June 2007 Large Car Sales

[waymondospiff]

Make Model - June 2007 - 2007 YTD

 

Ford Five Hundred - 3,029 - 30,309

Ford Taurus - 5,836 - 5,961

Mercury Motego - 927 - 8,718

Mercury Sable - 1,520 - 1,520

 

Ford Crown Victoria - 5,575 - 36,211

Mercury Grand Marquis - 3,936 - 31,263

 

Buick LaCrosse - 3,814 - 23,121

Buick Lucerne - 6,996 - 39,043

Chevy Impala - 35,849 - 180,390

Pontiac Grand Prix - 11,820 - 46,455

 

Chrysler 300 - 11,796 - 62,995

Dodge Charger - 11,529 - 65,972

Dodge Magnum - 2,523 - 15,988

 

Toyota Avalon - 5,661 - 37,522

 

Nissan Maxima - 4,280 - 25,507

 

Hyundai Azera - 1,807 - 12,539

 

Kia Amanti - 326 - 4,340

 

Sales of more than 11,000 D3-sedans make June 2007 the best for the D3 since the employee pricing sale in 2005 if I'm not mistaken. Hopefully the trend will continue and make the new Taurus/Sable a consistent performer for Ford.

 

A note to all of the numbers here - every vehicle except the Dodge Charger is showing MoM & YoY declines. Is the category dead or, as I see it, a lack of new product driving sales away?

 

Scott

 

Edit - added "key" at the top of the post.

Edited July 7, 2007 by waymondospiff

[jpd80]

People invariably downsize with high gas prices, large vehicles always suffer the most.

 

Chev Impala is very important to GM, RWD Zeta Impala will need to be an instant hit.

Screw that up and it's all over for them.

Edited July 7, 2007 by jpd80

[LincolnFan]

I have been waiting for mondo's threads about sales, thanks man.

 

I wonder where the Grand Prix buyers will move into when it is gone... and how the hell do Chryco manage to sell 11K each of their LX sedans when the hype is dead now (fleets lol).

 

Ford better start advertising if they want to get any share in here.

[dave9991]

I have been waiting for mondo's threads about sales, thanks man.

 

I wonder where the Grand Prix buyers will move into when it is gone... and how the hell do Chryco manage to sell 11K each of their LX sedans when the hype is dead now (fleets lol).

 

Ford better start advertising if they want to get any share in here.

 

 

I wont do the breakdowns for the vehicles, but will list the fleet percentages. You should be able to infer how they are acheiving such high sales levels.

 

Grand Prix 77.6%

Magnum 60.2%

Charger 58.2%

Impala 53.9%

300 44%

Azera 22.7%

[danup]

For all the talk about Buick sucking it up, the Lucerne is a nice car and it's outselling the Avalon. (It's no Aurora, but I've made my peace with GM axing the wrong division long ago.) That said, the LaCrosse... ouch.

 

It'll be a shame if the Taurus doesn't take off, it's an amazing car.

[matthewq4b]

I wont do the breakdowns for the vehicles, but will list the fleet percentages. You should be able to infer how they are acheiving such high sales levels.

 

Grand Prix 77.6%

Magnum 60.2%

Charger 58.2%

Impala 53.9%

300 44%

Azera 22.7%

 

 

Even with high fleet percentages the Chryco LX cars are still saw over 10K retail sales last month.

Draw you own conclusions on how they got the numbers.

 

Matthew

[LincolnFan]

I think he's using the fleet percentages from that old report.

 

That report was from Oct 06 ~ Feb 07. It's outdated and shouldn't be used.

[2000SableWagon]

Wow, the D3 sold about as many as the Avalon's, Maxima's and Azera's combined, and the majority were 08 with little to no incentives.

[96 Pony]

Even with high fleet percentages the Chryco LX cars are still saw over 10K retail sales last month.

Draw you own conclusions on how they got the numbers.

 

Matthew

 

He forgot to include Fords fleet numbers. But I agree that report that was listed is inaccurate for today:

 

Ford Five Hundred 43.1%

Mercury Grand Marquis 50.0%

Mercury Montego 30.2%

Ford Crown Victoria 91.3%

 

For arguments sake, even when you subtract out those old fleet numbers the LX's still outsell the D3 and Panthers combined in the retail market.

 

Article in USA Today a few days ago said that both Ford and Chrysler are now at 30% fleet overall and GM is at 25%.

Edited July 7, 2007 by 96 Pony

[LincolnFan]

What is the car that Chrysler sells to public? most of their cars are fleet oriented these days.

[96 Pony]

What is the car that Chrysler sells to public? most of their cars are fleet oriented these days.

 

Apparently the same things that Ford sells to the public as they and Chrysler are now at about the same for fleet sales:

 

Ford, Chrysler Top List of Fleet Sales

 

And before I am accused of being a MOPAR lover - IMHO Ford does and is doing everything right in their line EXCEPT in their full sized segment. I have high hopes for the Taurus, however.

Edited July 7, 2007 by 96 Pony

[LincolnFan]

Apparently the same things that Ford sells to the public as they and Chrysler are now at about the same for fleet sales:

 

Ford, Chrysler Top List of Fleet Sales

 

And before I am accused of being a MOPAR lover - IMHO Ford does and is doing everything right in their line EXCEPT in their full sized segment. I have high hopes for the Taurus, however.

 

Crown Vic & Town Car anyone? The Vic is %100 fleet, I don't think the TC is far behind that.

 

But %34 ouch that's pretty bad.

[96 Pony]

Crown Vic & Town Car anyone? The Vic is %100 fleet, I don't think the TC is far behind that.

 

But %34 ouch that's pretty bad.

 

True - Crown Vic, Town Car (58%) and Marquis do drag the figures down.

 

*sigh* I wish Ford would drop the panthers totally, bring out the Interceptor concept and call it Thunderbird. IMHO the Interceptor and Taurus would end Chrysler and Chevy's domination of the full sized market.

[taxman100]

Ford would have had more success if they had never introduced the Five Hundred/Taurus II and instead invested those funds in the Panther.

 

Clearly Ford wants people to forget about the Panther and buy a Taurus II. Park a 1998 Crown Vic (or a 1992 Grand Marquis) next to a 2008 Crown Vic/Grand Marquis - they look pretty much the exact same.

 

Ford could never again design a vehicle to the quality levels of the Panther, unless they wanted to charge $40,000 for it - it is a vehicle that Ford cannot afford to replace with a comparable product.

 

The fact they still sell should tell you something - unless you are a Ford product planner, I guess.

Edited July 7, 2007 by taxman100

[LincolnFan]

Panther Mafia Thread Hijack.

 

PMTH.

[96 Pony]

The panthers were fantastic cars - in the 90's.

 

The are now old people and taxi/police cars.

 

If Ford can make some money off them as fleet only then fine - keep it up.

 

But bottom line is Chrysler and Chevy saw a market and took it over on the domestic side.

 

Ford will have limited success with the Taurus II. It's sharp looking but doesn't have the *wow* factor that the LX's did when they first came out.

 

Bring out the Interceptor as retail only and they own that part of the domestic market again. And if they offered the 5.4 as an option they would blow Chrysler off the map with it's Hemis. :shades:

Edited July 7, 2007 by 96 Pony

[LincolnFan]

How's the wow factor doing for the 300C right now? I am seeing high fleet percentages.

[DCK]

I think once it gets going the Taurus will be reaching over 10K a month......I think Ford may be put in an wierd position with a fullsize seeling so well compared to their mid-size offering.

 

I think once the full redesign is here for 2010(hopefully a hybrid too) Ford will be leading with the Taurus in the large FWD segment with around 140k Taurus sales yearly.

[igor]

I think once it gets going the Taurus will be reaching over 10K a month......I think Ford may be put in an wierd position with a fullsize seeling so well compared to their mid-size offering.

 

I think once the full redesign is here for 2010(hopefully a hybrid too) Ford will be leading with the Taurus in the large FWD segment with around 140k Taurus sales yearly.

I agree ..

 

I think Ford is in a good position to have:

 

20k compact Car - Focus and anything below

20k Compact SUV - Escape and anything below

12k midsize SUV - Edge

12k midsize car - Fusion

12k full size car - Taurus

and

12k full size suv - Flex and TaurusX

 

Not a bad position if you ask me, but the success of the large cars/suv's might hurt Ford's CAFE. And of course - I wish the Fusion and Edge did better .. especially the Fusion - at least 20k a month ... somehow..

 

Igor

[LincolnFan]

Remember, with the Fusion refresh it's going to kick ass and take names with the Hybrid and the new 2.5 and the performance model. So it might be hitting 15K per month (very hopefully).

[igor]

Remember, with the Fusion refresh it's going to kick ass and take names with the Hybrid and the new 2.5 and the performance model. So it might be hitting 15K per month (very hopefully).

sure hope so.. but even the current model deserves 15k ... and even more .. it certainly deserves at least an upward spiral of sales .. slowly little by little climbing up .. unfortunately that stopped, and the Fusion got stuck at 12k units a month ..

 

15k for the new model is a nice level, given the current level.. but Ford needs the 20k no-discount units .. not just for Sales, but also for CAFE and image ..

 

Igor

[DCK]

Remember, with the Fusion refresh it's going to kick ass and take names with the Hybrid and the new 2.5 and the performance model. So it might be hitting 15K per month (very hopefully).

it did hit 15k a month a couple times since it launched.

 

I think the hybrid should do well, I wish Ford could launch hybrids as fast as GM. But I like that Ford is doing the right hybrids and not the pathetic "mild" hybrid GM uses which causes no signifact mileage gains, like the new hybrid malibu will only get 2 MPG better than the non hybrid variant..........That just looks really bad, so I rather they do it right like Ford even if it is taking a while.

[Traveler]

The panthers were fantastic cars - in the 90's.

 

They're still great cars. They are virtually 4 year-old cars wrapped in 6-8 year-old sheetmetal. If the exterior is important, then most will come up short because we all know the Joneses are driving Accords and Camry. The Taurus is a nice car for sure, but other than the cosmetics and the 3.5 its still basically the Five-Hundred with a name that just a couple of years ago, Ford wanted to abandon. It will probably take a while to get those Accord and Camry buyers to even consider a Taurus.

 

As for the Panther, you have to have an appreciation for the cars to understand them. After driving V8 Mustangs for years, the Crown Vic was just a natural. Smooth and fluid V8 power, flat and neutral handling, healthy exhaust note (although muted compared to a Mustang) and decent fuel economy. Then, of course, you can get just about any option on a Panther that can come on a Taurus/Sable.

 

The Panthers are still probably the best-built, longest-lasting, most trouble-free car Ford makes today. They are also probably one of the most comfortable and quiet...very tight and bank-vault. You can just about whisper from the front seat and be heard in the back. Even with the moonroof open, you can carry on a normal conversation.

 

The Taurus is no doubt the most refined FWD sedan Ford has built, but at the same time I believe that the Panthers are the best sedans Ford has ever built...up to this point.

[96 Pony]

Whoa, whoa, whoa!

 

The Fusion discussion is over in another thread. Different line here.

 

This is about the Taurus II/ Sable II /Crown Vic/Marquis/ Town Car. vs. LX and Impala.

 

How's the wow factor doing for the 300C right now? I am seeing high fleet percentages.

 

Still outselling retail the D3's and Panthers combined.

 

They are virtually 4 year-old cars wrapped in 6-8 year-old sheetmetal. If the exterior is important

 

Yes, it is important.

 

OMG - I just don't get it. The numbers are there and people are still trying to justify the Panthers existence!

 

Bottom line - despite all this fleet talk, subtracting out the fleet sales for both Ford and Chrysler the 3 LX models still outsell the 5 D3 and Panthers retail COMBINED.

 

We should be talking about what Ford can do to regain this market instead of making excuses.

Edited July 8, 2007 by 96 Pony

[Traveler]

Whoa, whoa, whoa!

 

The Fusion discussion is over in another thread. Different line here.

 

This is about the Taurus II/ Sable II /Crown Vic/Marquis/ Town Car. vs. LX and Impala.

Still outselling retail the D3's and Panthers combined.

Yes, it is important.

 

OMG - I just don't get it. The numbers are there and people are still trying to justify the Panthers existence!

 

Bottom line - despite all this fleet talk, subtracting out the fleet sales for both Ford and Chrysler the 3 LX models still outsell the 5 D3 and Panthers retail COMBINED.

 

We should be talking about what Ford can do to regain this market instead of making excuses.

 

Make no mistake, now. I am an advocate for the Interceptor and MKR. I think Ford needs to move into this direction, because if Ford wants to remain competitive in the niche RWD market, while fielding a police fleet RWD sedan, they have to do this car...or something along those lines.

 

Where I was taking issue was the value (not monetary) of the Panther and its usefulness today. These cars, equipped right, can perform as good if not better than its perceived competition. They are solid, sturdy, quiet, comfort well-equipped, etc. and can probably outlast anything else in its class. Exterior-wise, these cars are not out of style. They never really were at the cutting edge of it. They follow a simplistic template for a basic modern automobile. Crown Vics are Crown Vics. They aren't a Lexus IS or an Infiniti GS. However, they aren't offensively outdated because they were conservatively styled to begin with. When viewing the car as automobiles once were, they get the job done just fine and not at all in an ugly way. Just plain. Its the service they perform that matters here and few cars can deliver what the Panthers do.

 

I like the Panther styling. I especially like the old-school Ford engine and drivetrain. Its about as close to a four door Mustang GT as you can get when you find an HPP model. That said, I like the 300, Charger and Magnum styling as well. I am firm in my belief that its time to retire the Crown Vic name and build two Ford versions of the Interceptor. The chromed civilian version should be called the "Galaxie", the sport model the "Galaxie 500" and build a bare police version and call it the LTD Interceptor or something like that. Then build the Lincoln.

 

Most people judge the Crown Vic, Grand Marquis and Town Car by the way they think they drive without truly experiencing a new one for themselves. However, public sentiment will never change for these cars and Ford (and Panther fans) must look ahead...and that future is a unibody RWD V8 Ford/Lincoln sedan. If Ford is foolish enough to kill the Panther without a replacement, then I will give Chrysler my money for a 300, Charger or Magnum next time.