rjm1 Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 There have been discussions here about the lock-out of some functions of the Nav unit while in Drive. While I understand Ford's liability reasons for doing this, many feel that a passenger should be able to input data while the car is moving. I do not want to start a discussion as to the benefits/dangers of doing so, but would like to know if anyone has any first-hand information about this unit, which says it will do just that with SYNC - equipped cars? http://www.coastaletech.com/synclockpick.htm An e-mail to them was replied to quickly, saying that installation and operation should be very similar to that shown in their Liincoln video on the site: "We do not have any other install videos available yet for the Sync lockpick however as long as your vehicle has a sync radio with a harddrive then the lockpick will work. The installation wil be very similar to the installation for the MKS the only difference would be reomoving the trim around the radio." Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 Ford looked at ways of determining whether it was the driver or the passenger using the Nav including heat sensors, but determined it was too difficult and expensive. Their long term solution is to allow voice entered destinations which I believe is available on the newer Ford nav systems. If not then it's coming soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lantern Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 Seems like there should be a way to make this sensor work in the same manner that the passenger air bag does. If the sensors pick up enough weight to activate the airbag then the nav unit motion detection could be disabled. I am not an engineer and I don't play one on TV but it seems as if this should be in the realm of possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 Seems like there should be a way to make this sensor work in the same manner that the passenger air bag does. If the sensors pick up enough weight to activate the airbag then the nav unit motion detection could be disabled. I am not an engineer and I don't play one on TV but it seems as if this should be in the realm of possibility. But that doesn't tell you whether it's the driver or the passenger using the system - it just means that it's possible that the passenger is using it. Definitely would not hold up in a lawsuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lantern Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 But that doesn't tell you whether it's the driver or the passenger using the system - it just means that it's possible that the passenger is using it. Definitely would not hold up in a lawsuit. Oh I totally agree with you on that. I was not stating that as a way to make it 'safe'. I was instead, simply stating that there was some logic that could be used if someone truly wanted to engineer it that way. I am actually not in favor of the dvd working at all when in motion but I do think the nav should be functional. How is it allowable for the handheld/windshield mounted units to do this while in motion but a dash installed unit cannot? Would not the same legal standpoint apply? And this is not meant as simply a Ford question but rather a automotive one in general. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbf2530 Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 (edited) Oh I totally agree with you on that. I was not stating that as a way to make it 'safe'. I was instead, simply stating that there was some logic that could be used if someone truly wanted to engineer it that way. I am actually not in favor of the dvd working at all when in motion but I do think the nav should be functional. How is it allowable for the handheld/windshield mounted units to do this while in motion but a dash installed unit cannot? Would not the same legal standpoint apply? And this is not meant as simply a Ford question but rather a automotive one in general. Hi Green Lantern. :D Just to add to akirby's good advice and try to answer your legal standpoint question (as you requested), and not getting into the "should it or shouldn't it be this way" questions: If you mount an aftermarket NAV unit in your car, Ford (or any Automaker) is in no way legally liable for what may happen if you have an accident while you are driving due to your inattention while reprogramming it. They did not provide the equipment. You purchased it, you installed it (whether stuck to the windshield with suction cups, held in your hand, etc) and you used it in a "dangerous" or "negligent" manner. However, due to the litigious nature in the US nowadays, if Ford was to enable the Factory NAV system to be reprogrammed while driving, some idiot (or idiots lawyer) would eventually sue Ford (or any Automaker) after a crash. And some idiotic jury would eventually find Ford liable, ruling that the automaker should not have allowed the Factory NAV system to be reprogrammed while driving, since it created an "Attractive Nuisance". Since the Automaker provided the equipment (a factory NAV system) and allowed it to be operated in a "negligent manner" (programmed while driving), they can be held liable. Please keep in mind I do not agree with this state of affairs, I am simply providing the explanation. I will give this quick analogy. If I was to have an accident while driving because I dropped a hot cup of coffee in my lap that I brought from home or anywhere else (think McDonalds lawsuit), Ford (or another automaker) would not be liable. Ford did not provide the cup of coffee. I bought the coffee and carried it into the car myself (like an aftermarket NAV system). But if Ford was to install a coffee maker in my car (i.e. a Factory NAV system) and I brew a cup, drop the hot cup of coffee in my lap while driving and have an accident, Ford has opened themselves up to liability. They provided/installed the equipment and allowed it to be used while driving, thus creating an "attractive nuisance" (in the eyes of greedy lawyers). Hope this makes it a bit clearer. Good luck. :beerchug: PS - The following statement is not directed at you Green Lantern. I repeat, I do not agree with the way the law works, so I do not want to get into a debate over whether it makes sense. I already agree that it does not make sense. I believe in personal responsibility. But it is what it is and debating with me will not change the facts or the law. Edited March 4, 2009 by bbf2530 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lantern Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Hi Green Lantern. :D Just to add to akirby's good advice and try to answer your legal standpoint question (as you requested), and not getting into the "should it or shouldn't it be this way" questions: If you mount an aftermarket NAV unit in your car, Ford (or any Automaker) is in no way legally liable for what may happen if you have an accident while you are driving due to your inattention while reprogramming it. They did not provide the equipment. You purchased it, you installed it (whether stuck to the windshield with suction cups, held in your hand, etc) and you used it in a "dangerous" or "negligent" manner. However, due to the litigious nature in the US nowadays, if Ford was to enable the Factory NAV system to be reprogrammed while driving, some idiot (or idiots lawyer) would eventually sue Ford (or any Automaker) after a crash. And some idiotic jury would eventually find Ford liable, ruling that the automaker should not have allowed the Factory NAV system to be reprogrammed while driving, since it created an "Attractive Nuisance". Since the Automaker provided the equipment (a factory NAV system) and allowed it to be operated in a "negligent manner" (programmed while driving), they can be held liable. Please keep in mind I do not agree with this state of affairs, I am simply providing the explanation. I will give this quick analogy. If I was to have an accident while driving because I dropped a hot cup of coffee in my lap that I brought from home or anywhere else (think McDonalds lawsuit), Ford (or another automaker) would not be liable. Ford did not provide the cup of coffee. I bought the coffee and carried it into the car myself (like an aftermarket NAV system). But if Ford was to install a coffee maker in my car (i.e. a Factory NAV system) and I brew a cup, drop the hot cup of coffee in my lap while driving and have an accident, Ford has opened themselves up to liability. They provided/installed the equipment and allowed it to be used while driving, thus creating an "attractive nuisance" (in the eyes of greedy lawyers). Hope this makes it a bit clearer. Good luck. :beerchug: PS - The following statement is not directed at you Green Lantern. I repeat, I do not agree with the way the law works, so I do not want to get into a debate over whether it makes sense. I already agree that it does not make sense. I believe in personal responsibility. But it is what it is and debating with me will not change the facts or the law. Great points and for the record...I did not take one thing you said or akirby said personally. It is all good. I totally get the liability issue. Maybe someday people will truly be held responsible for THEIR OWN actions and companies will not be subjected to wasted lawsuits that ultimately just cost all us consumers more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottfisher Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) Friend of mine has a 2007 AMG Mercedes with Nav unit, it allows use of Nav but on start-up you have to answer questions Yes/No with touch screen, I think 3, to acknowledge that you are participating in a dangerous act willfully, and removing Mercedes from liability. His wifes older BMW does same thing, so it is possible with enough question/answer sessions on the screen. Its all about liabilty in the end, and protecting the company from frivilous suits, not that they do not want to give people what they want. Edited March 4, 2009 by scottfisher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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