We wanna know what salary and Bondholders are giving back

[fordworker]

Bond holder are asked to give up 70% of there Bond $$ thats 70% is that not enough?

UAW doesnt want to take the same stock for $ payment (but at 30% less not 70%) as they demand of the bond holders. It aint going to fly. Bond holders are not going for that and neither would you if it were you as the bond holder. Admit it you wouldn't take it.

UAW knows big 3 going to bankruptcy within 3 years or sooner or else they would take the stock options.

[kpc655]

Listen you bitter ass, the faster we get rid of the likes of you....the better off this company will be.

 

Your the kind of idiot that tramples people when they yell fire.........It's all about me...screww everyone else. No matter how much we fight.......we will stick together in the end.........you salary pukes will cut eachothers throats to survive...

 

That is okay though........no one needs your dead weight anyway.

 

Toyota screws their US retirees, and only has a few because the transplants are still young here. Do you suggest we screw the millions of retirees that built these companies and country over the last 100 years? Funny how Toyota gives out jobs for life, mortgages the employees homes and pays them when they are layed off overseas. They even are unionized over there.

But screw the US workers....go into southern or poor areas where unions are weak and Republipuke Senators are strong and get millions of tax breaks to prey on the lower class. Don't you tell us to mimic that playing field.

 

Screw you and your mother for having you..

 

I'm sorry you see this issue so emotionally. But back up and look at it logically and from a fiscal view point.

 

Time has and will continue to prove me right.

[fordworker]

Listen you bitter ass, the faster we get rid of the likes of you....the better off this company will be.

 

Your the kind of idiot that tramples people when they yell fire.........It's all about me...screww everyone else. No matter how much we fight.......we will stick together in the end.........you salary pukes will cut eachothers throats to survive...

 

That is okay though........no one needs your dead weight anyway.

 

Toyota screws their US retirees, and only has a few because the transplants are still young here. Do you suggest we screw the millions of retirees that built these companies and country over the last 100 years? Funny how Toyota gives out jobs for life, mortgages the employees homes and pays them when they are layed off overseas. They even are unionized over there.

But screw the US workers....go into southern or poor areas where unions are weak and Republipuke Senators are strong and get millions of tax breaks to prey on the lower class. Don't you tell us to mimic that playing field.

 

Screw you and your mother for having you..

toyota is NON UNION because of the Republican "get an abortion u will go to HELL" southerns who prefer to let there party bend them over all in the name of Religious beliefs! Well when there all fucked up when there 40 yrs old and cant work no more I dont want to hear there crying asses when that happens.

They can keep there non union over worked jobs.

[udontkno]

I am still for the IUAW to lobby Congress to come up with a health care bill that will protect all of the retired workers who have company provided health care. It could be structured like PGBC and all employers who provide health care to an employee who retirees will be required to pay into it. This is the UAW's biggest hang up VEBA and it could make that issue less important if implemented. This would help not only the union backed blue collar workers but the non union and white collar workers alike. After all unions were formed for social justice for workers. Instead Ron wants to run to Congress with the big 3 bosses and beg for the corporations to be given money. Ron's rational was that this would help prevent job loss but now our tax money is going to companies that are cutting thousands of workers white and blue collar. Im sorry if I am beating up on him but this isnt his or the IUAW's first questionable call and I am getting frustrated. These actions are the result of the UAW agreeing to not press the companies on social issues but as far as Im concerned, unions only issues should be social not financial. This is how we got 40 hour work weeks, time and a half over 8 hours, classifications, PGBC ect... Today all of these things are not a big issue with the UAW because they are more concerned with the companys bottom line. Why wasnt the union concerned with the bottom line when Ford was buying Volvo, Jag, Mazda, LR with the profits made in the U.S.? If Ron would have demanded money be spent in the U.S. with new models refreshened models updated equipment then Ford would be in better shape today.

[Marginal Economist]

wages, bonuses and benefits. The only thing there is to give. Unless you're union. When will they lose their golden parachute?

 

The UAW needs to be destroyed once and for all. It's crippling this country.

 

I'm a salaried grunt as well, but your post is out of line. We need smart, dependable people to produce and assemble our products. They need people like me to help sell their cars and parts. We are interdependent, and bitching and putting people down is not going to help anyone.

 

I had friends let go from the company this week, and it hurts. If we don't pick up some the pace of sales, we'll lose more people in 4-6 months. Ford is going to right size the capacity to match the SAAR and market share, for everyone involved.

 

I'm hopeful that Ford can return to its roots and actually produce more of the components that go into our vehicles. Losing Navistar and producing our own diesel is a start. Going forward we are going to need to be much more dependant on ourselves rather than shared suppliers.

[steve morris]

I'm sorry you see this issue so emotionally. But back up and look at it logically and from a fiscal view point.

 

Time has and will continue to prove me right.

 

From a fiscal view point.....Greed is what got us in this mess. In my opinion, the two MAIN reasons this country is in the mess it is in are Free Trade Agreements and the Banking System. They are both based on greed.

All of your "upper class" people i.e. company owners, top tier executives, the President, congressmen, senators, etc wanted these free trade agreements for all of the wrong reasons. They had every intention of going to these 3rd world countries and exploiting their people and country. They knew from the very beginning that the pay scale of these 3rd world countries were not going to rise but that in time, it would give them the excuse to try and bring our pay scale down in the name of being competitive. They knew they could exploit the workers in these 3rd world countries while ignoring the same environmental standards our country has and make huge profits. Big Business takes care of Big Business. From the President down through congress and the Senate, you cant tell me there were no kick backs to pass these bullshit Agreements. Well, look what it has done to this country. 6 million people out of work and the threat of more jobs lost if we ( the working class) do not agree to wage cuts, higher insurance co-pays, screwing our retirees, etc.

Look at the Banking Industry...you cannot tell me that the banking system did not know that down the road these bull shit mortgages were not going to cause millions of Americans to lose their homes. But once again, greed got the best of them. They passed millions of mortgages and in return, made Billions of dollars, while knowing that these mortgages were doomed to fail.

Show me anywhere in these two examples where the working class benefited. Billions of dollars were made. who got all the money? The "upper class".

 

The U.A.W. is NOT to blame in any of this. They fight for the working class to make a fair days wage for a fair days work. The U.A.W. has made many concessions when times get tough. Just look at the last few contacts. We fight for what's fair. The owners, top tier executives, are the ones who lobbied for these trade agreements. Yet, it wasn't until the shit hit the fan and bankruptcy was discussed that any mention of them taking a pay cut was mentioned. We have been doing our part for years. So please don't try to blame the U.A.W. for this mess.

[charly]

Your wages might be in line, but your benefits and fully fringed costs are not. Nor are the retirees and their benefits.

 

Be careful what you wish for. Most exec's have taken massive cuts. I don't see the union bending because the execs take a paycut. And the fact is that the execs are a tiny portion compared to the costs of other workers and retiree's. It probably feels good to think that executive paycuts would make much of a difference, but it doesnt.

 

Sooooooooooooooooooo are you saying that we should just ignore the retiree costs and just hope they will go away? Maybe in your world.

When someone in your family becomes ill or injured do you take care of them or just have them euthanized??

[wilydruger]

From a fiscal view point.....Greed is what got us in this mess. In my opinion, the two MAIN reasons this country is in the mess it is in are Free Trade Agreements and the Banking System. They are both based on greed.

All of your "upper class" people i.e. company owners, top tier executives, the President, congressmen, senators, etc wanted these free trade agreements for all of the wrong reasons. They had every intention of going to these 3rd world countries and exploiting their people and country. They knew from the very beginning that the pay scale of these 3rd world countries were not going to rise but that in time, it would give them the excuse to try and bring our pay scale down in the name of being competitive. They knew they could exploit the workers in these 3rd world countries while ignoring the same environmental standards our country has and make huge profits. Big Business takes care of Big Business. From the President down through congress and the Senate, you cant tell me there were no kick backs to pass these bullshit Agreements. Well, look what it has done to this country. 6 million people out of work and the threat of more jobs lost if we ( the working class) do not agree to wage cuts, higher insurance co-pays, screwing our retirees, etc.

Look at the Banking Industry...you cannot tell me that the banking system did not know that down the road these bull shit mortgages were not going to cause millions of Americans to lose their homes. But once again, greed got the best of them. They passed millions of mortgages and in return, made Billions of dollars, while knowing that these mortgages were doomed to fail.

Show me anywhere in these two examples where the working class benefited. Billions of dollars were made. who got all the money? The "upper class".

 

The U.A.W. is NOT to blame in any of this. They fight for the working class to make a fair days wage for a fair days work. The U.A.W. has made many concessions when times get tough. Just look at the last few contacts. We fight for what's fair. The owners, top tier executives, are the ones who lobbied for these trade agreements. Yet, it wasn't until the shit hit the fan and bankruptcy was discussed that any mention of them taking a pay cut was mentioned. We have been doing our part for years. So please don't try to blame the U.A.W. for this mess.

 

Just wanted to say great post Steve. Also, please put some more thought into the upcoming election and who might be BEST suited to help US, the membership. Thanks.

[fordworker]

Sooooooooooooooooooo are you saying that we should just ignore the retiree costs and just hope they will go away? Maybe in your world.

When someone in your family becomes ill or injured do you take care of them or just have them euthanized??

U know damn well it aint about that. The companies cannot afford these benefits anymore.They cant keep loosing $25 billion a year.

What part of bankrupt and on the verge of going out of business dont u understand

Whats going on now is obvious.

They are making the current workers take ALL the cuts while the union went back on there agreement with Bush to take 50% stock for VEBA.

So when there are 10K layoffs next 12 months and your pay is cut to $25 an hour with alot higher copays dont bitch about it.

utting GEN and SUB is not good for the current workers left is it? yes or no? No GEN will equal huge layoffs and the outsourcing of our jobs. You think Ford will put its new cars and engines programs in the USA when theres no GEN? HELL NO

They will stop the work on LAP and move that shit to Mexico. They will put the new I4 engines in mexico also and close REP and the cleveland site and eventually Lima also. NO GEN= fewer workers we are being soldout wake the fuck up and open your eyes.

WHERE IS THE GUARANTEE OF NEW WORK AT OUR PLANTS???? And dont even think about buyouts! NO GEN= NONE. just a pink slip

REMEMBER the ALAMO replace Alamo with the ATLANTA PLANT we were told in several plant meetings we were slated for getting the Taurus replacement and where did it go? MEXICO! They lied to our faces and where is Atlanta plant today? its gone. We had the best quality assembly plant in North America and it didnt matter did it? Thats gonna happen to alot of our stamping,powertrain and assembly plants real soon.

Edited February 21, 2009 by fordworker

[jm2607]

U know damn well it aint about that. The companies cannot afford these benefits anymore.They cant keep loosing $25 billion a year.

What part of bankrupt and on the verge of going out of business dont u understand

Whats going on now is obvious.

They are making the current workers take ALL the cuts while the union went back on there agreement with Bush to take 50% stock for VEBA.

So when there are 10K layoffs next 12 months and your pay is cut to $25 an hour with alot higher copays dont bitch about it.

utting GEN and SUB is not good for the current workers left is it? yes or no? No GEN will equal huge layoffs and the outsourcing of our jobs. You think Ford will put its new cars and engines programs in the USA when theres no GEN? HELL NO

They will stop the work on LAP and move that shit to Mexico. They will put the new I4 engines in mexico also and close REP and the cleveland site and eventually Lima also. NO GEN= fewer workers we are being soldout wake the fuck up and open your eyes.

WHERE IS THE GUARANTEE OF NEW WORK AT OUR PLANTS???? And dont even think about buyouts! NO GEN= NONE. just a pink slip

REMEMBER the ALAMO replace Alamo with the ATLANTA PLANT we were told in several plant meetings we were slated for getting the Taurus replacement and where did it go? MEXICO! They lied to our faces and where is Atlanta plant today? its gone. We had the best quality assembly plant in North America and it didnt matter did it? Thats gonna happen to alot of our stamping,powertrain and assembly plants real soon.

Back to your same 'ol self. Changing your screen name did nothing. Just stop it, you don't know anything. All speculation.

[fordworker]

Back to your same 'ol self. Changing your screen name did nothing. Just stop it, you don't know anything. All speculation.

speculation on what? o there not getting rid of GEN? There is not new work guarantees is there? NO

Ford wont export our jobs and put new cars in Mexico like they did the Fusion? With NO GEN they will speed up there exporting of our jobs if you think they wont then you have some serious problems.

[jm2607]

U know damn well it aint about that. The companies cannot afford these benefits anymore.They cant keep loosing $25 billion a year.

What part of bankrupt and on the verge of going out of business dont u understand

Whats going on now is obvious.

They are making the current workers take ALL the cuts while the union went back on there agreement with Bush to take 50% stock for VEBA.

So when there are 10K layoffs next 12 months and your pay is cut to $25 an hour with alot higher copays dont bitch about it.

utting GEN and SUB is not good for the current workers left is it? yes or no? No GEN will equal huge layoffs and the outsourcing of our jobs. You think Ford will put its new cars and engines programs in the USA when theres no GEN? HELL NO

They will stop the work on LAP and move that shit to Mexico. They will put the new I4 engines in mexico also and close REP and the cleveland site and eventually Lima also. NO GEN= fewer workers we are being soldout wake the fuck up and open your eyes.

WHERE IS THE GUARANTEE OF NEW WORK AT OUR PLANTS???? And dont even think about buyouts! NO GEN= NONE. just a pink slip

REMEMBER the ALAMO replace Alamo with the ATLANTA PLANT we were told in several plant meetings we were slated for getting the Taurus replacement and where did it go? MEXICO! They lied to our faces and where is Atlanta plant today? its gone. We had the best quality assembly plant in North America and it didnt matter did it? Thats gonna happen to alot of our stamping,powertrain and assembly plants real soon.

The Taurus replacement was built in Mexico....hmmmm... Edited February 21, 2009 by jm2607

[jm2607]

speculation on what? o there not getting rid of GEN? There is not new work guarantees is there? NO

Ford wont export our jobs and put new cars in Mexico like they did the Fusion? With NO GEN they will speed up there exporting of our jobs if you think they wont then you have some serious problems.

My God Man, I never said I didn't believe JSP was gone, we all know that. But all your stupid ranting about "pink slips and 10,000 people getting laid off" is fear mongering.

[fordworker]

The Taurus replacement is built in Mexico....hmmmm...

Fusion dumbass is the spinoff of Taurus. Ford made a decision to split the over 400K sales at the time to make to new versions of the Taurus.Fusion/The 500.

Every really informed ford worker knows this u r obviously just an asshole who knows nothing about the company. And Fusion is built in exico Atalnta Assembly got fucked.

[jm2607]

Fusion dumbass is the spinoff of Taurus. Ford made a decision to split the over 400K sales at the time to make to new versions of the Taurus.Fusion/The 500.

Every really informed ford worker knows this u r obviously just an asshole who knows nothing about the company. And Fusion is built in exico Atalnta Assembly got fucked.

Stop with the name calling.. it shows your maturity. Keep it up and you just might get kicked off again.

[fordworker]

My God Man, I never said I didn't believe JSP was gone, we all know that. But all your stupid ranting about "pink slips and 10,000 people getting laid off" is fear mongering.

So GM which seels more pickups every year (130k more last year) then ford does is closing a pickup plant and cutting a shift at another and you believe Ford will not cut 2 or more shifts on there pickup line?/ Your Crazy. Ford has more shifts building pickups then GM yet check last years and last 5 years pickup sales GM dominates Ford every year. Silverado/Sierra are samething just like fusion/Milan.

And plants supporting the pickup will see layoffs, stamping,engine,powertrain. GM closing 14 plants next 3 years and Im to believe Ford will close only the CCP and Minnesota. Ya OK you keep believing that

Go check the current monthly sale figures they aint good. ford on pace to sell 300K pickups after 530K last year.

Edited February 21, 2009 by fordworker

[fordworker]

Stop with the name calling.. it shows your maturity. Keep it up and you just might get kicked off again.

What are you talking about?

[statts]

U know damn well it aint about that. The companies cannot afford these benefits anymore.They cant keep loosing $25 billion a year.

What part of bankrupt and on the verge of going out of business dont u understand

Whats going on now is obvious.

They are making the current workers take ALL the cuts while the union went back on there agreement with Bush to take 50% stock for VEBA.

So when there are 10K layoffs next 12 months and your pay is cut to $25 an hour with alot higher copays dont bitch about it.

utting GEN and SUB is not good for the current workers left is it? yes or no? No GEN will equal huge layoffs and the outsourcing of our jobs. You think Ford will put its new cars and engines programs in the USA when theres no GEN? HELL NO

They will stop the work on LAP and move that shit to Mexico. They will put the new I4 engines in mexico also and close REP and the cleveland site and eventually Lima also. NO GEN= fewer workers we are being soldout wake the fuck up and open your eyes.

WHERE IS THE GUARANTEE OF NEW WORK AT OUR PLANTS???? And dont even think about buyouts! NO GEN= NONE. just a pink slip

REMEMBER the ALAMO replace Alamo with the ATLANTA PLANT we were told in several plant meetings we were slated for getting the Taurus replacement and where did it go? MEXICO! They lied to our faces and where is Atlanta plant today? its gone. We had the best quality assembly plant in North America and it didnt matter did it? Thats gonna happen to alot of our stamping,powertrain and assembly plants real soon.

 

theres is buyouts coming,same as gm and chrysler some cash a a car voucher.

[fordworker]

theres is buyouts coming,same as gm and chrysler some cash a a car voucher.

What $20K and a $25K car voucher

Im sure there gonna get alot of takers on that

[jm2607]

So GM which seels more pickups every year (130k more last year) then ford does is closing a pickup plant and cutting a shift at another and you believe Ford will not cut 2 or more shifts on there pickup line?/ Your Crazy. Ford has more shifts building pickups then GM yet check last years and last 5 years pickup sales GM dominates Ford every year. Silverado/Sierra are samething just like fusion/Milan.

And plants supporting the pickup will see layoffs, stamping,engine,powertrain. GM closing 14 plants next 3 years and Im to believe Ford will close only the CCP and Minnesota. Ya OK you keep believing that

Go check the current monthly sale figures they aint good. ford on pace to sell 300K pickups after 530K last year.

What the hell are you talking about dude, I never said I don't beleive they wont close plants or cut shifts.

[sterling joe]

Your wages might be in line, but your benefits and fully fringed costs are not. Nor are the retirees and their benefits.

 

Be careful what you wish for. Most exec's have taken massive cuts. I don't see the union bending because the execs take a paycut. And the fact is that the execs are a tiny portion compared to the costs of other workers and retiree's. It probably feels good to think that executive paycuts would make much of a difference, but it doesnt.

You must be as dumb as you sound , executives paycuts woundn't make a difference ,REALLY IF THE UAW WORKED FOR F@!KING FREE THE COMPANY WOULD STILL BE LOSING BILLIONS , SO YOU TELL ME WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ,20% OF THE COST OF THE VECHICLE IS BULLS@!T MANAGEMENT COSTS ,ITS THE EXECUTIVES THAT HAVE f@!KED THIS COMPANY UP AND YOU PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR SCAPEGOATS . COMING FROM SOMEONE THAT INSTEAD OF DOING "REAL" WORK YOU HAVE ALOT OF TIME ON A FRIDAY MORNING TO COME ON THIS FORUM AN TALK ABOUT PEOPLE WHO HAVE TO SHOWER WHEN THEY GET HOME .

[statts]

What $20K and a $25K car voucher

Im sure there gonna get alot of takers on that

 

well is something,i agree but you should get some.

[idriveamerican]

I'm not. just a white collar worker who's sick the company taking from me.

 

The UAW crippled this industry by creating an environment that cannot manage sales that move anywhere but up. They've pressured the companies to maintain far too much capacity and people.

If I managed my household like you "white collar" workers managed the company, I would be living in a card board box under a bridge. You people constantly under estimate our intelligence and knowledge. Perhaps if you listened to out input, just once, you might have been pleasantly surprised. I do not think we would have done worse for the company then has already been done. If you give respect, you will receive it.

[idriveamerican]

White collar, I challenge you to work one day on the line, if at the end of that day you can honestly say, "you guys do nothing" then I will stomach your superiority.

Edited February 21, 2009 by idriveamerican

[Makeastand]

From a fiscal view point.....Greed is what got us in this mess. In my opinion, the two MAIN reasons this country is in the mess it is in are Free Trade Agreements and the Banking System. They are both based on greed.

All of your "upper class" people i.e. company owners, top tier executives, the President, congressmen, senators, etc wanted these free trade agreements for all of the wrong reasons. They had every intention of going to these 3rd world countries and exploiting their people and country. They knew from the very beginning that the pay scale of these 3rd world countries were not going to rise but that in time, it would give them the excuse to try and bring our pay scale down in the name of being competitive. They knew they could exploit the workers in these 3rd world countries while ignoring the same environmental standards our country has and make huge profits. Big Business takes care of Big Business. From the President down through congress and the Senate, you cant tell me there were no kick backs to pass these bullshit Agreements. Well, look what it has done to this country. 6 million people out of work and the threat of more jobs lost if we ( the working class) do not agree to wage cuts, higher insurance co-pays, screwing our retirees, etc.

Look at the Banking Industry...you cannot tell me that the banking system did not know that down the road these bull shit mortgages were not going to cause millions of Americans to lose their homes. But once again, greed got the best of them. They passed millions of mortgages and in return, made Billions of dollars, while knowing that these mortgages were doomed to fail.

Show me anywhere in these two examples where the working class benefited. Billions of dollars were made. who got all the money? The "upper class".

 

The U.A.W. is NOT to blame in any of this. They fight for the working class to make a fair days wage for a fair days work. The U.A.W. has made many concessions when times get tough. Just look at the last few contacts. We fight for what's fair. The owners, top tier executives, are the ones who lobbied for these trade agreements. Yet, it wasn't until the shit hit the fan and bankruptcy was discussed that any mention of them taking a pay cut was mentioned. We have been doing our part for years. So please don't try to blame the U.A.W. for this mess.

Great post!!