Fordemployee189 Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Nothing in this modification suggests a yes vote to me.....give us something we can look forward to.....we can't even look at getting $1000.....if Ford shows a profit and we get profit sharing, we don't get the $1000.......I don't want to look forward to working for the same wage until 2015.....a lot can happen in 6 years....I think they should go back to the table and bring us something else....like when they start making money hand over fist.....we get something back, like COLA, or our 3% raises...or BOTH!!! this modification give us nothing to look forward to....Ford Motor is looking way ahead on this....we should be too....entry level employees will be voting on our behalf in 10 years....remember that.....lets make them go back to the table and bring us something we can vote yes on......we can do better than this...screw pattern bargaining....we are nothing like GM and Chrysler.....not even close.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Nothing in this modification suggests a yes vote to me.....give us something we can look forward to.....we can't even look at getting $1000.....if Ford shows a profit and we get profit sharing, we don't get the $1000.......I don't want to look forward to working for the same wage until 2015.....a lot can happen in 6 years....I think they should go back to the table and bring us something else....like when they start making money hand over fist.....we get something back, like COLA, or our 3% raises...or BOTH!!! this modification give us nothing to look forward to....Ford Motor is looking way ahead on this....we should be too....entry level employees will be voting on our behalf in 10 years....remember that.....lets make them go back to the table and bring us something we can vote yes on......we can do better than this...screw pattern bargaining....we are nothing like GM and Chrysler.....not even close.... Wow, that shows how little you know about pattern bargaining. Pattern bargaining allows the company doing the best or the one that has the most to lose to sit at the table and negotiate with the UAW knowing they will not be giving anything that the other 2 company's aren't going to give to make them at a disadvantage. This is a powerful tool and allows us to get more. Today Ford is strong, tomorrow it will most likely be GM. In 2007 GM was in the best position, who would have thought in 2 yrs Ford would be in a better position, but that is the way it goes. We have benefitted from pattern in the last agreement when GM's pensions were over funded, they folded the extra over and got something more for our retirees. In 2007 Ford was in a worse position and said that they could not do it and the UAW said tighten your belts, because if GM did it and you are going to do it! Who do you think is going to be in a better position in 2015? It won't be Ford, not with GM coming out of bankruptcy and eliminating all their debt through bankruptcy. They will be the ones we are patterning off of and Ford will have to follow suit. Pattern Bargaining has done us members great in the past and the UAW will never give that up because it is best for our members. This agreement doesn't say the UAW can't get some of the things we lost back, all it says if the UAW/Ford do not agree on any proposed increases that they could take it to arbitration! Not that they will! Ford don't want someone else in their books! Pattern Bargaining will not go away because all our members have benefitted from it! Asked a seasoned Chairperson what they think about pattern bargaining! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laidofflocal400member Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Wow, that shows how little you know about pattern bargaining. Pattern bargaining allows the company doing the best or the one that has the most to lose to sit at the table and negotiate with the UAW knowing they will not be giving anything that the other 2 company's aren't going to give to make them at a disadvantage. This is a powerful tool and allows us to get more. Today Ford is strong, tomorrow it will most likely be GM. In 2007 GM was in the best position, who would have thought in 2 yrs Ford would be in a better position, but that is the way it goes. We have benefitted from pattern in the last agreement when GM's pensions were over funded, they folded the extra over and got something more for our retirees. In 2007 Ford was in a worse position and said that they could not do it and the UAW said tighten your belts, because if GM did it and you are going to do it! Who do you think is going to be in a better position in 2015? It won't be Ford, not with GM coming out of bankruptcy and eliminating all their debt through bankruptcy. They will be the ones we are patterning off of and Ford will have to follow suit. Pattern Bargaining has done us members great in the past and the UAW will never give that up because it is best for our members. This agreement doesn't say the UAW can't get some of the things we lost back, all it says if the UAW/Ford do not agree on any proposed increases that they could take it to arbitration! Not that they will! Ford don't want someone else in their books! Pattern Bargaining will not go away because all our members have benefitted from it! Asked a seasoned Chairperson what they think about pattern bargaining! Captain723 I have a question for you.....Are you salary or an International rep who has to support this agreement? Because everywhere I've read a post from you, you don't answer the question or post that was originally asked, kinda like an International rep would do... why don't you international people just put out the info and let us working people vote what we think....it is what it is, why the hard sell with every one of these concession contracts? I mean you are supposed to be representing us "The Membership", but to hear everyone's (International, Local Reps, Plant Committees) thumbs up on every one of these deals really surprises me...again "It is what it is!" Let the people decide.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaah Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Pattern bargaining has worked for us in the past and will in the future, but..... years ago when we broke the pattern to help save chrysler we did not go to GM and Ford and offer them concessions to level the playing field. What we did was to keep our conract with Ford and GM stong and solid and ensured that Chrysler was brought back in line as quickly as possible. This year we were forced to concede more concessions to GM and Chrysler due to the governments intervention, they (the government) broke the pattern not us. The pattern had already been set (the last concession contract) with Ford. We do not need to set a new pattern by negotiating with Ford again, we need to ensure that in future negotiations GM and Chrysler meet the established pattern. We have set the benchmark and I see no need to lower it, keep wages and benefits as is with Ford so our brothers at GM and Chrysler have the best chance to regain what they have lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordemployee189 Posted October 18, 2009 Author Share Posted October 18, 2009 Wow, that shows how little you know about pattern bargaining. Pattern bargaining allows the company doing the best or the one that has the most to lose to sit at the table and negotiate with the UAW knowing they will not be giving anything that the other 2 company's aren't going to give to make them at a disadvantage. This is a powerful tool and allows us to get more. Today Ford is strong, tomorrow it will most likely be GM. In 2007 GM was in the best position, who would have thought in 2 yrs Ford would be in a better position, but that is the way it goes. We have benefitted from pattern in the last agreement when GM's pensions were over funded, they folded the extra over and got something more for our retirees. In 2007 Ford was in a worse position and said that they could not do it and the UAW said tighten your belts, because if GM did it and you are going to do it! Who do you think is going to be in a better position in 2015? It won't be Ford, not with GM coming out of bankruptcy and eliminating all their debt through bankruptcy. They will be the ones we are patterning off of and Ford will have to follow suit. Pattern Bargaining has done us members great in the past and the UAW will never give that up because it is best for our members. This agreement doesn't say the UAW can't get some of the things we lost back, all it says if the UAW/Ford do not agree on any proposed increases that they could take it to arbitration! Not that they will! Ford don't want someone else in their books! Pattern Bargaining will not go away because all our members have benefitted from it! Asked a seasoned Chairperson what they think about pattern bargaining! How does this "powerful tool" allow US to get MORE..............I don't get it............it sounds more like the company is using this patterning tool against us........If Ford would get it's head out of it's ASS and fire some of the idiots that are running the show on the floor maybe we could wipe that debt out before the end of 2010!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiredMotorCompany Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) Wow, that shows how little you know about pattern bargaining. Pattern bargaining allows the company doing the best or the one that has the most to lose to sit at the table and negotiate with the UAW knowing they will not be giving anything that the other 2 company's aren't going to give to make them at a disadvantage. This is a powerful tool and allows us to get more. Today Ford is strong, tomorrow it will most likely be GM. In 2007 GM was in the best position, who would have thought in 2 yrs Ford would be in a better position, but that is the way it goes. We have benefitted from pattern in the last agreement when GM's pensions were over funded, they folded the extra over and got something more for our retirees. In 2007 Ford was in a worse position and said that they could not do it and the UAW said tighten your belts, because if GM did it and you are going to do it! Who do you think is going to be in a better position in 2015? It won't be Ford, not with GM coming out of bankruptcy and eliminating all their debt through bankruptcy. They will be the ones we are patterning off of and Ford will have to follow suit. Pattern Bargaining has done us members great in the past and the UAW will never give that up because it is best for our members. This agreement doesn't say the UAW can't get some of the things we lost back, all it says if the UAW/Ford do not agree on any proposed increases that they could take it to arbitration! Not that they will! Ford don't want someone else in their books! Pattern Bargaining will not go away because all our members have benefitted from it! Asked a seasoned Chairperson what they think about pattern bargaining! Pattern bargaining worked when it involved all of the players involved. The Foreign (sorry, Transplant) manufacturers are not tied to pattern bargaining but we are tied to their wages and compensation. "Leveling the playing field" works when everyone is playing the same game. Either we unionize all manufacturers that we must "compete" with and pattern bargain across the board(won't happen!) or get the Government Auto Manufacturers to back off their forced concessions and don't support some companies with the pocketbook of the US Treasury and then make Ford fight against Foreign and Domestic companies. HOW IS THIS FAIR COMPETITION? Now I have to go take a blood pressure med! Edited October 18, 2009 by FiredMotorCompany Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Pattern bargaining has worked for us in the past and will in the future, but..... years ago when we broke the pattern to help save chrysler we did not go to GM and Ford and offer them concessions to level the playing field. What we did was to keep our conract with Ford and GM stong and solid and ensured that Chrysler was brought back in line as quickly as possible. This year we were forced to concede more concessions to GM and Chrysler due to the governments intervention, they (the government) broke the pattern not us. The pattern had already been set (the last concession contract) with Ford. We do not need to set a new pattern by negotiating with Ford again, we need to ensure that in future negotiations GM and Chrysler meet the established pattern. We have set the benchmark and I see no need to lower it, keep wages and benefits as is with Ford so our brothers at GM and Chrysler have the best chance to regain what they have lost. Excellent points all around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiredMotorCompany Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) The company came to us "Hat in hand". And this is all we got?????????????????????? Edited October 18, 2009 by FiredMotorCompany Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) Captain723 I have a question for you.....Are you salary or an International rep who has to support this agreement? Because everywhere I've read a post from you, you don't answer the question or post that was originally asked, kinda like an International rep would do... why don't you international people just put out the info and let us working people vote what we think....it is what it is, why the hard sell with every one of these concession contracts? I mean you are supposed to be representing us "The Membership", but to hear everyone's (International, Local Reps, Plant Committees) thumbs up on every one of these deals really surprises me...again "It is what it is!" Let the people decide.... 1st, I am not an International Rep and definitely not salary (don't know where you been). As far as letting people vote what they think, I think that would be great, but alot of people will be voting on the miss guided info given by others with their own personal agenda that doesn't necessarily have the future of the membership in mind. There are a lot of short sighted people out there that can not see or listen to the big picture. Look I am one of the biggest assholes I know and one of the toughest on questioning authority. These modifications are looked at with a fine tooth comb by everyone, including our leadership that knows a lot more than I do when it comes to how to interpret language. They also know the intent behind it. It sickens me for those that come on this site agaist something, when they haven't even seen it. I heard even Gary W. from 600 stood up at the conference and said that he was suprised, he thought it was going to be much worse, and then I see all these dumb fking letters he puts out. Even before the modification language came out he had letters bashing it on the floor. Now that they came out he had to put out a new letter bashing its contents. People like that aren't leaders, it is easy for someone to stand up and say NO, instead of looking at the language that was negtiated and saying hey we are the UAW we will make it work. The IUAW could have negotiated the best agreement in the world and at the end of the day, if there are no jobs attached to it, who would it benefit. This modification attaches stronger language and products to match the changing environment in which we are in now. Having SUV's tied to the old language was good until the market crashed and gasoline prices are back on the rise. So instead of being tough and sticking to their guns, the UAW see this as an opportunity to force the company to change that original product to accomidate the current conditions. What good would it of did to have another gas guzzler put in LAP or a small van put into OHAP and another hybrid put into Mexico. That wouldn't have done our members a bit of good. Thank the UAW for looking at an opportunity to get some things that our members need instead of taking a strong stance and this other product get sourced to another country. So again, the UAW is looking into the future knowing that we would have had problems with putting the old committments into LAP/OHAP/MAP/Romeo/Livonia/Sterling/Rawsonville/ACH product committments make viable to sell. All this and maintaining our right to strike over everything but wage improvements ONLY, open # of entry level members (which would not happen unless they found 11k jobs all of the sudden), and mechanical teams that we already have in the 2007 agreement, not to mention that they kept all their classifications, bumping and OT rights. Sorry so long! Edited October 18, 2009 by Captain723 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) How does this "powerful tool" allow US to get MORE..............I don't get it............it sounds more like the company is using this patterning tool against us........If Ford would get it's head out of it's ASS and fire some of the idiots that are running the show on the floor maybe we could wipe that debt out before the end of 2010!!! Today it will not allow us to get more, it benefitted the other 2 company's. Tomorrow however, when GM climbs out of this with 1/2 its debt they will be a much better company financially and we will benefit from them negotiating something good for their members. Again it swings from company to company. In 2007, GM was the one financially better....2 years later with the market crash, Ford benefitted from running low on cash and getting a loan prior too no one else being able to get financed. This made us stronger and kept us out of bankruptcy, so we went first and stopped the bankruptcy from tearing apart the UAW GM/Chrysler agreements totally. As far as the second part, I can not agree with you more! I feel this was being done because they did not think we would be coming to the table so they gave the directive to be assholes. I also think another piece came into to play and that was the fact that they are also fighting to keep their jobs so they are soo scared they lose track of humanity and try and make themselves look better than the next guy at any expencse. Edited October 18, 2009 by Captain723 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaah Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Today it will not allow us to get more, it benefitted the other 2 company's. Tomorrow however, when GM climbs out of this with 1/2 its debt they will be a much better company financially and we will benefit from them negotiating something good for their members. Again it swings from company to company. In 2007, GM was the one financially better....2 years later with the market crash, Ford benefitted from running low on cash and getting a loan prior too no one else being able to get financed. This made us stronger and kept us out of bankruptcy, so we went first and stopped the bankruptcy from tearing apart the UAW agreement totally. The pattern was set with GM in 2007 and was broken just prior to bankruptcy when we set a new pattern with Ford, now we are once again lowering the bar with yet another concession contract. This seems to me to be a dangerous precedent we are setting of opening our contract every time one of the companies comes crying. You also base your view that GM will be the stronger of the companies financialy when next we sit down to negotiate, I don't have your crystal ball so I can't argue if that will be fact or fiction, but, if your wrong and GM and/or Chrysler again need concessions to stay viable do we once again level the playing field for Ford. Where does it end and what benefit will there be to the union when there is no difference in wages and benefits between us and the non union plants. We just pay union dues and they don't. While the percentage of unionized workers has always been historically low it is widely known that it is they that set the standard for all workers wages and benefits and the UAW has been on the frontline since the beginning. When we start failing to lead and fight, the standard of life for all but the wealthy will suffer. We have not led the middle class to a decent standard of life by offering concessions, it was done through hard fought negotiations to keep or improve what we have. Look around, the trickle down effect is happening already. Once it was seen that the mighty UAW could be made to take rollbacks, everyone from public employees to other large unions were and still are under pressure to also open contracts and take concessions. Unions are under attack, not just the UAW but all unions and many look to the UAW to set the standard. Enough of my ramblings, just remember the Union is not the national exec's or the elected or non elected officials it is the line worker, the tradesman and the guy sweeping the floor, ultimately they will make the decisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lquidspine Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Wow, that shows how little you know about pattern bargaining. Pattern bargaining allows the company doing the best or the one that has the most to lose to sit at the table and negotiate with the UAW knowing they will not be giving anything that the other 2 company's aren't going to give to make them at a disadvantage. This is a powerful tool and allows us to get more. Today Ford is strong, tomorrow it will most likely be GM. In 2007 GM was in the best position, who would have thought in 2 yrs Ford would be in a better position, but that is the way it goes. We have benefitted from pattern in the last agreement when GM's pensions were over funded, they folded the extra over and got something more for our retirees. In 2007 Ford was in a worse position and said that they could not do it and the UAW said tighten your belts, because if GM did it and you are going to do it! Who do you think is going to be in a better position in 2015? It won't be Ford, not with GM coming out of bankruptcy and eliminating all their debt through bankruptcy. They will be the ones we are patterning off of and Ford will have to follow suit. Pattern Bargaining has done us members great in the past and the UAW will never give that up because it is best for our members. This agreement doesn't say the UAW can't get some of the things we lost back, all it says if the UAW/Ford do not agree on any proposed increases that they could take it to arbitration! Not that they will! Ford don't want someone else in their books! Pattern Bargaining will not go away because all our members have benefitted from it! Asked a seasoned Chairperson what they think about pattern bargaining! Pattern bargaining has been the best overall tool for the Big 3 however Captain do not act like it has never been broken before. 1979 Chrysler is awarded government loans and workers took pay cuts as a result, Ford and GM while they made concessions did not get near as hard as Chrysler workers. 2009 Ford ratifies a concessions agreement ahead of soon to be bankrupt GM and Chrysler which while similar had different concessions in the agreements. They broke pattern bargaining just this year, its not even like it was long ago (with time for most to forget) and the sales pitch is going to be about pattern bargaining for real ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 Pattern bargaining has been the best overall tool for the Big 3 however Captain do not act like it has never been broken before. 1979 Chrysler is awarded government loans and workers took pay cuts as a result, Ford and GM while they made concessions did not get near as hard as Chrysler workers. 2009 Ford ratifies a concessions agreement ahead of soon to be bankrupt GM and Chrysler which while similar had different concessions in the agreements. They broke pattern bargaining just this year, its not even like it was long ago (with time for most to forget) and the sales pitch is going to be about pattern bargaining for real ? We are also not not dipping as low as GM and Chrysler, that is why our language is much..much..better. In GM/Chrysler they can not strike over anything..period. Ford wanted something similar and the UAW knowing that the product committee in 2007 is in trouble with the gas prices and new projected vehicle sales, so they took this opportunity because Ford wanted something different, so did they. They feel like they got soomething more to protect our members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lquidspine Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 We are also not not dipping as low as GM and Chrysler, that is why our language is much..much..better. In GM/Chrysler they can not strike over anything..period. Ford wanted something similar and the UAW knowing that the product committee in 2007 is in trouble with the gas prices and new projected vehicle sales, so they took this opportunity because Ford wanted something different, so did they. They feel like they got soomething more to protect our members. Well I have the Chrysler agreement and the newest Ford modifications agreement, please point to me as to where the language is better. The way i see it the two contracts are almost 100% copy and pasted, without Ford claiming bankruptcy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTP'er Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 So let me see if I understand this. Ford wants the UAW to take concessins because of there outstanding debt which they reduced by $10 billion earlier this year from around $35 billion down to $25 billion and Ford has over $21 billion in cash on hand plus $10.7 billion in credit which they can access anytime. While @ GM the U.S. government is a 60 percent owner of GM with a $50 billion equity investment and $10 billion in debt and perpetual preferred shares. Oh yah I forgot the IUAW owns 17.5 percent GM. Then why are they throwing in a $1000 come March? Why not just put that towards the debt. Or........are the big boys getting a bonus and Ford dosen't want ot listen to us b*tch. Oh yah they took away there bonus until 2010 Hmmmmm..... I just don't get the no strike clause, what do they have to worry about? Or is there something in the pipeline thats going to make us want to strike??? And as far as the committing of product nothing new same ol'e same ol'e. Also whats up with the holding company (Visteon) promises?? Are they not still in BK??? Isn't Visteon still awaiting on a ruling whether it can terminate retiree health care and insurance benefits that its says constitute a liability of about $310 million and pose a significant obstacle to a successful reorganization. While Ford promises $125 million in loans. Hmmmmmmm :reading: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 and mechanical teams that we already have in the 2007 agreement, not to mention that they kept all their classifications, bumping and OT rights. I told myself I wouldnt be replying to any of Cap's crap but this is crap above. Ask Wayne Stamping how this mech. group works. They do keep their classif. and bumping . But.... often because they go by low hrs., a PF or MW or such will be left home while the low hr welder works doing their core skills. This is just an example and the trades involved can be intermixed any # of ways. But the OT rights do NOT stay the same. This is misleading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 This modification attaches stronger language and products to match the changing environment in which we are in now. Having SUV's tied to the old language was good until the market crashed and gasoline prices are back on the rise. So instead of being tough and sticking to their guns, the UAW see this as an opportunity to force the company to change that original product to accomidate the current conditions. What good would it of did to have another gas guzzler put in LAP or a small van put into OHAP and another hybrid put into Mexico. That wouldn't have done our members a bit of good. Thank the UAW for looking at an opportunity to get some things that our members need instead of taking a strong stance and this other product get sourced to another country. So again, the UAW is looking into the future knowing that we would have had problems with putting the old committments into LAP/OHAP/MAP/Romeo/Livonia/Sterling/Rawsonville/ACH product committments make viable to sell. So as I look in the Lowlights and letters.....where are the names of these great new products going into OHAP ,LAP ,TCAP(yes TCAP...they cant sell the same 14 yr old Ranger forever). Since you claim that the IUAW forced the company to change product lineups and there is all this transparency. The IUAW knows the market trends better than the company ?? Funny shit.......By the way, I have heard Pipas and others praise the reception the Transit Connect is getting among businesses. With the gas hogs we have in the E-150 vans I can tell you take instructions for a living. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chriper Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 1st, I am not an International Rep and definitely not salary (don't know where you been). As far as letting people vote what they think, I think that would be great, but alot of people will be voting on the miss guided info given by others with their own personal agenda that doesn't necessarily have the future of the membership in mind. There are a lot of short sighted people out there that can not see or listen to the big picture. Look I am one of the biggest assholes I know and one of the toughest on questioning authority. These modifications are looked at with a fine tooth comb by everyone, including our leadership that knows a lot more than I do when it comes to how to interpret language. They also know the intent behind it. It sickens me for those that come on this site agaist something, when they haven't even seen it. I heard even Gary W. from 600 stood up at the conference and said that he was suprised, he thought it was going to be much worse, and then I see all these dumb fking letters he puts out. Even before the modification language came out he had letters bashing it on the floor. Now that they came out he had to put out a new letter bashing its contents. People like that aren't leaders, it is easy for someone to stand up and say NO, instead of looking at the language that was negtiated and saying hey we are the UAW we will make it work. The IUAW could have negotiated the best agreement in the world and at the end of the day, if there are no jobs attached to it, who would it benefit. This modification attaches stronger language and products to match the changing environment in which we are in now. Having SUV's tied to the old language was good until the market crashed and gasoline prices are back on the rise. So instead of being tough and sticking to their guns, the UAW see this as an opportunity to force the company to change that original product to accomidate the current conditions. What good would it of did to have another gas guzzler put in LAP or a small van put into OHAP and another hybrid put into Mexico. That wouldn't have done our members a bit of good. Thank the UAW for looking at an opportunity to get some things that our members need instead of taking a strong stance and this other product get sourced to another country. So again, the UAW is looking into the future knowing that we would have had problems with putting the old committments into LAP/OHAP/MAP/Romeo/Livonia/Sterling/Rawsonville/ACH product committments make viable to sell. All this and maintaining our right to strike over everything but wage improvements ONLY, open # of entry level members (which would not happen unless they found 11k jobs all of the sudden), and mechanical teams that we already have in the 2007 agreement, not to mention that they kept all their classifications, bumping and OT rights. Sorry so long! what you are capt zero ,IS NOTHING ,you come on here offering nothing for anyone,you want the membership to give ,just because you have some obscure reason that its all gonna work out,WHAT HAPPENED TO THE UAW NEGOT, TODAY FOR MEMBERS TODAY,,,,IF FORD WANTS MORE CONSESSIONS,,FOR 6 YEARS,WHY DO WE NOT HAVE IMPROVEMENT LANGUAGE IN THIS NEW MODIFICATION,MULALLY GOES ON THE NEWS EVERYDAY TELLING EVERYONE HOW FORD WILL BE PROFITABLE IN 2011,WHY IS THERE NO LANGUAGE THAT IF CERTAIN MILESTONES IN PROFIT ARE REACHED,WE GET CERTAIN THINGS BACK??????ALL THIS AGREEMENT SAYS IS...... FORD CAN MAKE AS MONEY AS POSSIBLE ,ALAN GET MILLIONS IN BONUSES,AND IF I ASK FOR A NICKEL WAGE INCREASE A FEDERAL ARBITRATOR MUST SAY YES,,MY ONLY COMMENT IS,,,ARE YOU F,ING HIGH????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTP'er Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it and eventually they will believe it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uawwidow Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 (edited) Alan Mulally, CEO, Total 2007 compensation $21,670,674 Don Leclair, CFO, Total 2007 compensation $11,703,127. Mark Fields, President – The Americas, Total 2007 compensation $8,389,898. Lewis Booth, Exec. VP – Ford of Europe and Premier Automotive Group, Total 2007 compensation $10,264,463. Mike Bannister, CEO, Ford Motor Credit, Total 2007 compensation $8,677,747. And you want us to agree not to stike on wages and benefits? 3 words...GO FUCK YOURSELF Edited October 19, 2009 by uawwidow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chriper Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 Today it will not allow us to get more, it benefitted the other 2 company's. Tomorrow however, when GM climbs out of this with 1/2 its debt they will be a much better company financially and we will benefit from them negotiating something good for their members. Again it swings from company to company. In 2007, GM was the one financially better....2 years later with the market crash, Ford benefitted from running low on cash and getting a loan prior too no one else being able to get financed. This made us stronger and kept us out of bankruptcy, so we went first and stopped the bankruptcy from tearing apart the UAW GM/Chrysler agreements totally. As far as the second part, I can not agree with you more! I feel this was being done because they did not think we would be coming to the table so they gave the directive to be assholes. I also think another piece came into to play and that was the fact that they are also fighting to keep their jobs so they are soo scared they lose track of humanity and try and make themselves look better than the next guy at any expencse. what you are capt zero ,IS NOTHING ,you come on here offering nothing for anyone,you want the membership to give ,just because you have some obscure reason that its all gonna work out,WHAT HAPPENED TO THE UAW NEGOT, TODAY FOR MEMBERS TODAY,,,,IF FORD WANTS MORE CONSESSIONS,,FOR 6 YEARS,WHY DO WE NOT HAVE IMPROVEMENT LANGUAGE IN THIS NEW MODIFICATION,MULALLY GOES ON THE NEWS EVERYDAY TELLING EVERYONE HOW FORD WILL BE PROFITABLE IN 2011,WHY IS THERE NO LANGUAGE THAT IF CERTAIN MILESTONES IN PROFIT ARE REACHED,WE GET CERTAIN THINGS BACK??????ALL THIS AGREEMENT SAYS IS...... FORD CAN MAKE AS MUCH MONEY AS POSSIBLE ,ALAN GET MILLIONS IN BONUSES,AND IF I ASK FOR A NICKEL WAGE INCREASE A FEDERAL ARBITRATOR MUST SAY YES,,MY ONLY COMMENT IS,,,ARE YOU F,ING HIGH????? ,AND DID YOU EVER STOP AND THINK WHAT WE DO TODAY ,MAY VERY WELL MAKE US THE LEAD FOR ALL OF THE UAW AND ,,HOW WE MAY BE ABLE TO HELP OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS AT GM AND CHRYS IN THE FUTURE,WHEN AFTER ALL YOU "AND I QUOTE GM WILL BE PROFITABLE SOON" SAID,,, SO STEP AWAY FROM THE CRACK PIPE AND THINK,every reason you gave for taking this shit shoved up our ass ,is indeed every reason why we should not take it ,,,and why we should stand up and say ,WE ARE THE UAW,BROTHERS AND SISTERS AND WE STAND TOGEHTHER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 what you are capt zero ,IS NOTHING ,you come on here offering nothing for anyone,you want the membership to give ,just because you have some obscure reason that its all gonna work out,WHAT HAPPENED TO THE UAW NEGOT, TODAY FOR MEMBERS TODAY,,,,IF FORD WANTS MORE CONSESSIONS,,FOR 6 YEARS,WHY DO WE NOT HAVE IMPROVEMENT LANGUAGE IN THIS NEW MODIFICATION,MULALLY GOES ON THE NEWS EVERYDAY TELLING EVERYONE HOW FORD WILL BE PROFITABLE IN 2011,WHY IS THERE NO LANGUAGE THAT IF CERTAIN MILESTONES IN PROFIT ARE REACHED,WE GET CERTAIN THINGS BACK??????ALL THIS AGREEMENT SAYS IS...... FORD CAN MAKE AS MUCH MONEY AS POSSIBLE ,ALAN GET MILLIONS IN BONUSES,AND IF I ASK FOR A NICKEL WAGE INCREASE A FEDERAL ARBITRATOR MUST SAY YES,,MY ONLY COMMENT IS,,,ARE YOU F,ING HIGH????? ,AND DID YOU EVER STOP AND THINK WHAT WE DO TODAY ,MAY VERY WELL MAKE US THE LEAD FOR ALL OF THE UAW AND ,,HOW WE MAY BE ABLE TO HELP OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS AT GM AND CHRYS IN THE FUTURE,WHEN AFTER ALL YOU "AND I QUOTE GM WILL BE PROFITABLE SOON" SAID,,, SO STEP AWAY FROM THE CRACK PIPE AND THINK,every reason you gave for taking this shit shoved up our ass ,is indeed every reason why we should not take it ,,,and why we should stand up and say ,WE ARE THE UAW,BROTHERS AND SISTERS AND WE STAND TOGEHTHER Thats how short sighted you are asshole....he talks shit because he is trying to improve the ford image with the media dumb ass. Glad you are nopt in a leadership role! You are fking brilliant! We should all follow you! You do not know the first fking thing about standing together. You sit on here and listen to the other dumbasses that think an arbitrator will determine our wages! FYI that is only if they disagree on INCREASES will an arbitrator be asked to make a decision. Guess what that is not going to fking happen. The UAW has never been as greedy as the company. We want whats fair and there is never an issue. We didn't have to go to an arbitrator to get $1000 this time or the last time or the $500. That didn't take an arbitrator, quit trying to scare people asshole! I bet your daddy or momma got you a job and now you think you are the founder of the fking UAW. Do the rest of us members a favor and keep your trap shut until you have something significant to say. Other wise have a tall glass of STFU! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uawwidow Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 Thats how short sighted you are asshole....he talks shit because he is trying to improve the ford image with the media dumb ass. Glad you are nopt in a leadership role! You are fking brilliant! We should all follow you! You do not know the first fking thing about standing together. You sit on here and listen to the other dumbasses that think an arbitrator will determine our wages! FYI that is only if they disagree on INCREASES will an arbitrator be asked to make a decision. Guess what that is not going to fking happen. The UAW has never been as greedy as the company. We want whats fair and there is never an issue. We didn't have to go to an arbitrator to get $1000 this time or the last time or the $500. That didn't take an arbitrator, quit trying to scare people asshole!I bet your daddy or momma got you a job and now you think you are the founder of the fking UAW. Do the rest of us members a favor and keep your trap shut until you have something significant to say. Other wise have a tall glass of STFU! I understand the UAW isn't as greedy as the Company, but that's the point. If we ask for any increase....all the Company has to do is counter with a cut to be on par with "all US competitors". Simple, you're in arbitration. Then we wait for that decision in order to be able to strike on any other concern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 I understand the UAW isn't as greedy as the Company, but that's the point. If we ask for any increase....all the Company has to do is counter with a cut to be on par with "all US competitors". Simple, you're in arbitration. Then we wait for that decision in order to be able to strike on any other concern. That isn't what it says, but even if that was the case, what would it matter when you strike as long as you still have the right to strike? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stugots Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 That isn't what it says, but even if that was the case, what would it matter when you strike as long as you still have the right to strike? Then what do those words under arbitration say in the highlights? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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