Future Mustangs

[Explorer4X4]

Alright, I have heard of future models like the GT-R and Mach1. I am in an argument about the Mustang, Challenger and Charger with the Mopar fans at Allpar.com. They say, "Ford cheated by supercharging" and that the next Challenger SRT-8 will be faster. What is planned with the Mustang? What models will be produced or are likely to be produced and what engines are planned? They recently told me that the Stratus was competing with the Mustang. The Charger seems like it should be pointed to the Mustang, but it isn't? The Challenger is though, correct? Whats fastest now, Mustang, GTO or Charger and what'l be fastest in 2007 with the Camaro, Mustang, Charger, Challenger and GTO?

I really hope the Ford, Shelby, SVT and Roush can come up with something better then what those Germans at Dodge are doing. Allpar members seem pretty convinced that the Challenger will cream the Mustang. I have high hopes for the Mustang, but I'm worried... Especially with the Camaro and Challenger coming...

Edited June 26, 2006 by Explorer4X4

[Guest Sixcav]

Well first off let me say that clearly the Charger is a Sedan. It's a 4 door and its based on the 300 chassis, a sedan chassis, so yes it's a sedan. Secondly, Dodge has publicly stated that they are building the Challenger to compete directly with the Mustang. That is it's stated goal. There will be a V6 version and everything, they even plan to price it competitive with the Mustang. I'm not sure how supercharging a car is "cheating". It's a performance part, that's all. Some guys use turbochargers, some superchargers, some NOS, it's all the same to me. Whatever you want to do to improve the performance of your car. There are no rules here except playground rules. I haven't heard if Mustang is changing the HP rating for the 07 Mustang. Anything you read about HP ratings for the Camaro or Challenger are strictly speculation. Both cars are still in the prototype stage and they have a long way to go before they reach production. So whatever the concept cars are getting it's likely the production versions won't.

[NickF1011]

Well, the Mopar junkies better pray that Dodge is planning to put something more powerful than the current 6.1 into the Challenger if they want it to beat the GT500.

 

425 HP in a 4000 lb car likely won't be outrunning 500 HP in a 3900 lb car anytime soon.

 

Ford should be more worried about filling the gap between the GT and GT500 before they even concern themselves with what Dodge and GM have up their sleeve.

[igor]

I haven't heard if Mustang is changing the HP rating for the 07 Mustang. Anything you read about HP ratings for the Camaro or Challenger are strictly speculation. Both cars are still in the prototype stage and they have a long way to go before they reach production. So whatever the concept cars are getting it's likely the production versions won't.

 

the most true statement.... they can flex their muscles all they want.. and Auto rags can "race them" all they want.. the truth is ... there is only one pony car on the market - Mustang... and Ford has 2-3 years to get ready for anything they are trying to bring over...

 

and even if htye can;t do it in the current mustang.. the next get is on the table for 2009 or 2010...

 

Finally Shelby said recently 700hp is piece of cake for mustang.. we should keep in mind that if Ford wants, they can fit the real Ford GT engine in the car.

 

Finally by end of 2008 (so in time for 2009 MY) Ford will have the Hurrucane ready.... that would be able to compete with the HEMI even without SCc or TC

 

Finally.. how is making an neinge more efficient cheating? .... a car can get boost of good 30% in its power without significantly adverse effect on mileage... I think it is called innovation and progress .. not cheating.

 

Igor

[NickF1011]

Finally Shelby said recently 700hp is piece of cake for mustang.. we should keep in mind that if Ford wants, they can fit the real Ford GT engine in the car.

 

Actually, the dry sump provisions on the aluminum 5.4 block used on the Ford GT motor make that an impossibility.

[igor]

Actually, the dry sump provisions on the aluminum 5.4 block used on the Ford GT motor make that an impossibility.

 

oh.. I did not know that.... I stand corrected.... but cannot they bypass it?

 

Igor

[NickF1011]

oh.. I did not know that.... I stand corrected.... but cannot they bypass it?

 

Igor

 

Well, they could certainly redesign the aluminum block to accept a wet sump system. Wouldn't be the cheapest option though. And of course, they could also add the twin-screw blower from the GT motor to the current GT500 engine without any trouble.

 

I still don't really see any point of going beyond 500 HP anytime soon though. They need something in the 360-400 HP range more.

[NLPRacing]

Well, they could certainly redesign the aluminum block to accept a wet sump system. Wouldn't be the cheapest option though. And of course, they could also add the twin-screw blower from the GT motor to the current GT500 engine without any trouble.

 

I still don't really see any point of going beyond 500 HP anytime soon though. They need something in the 360-400 HP range more.

 

I think a GT350 with a 350 to 400 HP all aluminum 3V 5.4 and 6 speed manual with IRS would be much better than a 700HP halo car. And if they could make a stripped down version with no warranty (GT350R?) for SCCA racing, that would be even better!

[Explorer4X4]

Thanks for the information. Another question, what was the peak in horsepower for the old (1960's, 1970's, 1980's) Ford Mustangs, Dodge Challengers and Chevrolet Camaros? Isn't the fastest Mustang built the Boss 429 with the 375-HP V8? Oh yes, what is the planned engine for the Mustang Mach1, has this inforamtion been released yet? And what is the horespower and engine in the GT-R? I know, too many questons, but it is hard to keep up with all the different models and enignes in the Mustang along with the engines and power of the GTO, Challenger, Camaro and Charger. It also doesn't help that I'm only 13 and most of my time is spent with school, my girl and my family and pets.

[NickF1011]

Thanks for the information. Another question, what was the peak in horsepower for the old (1960's, 1970's, 1980's) Ford Mustangs, Dodge Challengers and Chevrolet Camaros? Isn't the fastest Mustang built the Boss 429 with the 375-HP V8? Oh yes, what is the planned engine for the Mustang Mach1, has this inforamtion been released yet? And what is the horespower and engine in the GT-R? I know, too many questons, but it is hard to keep up with all the different models and enignes in the Mustang along with the engines and power of the GTO, Challenger, Camaro and Charger. It also doesn't help that I'm only 13 and most of my time is spent with school, my girl and my family and pets.

 

The Boss 429 was certainly amongst the quickest "old school" Mustangs. More recently though, the 03-04 Cobra and '07 GT500 have all eclipsed its mark. Don't know enough about the Camaros or Challengers to reliably tell you anything.

 

No solid news on the Mach 1 or any other "mid-pack" Mustangs between the GT and GT500. However, there have been rumors of a few GT500 test mules that were running around with supercharged 4.6 DOHC engines a'la the last Cobra. Either that or a naturally aspirated 5.4 3V are my two guesses if I had to pick now.

 

As for the Mustang GT-R concept, I'm pretty sure it utilized the "Cammer" 5.0 crate motor @ 425 HP just like the Mustang FR500C's that compete in Grand Am Cup.

 

Don't worry about your age! It's just good to see some kids that are still into good ol' American iron!!! :happy feet:

Edited June 27, 2006 by NickF1011

[blksn8k2]

You will probably need to ask a true Mopar or Chevy nut to get a more accurate answer than mine but since I was in high school back when all those cars were new I have a little knowledge about them. As far as the Challenger goes, I would have to guess that the fastest production models were probably those equipped with the 426 Street Hemi. Those built with the 440 Six-Pack wedge engine were pretty fast as well and they may have even been quicker than the Hemi cars on the tires available at the time.

 

The Camaro was available with the 396 big block and there were a few cars built with the 427. Most of those would have been factory special order COPO cars or built by specialty companies like Yenko, which was also a Chevy dealer in Cannonsburg, PA. I don't recall the Camaro ever being available from the factory with the 454 but the 427 cars were some of the fastest muscle cars evre built.

 

While the Boss 429 was the highest rated horsepower engine offered in the "classic" '64 1/2 to 73 Mustangs, a similar situation to the Challenger existed. In '69-70 the Mustang was available with both the Boss 429 and the 428 Cobra Jet and they were two entirely different engine designs. The Boss 429 cylinder heads were very similar to the Chrysler Hemi with their hemispherical combustion chambers and huge ports and valves. This was great for NASCAR and the NHRA but really didn't work that well on a street car. The 428 CJ, on the other hand, had much more conservative heads and a longer stroke crankshaft and thus developed its torque at lower rpms which made it a much better street engine.