the price right, 50,000. If Lutz's price of US$25,000 is to be believed then Pontiac are going for the throat with 50,000 order, otherwise I recon it could be more like US$28,000, for a 30,000 shipment - still a reasonable price. Seems like other people can make cheap platforms besides Ford and their D2C eh ?

Sorry mate , missed your question. Commodore is very similar to CTS_V in overall dimensions. It's about Fusion length, 114" wheelbase, and about as wide as a Fivehundred, interior is big. For the record: Length: 4894mm 192.67" Width: 1899mm 74.76" Height: 1476mm 58.11" Wheelbase: 2915mm 114.76" Track Front: 1592mm 62.67" Track Rear: 1608mm 63.30" Leg Room Front: 1071mm 42.16" LegRoom Rear: 1001mm 39.41" Shoulder room Front: 1501mm 59.90" Shoulder Room Rear: 1499mm 59.01" Head Room Front: 985mm 38.77" Head Room Rear: 965mm 37.99" Hip Room Front: 1439mm 56.65" Hip Room Rear: 1472mm 57.95" By comparison the current Aussie Fakcon has 111.3" wheelbase, O/A Length193" and about 1.5" narrower than Commodore. Next Orion Falcon will have existing wheelbase shorter trunk and slightly wider body. (Between Fusion and Fivehundred) Hope this helps your research http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/action...ta?modelid=4000

I hear what you're saying Blackhorse. I sense that the 30,000 to 50,000 loose-lips-Lutz spoke about may only be as a stop gap measure until NA gets up and rolling with their own Zetas. Holden have had a Mustang for over 12 months to compare their car against so you can imagine what went on there. I just wished they would call it what it is, a Pontiac Commodore SS. That Monaro (GTO) was designed by two Holden Engineers in their own time, as a case for our Aussie Monaro and was based on the 1997-2002 Commodore. GM bosses loved it so much so that the Monaro made it to production (an extremely cheap but already dated style). By the time export was approved the style of the Commodore had moved on to sharper lines and a more squared off style, pity this wasn't included in the GTO. The truth was that the GTO was a small toe in the water to see if a GTO would fly, the advanced age of the styling meant a car penned in 1999 was still selling in 2006. By this time a Zeta Commodores were in full swing with the former GTO plant in Elizabeth being changed over to produce more Holden LHD Chev Luminas and Caprices for the Middle East. Frankly there was no room to keep producing the outdated LHD GTO. That's what killed it. It was never the full broadway production others made it out to be, the UAW also made sure of that (10,000 cars/year max. from memory) but it also wet GM fans apptite for more and better. it was all over for the GTO in 2006 when production of the export LHD Zeta Commodores and Caprices commenced in August. . Damned frustrating when some posters bag our local cars as though the were developed some third world dump. Our Commodores and Falcons go through all the same rigours as any car developed in NA. For all intents and purposes they are as good as or better than anything out of Detroit. Both Aussie Falcons and Commodores have been fully assessed and tested in North America by their respective parents including NA crash testing and emissions (Now Euro 3 and closing in on US regs). The estimated cost of Federalising the Commodore was US$15 Million but, I Ford AUS hasn't done this with the Falcon - no business case you see and no LHD engineering in current model anyway (next model will be LHD compatible though) Motor companies like ford and GM are sensitive to the styling needs of buyers in NA, Europe and AUS. If not we would all be driving lowest common denominator Corollas and Camrys. After all, that's what sets Ford, GM and Chrysler apart from Toyota, the chance for regional styling changes. I would expect that the Pontiac boys will make changes to the front and rear clips as needed for a "new improved all American Series II" . Looking to the future, I see good things with re organisation of platforms and the retention of local engineers and stylists. I'm ever hopeful of three super platform families: 1. A small FWD/AWD platform for the likes of "Fiesta", "Focus" and "Mondeo" including a small SUV/MPV 2. A large FWD/AWD platform for the likes of "Fusion" and "Fivehundred" and including a medium SUV/MPV 3. A large RWD/AWD platform for the likes of "Mustang" and "Falcon" "Torino" and "Thunderbird" and including a large SUV/MPV Maybe I'm wrong but if you start with good adaptable foundations, most divisions can style almost anything on it.

Mate you're full of it. You're trying to comment on cars you've never seen but I see every day. I've seen your NA cars quality in the flesh as well so don't go there my friend. This is a well built car with quality up the kazoo. Even panel gaps set at 3mm (1/8") big cabin with heaps of room, more than your Crown Victoria They do 1/4 mile in 13.5 , verysimilar overall dimensions similar to CTS-V. The LWB Caprice does 13.9 with 6-speed auto (about Town car size inside) With the name, I would have preferred they called it what it is, a Pontiac Commodore SS. Lutz has already stated the price will be around US$25,000. If they imported the 6 cylinder it would sell just under US$20,000. Also, The GTO didnt fail, they ended up selling over 40,000 restricted inporting imposed by UAW. NA sales helped subsidise the comparatbly low production run of local Monaros in AUS. Once again, I seriously doubt that the detractors of this car ever bothered test driving it. remember, it also paved the way for the new Camaro and a Future GTO.

Funny thing is the GM boards are all over it and the people passing judgement on it haven't driven it or seen it in the flesh. I have and Ford NA will disregard this car like they did with the GTO (Monaro). That car stirred up a hornet's nest of emotions over at GM Everyone had strong opinions fore and against. It was only the price that really held it back but, if the G8 goes on sale at the expected US$25,000 then I think they'll do ok. Do any americans drive stick anymore? If so this is a car for you, a real driver's car with a good IRS that excells on the twisty bits. Here's one we prepared earlier: Ve Commodore Drifting

Expected price of US$25,000. Gee, I wonder if Ford NA could import some 2008 GT Falcons, the SS-V Commodore's Aussie Rival for the same price? Now that would be interesting....

In the overall cost of a project, engineering a different nose or tail clip and door skins is cheep, just gotta get the right input at design stage. That's where all the engineering groups sharing a platform have their say. After spending US$800 Million on its VE Commodore, Holden developed the LWB Statesman and caprice for the trifiling sum of US150 Million. Imagine Ford NA "buying a coup or a LWB version of the 2008 Falcon, $150 Million each, and how much did the last update of the CV cost, $300 Million?

I think "shared sheetmetal" is short hand for common engineering programs, like Aussie Holden Zetas shares with new NA Camaro. Looks like two different cars but under the skin the Zeta shell is designed for 110", 114" and 118" wheelbases. The whole side frame and rear panel is stamped in one and that's where the difference starts but, the unitary chassis are blood brothers.

Are we going to see weekly or monthly conferences between all of the engineering groups like Mulally does with his managers? If, so this will speed the process up no end. Go you good thing!!!!!