7Mary3

BTW- the order bank for the 2024 F-650 and F-750 was supposed to open 11/14. Any news about 2024 changes?

Sorry to say not at all. Getting out of heavy truck and committing KTP to the then-new Super Duty allowed Ford to stay competitive with GM and FCA in the far more profitable light truck market. Ford should have left heavy truck sometime in the late 80's before starting on the HN80 program.

Brings up a question: Was Ford actively 'marketing' their heavy truck division or was Freightliner's offer unsolicited?

I remember there were a few Sterling-branded LCF Fuso's too. Cleveland, huh? Seems to me there was a truck manufacturer there that was big in vocational for a number of years.......

You may remember that Freightliner, a Daimler company at the time, bought Ford's heavy truck operation right before Daimler 'merged' with Chrysler, creating DaimlerChrysler. I heard some thought was given to naming the former Ford trucks 'Ram'. Maybe there was something to that, Stering sold a version of the Ram 4500/5500.

I don't believe it was. Freightliner put a lot of money into the HN80, beyond the expenses of moving the assembly line to Canada. Freightliner made many needed improvements to the truck and even expanded the line to include medium duty models (Acterra). Ironically Ford's plans were to eventually replace the medium duty F series with a medium duty HN80. Sterling hung on for 10 years, what killed them was the 2007 recession. I was told another issue facing Sterling at the time was they needed to tool up for a new cab because they were no longer able to source components for the Ford designed cab. Couldn't make a business case to keep Sterling going.

I think the '70 Transtar conventionals still used the 'Donald Duck' Diamond T cab! Maybe '71 for the square aluminum conventional cab. The video made me think about the prototype long-nose HN80, which would have been the successor to the Aeromax 120. I think we talked about that truck. Story was one or two were built in 1996, shown at a trade show a couple of times, and then dissappeared when Freightliner took over. Not part of the plan for Sterling!

Also noticed that Super Cab availability is very imited, looks like only available as a Lariat. Not seeing XL crew cabs either. I wonder if more configurations will be added later in the model year. Disregard, Build and Price is screwed up.

Interesting the Aeromax 120 was introduced late in the Louisville's run. The HN80's were in development at this time, and maybe the Aeromax 120 was something of a stop-gap as the HN80 program was running late. I saw very few of these trucks when they were new though the short hood day cab version was somewhat popular with grocery stores on the West Coast. The host of this video is funny when he comments the International uses the 'old' Transtar cab!

Interesting:

I looked at the build and price again, and I can get closer to what I want with an XLT. Just strange that the 7.3L has so many mandatory (and unrelated to the powertrain) options in an XL. Frustrating because I could have ordered the exact Super Duty I would have wanted in 2022. Well, closer anyway because I really would have wanted a 7.3L with a 6R140 transmission.

O.K., kicking around the idea of ordering a new big pickup. Not in a hurry figure I would order a 2023 F-350 from a local trusted dealer and just wait, current truck is in fine shape and I have a buyer for it whenever I get a new one. Now that the order banks are at least temporarily open and the 'Build and Price' is fuctional on the Ford website, I took a more serious look. Can't say I am too happy with they way Ford has bundled up many options. For instance the 7.3L is a $1705 option which I think is very reasonable considering it comes with the 10R140 transmission, but if you order it the STX Apperance Package is a mandatory option, which now includes pre-collision assist, 360 cameras and aluminum wheels among other things. Bottom line is all that with the 7.3L sets you back a whopping $9720! Some other worthwile options like the FX4 off raod package, wheel well liners, and 5th. wheel prep. are still available separately. All this has really dampened my enthusiasm for the 7.3L, now figure I would probably go with the 6.8L. The smaller 10 speed, though lighter capacity, seems to be a less troublesome transmission anyway. I just don't want most of that extra equipment Ford forces you to take with the 7.3L. Couldn't help but notice the competition still lets you order pretty much what you want....

I wonder if the 6.8/7.3L will ever get variable displacement. I figure it will have direct injection in a few years.

The VVT was substantially redesigned on the 6.2L, it didn't have issues. A smaller 'Boss' never made it to production, efficiency wasn't there. I believe since the 6.2L supposedly had issues in higher G.V.W. vehicles a larger displacement version was not pursued. Kind of makes sense why the 6.2L ended up an orphan when you consider all that plus the fact that it never went into the Mustang and was pulled from the F-150 after only a few years.

Not getting VVT saved the 6.8L from being junk like the 5.4L 3v. is. The V-10 still suffered from some of the timing chain tensioner and valve train issues common on 3 valve Mods., but not as bad as the VVT versions.

No question there was tremendous undeveloped performance potential in the Boss engine. You may remember very early on the Boss was rumored to be an eventual option in the Mustang, and there was that '777' prototype engine. Then suddenly Ford seemed to go out of their way to make it known the Boss was not going into the Mustang and the 777 dissappeared without a trace, at that point I figured the Boss would be another orphan Ford engine. And it was.

Exactly. I would have de-stroked and de-bored the 7.3L down to around 6L.

I think the GM 6.6L gas gets the best fuel economy of any of the current gasoline HD pickups. Have to see how well the Ford 6.8L does, but I am not expecting much better than the 7.3L. Port fuel injection will hurt Ford in both fuel economy and emissions.

The H.O. diesel's numbers are impressive. The 6.8L seems to be a complete waste of time. Less than 10% less H.P. and torque, and I will be willing to wager about the same fuel economy as the 7.3L.

It involves a few different wheelbases with the Payload Plus package. It only covers trucks with specific vocational bodies like aerial bucket, roll-back wreckers, service bodies with hoists and cranes, and roll-off refuse trucks. No wonder, those are tough applications and those bodies are tricky to mount properly. Bad thing is to perform the repair the body has to be removed in some instances (sounds like Ford may reimburse).

Interesting recall: https://ford.oemdtc.com/7612/customer-satisfaction-program-21b04-frame-rail-crack-2017-2020-ford-f-550

From what I understand, the 2023 Super Duty has an 'all new' cab, though it looks very similar to the 2017-2022 cab. And yes, it is the same as the F-150. As far as the 650 and 750 are concerned, as you know they currently use the old circa-1999 steel cab. The 2024 650 and 750 should be out first quarter 2023, no idea at present if those trucks will adopt the new aluminum cab.

Eventually it will, no question.

Now that's interesting, particularly if it will be available in a passenger version.

https://gmenergy.gm.com/?ppc=____&d_src=313715&d_adsrc=3876788&d_campaign=&d_site=&d_adgroup=&d_keyword=&gclick=EAIaIQobChMIntyWy_XY-gIVBCytBh2jFAZfEAAYASAAEgJHovD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIntyWy_XY-gIVBCytBh2jFAZfEAAYASAAEgJHovD_BwE