fmccap Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 'American descent into Marxism happening with breathtaking speed'... The final collapse has come with the election of Barack Obama. His speed in the past three months has been truly impressive. His spending and money printing has been a record setting, not just in America's short history but in the world. If this keeps up for more then another year, and there is no sign that it will not, America at best will resemble the Wiemar Republic and at worst Zimbabwe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadtrip Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 'American descent into Marxism happening with breathtaking speed'... I respect the editorialists' of Pravda's opinion. They know Marxism. I'm not really concerned that America is descending into Marxism "at breathtaking speed." Actually, the American government has been engaging in Marxist policies for more than 100 years - one could argue many more years (to include the Pacific Railroad Act of 1864) - with commodities subsidies, trade tarriffs, anti-trust laws, the 16th Amendment, most of the programs of the New Deal, the Great Society, Medicare (Part D), and so on and so forth. ... America has been descending into Marxism at a very slow but steady rate, to the extent that a supposed conservative like George W. Bush would push through and sign a bill like the redistributive Medicare (Part D) program. And never mind that Congress passed, and President Obama signed, the recent massive stimulus package: Members of Congress didn't read it because they knew it was a drop in the bucket compared to Americans' real public debt. According to a study by USA Today, total public debt in the U.S. equals $546,668 per household (compared to private debt of $121,953 per household). http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/20...5-28-debt_N.htm Yikes! Since the economy cannot grow fast enough to support servicing the interest and repayment of this massive debt (the economy has been contracting over the past two quarters), the government must either raise taxes or print money - on a seriously large scale. Both measures will diminish the purchasing power of consumers - to the extent that they will, at some point, well, you can fill in the blank. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 'American descent into Marxism happening with breathtaking speed'... You realize you're quoting a Soviet Union newspaper to support your claim. No bias there of course...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 (edited) I respect the editorialists' of Pravda's opinion. They know Marxism. According to a study by USA Today, total public debt in the U.S. equals $546,668 per household (compared to private debt of $121,953 per household). http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/20...5-28-debt_N.htm Yikes! You have made me feel so much better knowing your public debt is so much r e h g i h than the Banana Republic of Great Britain, not much higher though. Edited June 1, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 (edited) Bottom line: The government took on $6.8 trillion in new obligations in 2008, pushing the total owed to a record $63.8 trillion. Glad I live in: Edited June 1, 2009 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 (edited) What is your deficit this year anyway JPD? Oh, and the US will come out of this....somehow. Japan after all carries far more debt. Edited June 1, 2009 by suv_guy_19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 What is your deficit this year anyway JPD? Oh, and the US will come out of this....somehow. Japan after all carries far more debt. AUS$50 billion for 2009/10 expected to rise to AUS$60 billion for 2010/11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 (edited) AUS$50 billion for 2009/10 expected to rise to AUS$60 billion for 2010/11 Interesting...Very similar to our numbers. CAD $50B for this year (so far) and at least $32B next year. Anyway, I think America has to come up with a plan to get out of deficit for a while, so it can pay off some of the debt before the service charges become crazy. Edited June 1, 2009 by suv_guy_19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Anyway, I think America has to come up with a plan to get out of deficit for a while, so it can pay off some of the debt before the service charges become crazy. Here's an idea: Stop spending so much freaking money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Here's an idea: Stop spending so much freaking money! A better one would be to recall all the TARP funds. I sense the economy is about to launch into inflation..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikem12 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 You realize you're quoting a Soviet Union newspaper to support your claim. No bias there of course...... They should know how marism works don't you think. Further, just about every economist I have listened to has said the exact same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 They should know how marism works don't you think. Further, just about every economist I have listened to has said the exact same thing. They're talking shit. A marxist Government wouldn't be lending cash to capitolist companies with the intent of making money. All of those Einsteins didn't predict any of this 18 months ago, they're just making up crap on the run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Here's an idea: Stop spending so much freaking money! I think that a decrease in spending along with some tax increases may be needed. I'mk not a fan of doing either thing, but I don't see another way out for the US and some of the states. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 I think that a decrease in spending along with some tax increases may be needed. I'mk not a fan of doing either thing, but I don't see another way out for the US and some of the states. Increasing taxes is never the answer and likely wouldn't help anything. It would prolong the recession and discourage individual and corporate spending. Massive cuts to government spending are the only long-term solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Increasing taxes is never the answer and likely wouldn't help anything. It would prolong the recession and discourage individual and corporate spending. Massive cuts to government spending are the only long-term solution. I don't think that taxes should be increased now, but they may have to be to some extent down the road in order to services the debt. Those charges are going to get very large and even cutteing government spending may not be enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 I don't think that taxes should be increased now, but they may have to be to some extent down the road in order to services the debt. Those charges are going to get very large and even cutteing government spending may not be enough. Cutting government spending will be plenty, just so long as the politicians finally grow balls big enough to make the cuts where they need to be made *cough-cough*entitlements*cough-cough*. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikem12 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Cutting government spending will be plenty, just so long as the politicians finally grow balls big enough to make the cuts where they need to be made *cough-cough*entitlements*cough-cough*. entitlements should be cut? I agree but guess what, it won't happen. California's problem would most likely go away if they stopped feeding, giving medical, housing etc to all the illegals. Bama says we are out of money but they are still trying to pass national health care and bunch of smaller entitlement programs as well. When do we start making the Government stay within a budget. Can you say bankruptcy. If you haven't heard the IRS has stated incoming tax revenue has dropped by 30+ percent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 entitlements should be cut? I agree but guess what, it won't happen. California's problem would most likely go away if they stopped feeding, giving medical, housing etc to all the illegals. Bama says we are out of money but they are still trying to pass national health care and bunch of smaller entitlement programs as well. When do we start making the Government stay within a budget. Can you say bankruptcy. Like I said, it won't happen until politicians grow a pair. Never said I expected it to happen anytime soon. If you haven't heard the IRS has stated incoming tax revenue has dropped by 30+ percent. No surprise there based on the economic climate. Increases taxes would probably make those revenues drop even further as economic activity and spending slowed more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikem12 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Like I said, it won't happen until politicians grow a pair. Never said I expected it to happen anytime soon. No surprise there based on the economic climate. Increases taxes would probably make those revenues drop even further as economic activity and spending slowed more. now they are talking a "VAT" tax, ie: Value added tax at each point of sale. hold on to your knickers cause I doubt they do away with income taxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trimdingman Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 If hyper-inflation comes, it will wipe out everybody's savings, and debts. Everybody will be more or less equal. That is Marxism. It seems to be happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmccap Posted June 1, 2009 Author Share Posted June 1, 2009 I don't think that taxes should be increased now, but they may have to be to some extent down the road in order to services the debt. Those charges are going to get very large and even cutteing government spending may not be enough. Last I seen our debt services were half a trillion, I don't remember if it was 07 or 08. We have all seen how much we have been borrowing since, I'd hate to see it now. It's almost over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 How much does the US government collect in tax every year (this year doesn't count, it will be much lower than average). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 How much does the US government collect in tax every year (this year doesn't count, it will be much lower than average). I want to say somewhere in the range of $3-4 trillion through income tax. Couldn't find any good numbers doing a quick search though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 If hyper-inflation comes, it will wipe out everybody's savings, and debts. Everybody will be more or less equal. That is Marxism. It seems to be happening. Oh come on really. The government spends billions trying to stimulate the economy, lends hundreds of billions to capitalist banks to free up interbank lending. That's not Marxism but to let them fail would be....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 If hyper-inflation comes, it will wipe out everybody's savings, and debts. Everybody will be more or less equal. That is Marxism. It seems to be happening. Deflation is more likely in the immediate future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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