flipuaw164 Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 The next fight won't be this civil. We're not dealing with Nardelli, Waggoner, or even Ford. Mullaly took on the Unions at Boeing and guess what? He won. This is OUR chance to show the American public that we are serious about being part of the solution instead of being part of the problem, and we are f**king it up royally. If anyone thinks Mullaly is going to let Ford take the hit for this you're as idiotic as half the posts on this site. We will be the target for what's wrong with the auto industry, and all of our progress over the past few months will be all for not. Mullaly will place the blame solely on our shoulders and he will take an offensive stand against the UAW. Ford is not in the clear yet and right now it is crucial for everyone to understand that PR wise, we could utilize this situation to make people think differently about the UAW and Ford. Once things improve economically we can go back to the table, with a new bargaining team and a bargaining chip in our back pocket. We could go to the table with higher market share and higher profits because of our efforts. You go to the well when the well is full, not when it's running on borrowed money. All of the blowhards I see on this site talk a big game but have no clue what it means to truly put their neck on the line and represent the people every day. I hear all of these "union brothers" who work at nearly untouchable plants brag about how their going to send a message to Ford and the IUAW, all the while those of us at closing facilities are trying to decide between yes and no to keep our jobs and provide for our families. There's more Unionism in Indy's 550 beaten down, hard working members than most of the shadow critics on this site. Try walking into work everyday knowing that your job is one day closer from disappearing, and you read things like "vote no because that's the right thing to do." Guess what? Real people and their families are on the line here. When you damn this vote, you are risking people's livelihoods. My grandfather was an original organizer and my father is as Union as they come and they both have always believed that you have to pick your battles. The battle was the last vote and we blew it. Now, we have a chance to swing the pendlum back on our side and prepare a new plan of attack later on down the road, but instead we are choosing to risk destruction at the hands of the media and the car buying public. Who by the way are the gatekeepers to our financial success But, hey. Who gives a shit? We'll send a message. Nobody will hear it or even care, but everyone can brag about it here while the outside world says to hell with Ford and the UAW. Mulally don't have the guts to face anyone that works the line He is a Pussy He will not keep the promises made to you in INDY just like the promises made in 2007 and the last 2 modification Vote for what you think is right Theres no better time to make a stand because the rich are getting richer problem is we are getting poorer Nothing you do is going to save the INDY plant Sorry its a sad fact and Yes most of us have been there worrying about how we are going to feed our families Your not alone MOST PEOPLE DON'T EVEN KNOW WHATS UNION MADE AND WHATS NOT If UAW GETS BUSTED A WHOLE LOT OF ANTI UNION JAP CAR BUILDERS WILL FEEL THE FULL RATH OF CORPERATE GREED THERE WILL BE TWO CLASSES THE RICH AND POOR WHEN NO ONE CAN AFFORD TO BUY THE CARS THEN WE HAVE A SOLIALIST SOCIETY NO BODY WINS Indy people transfer to Louisville build quality and help save the few jobs we have left Vote No Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalterWeeps Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) Ok so if we vote this down what will Ford do just shut down all its production .I doubt it.Is this the same Ford that has cut nearly 40000 jobs since 2006 .All during a time when we voted yes to everything they wanted.Vote No. No, just your plant. And move your work to all of the empty floor space in Indy. Somewhere the employees have their feet grounded to the reality of the current economic hardships this company and this country still face. But keep telling yourself pattern bargaining isn't important and hasn't gotten you $29/hr with excellent benefits. That the big 3 WANT to pay you that because you're worth it. Put OUR company at a negotiating disadvantage to our own detriment. Ford didn't create this economic environment, but is having to find a way to pull out of it. Yeah, we didn't file bankruptcy, but how long do you think it will be before they have to head in that direction? Then we'd be tickled to accept this modification agreement to keep it out of a bankruptcy judges hands. Instead we'll just push them to that brink cause it makes us feel good...like we've done something radical to say screw the man. The sense of entitlement is amazing on this site anymore. Unemployment is up to 10% and we're telling the company to go stuff $2 billion in new investment up their asses cause we want the right to strike on something we've NEVER stricken over in the history of Ford/UAW contracts. Health and Safety or Outsourcing yes...Wages and Benefits ..no. So sleep well tonight knowing you might have to look at your kids one night and explain to them why Santa won't be visiting this year. Cause Daddy was in denial and voted his job away. Edited October 28, 2009 by WalterWeeps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FiredMotorCompany Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Ford isn't going anywhere. They know that they have an opportunity to pile up mounds of cash over the next 6 years if they can get us to agree to this garbage. They won't give back in 2015 so why give it up now. Ford has great products that are selling well and will continue to do so. They have $5.8 billion that has to be invested in the United States and it will go to new products, powertrains, etc... Guess what? Profit sharing next year will likely be higher than the $1000 bonus they are offering us! Amen to your comment about $1,000.00 bonus. If we vote yes based on $1,000.00 bonus then we get profit sharing greater than that, we bought this modification cheap. And we weakened the "economic weapon", the only one we have, to boot! What about the billions the Dept. of Energy is giving Ford for US based development of Electric Vehicles? It's gotta be spent in US, not Mexico or China! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale143 Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 The next fight won't be this civil. We're not dealing with Nardelli, Waggoner, or even Ford. Mullaly took on the Unions at Boeing and guess what? He won. This is OUR chance to show the American public that we are serious about being part of the solution instead of being part of the problem, and we are f**king it up royally. If anyone thinks Mullaly is going to let Ford take the hit for this you're as idiotic as half the posts on this site. We will be the target for what's wrong with the auto industry, and all of our progress over the past few months will be all for not. Mullaly will place the blame solely on our shoulders and he will take an offensive stand against the UAW. Ford is not in the clear yet and right now it is crucial for everyone to understand that PR wise, we could utilize this situation to make people think differently about the UAW and Ford. Once things improve economically we can go back to the table, with a new bargaining team and a bargaining chip in our back pocket. We could go to the table with higher market share and higher profits because of our efforts. You go to the well when the well is full, not when it's running on borrowed money. All of the blowhards I see on this site talk a big game but have no clue what it means to truly put their neck on the line and represent the people every day. I hear all of these "union brothers" who work at nearly untouchable plants brag about how their going to send a message to Ford and the IUAW, all the while those of us at closing facilities are trying to decide between yes and no to keep our jobs and provide for our families. There's more Unionism in Indy's 550 beaten down, hard working members than most of the shadow critics on this site. Try walking into work everyday knowing that your job is one day closer from disappearing, and you read things like "vote no because that's the right thing to do." Guess what? Real people and their families are on the line here. When you damn this vote, you are risking people's livelihoods. My grandfather was an original organizer and my father is as Union as they come and they both have always believed that you have to pick your battles. The battle was the last vote and we blew it. Now, we have a chance to swing the pendlum back on our side and prepare a new plan of attack later on down the road, but instead we are choosing to risk destruction at the hands of the media and the car buying public. Who by the way are the gatekeepers to our financial success But, hey. Who gives a shit? We'll send a message. Nobody will hear it or even care, but everyone can brag about it here while the outside world says to hell with Ford and the UAW. "Mullaly took on the Unions at Boeing and guess what? He won" I don't see it that way. His last ten years at Boeing, speea won wage increases and and never had to give up the strike. http://www.redorbit.com/news/science/27152...ions/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbabbitt Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) The next fight won't be this civil. We're not dealing with Nardelli, Waggoner, or even Ford. Mullaly took on the Unions at Boeing and guess what? He won. This is OUR chance to show the American public that we are serious about being part of the solution instead of being part of the problem, and we are f**king it up royally. If anyone thinks Mullaly is going to let Ford take the hit for this you're as idiotic as half the posts on this site. We will be the target for what's wrong with the auto industry, and all of our progress over the past few months will be all for not. Mullaly will place the blame solely on our shoulders and he will take an offensive stand against the UAW. Ford is not in the clear yet and right now it is crucial for everyone to understand that PR wise, we could utilize this situation to make people think differently about the UAW and Ford. Once things improve economically we can go back to the table, with a new bargaining team and a bargaining chip in our back pocket. We could go to the table with higher market share and higher profits because of our efforts. You go to the well when the well is full, not when it's running on borrowed money. All of the blowhards I see on this site talk a big game but have no clue what it means to truly put their neck on the line and represent the people every day. I hear all of these "union brothers" who work at nearly untouchable plants brag about how their going to send a message to Ford and the IUAW, all the while those of us at closing facilities are trying to decide between yes and no to keep our jobs and provide for our families. There's more Unionism in Indy's 550 beaten down, hard working members than most of the shadow critics on this site. Try walking into work everyday knowing that your job is one day closer from disappearing, and you read things like "vote no because that's the right thing to do." Guess what? Real people and their families are on the line here. When you damn this vote, you are risking people's livelihoods. My grandfather was an original organizer and my father is as Union as they come and they both have always believed that you have to pick your battles. The battle was the last vote and we blew it. Now, we have a chance to swing the pendlum back on our side and prepare a new plan of attack later on down the road, but instead we are choosing to risk destruction at the hands of the media and the car buying public. Who by the way are the gatekeepers to our financial success But, hey. Who gives a shit? We'll send a message. Nobody will hear it or even care, but everyone can brag about it here while the outside world says to hell with Ford and the UAW. they brought this on them selfs. we were lookin good, public was talkin us up , know we are in the spot light again what the hell were thay thinkin. should of left a good thing alone i am sure this will hurt sales Edited October 28, 2009 by mbabbitt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBodette68 Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 No, just your plant. And move your work to all of the empty floor space in Indy. Somewhere the employees have their feet grounded to the reality of the current economic hardships this company and this country still face. But keep telling yourself pattern bargaining isn't important and hasn't gotten you $29/hr with excellent benefits. That the big 3 WANT to pay you that because you're worth it. Put OUR company at a negotiating disadvantage to our own detriment. Ford didn't create this economic environment, but is having to find a way to pull out of it. Yeah, we didn't file bankruptcy, but how long do you think it will be before they have to head in that direction? Then we'd be tickled to accept this modification agreement to keep it out of a bankruptcy judges hands. Instead we'll just push them to that brink cause it makes us feel good...like we've done something radical to say screw the man. The sense of entitlement is amazing on this site anymore. Unemployment is up to 10% and we're telling the company to go stuff $2 billion in new investment up their asses cause we want the right to strike on something we've NEVER stricken over in the history of Ford/UAW contracts. Health and Safety or Outsourcing yes...Wages and Benefits ..no. So sleep well tonight knowing you might have to look at your kids one night and explain to them why Santa won't be visiting this year. Cause Daddy was in denial and voted his job away. Goddam man get ahold of yourself..and pass me a kleenex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeptic Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) No, just your plant. And move your work to all of the empty floor space in Indy. Somewhere the employees have their feet grounded to the reality of the current economic hardships this company and this country still face. But keep telling yourself pattern bargaining isn't important and hasn't gotten you $29/hr with excellent benefits. That the big 3 WANT to pay you that because you're worth it. Put OUR company at a negotiating disadvantage to our own detriment. Ford didn't create this economic environment, but is having to find a way to pull out of it. Yeah, we didn't file bankruptcy, but how long do you think it will be before they have to head in that direction? Then we'd be tickled to accept this modification agreement to keep it out of a bankruptcy judges hands. Instead we'll just push them to that brink cause it makes us feel good...like we've done something radical to say screw the man. The sense of entitlement is amazing on this site anymore. Unemployment is up to 10% and we're telling the company to go stuff $2 billion in new investment up their asses cause we want the right to strike on something we've NEVER stricken over in the history of Ford/UAW contracts. Health and Safety or Outsourcing yes...Wages and Benefits ..no. So sleep well tonight knowing you might have to look at your kids one night and explain to them why Santa won't be visiting this year. Cause Daddy was in denial and voted his job away. I am so scared Santa won't come and Ford won't build another car just to get back at me for my No vote.What do think that 29 dollars an hour will look like whitout a raise in the next 6 years and our benefits won't be worth much either if this passes.Vote Yes and you will be working for less than Santa's elves.Get enough yes votes and Ford and the UAW will make you a leader like Rudolph. Edited October 28, 2009 by skeptic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seniority Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 No, just your plant. And move your work to all of the empty floor space in Indy. Somewhere the employees have their feet grounded to the reality of the current economic hardships this company and this country still face. But keep telling yourself pattern bargaining isn't important and hasn't gotten you $29/hr with excellent benefits. That the big 3 WANT to pay you that because you're worth it. Put OUR company at a negotiating disadvantage to our own detriment. Ford didn't create this economic environment, but is having to find a way to pull out of it. Yeah, we didn't file bankruptcy, but how long do you think it will be before they have to head in that direction? Then we'd be tickled to accept this modification agreement to keep it out of a bankruptcy judges hands. Instead we'll just push them to that brink cause it makes us feel good...like we've done something radical to say screw the man. The sense of entitlement is amazing on this site anymore. Unemployment is up to 10% and we're telling the company to go stuff $2 billion in new investment up their asses cause we want the right to strike on something we've NEVER stricken over in the history of Ford/UAW contracts. Health and Safety or Outsourcing yes...Wages and Benefits ..no. So sleep well tonight knowing you might have to look at your kids one night and explain to them why Santa won't be visiting this year. Cause Daddy was in denial and voted his job away. Well Walter...........I'm still voting NO! Keep Weeping Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReDemption Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) Maybe you just skipped past or just couldnt understand. FMC stock is up FMC builds 3rd assembly plant in China for 490 million. FMC is still paying its top CEOs the best salaries and bonuses. (no pattern here) FMC has posted profitability in the first 2 quarters this year (but they are holding back the 3Q results until after the voting) FMC spent 550 million on refurbishing the Michigan Truck Plant. FMC has gained market share in all 19 European markets. FMC looks better in the public eye then ever before. And we are being asked to accept more concessions. Are you kidding? you really dont get the rub here? FMC does badly - UAW workers take concessions (did the right thing) ----- with that done -------- FMC does great - UAW expected to take concessions again (WTF) again (WTF) No really you didnt miss it, FMC is doing better then in years. Just on the news today they (FMC) stated that they are going to turn the corner earlier then expected 2010. GM and Chrysler CEO's are now capped at 250k per year. If FMC is in such sad shape do you think they will pattern this as they say our contracts are? Dont you think this to is an unfair advantage? Edited October 28, 2009 by ReDemption Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBGB Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Well Walter...........I'm still voting NO!Keep Weeping That goes for me too Waldo, uh, Walter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gocash Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) The next fight won't be this civil. We're not dealing with Nardelli, Waggoner, or even Ford. Mullaly took on the Unions at Boeing and guess what? He won. This is OUR chance to show the American public that we are serious about being part of the solution instead of being part of the problem, and we are f**king it up royally. If anyone thinks Mullaly is going to let Ford take the hit for this you're as idiotic as half the posts on this site. We will be the target for what's wrong with the auto industry, and all of our progress over the past few months will be all for not. Mullaly will place the blame solely on our shoulders and he will take an offensive stand against the UAW. Ford is not in the clear yet and right now it is crucial for everyone to understand that PR wise, we could utilize this situation to make people think differently about the UAW and Ford. Once things improve economically we can go back to the table, with a new bargaining team and a bargaining chip in our back pocket. We could go to the table with higher market share and higher profits because of our efforts. You go to the well when the well is full, not when it's running on borrowed money. All of the blowhards I see on this site talk a big game but have no clue what it means to truly put their neck on the line and represent the people every day. I hear all of these "union brothers" who work at nearly untouchable plants brag about how their going to send a message to Ford and the IUAW, all the while those of us at closing facilities are trying to decide between yes and no to keep our jobs and provide for our families. There's more Unionism in Indy's 550 beaten down, hard working members than most of the shadow critics on this site. Try walking into work everyday knowing that your job is one day closer from disappearing, and you read things like "vote no because that's the right thing to do." Guess what? Real people and their families are on the line here. When you damn this vote, you are risking people's livelihoods. My grandfather was an original organizer and my father is as Union as they come and they both have always believed that you have to pick your battles. The battle was the last vote and we blew it. Now, we have a chance to swing the pendlum back on our side and prepare a new plan of attack later on down the road, but instead we are choosing to risk destruction at the hands of the media and the car buying public. Who by the way are the gatekeepers to our financial success But, hey. Who gives a shit? We'll send a message. Nobody will hear it or even care, but everyone can brag about it here while the outside world says to hell with Ford and the UAW. The UAW brothers and sisters didn't pick this fight my friend,Ford and Mullaly did. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever to give up the right to strike,after everything that has been given back already...Keeping a cap on the 2 tier workers at 20% is necessary for the future of autoworkers.If Ford wants to ruin the public image that has been created lately of it being the best automaker then that is the Ford Executives choice. Ford must respect the damn lineworkers who are doing the labor to make Ford the best company possible...Enough is enough already...It's time that Ford cuts the extra fat from the top if more cuts need to be made. These modifications being rejected will not hurt Ford in any financial way for awhile anyway.The UAW International Leadership should be ashamed of themselves for even putting this decision to the members for voting,it goes against the principle of what a union is supposed to be....When this vote is over and if these modifications are rejected as they rightly should be,I hope the I-UAW Leadership,whoever in these positions that supported this will be embarrassed and voted out of these very important positions.Unions are supposed to work for the members,not for the company...These re-re-re commitments for investment will either be carried out by Ford with the gov't money they received to invest in the U.S. or they would likely never have been carried out anyway and just become more broken promises...Get your head out of the sand and wake the hell up... Edited October 28, 2009 by gocash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordxer Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 What are you going to do after sub and unemployment run out. Thats what you'll face, if the contract goes down. Also loss of health insurance, maybe even pensions. With the economy as bad as it is. how can you possibly jeapardize your job. Thousands of people are loosing their jobs daily. NOW is not the time to fight. The company has the advantage right now. When the economy improves, that when we have achance to do better (regain lost benefits and wages). Ford Motor is fighting for its life right now, it has been for a couple of years and now its just starting to get out of the whole. A strong Ford is vital to the UAW and we and our families are the UAW. If we cower down to the company (and the IUAW) on these mods, it would take decades to regain lost benefits and wages. Especially if there is the no strike on wages. We would all be working for $14 per hour. Who, then, would be able to buy a new vehicle? You know FMC would not lower their sticker prices. I know these are trying times with the economy and all, but if you read these posts, you will see that the company has us right where they want us. Even on BON they have pitted plant against plant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm2607 Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 No, just your plant. And move your work to all of the empty floor space in Indy. Somewhere the employees have their feet grounded to the reality of the current economic hardships this company and this country still face. But keep telling yourself pattern bargaining isn't important and hasn't gotten you $29/hr with excellent benefits. That the big 3 WANT to pay you that because you're worth it. Put OUR company at a negotiating disadvantage to our own detriment. Ford didn't create this economic environment, but is having to find a way to pull out of it. Yeah, we didn't file bankruptcy, but how long do you think it will be before they have to head in that direction? Then we'd be tickled to accept this modification agreement to keep it out of a bankruptcy judges hands. Instead we'll just push them to that brink cause it makes us feel good...like we've done something radical to say screw the man. The sense of entitlement is amazing on this site anymore. Unemployment is up to 10% and we're telling the company to go stuff $2 billion in new investment up their asses cause we want the right to strike on something we've NEVER stricken over in the history of Ford/UAW contracts. Health and Safety or Outsourcing yes...Wages and Benefits ..no. So sleep well tonight knowing you might have to look at your kids one night and explain to them why Santa won't be visiting this year. Cause Daddy was in denial and voted his job away. Tell me,how much money will Ford save by having the no strike clause? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feegsit Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Goddam man get ahold of yourself..and pass me a kleenex Walter Weeps.. Perfect name for a CRYBABY! Vote NO! BTW Walter JUMP, the union will save you. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feegsit Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 If we cower down to the company (and the IUAW) on these mods, it would take decades to regain lost benefits and wages. Especially if there is the no strike on wages. We would all be working for $14 per hour. Who, then, would be able to buy a new vehicle? You know FMC would not lower their sticker prices. I know these are trying times with the economy and all, but if you read these posts, you will see that the company has us right where they want us. Even on BON they have pitted plant against plant. Just think how tickled the consumer would be if all these concessions would bring the cost of the vehicles down. Wages are going down and vehicle prices keep going up, and the auto workers are catchin' the flak because of this. The public should be pissed at the automakers NOT the autoworker! Yep, All the Big Dogs in Dearborn are probably laffin' their azzes off, while their wackin' off to see who cums first! Vote NO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordxer Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Just think how tickled the consumer would be if all these concessions would bring the cost of the vehicles down. Wages are going down and vehicle prices keep going up, and the auto workers are catchin' the flak because of this. The public should be pissed at the automakers NOT the autoworker! Yep, All the Big Dogs in Dearborn are probably laffin' their azzes off, while their wackin' off to see who cums first! Vote NO! I was part of the KCAP 92% NO. Yeah if the public knew the truth instead of what the media tells them, we would be off the hook and the Big Dogs in Dearborn would be shaking in their boots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobo5100 Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Are you related to Gettelfinger by chance? No I'm not related to Gettelfinger, he has a job I would not want. He's damned if he do and he's damned if he don't. He has alot of pressure on him, pretty much the future of the UAW. If he makes a mistake we all lose. Does anyone one in the UAW want to give concessions, I don't think so, I know I don't, its a tough pill to swallow! Tough talk and pride only goes so far. The union brothers on the bridge were brutalized by company goons for wanting decent work conditions and willing to stand up for that. But its a different ball game today, today they don't have boards or bats, they have law degrees and laws that are set-up to benefit the company and destroy the union. Being tough worked 50 years ago, today you'll get burned. Fight when the time is right, like after the economy gets better and people can afford to buy a new car, and ford has profits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.Knight Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) No I'm not related to Gettelfinger, he has a job I would not want. He's damned if he do and he's damned if he don't. He has alot of pressure on him, pretty much the future of the UAW. If he makes a mistake we all lose. Does anyone one in the UAW want to give concessions, I don't think so, I know I don't, its a tough pill to swallow! Tough talk and pride only goes so far. The union brothers on the bridge were brutalized by company goons for wanting decent work conditions and willing to stand up for that. But its a different ball game today, today they don't have boards or bats, they have law degrees and laws that are set-up to benefit the company and destroy the union. Being tough worked 50 years ago, today you'll get burned. Fight when the time is right, like after the economy gets better and people can afford to buy a new car, and ford has profits. Corporations are artificial entities designed to maximize profits. When things are bad and they can’t increase production to generate profit… they look to cut costs. Where your argument fails is that when demand increases the corporation does not want to return what they have taken from you. You must fight to get it back. If you cede the tools that you can use to wrestle what has been lost, back… you will be left forever wanting Edited October 28, 2009 by S.Knight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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