Ck this Bull Crap out our trades chairman is pulling in Sharonville!!

[charly]

This system is set up to protect the slackers, PERIOD!!! You see people that come to work everyday and do their job DON'T need PROTECTING. There's so many sue happy lawyers today if a boss looks at a person wrong the company gets sued. The only thing the union does is cripple the company from getting rid of the dead weight. Maybe if they could have gotten rid of some of this dead weight, we would be sinking to the bottom of the ocean faster than the Titanic. :titanic: :titanic: :titanic:

Not likely!! Been there 16 years haven't need the union yet. I show up, I do my job, and I don't bitch, gripe, and complain...

Have a wonderful night.

 

 

So, you don't need the Union?

Who negotiates the wages and benefits that you get?

 

Seniority

Vacation

Paid Holidays

Breaks

Safe workplace

Job security

pensions

AND YOUR ABOVE AVERAGE WAGES

 

 

and on and on...........

and for the record.....your post is a a prime example of whining and complaining.

[uRfk9AcDfo9Wui]

So, you don't need the Union?

Who negotiates the wages and benefits that you get?

 

Seniority

Vacation

Paid Holidays

Breaks

Safe workplace

Job security

pensions

AND YOUR ABOVE AVERAGE WAGES

and on and on...........

 

 

And guess who is giving it back...... COA & MOA's Can't WAIT to see what they do for Sept. !!!

 

 

and for the record.....your post is a a prime example of whining and complaining.

 

I've EARNED it!!!

[Wanderinglost]

Other than making sure they are payed properly: why should the supervisor be chasing, grown men who know better how to do a job than anyone, around to make sure they are working? Everyone knows what crappy shape this company is in, and saying the supervisor lets is happen just blows my mind. No one is supposed to do work unless a supervisor is standing there with a bull whip making people work? If thats the case, last one out turn off the lights please.................

 

If this is true, then what is the supervisor doing? If the supervisor allows this to happen, you may have identified part of the problem.

[charly]

And guess who is giving it back...... COA & MOA's Can't WAIT to see what they do for Sept. !!!

I've EARNED it!!!

 

 

They will do the best that they can for the membership. It's up to YOU to make sure the Union knows what your wants, needs and desires are.

 

Get involved...........you have certainly "EARNED" that obligation as well.

[uRfk9AcDfo9Wui]

They will do the best that they can for the membership. It's up to YOU to make sure the Union knows what your wants, needs and desires are.

 

 

Now that's hysterical!!!

Edited March 18, 2007 by uRfk9AcDfo9Wui

[davdog]

And guess who is giving it back...... COA & MOA's Can't WAIT to see what they do for Sept. !!!

I've EARNED it!!!

 

 

Then go get another job!! You sit here and bitch about the union but the union is the reason you have what you have. If it isn't then go the fuck out and get a job that pays you what you make today.

[Xerxes12]

So, you don't need the Union?

Who negotiates the wages and benefits that you get?

 

Seniority

Vacation

Paid Holidays

Breaks

Safe workplace

Job security

pensions

AND YOUR ABOVE AVERAGE WAGES

and on and on...........

and for the record.....your post is a a prime example of whining and complaining.

 

Let the union be our agent and hire our agents like the company hires their's, by reputation and performance. Beyond our wages and other economic matters we have no need for the International. The locals have the discretion to hire and fire and in most cases are politically corrupt. If you are friends or family of Union or management, you will be given a free pass. That is reality. A friend of my son who works in Trim told him that 42 members of his extended family work in CAP and CSP and his nephew ( with little seniority ) was transfered to CSP when they were trying to fire him at CAP. We have all seen examples of grievances tossed for political reasons. Especially when a new "reform" slate is about to take office.

[uRfk9AcDfo9Wui]

Then go get another job!! You sit here and bitch about the union but the union is the reason you have what you have. If it isn't then go the fuck out and get a job that pays you what you make today.

 

 

Hey fuckstick if you don't like what I'm saying then put me on your ignore list. You don't even work for Ford so get a FUCKING LIFE!!! You come out and bitch and moan about the union and the high wages they make and then you turn around a defend them??? :shrug:

 

You sit here and bitch about the union but the union is the reason you have what you have

 

Yeah my plant got shut down!! Way to go UAW!!! SO I've EARNED the right to BITCH!!!! Now

[CD4EMAN]

The Union (locally) generally only has to represent those that are in some kind of trouble or need. Most of the time those that do their job and show up on time usually dont use the representation provided by the CBA.

 

We all have screw ups in every plant, that is what keeps our committee persons from doing real Union work.

[sharonvilletradesman]

If they had selected people based on merit, skill level, loyalty, motivation etc etc then you would not have lost all the work to begin with. Good for him! It is about time someone tried to make people understand this is a JOB not a never ending charity.

 

You don't have a clue brother! We lost our work because the plant manager doesn't like construction period end of statement. We was doing the work before and making schedule. I'm a electrician with 15 yrs. at Ford and 10 on the outside. So i'm not some old timer there just to suck the overtime and not do the job. I'm there to make a living for my family just like everyone else. So yes if I'm low on hours I expect to be scheduled just like the contract says. You say people should be selected on " merit, skill level, loyalty, motivation etc " Well I have altogether 25 yrs as electrician so that means I should have the skill. I have always been praised for getting the job done so that must mean I must have the motivation. With riding the fence with 15 yrs and not taking the buyout and always buying Ford products means I must have the loyalty. I have worked construction for 5 yrs at the plant. So now you tell me why I wasn't selected to work out of turn? That isn't the point here. The point is:The Union doesn't have the right to decide who should and shouldn't work on the job period!! We have a overtime agreement and they need to adhere to it. If there is "Dogs" on the job the it is the Company's responsibilities to write them up and keep following that till the "Dogs" are gone.

[sharonvilletradesman]

And the average Saturday of a CAW/UAW skilled trades.

Payday starts at 7:00 am

7:30 start getting organized

8:00 am arrive at jobsite

8:30 am have looked over jobsite and starting to determine what to do. Time to go for for break.

9:45 end of 15 minute break(which was more than an hour)and go back to jobsite.

Eventually by the end of the day do 2 hours work.

 

Evening: Listen to Hargrove and Charley tell you that the problem is unfair trade practices.

 

You must definetly be production. What about all the times I come over for a fault and find out that it is dirt on the end of a prox switch. It is fixed in the 10 minutes but your gone for 45 minutes to the break room or out bull shitting with your buddies. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones!!

[davdog]

Hey fuckstick if you don't like what I'm saying then put me on your ignore list. You don't even work for Ford so get a FUCKING LIFE!!! You come out and bitch and moan about the union and the high wages they make and then you turn around a defend them??? :shrug:

Yeah my plant got shut down!! Way to go UAW!!! SO I've EARNED the right to BITCH!!!! Now

 

I'm not defending the uaw, they put you all in a shit postion by elevating pay to the point where you were dependent on one industry and one industry alone. For cripes sake you paid these people to watch out for your best interests and all they looked at was the present. BUT you signed up and didn't look out for your best interest either. You saw what you could get today and just figured the future would work itself out. You knew that if Ford putlled up its stakes in VA then you would get your pay cut in half, and don't tell me you didn't. Do you know anyone in the greater VA beach are making $28 without a solid college degree? Hell no!!! You just figured your abundance of transferable skills were why you got what you got. Bullshit, you made what you made becasue the union GOT you those wages. Maybe if you had gotten those wages on your own you wouldn't be in the postion you are in today. You fools are breaking up the very thing that got you where you are.

[sharonvilletradesman]

You may not feel the same if cleaners, leaders, and other "choice" jobs were filled by someone's "opinion", especially when that person is not your boss.

 

WE pay the Union to look after all our jobs, we do not pay Chairmen to secure jobs for his buddies or pet children. If the company has problem employees, get THEM to get rid of them. Seniority is the foundation of Unionism, whether you agree with the principle or not. If you want to pick and choose, simple. Quit the union.

 

 

Than you Sparky finally someone who understands this. It isn't the unions job to police these people it is the company's job. I bet if these production people that are putting these replys in were told by they had the option to work the next couple of Sunday. Then the union came down and told them they was going to let some other guys from the other end of plant come down and do there job because these guys did that job for 10 yrs so they probably know it better. Regardless they aren't in that dept or of the hrs. I bet some of there responses would be different!!

[sharonvilletradesman]

Most plants have used outside trades for years, to do the big jobs.

You only need to look at OAC and the abismall launch of the Edge to realize the plant is not equipped to deal with new installations.

 

We have mostly always done most of work. We have farmed out some of the big jobs. We have always made schedule as far as new product launches go. These jobs i'm talking about for us electricians is just running some conduit and pulling some wire. I would rather see our guys make this money than the outside contractors but not at the expense of the union hand picking people.

[sharonvilletradesman]

Its about damned time!

 

Let the dogs show themselves. Then the company can show them the door and the hard working brothers can still have a job.

 

I do agree with you but, I didn't hire them the company did. So why should I sit back and miss out on money because of this? This company will never police it's own. It take way too much paper work to show them to the door. Anyway I've heard many of time by supervision that it's just not worth it. They put the paper on them and then the union just gets them off by offering something like throwing some grievances away or something else. I think if the union want to hand pick people why don't they come out and tell the individual that he isn't working because he is a "Dog"!! I bet that would fly. I bet the dog would hire a lawyer for discrimination so fast your head would swim.

[sharonvilletradesman]

Skilled trades chair is sucking for votes from the younger crowd. What a fuckin loser. You must go by seniority. Sparky's right. Its the very foundation we're built on. Of course this is wht the Company wants; to divide the union side of the house. Vote his ass back to the tools next election.

 

 

You are dead on brother!! Believe me I will do my best to see him back on his HI-LO next election time!!

[nonvalue]

Other than making sure they are payed properly: why should the supervisor be chasing, grown men who know better how to do a job than anyone, around to make sure they are working? Everyone knows what crappy shape this company is in, and saying the supervisor lets is happen just blows my mind. No one is supposed to do work unless a supervisor is standing there with a bull whip making people work? If thats the case, last one out turn off the lights please.................

 

"Ouch" I sense anger in your reply I respectfully disagree with your position "Other than making sure they are payed properly", but then again, isn't that what's being said when I wrote "if this is true then what is the supervisor doing".

Let me explain, if I were to assign a job, and the people on the job did not show up until 2.5 hours into the shift then I would start their time when they started. Furthermore, the supervisor should do more than just pay people.

Let's hope, for the sake of Ford, that the supervisor has more expertise than just being able to navigate the payroll system. In closing, I wouldn't suggest the supervisor chase grown men or women, but I would suggest that "you" tone down the sexist remarks..... Have a good day

[charly]

Most plants have used outside trades for years, to do the big jobs.

You only need to look at OAC and the abismall launch of the Edge to realize the plant is not equipped to deal with new installations.

 

 

 

Hey Einstein...The outside contractors did 99.9% of the new installation, the in house trades are still correcting their screw-ups.

Get a Kloo.

[Bluecon]

Hey Einstein...The outside contractors did 99.9% of the new installation, the in house trades are still correcting their screw-ups.

Get a Kloo.

So in a couple more years, you should have the line up to speed?

Not good enough to compete in the global market.

Get a work ethic.

 

What is a kloo?

[CountryClubContract]

Ever heard of a "Launch Team" from the said plant getting the new systems and tooling.

Funny thing is I believe these team volunteers are picked using seniority not whether the person would be an asset or not. Ford spends a fortune flying these guys in to Detroit on a Monday, paying for rooms, rental cars, food and then fly them home on Friday so they can work the weekend. They do this for 6 month's to a year or so prior to a launch. Most of the time they (hourly) show up at the build shops eat the complimentary donuts drink coffee and hang out for an hour or two then they are gone. They are supposed to see into the system, bring fourth problems they can foresee with maintenance and operation, basically get involved. I have had to show guys on the launch team for a year how to do something as easy as put a robot in teach after he spent a years at the build facility! Ask them how many free flights they have accumulated with frequent flyer miles and they can tell you though! But oh well that is the nature of the beast at FOMOCO Pass the blame, no accountabilty, not my job, I was not trained, no one told me to etc etc etc.

But hey why should I care we are and will sell equipment and work even if all the plants close or move.

[nonvalue]

So in a couple more years, you should have the line up to speed?

Not good enough to compete in the global market.

Get a work ethic.

 

What is a kloo?

 

Cycle time, is the amount of time it takes to complete any given operation, on any given line. If 99.9% of the operation was designed by brand X vendor, WHY SHOULD IT TAKE TWO YEARS TO GET IT UP TO SPEED? I can throw all the "ethic" I want at the problem, but the more "work" I put into the operation will count against my efficiency. Which is called first time through or throughput. People on the outside know this as Harbor Hours.

[Bluecon]

Cycle time, is the amount of time it takes to complete any given operation, on any given line. If 99.9% of the operation was designed by brand X vendor, WHY SHOULD IT TAKE TWO YEARS TO GET IT UP TO SPEED? I can throw all the "ethic" I want at the problem, but the more "work" I put into the operation will count against my efficiency. Which is called first time through or throughput. People on the outside know this as Harbor Hours.

Then what would the cycle time of the line be?

If the line is down for 2 hours what is the cycle time?

Working as opposed to sitting on your butt will not cause Ford any problems.

You sound like a plumber describing cycle time.

[nonvalue]

Ever heard of a "Launch Team" from the said plant getting the new systems and tooling.

Funny thing is I believe these team volunteers are picked using seniority not whether the person would be an asset or not. Ford spends a fortune flying these guys in to Detroit on a Monday, paying for rooms, rental cars, food and then fly them home on Friday so they can work the weekend. They do this for 6 month's to a year or so prior to a launch. Most of the time they (hourly) show up at the build shops eat the complimentary donuts drink coffee and hang out for an hour or two then they are gone. They are supposed to see into the system, bring fourth problems they can foresee with maintenance and operation, basically get involved. I have had to show guys on the launch team for a year how to do something as easy as put a robot in teach after he spent a years at the build facility! Ask them how many free flights they have accumulated with frequent flyer miles and they can tell you though! But oh well that is the nature of the beast at FOMOCO Pass the blame, no accountabilty, not my job, I was not trained, no one told me to etc etc etc.

But hey why should I care we are and will sell equipment and work even if all the plants close or move.

 

This was old Ford.... The programs in the new Ford have been cut to the point vendors will not serve coffee and donuts. Besides just repeat the same BS phrase "this is Ford Spec" or "this change has been bought off by VO."

Repeat the same phrases for any question and you have a buy off meeting. Minus the coffee and donuts...

I just realized I'm passing the blame... forget what I said, the automation will make cycle time on it's own.

Even if the gearbox will explode because it can't handle the speed required to make cycle time. Those scum bag skilled trades cause all of this you know. :reading:

[nonvalue]

Then what would the cycle time of the line be?

If the line is down for 2 hours what is the cycle time?

Working as opposed to sitting on your butt will not cause Ford any problems.

You sound like a plumber describing cycle time.

 

Why is the line down? Parts shortage related to equipment? No production parts? Blown up gearbox? need more info... Maybe I should bury my head in the sand then I could be you, and things would be normal in a perfect world.

 

The plumber shot was kinda shitty :shades: If I over simplified cycle time, it was because I wanted you to understand.

[OAC_Sparky]

So in a couple more years, you should have the line up to speed?

Not good enough to compete in the global market.

 

Ford paid vendors to install the machinery, not me. If it won't run at proper line speed out of the box I guess the contractors didn't do their job, right?

 

During commissioning, our trades "weren't allowed" to touch the machinery, as not to "interfere" So please tell me why it doesn't run at full line speed? And whose fault is it?

 

I was ready and willing to work to improve things from Day 1. I wasn't invited until January. So whose fault is it?

 

Wait. Didn't you say you were a contractor? :shades:

Edited March 19, 2007 by OAC_Sparky