Len_A

You are largely correct. And yes, where to put product is a business decision, except in this case, they will have the influence of IG Metall in that decision.

Not really. Would more likely be a bitch slap to Corker, Norquist, et al, from IG Metall, one of the most militant unions in the manufacturing world, and not an organization I would choose to f**k with. Look how much trouble they, and their German government allies, have given GM on trying to cut Opal's losses. And then also keep in mind that one of VW's biggest shareholders is the government of the German province where VW is headquartered. The whole "worker co-determination" thing is not only big in Germany, it's huge, and the since VW badly wants a worker council in Tennessee, like they have every where else in the world, they needed the UAW to win. The y're going to have a hell of a time setting up a council where the workers (hourly) are independently represented, wihtout a union. Almost anything they set up would be viewed as a company sponsored union, which is illegal under American labor law.

Form an independent union? Possible? Technically yes, practically very, very difficult. Personally, I would find it very ironic if the involvement of people like Corker led the Tennessee plant to lose product opportunity to Mexico. What is telling is that Corker, Norquist, et al have yet to be heard from on this latest news.

http://www.freep.com/article/20140219/BUSINESS0104/302190171/Volkswagen-UAW-Germany-labor-UAW "I can imagine fairly well that another VW factory in the United States, provided that one more should still be set up there, does not necessarily have to be assigned to the South again," Osterloh said in a report published Wednesday by German newspaper Sueddeutsche Zeitung. "If co-determination isn't guaranteed in the first place, we as workers will hardly be able to vote in favor."

Agreed, 100%, on both your points. Life at hard labor is hardly a slap on the wrist. I used to be a big proponent of the death penalty. Not any more. For the death penalty to be justified, you have to have complete trust in the police, the prosecutors, and the judges. I've had the unfortunate experience of dealing with some corrupt ones, on minor matters. Since, in my opinion, there can not be 100% trust in the system, I'm not in favor of anything that could result in taking the life of someone, who later on, turns out to be innocent. Confidence in the system isn't a separate issue. It's an important part of it. As far as it being a deterrent, capital punishment has never proven to be an effective deterrent. What it's really good at, is giving society something that feels like justifiable vengeance, something I completely understand, but, again, without absolute 100% confidence in the system, I am loath to try justifying killing anyone, on the chance that later on, it turns out he or she wasn't guilty. I know there those who disagree with me, but given the fact that I don't trust cops, prosecutors, and judges, in any way, shape or form, given the fact that I've personally seen them start with a conclusion, and work their case backwards from there to make the "facts" fit their conclusion (albeit it was on something very minor), I won't debate an opinion not shared with me. Anyone who disagrees with me is entitled to their opinion, I'm entitled to mine, and on this subject, I won't participate in a debate. I no longer trust the system at all, let alone enough to support the death penalty for anything.

http://www.kswo.com/story/24749088/europe-at-origin-of-chronic-us-execution-dilemma

I don't think it determined the outcome, but it didn't help. Still, there's nothing illegal about it.

VW vote shows Detroit and labor still have bad raps to shake: http://www.freep.com/article/20140216/COL06/302160149/Tom-Walsh-UAW-Volkswagen-Bob-King

Like I said, the UAW is finished. No coming back from this.

nice!

I'm pro union, but this puts the nail in the coffin for the UAW. They're finished.

http://www.freep.com/article/20140214/BUSINESS0104/302140095/uaw-volkswagen-chattanooga http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20140214/AUTO0104/302140116/Tennessee-Volkswagen-workers-reject-UAW-representation

This is interesting. Remember, as you read this, that the bonus is equal to 62% of base wages or salary, not 62% of total compensation. For the mathematically challenged, it means that their base wages/annual salary is around $53325. Plus the $33025 profit sharing. read: http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2014/02/01/american-factory-workers-getting-33029-yearly-bonu.aspx

I've been a member for a long time.I'm fine with your moderating.

And I love how you jump on a settlement on less than half a billion dollars, out of over eleven billion dollars, in debt. This judge is going to allow Orr to stick it to the banks. The settlement you referred to was still a loss to banks of twenty-five cents on the dollar, on debt that was specifically backed up by a dedicated income stream. What do you think is going to happen to the rest of the debt that has no dedicated, flush income stream to back it up? They (the banks) are going to get hosed, and they deserve it. They've known for the better part of a decade that Detroit's property tax and income tax revenue was in a free fall. As far as the retirees, I have some very limited sympathy for them, but almost a quarter of that $11 billion in debt was to prop up the two pension funds, that the Detroit Free Press had illustrated gross incompetence in their administration. A thirteenth annual pension payment, when the stock market investments are tanking? Seriously? Shit real estate investments? Are you f*cking kidding me? Administrators taking expensive trips to get information they could have easily found on-line? No way. And as a Westland,MI resident (for all you non-residents of Michigan, a western Detroit suburb), I'm supposed to see my state income tax used to prop the Detroit retirees up, when my retirement savings were completely eliminated, not just decimated, but eliminated by four-and-a-half years of unemployment, my wife with two bachelors degrees (at above 3.75 GPA's), and over twenty-five years experience is out of work still after over sixteen months, and we're inching closer to our own eventual bankruptcy, with no one, not even my own extended family, calling for anyone to come help us? I'll repeat myself - no f*cking way. I have some limited sympathy for the retirees, but I absolutely think it's completely justifiable for them to take it in the ass. And as a Detroit suburb resident, I voted in favor of the regional tax for the Detroit Institute of Arts, and I want absolutely no art to be sold ever to help one person outside of DIA. I'm all in favor of both Oakland County Executive Brooks Paterson and Macomb County Executive Mark Hackel, who are on record as saying regional art institute tax is null and void if they sell one piece of art. To hell with Detroit, their retirees and their municipal unions.

It still remains that the remainder of the over $11 billion in debt is offered at ten cents on the dollar.

Please cite your source. According to these articles, and I've been following this since it began, Orr offered the banks pennies on teh dollar, under ten cents on teh dollar, they balked,and he filed for bankruptcy. http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/06/07/detroit-to-offer-creditors-pennies-on-the-dollar/2399333/ http%3a//www.freep.com/article/20130606/NEWS01/306070018/Detroit-bankruptcy-Kevyn-Orr-creditors - "Detroit’s attempt to avoid bankruptcy will hit a critical stage next week as emergency manager Kevyn Orr brings together dozens of creditors to present a stark offer: less than 10 cents on the dollar for the loans, bonds, retiree obligations and other debts that have been strangling the city for years." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/07/detroit-to-offer-creditors_n_3402116.html (yes, even liberal blog HuffPost reported the same thing, linking to the Detroit Free PRess article. http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/nation/jan-june13/detroit_06-14.html - PBS - "Painful Options Ahead: Detroit to Default on $2.5 Billion Debt" What you're referring to is, which I can cite here, http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20130716/NEWS01/130719842/if-signed-orrs-deal-with-banks-would-reduce-detroits-swaps-debt-by-25, is on 75 cents on the dollar from Detroit on $343.6 million in swaps liabilities, out of over $11.5 billion in total debt, and tied to tax revenue from Detroit three casinos, and only on that revenue and debt. The rest of Detroit's debt, the offer stands at ten cents on the dollar. Nothing has changed.

He offered the banks no more than 10 cents on the dollar. What large payout are you talking about?

I'm not surprised. He's always had this affinity for Detroit, and Detroit iron. It shows every time he talks about this area.

I noticed that, too. Watching NBC's coverage last night, my wife & I laughed our asses off when Brian Williams, referring to all the Ford police vehicles, said it looked like every Crown Victoria ever made was involved. Saw plenty of Taurus and Explorer police cars, too.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20130123/DA402P704.html Disturbing...

Excellent video. Thanks for posting.

ROFLMAO! Boy, is it going to cost him to remove that!!

Nick, all the political vitriol has kept me out of here, I'll tell you that. Haven't posted here in a long, LONG time. Tired of all of it.

Being the adult child of an hourly Detroit autoworker (now retired), and in a business career, this is the kind of crap that has led me, over the past few years, to never let any of my more recent colleagues know that I come from a UAW family. This crap is more than just embarrassing, and I live in Metro Detroit.