chucky2 Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Which is one of the beefs I've got with your whole comparison. It's a week long treatise on how minivans are more practical than crossovers for hauling kids and suchlike. You're either preaching to the converted, or you're wasting your time. Those that haven't been persuaded otherwise can't see your point, and those that already get it, well, uh, already get it. Or the group that's on the fence deciding between the two and would like this comparison...which would mean he's not preaching to the converted, nor wasting his time. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Or the group that's on the fence deciding between the two and would like this comparison...which would mean he's not preaching to the converted, nor wasting his time. Chuck but there IS NO COMAPRISON...its all about adressing ones NEEDS....you either NEED a minivan or you dont, thats it....the rest is just waffling....and SHOCKER the three mini-vans rate at the top of a comparison dis-advantageous to CUVS from the get go.... next up a e450 CUBE van in the comparison to figure out which is best to haul 600 wooden TIKIs to the swap meet.....12th Place Chevy HHR............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Or the group that's on the fence deciding between the two and would like this comparison...which would mean he's not preaching to the converted, nor wasting his time. Chuck You mean people who would rather spend a week breathlessly waiting for each installment vs. spending an hour or two on a Saturday afternoon doing test drives? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 You mean people who would rather spend a week breathlessly waiting for each installment vs. spending an hour or two on a Saturday afternoon doing test drives? avoiding vasectomys...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucky2 Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 You mean people who would can rather spend a week breathlessly waiting for each installment vs. spending an hour or two on a Saturday afternoon doing test drives? Yes. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucky2 Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 but there IS NO COMAPRISON...its all about adressing ones NEEDS....you either NEED a minivan or you dont, thats it....the rest is just waffling....and SHOCKER the three mini-vans rate at the top of a comparison dis-advantageous to CUVS from the get go.... next up a e450 CUBE van in the comparison to figure out which is best to haul 600 wooden TIKIs to the swap meet.....12th Place Chevy HHR............... If ones needs fall on the line between the two, or ones needs are preferring a CUV except there are frequent enough times a minivan type space is needed, then it's a valid comparison. If you work for a Stealership, you of all people should instinctively understand this. If you don't.....wow.... Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Car Examiner Posted January 7, 2010 Author Share Posted January 7, 2010 Which is one of the beefs I've got with your whole comparison. It's a week long treatise on how minivans are more practical than crossovers for hauling kids and suchlike. You're either preaching to the converted, or you're wasting your time. Those that haven't been persuaded otherwise can't see your point, and those that already get it, well, uh, already get it. People simply do not recognize the space differences between a van and an SUV/crossover. I don't know why you keep ignoring that point. Many car people don't see it -- I've seen people who don't realize that on every forum I've ever posted on and in the mainstream automotive media -- and if they don't see it, why would the average car buyer? The point is not "don't buy an SUV for its looks." It's "before you make that choice, know what you're giving up." Why you're so opposed to that concept, I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) Yes. Chuck Wow. Now that you've done that I bet people everywhere will start sarcastically editing other people's posts. You're such an innovator. And seriously. If you're debating a minivan or a CUV, pretty sure you'll be test driving at least one of each. Edited January 7, 2010 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucky2 Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Wow. Now that you've done that I bet people everywhere will start sarcastically editing other people's posts. You're such an innovator. Happens all the time on AnandTech, most people have enough brain power to realize when they see strikethrough or bold, that something is being called out. And seriously. If you're debating a minivan or a CUV, pretty sure you'll be test driving at least one of each. Ok? Who ever said people wouldn't? Nice strawman.... Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Car Examiner Posted January 7, 2010 Author Share Posted January 7, 2010 but there IS NO COMAPRISON...its all about adressing ones NEEDS....you either NEED a minivan or you dont, thats it....the rest is just waffling....and SHOCKER the three mini-vans rate at the top of a comparison dis-advantageous to CUVS from the get go.... next up a e450 CUBE van in the comparison to figure out which is best to haul 600 wooden TIKIs to the swap meet.....12th Place Chevy HHR............... The only advantage a crossover has is looks, and the two crossovers in this comparison were what their manufacturers introduced to replace their minivans. That's the difference between this comparison and one between an Odyssey and the passenger version of a 1970s-era work truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 People simply do not recognize the space differences between a van and an SUV/crossover. I don't know why you keep ignoring that point. Many car people don't see it -- I've seen people who don't realize that on every forum I've ever posted on and in the mainstream automotive media -- and if they don't see it, why would the average car buyer? The point is not "don't buy an SUV for its looks." It's "before you make that choice, know what you're giving up." Why you're so opposed to that concept, I don't know. DC, sorry, if they dont they are morons.....and the differences are self explanatory...Minivans have NO competition.....they have their OWN segment..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 The only advantage a crossover has is looks, and the two crossovers in this comparison were what their manufacturers introduced to replace their minivans. That's the difference between this comparison and one between an Odyssey and the passenger version of a 1970s-era work truck. looks are subjective and individual...the Flex is NOT a minivan replacement....it is a smaller ALTERNATIVE.....do some utilize it in a similar fashion...most definitely, but i would also go so far as to vehemetley state that the owners of the Flex, I underline OWNERS, are FULLY aware of its shortcomings IF considered a van replacement...oh, add handling, potential MPG superiority, availabilty of an ECO engine, and thus power, quieter interior ( speculation ) better mid row comfort, synch, vista roofs, manouverabilty to name a few other "advantages"....they really are two different beasts altogether DC, how one can actually have a valid comparison is sensless....no knock on you, I just question how valid the comparison is from the get-go.....next up a Smart car gos head to head with a Ferrari 458 on Laguna Seca....point is they can both do it...but which suits the purpose better....wheres a coin?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Car Examiner Posted January 7, 2010 Author Share Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) DC, sorry, if they dont they are morons.....and the differences are self explanatory...Minivans have NO competition.....they have their OWN segment..... They'd just have to be moronic enough to read what the supposed experts say: "If you need the interior space of a minivan, but don't want to be caught getting that page at the gym, or have grown tired of spending $100 a week filling up your full-size SUV at the local gas 'n' milk minimart, the Traverse and its brethren appear to be the ticket."-Motor Trend ^That is what people think a crossover is, and too little information is out there to dissuade that notion. I'm glad that you recognize that a van is roomier, but many people do not. Edited January 7, 2010 by DC Car Examiner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 If ones needs fall on the line between the two, or ones needs are preferring a CUV except there are frequent enough times a minivan type space is needed, then it's a valid comparison. If you work for a Stealership, you of all people should instinctively understand this. If you don't.....wow.... Chuck oh, here we go....so, please explain the grey area....dont trip up chuck....point is aside from "vanity" there is not one, the comparison is MOOT, groundless and mis-leading....if you NEED someone to scribe the differences between a Minivan, its capabilites and utility, angainst ANY CUV or SUV, then you sir are a totally lost cause...man education is going downhill and so is common sense..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 They'd just have to be moronic enough to read what the supposed experts say: "If you need the interior space of a minivan, but don't want to be caught getting that page at the gym, or have grown tired of spending $100 a week filling up your full-size SUV at the local gas 'n' milk minimart, the Traverse and its brethren appear to be the ticket."-Motor Trend ^That is what people think a crossover is, and too little information is out there to dissuade that notion. I'm glad that you recognize that a van is roomier, but many people do not. I see your point, I just find blatant ignorance unfathomable....which leads to this question, if they are stupid enough NOT to realize the differences, can they even read to begin with....your prose may be in vain.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucky2 Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 oh, here we go....so, please explain the grey area....dont trip up chuck....point is aside from "vanity" there is not one, the comparison is MOOT, groundless and mis-leading....if you NEED someone to scribe the differences between a Minivan, its capabilites and utility, angainst ANY CUV or SUV, then you sir are a totally lost cause...man education is going downhill and so is common sense..... I really don't know what else to say to you other than to get a mental picture in your head of a full minivan, a full - say - Flex, and then take a bunch of stuff out of the minivan, put it on the ground, and that's the space differential people who fit into either of those two categories needs to be aware of. That I seriously had to explain that to you worries me more than people slamming DC here who themselves have lent nothing to giving the Internet reading public useful information. In short: Why is it so difficult for you to understand that people will not solely fit into neat little pre-packaged classifications, like CUV, minivan, etc., there will be people (measuring in the thousands, tens of thousands, whatever) that are between a solution. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Car Examiner Posted January 7, 2010 Author Share Posted January 7, 2010 I see your point, I just find blatant ignorance unfathomable....which leads to this question, if they are stupid enough NOT to realize the differences, can they even read to begin with....your prose may be in vain.... Again, people can do their research and still find inaccurate information from seemingly credible sources. The Motor Trend piece is just one of many examples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiefstang Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 If you work for a Stealership, you of all people should instinctively understand this. If you don't.....wow.... Chuck Nice. Still know our business better than us, but more obviously- Still a prick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 I really don't know what else to say to you other than to get a mental picture in your head of a full minivan, a full - say - Flex, and then take a bunch of stuff out of the minivan, put it on the ground, and that's the space differential people who fit into either of those two categories needs to be aware of. That I seriously had to explain that to you worries me more than people slamming DC here who themselves have lent nothing to giving the Internet reading public useful information. In short: Why is it so difficult for you to understand that people will not solely fit into neat little pre-packaged classifications, like CUV, minivan, etc., there will be people (measuring in the thousands, tens of thousands, whatever) that are between a solution. Chuck I'm not slamming him...to me its blatantly obvious of being an erronious comparo, thats all, those that NEED a minivans advantages are FULLY aware of them, those that can't handle the stigma and purchase a CUV as an alternative, but really still NEED those advantages, REALIZE fully the compromise....how simple do i have to put it?.....if it were me, my answer lies in post 61...its a bogus comparison.....NEEDS and desires ore two polar opposites...and Chuck, yes, I am quite aware of them but leave the choices to customers rather than force common sense down their throats.....what scares me is someone having to READ the obvious rather than utilize frontal lobes...how bout this, right up your alley....a recent scientific study proves that eating nothing but McDonalds can lead to health issues and potential obesity.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Happens all the time on AnandTech, most people have enough brain power to realize when they see strikethrough or bold, that something is being called out. Duh. I was highlighting the triteness of your tactic by treating it as though it were unique and original. It's a rhetorical technique known as sarcasm. It's possible you may have heard of it before, but your too literal responses both now and in the past do not inspire me with much hope. By the way, the preceding was also an instance of the use of sarcasm. Ok? Who ever said people wouldn't? Nice strawman.... Chuck The whole comparison is a straw man. It assumes that people are incapable of discovering the difference between minivans and CUVs and sets about painstakingly and slowly explaining that yes, crossovers are more stylish, but no, they are not more practical than minivans. The whole thing could be reworked into a Monty Python sketch along the lines of 'how not to be seen' or 'how to recognize different trees from a very long ways away' or 'bicycle repair man'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Again, people can do their research and still find inaccurate information from seemingly credible sources. The Motor Trend piece is just one of many examples. +1 there, and truth be told, the info some take as verbatum is ONLY as accurate as the person that inputs said info....no dis-respect, but I'm filing this article under Captain Obvious....obviously a service NEEDED by some that consider drooling from both sides of their mouth amounts to being level headed..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 The Stow-N-Go concept is nice as long as you don't have to sit on it. It's like sitting on a bar stool. Great for little kids I guess. I'm out in Texas now, and we got a Grand Caravan with stow and go, I'm sitting in the second row of seats directly behind the Driver and Passenger seat and my first experience with it is the head rest is directly in-between my shoulder blades!!!! I had to adjust it, but the Seats suck for an adult from my first experience with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 I'm out in Texas now, and we got a Grand Caravan with stow and go, I'm sitting in the second row of seats directly behind the Driver and Passenger seat and my first experience with it is the head rest is directly in-between my shoulder blades!!!! I had to adjust it, but the Seats suck for an adult from my first experience with it. who gives a rats, vehicle is designed for kids back there anyway.....oh, wait......let me wake up Kobe from his doze in the second row seats of the Flex.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Car Examiner Posted January 8, 2010 Author Share Posted January 8, 2010 The whole comparison is a straw man. It assumes that people are incapable of discovering the difference between minivans and CUVs and sets about painstakingly and slowly explaining that yes, crossovers are more stylish, but no, they are not more practical than minivans. Um, no, that is not what it says. It says that crossovers are much less practical, in what ways they are less practical, and exactly how much less practical they are. It then goes on to say the strengths and weaknesses of each minivan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 Um, no, that is not what it says. It says that crossovers are much less practical, in what ways they are less practical, and exactly how much less practical they are. It then goes on to say the strengths and weaknesses of each minivan. like I said...Captain Obvious......and the practicality TOTALLY depends on ones individualastic needs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.