Ford, GM reputations sink

[Blue Oval Guide]

The reputations of General Motors Corp. and Ford Motor Co. plummeted last year as the companies were buffeted by bad news about job cuts, factory closings and financial problems.

 

Once among the most admired U.S. companies, GM and Ford now have among the worst reputations in corporate America.

 

How bad is it?

 

Of the 60 best-known U.S. companies rated in the eighth annual Wall Street Journal/Harris Interactive Poll, released Wednesday, GM ranked 57th, down from 38th in 2005, while Ford dropped to 55th from 37th. GM and Ford dropped the most of any companies.

 

Read the full article here.

[musclford]

Read the full article here.

 

Why the Heck don't they make a car specifically for the rental fleet. That way they don't lose the resale of their vehicles for the retail market and they can still capitalize on the volume. Run it down the same line, but don't make it available to the public.. Oh, oh, and make it look different then the platform it is sharing... don't just change the freaking headlights, tailights and grill.

 

I'm not necessarily a strategist, but by all means this doesn't appear to be rocket science....

[swenson88]

Why the Heck don't they make a car specifically for the rental fleet. That way they don't lose the resale of their vehicles for the retail market and they can still capitalize on the volume. Run it down the same line, but don't make it available to the public.. Oh, oh, and make it look different then the platform it is sharing... don't just change the freaking headlights, tailights and grill.

 

I'm not necessarily a strategist, but by all means this doesn't appear to be rocket science....

 

I think people renting cars would still choose the type of vehicle they wanted to rent. I doubt they'd be happy renting the same car that everyone else around them was renting, that's why rental fleets make money on things like convertibles, SUV's, or even luxury cars.

[Ovaltine]

Why the Heck don't they make a car specifically for the rental fleet. That way they don't lose the resale of their vehicles for the retail market and they can still capitalize on the volume.

 

I think they tried that.... it was called the 'Taurus'. B) The only problem was that they still tried to sell it at the dealership, either new or in the used car lot when they were returned by leasee's and/or rental companies. And it probably cost too much to make compared to what the rental companies wanted to pay.

 

I see what you're saying though.... Make a tough mid-sized, basic featured transportation appliance just for commerical use. Heck..... why not even give it a pseudo brand of it's own so that it doesn't muddy the waters up at all with the parent brand.

 

And have it made in either Eastern Europe, China, or India. That way the talking heads can quit their bitchin' about

"not being able to make money on rental sales".

 

-Ovaltine

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Read the full article here.

 

Boeing were getting very much same sort of bad press in the past, when Airbus became the No1 Plane maker in the world.

At the time Alan Mulally was trying hard to restructure Boeing, which must have been a very stressful process, they had to change or go under, they did change at Boeing, changing outdated working practices, and updated outdated factories & tooling, and also with a little bit of luck, as Airbus hit problems with A380 wings cracking up on test rig after only 1/3 way into the aircrafts life cycle (BAE want out of Airbus, and it's being hushed up by airbus blaming it on wiring loom problems), and massive problems with the A319, A320 and A321 I/B Rib 5 cracking up, Boeing are back where they belong as the No1 Plane maker. People hate change, sometimes it's for the worse, but if you stand still everyone loses. The Japanese take no prisoners they will kill of Ford if you stand still. Alan Mulally has started the same process rolling at Ford, he won't make many friends to start with, as nobody likes change, but if you don't become more efficient you either die or end up with all production moving to the Lowest Common Denominator which is China, car workers should put pressure on, and force governments to restrict Chinese imports unless they put something back into that country, the French are masters at it, sit back do nothing, and you will end up with nothing, much like, do nothing easy us going Brits. We had a comprehensive survey two years ago in the UK that received the biggest ever number of voters recorded for a poll ever carried out in the UK, it was conducted by a National daily paper, "What Car" magazine and Men & Motors TV Channel. It was a top 100 chart run down British peoples most popular car Ever,

 

1st - Porsche 911

2nd- Mini (old type)

3rd- 60's "e "type Jaguar

4th - Ford Capri Mk1

5th - Ford Escort Mk1 & 2 RWD

6th - Ford Cortina

 

Why is it Ford seem to think that the Ford Focus, which did not make it into the top 30, or the Ford Mondeo which didn’t make it into the top 50, are cars that we love and want to drive. There is something very sad that l am a Ford man to the core, and want to buy a new Ford but find the whole UK range so very boring, and can not warm to them in any shape or form. I was travelling from Fulham to Wandsworth in London a 5 mile journey that's about 1 1/2 hours due to our road being so clogged up, a horse and cart used to this trip in half the time back in the 1800's, l followed a Ford Focus for a few miles with a Labrador dog hunched up in the back with no space move, l just thought what practical purpose does the rounded off shape of a Ford Focus serve. back in the 80's the dog would have had acres of space in the back of a mk 4 Cortina/Granda estate, you make the Transit boxed shape at the back so why not an estate car, l have read a book on Aerodynamics by AC Kermode he states aerodynamics play no important part until and object reaches speeds of over 120 MPH, so why are we saddled with an unpractical shaped cars like the Focus. Sale folk will tell me it sells ok in the UK, We Brits would buy anything old thing Ford or GM kicked out of there design studio, as we don't like the French, German or Japs. Ford should do a bit of research on the age group of folk buying its cars most private buyers are pensioners that buy Fords, as they remember how good they were in the 60s, 70s, and 80's, there is a very large under current of under 25s that are Anti everything American, anti car, pro-environment/stop global warming, and driving the green agenda in the UK at the moment, so your market share might vanish in the future.

You can't go backwards with car design but the list of cars above are cars that Brits have warmed to in the past, which may give you a clue to what cars folk really like in the UK. You cannot just have the most efficient plants with the most motivated workforce if you have not got the right product, much like when VW introduced the jellymolded Mk3 Golf, 120,000 workers got laid off at the stroke of a CAD pen, it was just as well they acquired Skoda at the time as they replaced a lot off the lost Golf sales at the time. Why do we have to let the computer rule car design, it's NOW producing a generic range of cars that all look the same, and won't ever change as the computer will always punch out the same car shape. What Ford need is to start to produce are special cars like the one's mention above, that people can warm to, but modern, they need something the car equivalent of apples I-pod on 4 wheels. At the moment l would rather catch a bus than buy a new UK Ford.

Alan Mulally has got an impossible job to do, l would not want it for all the money in the world.

 

1966 Mustang is the greatest car ever made

Edited February 1, 2007 by Ford Jellymoulds

[FLLMTR]

Think Aston Martin and Land Rover turn around. It comes down to building the best product within a niche. Does Ford have any car that stands out from the competition? No. Not one single vehicle has the best fuel mileage, reliability or resale value. Not one. And that is the problem.

[StevenJ]

Boeing were getting very much same sort of bad press in the past, when Airbus became the No1 Plane maker in the world.

At the time Alan Mulally was trying hard to restructure Boeing, which must have been a very stressful process, they had to change or go under, they did change at Boeing, changing outdated working practices, and updated outdated factories & tooling, and also with a little bit of luck, as Airbus hit problems with A380 wings cracking up on test rig after only 1/3 way into the aircrafts life cycle (BAE want out of Airbus, and it's being hushed up by airbus blaming it on wiring loom problems), and massive problems with the A319, A320 and A321 I/B Rib 5 cracking up, Boeing are back where they belong as the No1 Plane maker..........

 

I just wanted to say that was a very interesting post that you made. Granted, we get many of thoose same kind youth here, (anti-american, anti-car, pro-enviornment, anti-global warming) and I can share your pain. Just out of curiosity, what is it that the Brittish miss the most about the old Fords? Is it anything to do with drivetrain configuration, FWD vrs RWD, style, etc. I was just curious that's all. It is nice to know that there are Ford fans all over the world. Even across the pond...

Edited February 3, 2007 by StevenJ

[JM]

Kind of pointless poll, it's all opinion. The only thing worth noting is Ford needs to do a better job at pointing out where Asian companies miss the mark and do a better job of showing how Ford hits it.

 

Reputation for what? Seems to be Ford's bad reputation for laying people off and Toyota's good reputation for quality. Apples & oranges. The reality is, Ford gave generous buy outs and college educations, but when asian companies lay off their workers are they this generous? Nope. Are they as generous as Ford was with benefits durnig employment. Nope.

 

It is kind of sad that it is opinion, shows people in general are dumb and too susceptible to the media's influence.

[J-150]

Kind of pointless poll, it's all opinion. The only thing worth noting is Ford needs to do a better job at pointing out where Asian companies miss the mark and do a better job of showing how Ford hits it.

 

Reputation for what? Seems to be Ford's bad reputation for laying people off and Toyota's good reputation for quality. Apples & oranges. The reality is, Ford gave generous buy outs and college educations, but when asian companies lay off their workers are they this generous? Nope. Are they as generous as Ford was with benefits durnig employment. Nope.

 

It is kind of sad that it is opinion, shows people in general are dumb and too susceptible to the media's influence.

 

 

its sad, but today's buyer is more concerned with price. Evidenced by the shear numbers running to Wal-Mart to buy Chinese goods. Most people no longer car where its made or how well the workers are treated.

 

Also factor in that the difference in compensation betwen the two is noted by Wall Street types. Those money managers agree more with Toyota compensation practices. And the public at large is anti-UAW.

 

So unfortunately, this is not a plus for Ford. Toyota proved that people will build cars for less wage within America.

[g48150]

So unfortunately, this is not a plus for Ford. Toyota proved that people will build cars for less wage within America.

 

Man you sure hit the nail on the head. Delphi ring a bell anyone?

 

The recapitalization of detroit is happening and no one seems to care.

 

The scary part is when Hyundai perfects the 100% automated assembly line with robots everywhere. Then we're ALL screwed...

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Man you sure hit the nail on the head. Delphi ring a bell anyone?

 

The recapitalization of detroit is happening and no one seems to care.

 

The scary part is when Hyundai perfects the 100% automated assembly line with robots everywhere. Then we're ALL screwed...

No we won't!! l would never buy a Korean, French, German, Jap Crap car brand, it's got to be a British or American Branded car preferably made in either country. If Hyundai were the only manufacturer left in the world then would catch the bus provided it was not made in Korea. You are dead right saying we will all be screwed, now that all cars look like the same computer generated generic tin Bean Cans on a Wal-Mart shelf in the UK. What tin would you buy? Brits are being taxed to death by a bankrupt government at the moment, we taxed for being taxed for the air we breathe with a $80 Global Warming air travel tax, not one $1 of the 2 Billion dollars raised this year will go back into combating global warming climate change or ice caps melting, they have a road pricing plan which will cost $4 a mile to drive anywhere in the UK, which the hope to introduce within the next five years, which will price all but small cars off the road. So folk will want small French type cheap eco box cars, which will be lowest common denominator priced French, Chinese and Korean made cars. You are dead right what you say, the majority of Folk will switch to these cars, or catch the bus. But l won't be one of them. The British Government has already let our car industry die by doing nothing until it's to late, but the French will slap big tax’s on Chinese and Korean imported cars and price them off French roads, is the US Government going to sit back and do nothing and let Ford and GM die, l hope not.

Edited February 4, 2007 by Ford Jellymoulds

[F250]

No we won't!! l would never buy a Korean, French, German, Jap Crap car brand, it's got to be a British or American Branded car preferably made in either country. If Hyundia were the only manufacturer left in the world then would catch the bus provided it was not made in Korea.

 

I like your style!

 

And just a word to those who think Americans don't care where their car is made, If it didn't mater Toyota would not be spending millions on advertising their "made in USA" plants. And they selected Texas for their new Tundra truck plant only because Texas is the largest truck market in America. You had better believe if a customer is compairing a Fusion to a Camry (like the commercial) one of the points the Toyota salesman will be hammering home is the fact the Camry plant is in America and the Fusion is assembled in Mexico.

[g48150]

I like your style!

 

And just a word to those who think Americans don't care where their car is made, If it didn't mater Toyota would not be spending millions on advertising their "made in USA" plants. And they selected Texas for their new Tundra truck plant only because Texas is the largest truck market in America. You had better believe if a customer is compairing a Fusion to a Camry (like the commercial) one of the points the Toyota salesman will be hammering home is the fact the Camry plant is in America and the Fusion is assembled in Mexico.

 

Why is the Camry the best selling car (not automobile) in America then?

 

Is it even "American" to say "Buy American"?

[Watchdevil]

Ford should do a bit of research on the age group of folk buying its cars most private buyers are pensioners that buy Fords, as they remember how good they were in the 60s, 70s, and 80's, there is a very large under current of under 25s that are Anti everything American, anti car, pro-environment/stop global warming, and driving the green agenda in the UK at the moment, so your market share might vanish in the future.

 

1966 Mustang is the greatest car ever made

 

Okay lets get real here... Remembering how good cars of the past were?... Drive an example of any classic old car you love and you will realize how crude and unrefined they were.. We are spoiled by advancement with modern engineering and atention to details. Driving an old car today, you will be annoyed by freeplay in the steering, sloppy handling, seats that don't adjust, clunkyness of the drivetrain and rattles that are just unacceptable in modern automobiles...

 

We romanticize old cars simply because they look different and more interesting to us than the sea of lookalike sedans we are stuck with today. We also romanticize them because they were the cars we enjoyed in the past.

 

The old cars did not have advanced build quality, stiff quiet structure, the advantage of electronic engine management systems and they did not have precise steering, suspension and handling. Power was obtained by thristy big block engines, not highly efficient smaller engines....

 

This is where the marriage of modern technology and classic style becomes a seller... Look at the New Mustang, New Beetle, PT Cruiser... They are all much better than the cars in their original forms. The New Mustang is the best example. Think about how well it is built, how well it handles, how much power you get out of a V6 compared to the base I-6 and V8's of the original. Also, think about how much more comfortable they are to ride in...

Edited February 3, 2007 by Watchdevil

[Ford Jellymoulds]

I just wanted to say that was a very interesting post that you made. Granted, we get many of thoose same kind youth here, (anti-american, anti-car, pro-enviornment, anti-global warming) and I can share your pain. Just out of curiosity, what is it that the Brittish miss the most about the old Fords? Is it anything to do with drivetrain configuration, FWD vrs RWD, style, etc. I was just curious that's all. It is nice to know that there are Ford fans all over the world. Even across the pond...

 

Hi Steven,

 

.Old RWD drive Ford's were a easy to look after and DIY is dead simple (No laptops required & $100 sensors dotted all round the car, expensive ECU, Cats fitted etc to replace go wrong), all parts were put in the right place very well designed easy to get at, and anything on them was dead easy to change, fun to drive. I just missed the Ferrari beating123GT40 Era, but followed Motorsport also from the late sixties onwards the Capri was Ford's most successful car ever on the race track, in the European Touring Car Championships, Ford used to enter to only 3 works cars using some F1 drivers, and l think it was 1972 came 1st, 2nd and 3rd in all but one of the 8 races in Europe, Autosport said they were invincible at the time with BMW, Porsche 911, struggling to keep up with the Fords. RWD Escorts totally domineered World rallying for a whole decade until the awesome 4WD Audi Quatro entered in the early 80's, the Escort is the worlds most successful rally car of all time, they were also up against Europe’s best BMW, Ferrari powered Lancia Deltas, Porsche 911s and Saabs so it was no easy ride. Here is a link to a link with a video to the best off road rally car ever made.

 

http://www.rsownersclub.co.uk/car_info/esc1rs16mex.htm

 

One of the reason Capri's and Escorts done so well is what l think you call Drift in States, we call it a little bit sideways on in the UK, the back end slides out, this used to completely block the track off and shut off the door, to cars following behind, and not to forget you could take any thing off fitted to the car within 15 minutes. If you have to change a head gasket on a modern Subaru Impresa it's and Engine out job, it's a dead easy job on an old RWD Escort. All pre 1973 cars in the UK get free road tax, a 4WD costs after that date has to pay $500 a year, so that pays for running costs.

FWD cars have nothing going for them at all, my wife has one you are very lucky to get you hand down the side of engine, you have about 1 inch of space to slip your hand in change a cam belt on it, gearbox drain plug is the only plus point over RWD. All the top quality brands are RWD, l find FWD eco boxes are very fatiguing to drive a long distance a you tend to get more feedback though the steering wheel, RWD also seem smoother more relaxing drive. We stayed just off the 192 in Florida two years ago Steven, It l really enjoyed the classic car show in Kissimmee Old Town they put on every Friday night your cars put ours to shame, l have never seen so many old Chevy’s or Corvette Stingrays in one place before it was like car heaven for me. It was the best holiday we ever had apart from the big mouse that scared the wife a bit, don't you have any rat catchers in your theme parks. I do find new Fords so very Boring and Mundane in the UK, the computer has made cars look very stale, there is no passion at all in car design anymore, cars all look the same. and the computer will still keep punching out the same dull Focus shape 100,000 years from now. I attend lots of classic Ford car show in the UK, most owners say the same thing, if only Ford would produce one old retro style Classic Ford again with all the mod cons Air Con, PAS, ABS etc l would buy one, don’t care much which one Anglia, Capri, Cortina, Escort or Granada non seen to bothered but the RWD Escort is the one most loved. Ford has also been the uninterrupted number one best seller since the late 60's till now so that’s why we love RWD Fords, and not to mention they were so successful in Motorsport. Still there is a glimmer of hope the Focus picked up the Manufacturers World Rally Championship last year, first time since 1979 even though it was by default as the World champion Sebaston Loeb in his Citroen missed the last 5 events due a mountain bike injury. So it show's Ford have caught up in the handling department at long last 28 years. I would buy a new RHD Mustang today it's got the same old Cologne V6 2.8 engine which started it's life in a truck, it then the powered the Capri RS to victory in the 70's, Ford put in the late 80s Cortina, Capri 2.8i, Sierra and 2.9 Granadas, but as much as l want one, they don't sell Mustangs in the UK .

Ford don't sell a sports car in the UK, the last three were big sales flops Puma, Cougar and Probe. I still would not buy either the Jap Crap Toyota built in the states or the Mexican Fusion

Edited February 5, 2007 by Ford Jellymoulds

[F250]

Why is the Camry the best selling car (not automobile) in America then?

 

Is it even "American" to say "Buy American"?

 

I think most Americans do care where their car is made, at least in the most popular mid-sized sedan segment. These cars are most frequently purchased by working families that know the importance of supporting American jobs. Do not bring up the Chinese crap they buy at WalMart because people think there is a big difference between a $19 blender and a $25,000 automobile. The Camry was never a contender until Toyota began building them in America and advertising that fact consistantly year after year until many people (mistakenly) began to think of them as "American."

 

Then what does Ford do? They play right into the "enemy's" hand by closing the American Taurus plant and investing billions in Mexico to produce the company's new mainstream sedan the Fusion. Toyota's executives have to be laughing their asses off right now because it is obvious they (a foreign company) know more about American customers than Ford which has been here 104 years!

 

Why does the Camry outsell the Fusion 3 to 1?

Performance, price, quality, style or options? Well Fusion has proven to match or beat Camry in almost every meaningful catagory. Some say it's because of Camry's solid reputation...well that's bulls---. Right now there is a class action law suit against Toyota for millions of Camrys, Solaras, Avalons and Siennas that have engine failures as a result of design defects that accelerate oil gelling (sludge). If Toyota was so customer driven those customer's wouldn't have had to take the problem to court to force Toyota to acknowledge the defect and take responsability. The law suit could only go back 8-years but both of those engine designs (4 & V6) have been in service since 1992. Toyota has reciently had to recall more cars that they sold in a single year!

 

Ford dropped the ball on the biggest car segment in the country! They had the Taurus which earned an outstanding reputation and then after 1 refresh in 10 years they completely screwed up it's style in 1996, which conviently was the time Toyota started shouting about their American Camry plant. So what does Ford do? Do they go back to the drawing board to fix the problem? Na, they just let the Taurus rot for 10 more years with 1 minor refresh until the only people buying them were rental fleets. Ford so damaged the once great Taurus reputation that they had to drop the name and come up with Fusion for it's replacment and start from zero again to earn back that reputation. The Fusion should have been the new Taurus, the Fusion should have been introduced 7 years ago and above all the Fusion should be made in America, by Americans for American working families!

 

Until then Ford will continue to wonder why Camry outsells Fusion 3 to 1 when the Fusion is the better car. And I am certain the arrogant Ford executives (who were born millionaires) have no clue what a working class American wants to spend their money on.

Edited February 4, 2007 by F250