Empire Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Is the an effort to recall the state congressmen and state senators who voted for these bills as well? What was the alternative plan to reducing the 12.8% unemployment rate in MI? Do you think that increased taxes on business would encourage them to hire more people? From what I understand there are several recalls for the Senators and Congress that supported this travesty. There were some Republicans with sense not to increase and invent new taxes, so the republicans that had a lick of sense voted against this huge burden placed on our weakest citizens and will be supported by the voters. The republican voting was not by party line. Those are the types of Republicans that get my vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Empire Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Is the an effort to recall the state congressmen and state senators who voted for these bills as well? What was the alternative plan to reducing the 12.8% unemployment rate in MI? Do you think that increased taxes on business would encourage them to hire more people? Oh and the hiring people part..... No such provision. You would think if snyder truly was looking to lower the unemployment rate he would have given tax breaks for the businesses that actually hired. They wont even put an estimate out there to identify potential because there isn't any. This really was a political pay back to the rich............. Unemployment will stay in the 12-13% range during snyders dictatorship. This is a fallacy that hasn't worked since reagan. Remember the bush tax breaks for the rich Obama extended because they are the "job creators"...??? now you know the rest of the story............. that cash never finds its way back in the economy creating jobs. But the sheeple continue to buy into it.......... Oh well move along nothing to see here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordM/R Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 quite funny how these people join the site and respond to these threads as soon as they are made. I bet one person owns all the usernames.. UAW Wife, wanna cheat on your husband with me. You belong in the kitchen not in the factory.. This is why we (us men) don't have any good jobs anymore.. Stay at home and cry a river. Really? Talk about ignorant. Just go away if this is all you can add. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tapper Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 6 teachers in our neighborhood and not one drives ANY American vehicle. All have nothing but contempt for autoworkers as a whole. I find a little humor in their actions when asked or told to take some concessions like most of the workers out there. Unless your driving a bicycle or a horse to work the majority of people driving cars should thank and autoworker. My neighborhood has 113 homes in it. 21 were/are Ford employees. When our plant closed, 13 of the 21 homes went into foreclosure (whole different issue). We have 3 school teachers in my neighborhood. All three drive toymotors. 1 of the three lived between 2 of the foreclosed homes of former Ford employees. The same teacher moans and groans about her property value decrease and to this day, doesnt understand what she drives DOES affect her neighborhood. Now, if she would have bought a Ford, would she still live in the same situation, YES. But if she and all Americans had bought Ford or any of the Big 3, 2007 concessions would have not been needed and chances are the plant would still be opened because of sales volumes. Easy to figure out. As for the Gov. being recalled, doubt it will happen. Koch bros will pump so much money into Michigan for him to stay in office, you wont know what hit you! Teachers, nurses, firefighter, cops and city-county-state workers arnt being asked to give up wages. They are being stripped of all collective bargaining rights with no voice in the workplace, regardless of it being public vs private. Look at Wisconsin, Ohio and New Jersey. First thing they cut wasnt wages and benefits, it was dues collections. Thats all they were really after as they no Unions almost always support Democrats. Tapper 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1993Stang Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Are these the same teachers and nurses, etc., who asked for our help and wanted to park their Toyotas and Hondas in our union parking lot? And then when told they couldn't had a fit stating that the UAW couldn't tell them what kind of car to drive? Those teachers? LOL, Spring you totally get it...it is a shame others don't. I feel the same way. I am only happy to see that parking lot changing now, but before you are absolutely 100% right on target. Even when I go to the doctor, dentist, they better be driving American cars or I can always go to a different dr. and dentist : ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Wahrheit Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Don't worry Obama will be recalled in 2012.. He is the worst president ever. Watch trump will be offered the GOP nomination. (yes I can see into the future).. HAHA thatss funny. The republicants have no one or nothing to offer. Its going to be anothere landslide victory for OBAMA> Worry about your state and geting rid of the tax increase man Snyder. That rat has got to go . Recallrick.com. Get rid of this rat and every other republican in office.. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Wahrheit Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Are these the same teachers and nurses, etc., who asked for our help and wanted to park their Toyotas and Hondas in our union parking lot? And then when told they couldn't had a fit stating that the UAW couldn't tell them what kind of car to drive? Those teachers? Just like the republican backed UAW asswipes that drive honda goldwing bikes to work and park them on the lot. Your represent a party that is bent on destroying UAW jobs and your too stupid to realize that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Wahrheit Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. If teachers, and other public sector employees go out of their way to buy imported cars, then I say they have made their choice as to who's side they are on. And if they aren't on my side, then they are on the other. I will support those who support me. I will not support those who do not support me. It's that simple. Go ahead and stand up for the teachers, just know that when it's your turn to fight, the teachers will not be there next to you. SO you vote for and support republicants, they sure as hell do not support you! So where is your logic? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Wahrheit Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Since you didn't answer, I'll ask again. Where is the recall for Obama? Obama is not being recalled there are not enough right winger votes to do it. The majority of the country will vote Obama in again.. SO why don't you start with your state and recall these republicants. Snyder must go! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale143 Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 Haha, so that's your grasping at straws reply? That some teachers and nurses MAY drive foreign cars? I'm talking about unions in general. Doesn't matter the occupation at this point. I just wanted to spread the word that unions are going to be majorly targeted in the next three years and the attack has already begun. I guarantee you the UAW workers are going to get badmouthed here pretty soon just as contract negotiations begin and will back up the argument that here is just another reason there should be no unions. They are out of step with reality and antiquated. If anyone in another union thinks they are safe from the attack, think again. Sign. Don't sign. I don't care. But don't be crying when all the benefits of being protected by a union will be gone some day if the Republicans get their way. You will be at the mercy of Ford. They will pay you what they want, fire you at will and make you pay out the nose for your medical benefits, just like every other job without union protection. I'm not posting anything else about it. http://www.americanrightsatwork.org/component/option,com_issues/Itemid,366/view,issue/id,12/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 There is some doubt as to whether the rate cut will induce business to hire more when there is still a small market for product and supply is exceeding demand by a large amount. You know this marginal, you read thoughtful non-partisan economic discussions on the subject. I've read more than my share of economists working outside of policy groups and partisan circles that dispute generic cuts and find that targeted breaks like the move industry ones eliminated by the republicans in Michigan work better. Thanks for the post. I try to make a point of ready your posts - I usually agree with you when you are not baiting our resident politicos. I was listening to CNN on a road trip last week and they seem to argue the same chicken vs. egg point in most economic debate. Companies won't hire until more people buy their product vs. people won't buy the products until they are employed. The stimulus has not done a great job of stimulating - most of the money to the states went to meet shortfalls that were already commited to. As the money dries up, the states have not made any systemic changes and are faced with the same tough decisions. I'm torn on the Laffler curve and trickle down economics. I'm not sure that lowering corporate taxes are going to create more jobs, but it does seem that raising taxes on the private sector will not create jobs. I'd probably like to see a tax holiday on payroll to put more money in people checks - at least the first $50-100K. I'd consider a dollar for dollar tax break for all money spent on net add employees. SS and medicare need to be looked at for a graduated benefit scale. Social, defense, and entitlement programs all need to go under the scapel. I'm not a fan of recalls in general. People voted for the guy - take your medicine. If he is not in clear abuse of power and has the support of the state senate and house, I think you need to let it play out. There are 2-4 year terms for a reason - lets not judge our elected officials after 6 months. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lquidspine Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 Thanks for the post. I try to make a point of ready your posts - I usually agree with you when you are not baiting our resident politicos. I was listening to CNN on a road trip last week and they seem to argue the same chicken vs. egg point in most economic debate. Companies won't hire until more people buy their product vs. people won't buy the products until they are employed. The stimulus has not done a great job of stimulating - most of the money to the states went to meet shortfalls that were already commited to. As the money dries up, the states have not made any systemic changes and are faced with the same tough decisions. I'm torn on the Laffler curve and trickle down economics. I'm not sure that lowering corporate taxes are going to create more jobs, but it does seem that raising taxes on the private sector will not create jobs. I'd probably like to see a tax holiday on payroll to put more money in people checks - at least the first $50-100K. I'd consider a dollar for dollar tax break for all money spent on net add employees. SS and medicare need to be looked at for a graduated benefit scale. Social, defense, and entitlement programs all need to go under the scapel. I'm not a fan of recalls in general. People voted for the guy - take your medicine. If he is not in clear abuse of power and has the support of the state senate and house, I think you need to let it play out. There are 2-4 year terms for a reason - lets not judge our elected officials after 6 months. I am no finacial wizard and do respect alot of the posts you make here, so as someone that clearly follows economics how would you feel about a flat tax ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 I am no finacial wizard and do respect alot of the posts you make here, so as someone that clearly follows economics how would you feel about a flat tax ? I don't think we'll see a flat tax in the near future. While seemingly simple, setting the rules will be a political nightmare. Recent proposals have set targets at 15-25% of earned income. Questions that will be debated before implementation should include: Is any earned income exempt from the tax? Many politicians will push for a income exemption based on the first 20K or so. Our national savings rate is low so I can see arguments for exempting money going into savings accounts such as an IRA or 401K. What happens to the mortgage interest discount. Under a flat tax, it should probably go away, but it would likely crush housing prices further. Are pensions and 401K withdrawals exempt from the tax? By the time the policiticians get through with the exemptions, does it resemble a flat tax any longer? If you don't exempt the first X amount of dollars, people will say that it hurts the lower and middle class too much. If you take away the mortgage exemption, you hurt the middle class and destroy home equity. If you tax pensions, the middle class and retirement folks will object. The wealthy and upper class would probably benefit the most,as the marginal tax rate is greatly reduced, but hopefully the net revenue is increased through less loopholes. In addition, a flat tax could put a lot of government workers (IRS and state workers) and accoutants out of work. I'd look for increased gasoline taxes and other VAT options in the next 3-5 years as a more likely scenario. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 Obama is not being recalled there are not enough right winger votes to do it. The majority of the country will vote Obama in again.. SO why don't you start with your state and recall these republicants. Snyder must go! If you want to recall Snyder because he is not living up to his campaign promises, then you should recall Obama for doing the same thing. It should not be about which political party the person is for, but rather that he isn't doing what he said he would do. Or do you not care since Obama is on your side, so therefore it's ok? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 SO you vote for and support republicants, they sure as hell do not support you! So where is your logic? The Dems support me less than the Repubs do. Why do you just blindly support whomever you are told to wupport? Where is your logic? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 If you want to recall Snyder because he is not living up to his campaign promises, then you should recall Obama for doing the same thing. It should not be about which political party the person is for, but rather that he isn't doing what he said he would do. Or do you not care since Obama is on your side, so therefore it's ok? Why don't you learn what your talking about , the president cannnot be recalled. Snyder is facing recall because he is trying to pull shit that he never mentioned in his campaign. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Why don't you learn what your talking about , the president cannnot be recalled. Snyder is facing recall because he is trying to pull shit that he never mentioned in his campaign. And Obama did the same thing. So why are you still supporting him? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 And Obama did the same thing. So why are you still supporting him? Again learn what you are talking about,Obama's doing exactly what he campaigned on. He has had some success and some failures. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Again learn what you are talking about,Obama's doing exactly what he campaigned on. He has had some success and some failures. I would suggest you take your own advice Obama's Broken Promises And for the record, he's had far more failures than success. So again I ask, why do the people who want Snyder recalled, still support Obama? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
905 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 And for the record, he's had far more failures than success. Right, somehow three pages of broken promises is greater than seven pages of kept promises – in your world, that is. The funny thing is that you did not even check your own source... http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/ 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Right, somehow three pages of broken promises is greater than seven pages of kept promises – in your world, that is. The funny thing is that you did not even check your own source... http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/ You missed the point. rn4 said "Obama's doing exactly what he campaigned on", yet I provided examples of things he campaigned on, but failed to do. It doesn't matter if he has done things that he said he would do, he has failed to live up to what he promised. Whether it's one thing, or a hundred things. People like rn4 want to recall Snyder because he is doing things he didn't campaign on. Yet the exact same thing can be said about Obama. So again I ask, why is it ok for Obama to break campaign promises, but not ok for Snyder to do so? If you would just answer the question, then we could save bandwidth. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Lol. if you could just not ask questions and tell us in the first place then we would save even more bandwidth. But you and i both know that breaking promises is different than not offering plans for major changes like Financial Martial law. Hell, even libertarian minded republicans don't like that and aren't happy with him for hiding that. You know, but I don't think happy knows the difference. Happy just needs to go and find his happy place then all will be good. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Empire Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 What is amazing to me is snyder>>>>>>>> Raised taxes Imposed brand new taxes Installed jack booted thugs a financial manager to bust union contracts Cut K- 12 education And gave all of the revenue (from robbing the weakest citizens) to business to the tune of 1.3 BILLION DOLLARS !!!! All of this and not 1 peep from the teabaggers of Michigan Remember the teabaggers they are the ones protesting tax increases, new taxes and government taking away our freedoms I ask this............. Where are the teabaggers????? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Lol. if you could just not ask questions and tell us in the first place then we would save even more bandwidth. But you and i both know that breaking promises is different than not offering plans for major changes like Financial Martial law. Hell, even libertarian minded republicans don't like that and aren't happy with him for hiding that. You know, but I don't think happy knows the difference. Happy just needs to go and find his happy place then all will be good. So neither one of you will answer the question? Can you guys at least admit that you have double standards when it comes to politics? I don't care if that is the case, but at least be man enough to come out and say it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Gilmore Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I ask this............. Where are the teabaggers????? Check your mom's bedroom. In the mean time, when you're sitting around waiting, please tell me where all the people who thought they were getting "Hope and Change" have been hiding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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