Michigan and Ohio senators demand Obama gets tough on South Korean auto importing

[Ford Jellymoulds]

AUTOBLOG...

Talk to most analysts in the auto world, and they'll say that the recent rise of South Korean automakers likeHyundai and Kia have been an absolute blessing to the industry as a whole. Consumers now have an array of quality, inexpensive products, extra jobs have landed in rural areas of the deep south thanks to American-based manufacturing facilities and the competition from low-priced models have forced domestic manufacturers to up their game.

But not everyone's thrilled about the balance of automotive trade between the two nations. According to The Detroit News, senators Debbie Stabenow, D-Michigan, and Sherrod Brown, D-Ohio, recently wrote to the Obama administration in order to urge the President to take a hard line on the South Korean Free Trade Agreement.

Both senators are on the President's Export Council. Obama this month named three Michigan CEOs, including Ford CEO Alan Mulally to the council. Ford has urged changes to the agreement to open the Korean market to more U.S. imports.

 

Last month, Obama said his administration would launch new talks with South Korea aimed at resolving those differences before he visits South Korea in November; he wants to submit an agreement to Congress soon thereafter.

 

Ford said the South Korean government "has a long history of actively intervening in the market to exclude imports."

 

"A well-negotiated U.S.-Korea Free Trade agreement," it said, "represents the last, best chance to open the Korean market to imported automobiles."

 

 

The two senators aren't taking issue with Korean products here in the U.S., they simply think it's unfair that South Korea has a moratorium on importing any vehicles into the country. The senators want American companies to have the opportunity to do business on the peninsula – something that most automakers, with the exception of General Motors, have been pushing for since before the second President Bush was in office. GM, meanwhile, owns Korean automaker Daewoo, so it has no problem dealing with the current ban on auto imports.

LINK

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ford Jellymoulds

[SVTDarkCobra]

Good to see someone is shooting at this. I thought I was the only one complaining about this.

 

After we get South Korea to play fair we need to have a nice talk with Japan too.

[timmm55]

The ``Obama Effect'' is keeping Hyundai Motor on its toes as the President-elect has vowed to address the plight facing American automakers by, among other things, going for better terms in the Korea-U.S. Free Trade Agreement (KORUS FTA).

 

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/biz/2010/05/124_34156.html

 

Nothing new here, it's an ongoing discussion.

 

 

Obama has charged U.S. Trade Representative Ron Kirk with initiating new discussions with his Korean counterpart, Minister of Trade Kim Jong-hoon, to resolve outstanding issues that have stood in the way of congressional consideration of the Bush deal. The major impediment has been Ford's, Chrysler's and the UAW's complaints that the KORUS FTA does not do nearly enough to open the Korean market to U.S. auto sales. In 2007, when the International Trade Commission held hearings on the agreement, just before President Bush signed it, the estimate was that in 2006 Korea exported over 700,000 cars, vans, and sport utility vehicles (SUVs) to the United States, while the United States exported just over 4,000 of these vehicles to Korea. There are a number of reasons for that imbalance, mostly having to do with Korean nontariff and tax trade barriers. Less a factor is the Korean tariff of 8 percent.

 

http://aftermarketbusiness.search-autoparts.com/aftermarketbusiness/Distribution/Korea-free-trade-agreement-on-hold/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/678296

[Chester]

Screw the free trade agreements we have with these countries. Make it free for ever one to one ratio. Then tax a grand or two for every vehicle over the imbalance. In this case it would be $1000 times 696,000 vehicles sold above the amount imported.

 

 

Do you really think Hyundai would flinch having to pay the US government 696,000,000.

[kpc655]

AUTOBLOG...

Talk to most analysts in the auto world, and they'll say that the recent rise of South Korean automakers likeHyundai and Kia have been an absolute blessing to the industry as a whole. Consumers now have an array of quality, inexpensive products, extra jobs have landed in rural areas of the deep south thanks to American-based manufacturing facilities and the competition from low-priced models have forced domestic manufacturers to up their game. <br style="line-height: 0.8em; "><br style="line-height: 0.8em; ">But not everyone's thrilled about the balance of automotive trade between the two nations. According to The Detroit News, senators Debbie Stabenow, D-Michigan, and Sherrod Brown, D-Ohio, recently wrote to the Obama administration in order to urge the President to take a hard line on the South Korean Free Trade Agreement.<br style="line-height: 0.8em; "><br style="line-height: 0.8em; ">The two senators aren't taking issue with Korean products here in the U.S., they simply think it's unfair that South Korea has a moratorium on importing any vehicles into the country. The senators want American companies to have the opportunity to do business on the peninsula – something that most automakers, with the exception of General Motors, have been pushing for since before the second President Bush was in office. GM, meanwhile, owns Korean automaker Daewoo, so it has no problem dealing with the current ban on auto imports. <br style="line-height: 0.8em; ">

LINK

 

 

Focusing on a closed door policy in S korea is a diversion. domestics have a hard time competing with S korean cars here....these idiots think domestics can ship cars to korea and compete?

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Koreans are take take take leaching off everybody's C4C programs and put nothing back.

 

UK C4C Sales Top Ten trade-ins (392,677 car got sold under UK C4C Program).

1. Hyundai 45,757

2. Ford 43,033

3. Kia 33,711

4. VW 32,607

5. Fiat 31,123

6. Toyota 28,262

7. GM Vauxhall 26,019

8. Peugeot 16,117

9. Nissan 15,692

10. Renault 13,678

 

British based companies benefitted from UK C4C program the least

MG 106

Jaguar 375

Land Rover 1,797

Mini 7,633

 

LINK

 

British government said they will never do another C4C program due to greedy Koreans taking the piss, so thats the end of anymore help from the UK.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ford Jellymoulds

[jpd80]

Screw the free trade agreements we have with these countries. Make it free for ever one to one ratio. Then tax a grand or two for every vehicle over the imbalance. In this case it would be $1000 times 696,000 vehicles sold above the amount imported.

 

 

Do you really think Hyundai would flinch having to pay the US government 696,000,000.

Hyundai (and Kia) have spent billions on US production line and engine plants.

Sonatas and Santa Fe CUVs are built in Alabama.

 

Of the 51,000 vehicles sold in June, USA built Sonata (17,771) and Santa Fe (7,586) make up almost half of the sales.

 

LINK

 

Turning around and putting back door Tarrifs on cars won't work and the US government knows it

because Hyundai are spending money in the USA and doing the right thing.

The imbalance with cars is not as large as some think.

 

 

 

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Hyundai (and Kia) have spent billions on US production line and engine plants.

Sonatas and Santa Fe CUVs are built in Alabama.

 

Of the 51,000 vehicles sold in June, USA built Sonata (17,771) and Santa Fe (7,586) make up almost half of the sales.

 

LINK

 

Turning around and putting back door Tarrifs on cars won't work and the US government knows it

because Hyundai are spending money in the USA and doing the right thing.

The imbalance with cars is not as large as some think.

 

 

 

 

It's a shame Ford don't do the same with the Fiesta & Fusion and build them in the USA sales would treble JPD.

 

Just have a look how many absolute junk designed well screwed together Aussie Chevy Holden Cruze's (3,000) get sold in your country to compared to the Thai made brilliant designed Fiesta's (981) JPD why is that do you think Australians prefer junk designs?

Edited July 21, 2010 by Ford Jellymoulds

[aneekr]

Focusing on a closed door policy in S korea is a diversion. domestics have a hard time competing with S korean cars here....these idiots think domestics can ship cars to korea and compete?

:yup:

Maybe it's worth giving Ford and Chrysler a better shot at selling more of their vehicles in the Korean Domestic market, just to see how long it takes for both companies to pull out due to lack of demand!

Edited July 21, 2010 by aneekr

[Ford Jellymoulds]

:yup:

Maybe it's worth giving Ford and Chrysler a better shot at selling more of their vehicles in the Korean Domestic market, just to see how long it takes for both companies to pull out due to lack of demand!

 

If the Koreans don't open their doors to any US made products then its about time a tax was placed on all its goods that get imported and recoup some of that Korean C4C money, if Korean cars become more expensive Stateside maybe folk would start buying more Fords.

 

Nothing will be gained by selling gas guzzling Taurus's to a nation thats driving around Daewoo Matiz's they would rewrite the rules just like the cheating Japanese do in Nippon that favor small cars.

 

 

 

[8A4RE]

Hyundai (and Kia) have spent billions on US production line and engine plants.

Sonatas and Santa Fe CUVs are built in Alabama.

 

Of the 51,000 vehicles sold in June, USA built Sonata (17,771) and Santa Fe (7,586) make up almost half of the sales.

 

LINK

 

Turning around and putting back door Tarrifs on cars won't work and the US government knows it

because Hyundai are spending money in the USA and doing the right thing.

The imbalance with cars is not as large as some think.

 

What is your point?

 

Oh boy! They assemble some crap cans over here. Kia still adds up to less than 1% of the automotive related jobs in America! The big three make up 8%.

 

Hell, all of the transplants combined in this country barley make up 2%!

Edited July 21, 2010 by 8A4RE

[J-150]

If the Koreans don't open their doors to any US made products then its about time a tax was placed on all its goods that get imported and recoup some of that Korean C4C money, if Korean cars become more expensive Stateside maybe folk would start buying more Fords.

.

 

 

Here is an idea.

 

Obama tells the S Korean government "open your borders like we have done for you or we remove 100% of our military protection and you will be saying hello to your northern neighbours"

[DC Car Examiner]

To people lumping Japan with Korea, there's a clear difference in automotive tastes. Cars popular in the Japanese market are tiny but space-efficient, with tiny gas-powered engines, and no one else is really building cars like that that would be popular there.

 

Korean tastes, however, seem to be much more like those of the American market, so open auto imports could potentially matter there.

[jpd80]

It's a shame Ford don't do the same with the Fiesta & Fusion and build them in the USA sales would treble JPD.

 

Just have a look how many absolute junk designed well screwed together Aussie Chevy Holden Cruze's (3,000) get sold in your country to compared to the Thai made brilliant designed Fiesta's (981) JPD why is that do you think Australians prefer junk designs?

Nothing to do with Thailand and everything to do with Ford's perception.

Aussies don't like imported Ford, years of shit Euro Ford cars and almost zero

dealer support when things go wrong (Gee if you'd bought a Falcon we could help)

makes them wary of anything Ford brings in from elsewhere.

 

Fiesta, Focus and Mondeo are way down on buyers lists with

a lot of competition outselling them by 2 to 1 to 3 to 1 ratio.

 

That's why One Ford is a failure in Australia.

Edited July 22, 2010 by jpd80

[jpd80]

What is your point?

 

Oh boy! They assemble some crap cans over here. Kia still adds up to less than 1% of the automotive related jobs in America! The big three make up 8%.

 

Hell, all of the transplants combined in this country barley make up 2%!

Your problem is not with the Likes of Hyundai and Kia.

North American Automotive related jobs are estimated to be around 3 million

and come mostly from the supplier networks, not car companies.

 

My point is that Hyundai's sales numbers are not as huge as people make out

and the great hoad of Korean assembled cars coming to the USA is a myth..

I pointed out that Hyundai has 50,000/month sales with almost half of them

coming from US based plants that do a lot more than just assembly. Hyundai have

invested almost $2 billion dollars in the USA, stamping plants, engine plants, assembly plants, R & D centers..

 

 

It's a shame some people don't research the topic at hand before getting on the soap box.

Edited July 22, 2010 by jpd80

[timmm55]

To people lumping Japan with Korea, there's a clear difference in automotive tastes. Cars popular in the Japanese market are tiny but space-efficient, with tiny gas-powered engines, and no one else is really building cars like that that would be popular there.

 

Korean tastes, however, seem to be much more like those of the American market, so open auto imports could potentially matter there.

 

Good point, but the Camry and other large Toyota/Lexus cars are made and sold for Japan.

http://internationaltrade.suite101.com/article.cfm/list-of-top-10-best-selling-cars-in-japan-2009

 

What can be said of US buyers of imports can be said of Korean import buyers:

 

Ford and BMW selling well in Korea

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/biz/2010/07/123_65580.html

Some point their fingers to rich people for the unexpectedly solid performances of expensive foreign carmakers.

 

``A majority of demand for luxury foreign sedans comes from corporate clients, which hope to show off their high status and financial leeway via operating luxury vehicles,'' Woori Investment & Securities analyst Michael Sohn said.

 

``The point is that they purchase the expensive items for the very reason that they are expensive. They want to distinguish themselves from ordinary consumers by buying them or the classic case of the so-called Veblen effect''

 

Named after U.S. economist Thorstein Veblen, the effect refers to mysterious market behavior where end users prefer higher-priced products even though much cheaper substitutes are available.

[timmm55]

Nothing to do with Thailand and everything to do with Ford's perception.

Aussies don't like imported Ford, years of shit Euro Ford cars and almost zero

dealer support when things go wrong (Gee if you'd bought a Falcon we could help)

makes them wary of anything Ford brings in from elsewhere.

 

Fiesta, Focus and Mondeo are way down on buyers lists with

a lot of competition outselling them by 2 to 1 to 3 to 1 ratio.

 

That's why One Ford is a failure in Australia.

 

Aussie vehicles haven't done too well over here either! Capri (FWD convertible) , GTO, G8......none have been, even remotely, a sales success.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Nothing to do with Thailand and everything to do with Ford's perception.

Aussies don't like imported Ford, years of shit Euro Ford cars and almost zero

dealer support when things go wrong (Gee if you'd bought a Falcon we could help)

makes them wary of anything Ford brings in from elsewhere.

 

Fiesta, Focus and Mondeo are way down on buyers lists with

a lot of competition outselling them by 2 to 1 to 3 to 1 ratio.

 

That's why One Ford is a failure in Australia.

 

 

Mmmmm would love a Falcon JPD but we are only allowed get given permitted Hobsons Choice from FOE

 

If you dont do buy crap global cars down under JPD why do you by so many global made crap designed shitboxes like the Holden Cruze its an absolute pile of gutless shit with shite handling to match taboot its not a patch on comes close to the brilliant Thai Fiesta.

 

 

 

 

[156n3rd]

As a side note before I make a remark is that Kia used to build Fords under license, hence their BLACK Oval.

Wah Wah Wah! Cry. Go ahead and cry into yer beer. This is open marketing and competition. I suppose that Toyota should have run off in 1970. You should all realize that no company can be all thing to all people. In the future, Hyundai/Kia will be knock out of it's current sales position. But in the meantime, wasting people's time with this childish blog is biased and anti-Ford. That's the real world. get over it.

[calypsocoral]

Good to see someone is shooting at this. I thought I was the only one complaining about this.

 

After we get South Korea to play fair we need to have a nice talk with Japan too.

 

Do me a favor-- name one thing the United States manufactures that is less expensive, and at least equal in quality to what South Korea manufactures.

 

Under the current agreement, BOTH SIDES benefit from it. We get less expensive goods that are at least near-equal in quality to anything manufactured stateside, which LOWERS OUR COST OF LIVING, making our dollars go further (which, mark my words, will be vital to survival in the next few years). In return, they get to grow their industrial base and expand their market.

 

A new agreement that would force a "tit-for-tat" would seriously hurt both sides, because our goods, thanks to high labor costs and astronomical legacy costs, would invariably be more expensive than those produced by South Korea. How would that help them, exactly?

 

It wouldn't. It would be in their interest to scrap the whole damn thing altogether and pull out of the American market, which, in turn, deprives us of access to less-expensive goods, which would, in turn, RAISE our cost of living. In essence, with the proposed changes, BOTH SIDES LOSE!!!!!

[nelsonlu]

A new agreement that would force a "tit-for-tat" would seriously hurt both sides, because our goods, thanks to high labor costs and astronomical legacy costs, would invariably be more expensive than those produced by South Korea. How would that help them, exactly?

 

If that's true, then if South Korea lifts the ban on American auto imports, they wouldn't suffer anyway; nobody would be forced to buy those American cars if they didn't want them. But the artificial barrier on American auto imports means that no one is given that choice to buy American.

 

The entire rationale for free trade is that both economies benefit with free trade, because consumers and manufacturers in both countries would have access to both countries' product supplies/markets. Currently, it is entirely speculation on your part that American automobiles are "invariably be more expensive than those produced by South Korea." Plus, there could be additional benefits beside cost. A Korean consumer may very well conclude, given the chance to buy a Fusion, that despite its likely higher cost than a Sonata, that he/she prefers the Fusion because of the things that the Fusion does better than the Sonata. Further, with the competition by the Fusion, Hyundai may discount the Sonata further, thus allowing the consumer to buy the Sonata at a better price.

 

No economic agreement revision is going to force Korean consumers to buy American cars. What it should is to require South Korea to allow American cars to be imported so that Korean consumers would have that choice to do so.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Do me a favor-- name one thing the United States manufactures that is less expensive, and at least equal in quality to what South Korea manufactures.

 

Under the current agreement, BOTH SIDES benefit from it. We get less expensive goods that are at least near-equal in quality to anything manufactured stateside, which LOWERS OUR COST OF LIVING, making our dollars go further (which, mark my words, will be vital to survival in the next few years). In return, they get to grow their industrial base and expand their market.

 

A new agreement that would force a "tit-for-tat" would seriously hurt both sides, because our goods, thanks to high labor costs and astronomical legacy costs, would invariably be more expensive than those produced by South Korea. How would that help them, exactly?

 

It wouldn't. It would be in their interest to scrap the whole damn thing altogether and pull out of the American market, which, in turn, deprives us of access to less-expensive goods, which would, in turn, RAISE our cost of living. In essence, with the proposed changes, BOTH SIDES LOSE!!!!!

 

You are the kinda guy who would be happy to see everybody up your street lose their jobs get kicked out on to the street just as long as it meant you got to keep your shiny new Kia Cee'd in the driveway. So you think is great to see 10 million unemployed Stateside as long as you getta have a sniny new Kia in your drive?

 

Brits used to have that same mentality as you with British Leyland, Ford used to produce every car it sold in Europe in the UK but once British Leyland got finished wiped by calypsocorals and myself included. Ford pulled the plug on assembling cars in the UK once they owned the market, the last car we made here was the Escort back in 2000. We still have a few Honda, Nissan & Toyota chinese component kit car plants but the car industy of today employs a very very small fraction of car workers compared to when British Leyland were around on the scene.

 

Once British Leyland disappeared Ford had very little competition other than GM car prices rocketed upwards and British new cars become the most expensive to buy in Europe sometimes costing twice as much for decades so enjoy the cheap prices whilst they last calypsocoral because you gonna pay for it somewhere down the line when more than 4 brands at GM get wiped out Mercury becomes history Volvo become Chinese and those all American dreams Sonata's, Camrys & Accord production lines get shifted to China and become the big expensive Chinese nightmare because the big 3 don't make cars to complete with them anymore and the Chinese Camry & Cee'd ends up costing twice the price with 20 million unemployed Americans to keep fed & watered, still Mcdonalds & Walmart will help fill the void, enjoy it while it lasts calypsocoral!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Every action has an equal and opposite reaction - Newton

Edited July 23, 2010 by Ford Jellymoulds

[DC Car Examiner]

Good point, but the Camry and other large Toyota/Lexus cars are made and sold for Japan.

http://internationaltrade.suite101.com/article.cfm/list-of-top-10-best-selling-cars-in-japan-2009

 

 

They're sold there, but not in significant volume. Meanwhile, a Seoul street has a similar traffic mix to an American one -- except that nearly every car is from one of the four Korean automakers:

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/07/Seoul_Street.jpg

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Gangseogu_Office_Intersection_Seoul.jpg

 

Note also: no need for RHD conversion.

[jpd80]

Aussie vehicles haven't done too well over here either! Capri (FWD convertible) , GTO, G8......none have been, even remotely, a sales success.

 

You're absolutely right, the coming S/C V8 Falcon is an absolute disgrace

and completely unworthy of importation to the USA.

 

No way should Ford ever consider tackling Cadillac CTS-V head on

with a RWD Lincoln, they should just stick to D3 oatmeal.......

Edited July 23, 2010 by jpd80

[timmm55]

You're absolutely right, the coming S/C V8 Falcon is an absolute disgrace

and completely unworthy of importation to the USA.

 

No way should Ford ever consider tackling Cadillac CTS-V head on

with a RWD Lincoln, they should just stick to D3 oatmeal.......

 

Did I mention the Falcon? No.

 

You were saying One Ford doesn't work in Australia because of shitty Ford import cars (from the 80-90s?). One Ford IMHO should incorporate the BEST from all over the world. The new Ford Fiesta/Focus are excellent. The new Falcon is excellent.

I don't want a repeat of the past. The next Aussie Import (or shared chassis) needs to be a sucess.

 

BTW in your opinion, why hasn't any of the Aussie Imports worked here?