flex2009 Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Does any one know when and how they going to hire the 2nd tier ? heard we getting 80 people by may Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niteeyes Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Not sure when but how, they should fill out some paperwork and have physical and then be called and said your hired and then given a start date . Don't forget, ya got to pass the test. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damagedone37 Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Don't forget, ya got to pass the test. If you can't pass that test you had no business graduating elementary school... Wait nvm that answers a lot of issues we have with ford HA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seniority Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Don't forget, ya got to pass the test. No you don't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepie Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 move these red dots around on a board, you have 30 secs.. ok you past. now let us do an illegal seizure of you're hair follicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoTwoAte Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Does any one know when and how they going to hire the 2nd tier ? heard we getting 80 people by may Since 228 continues to censor their face book page,this will have to do. It appears Neil and Lorenzo have decided the way to get an application is to have had,or willing to have,one of them in your mouth.(no application 4 me) Those 2,against the recomendations of the other officers,who suggested a lottery was the only fair way,came up with giving the locals alotted applications to the committeemen and appointees to hand out at their discretion.By the time anyone knew what was going on they were all handed out.There might be some info following about how to get one of the other apps,im sure the ones that went to management and h.r. are being handed out to their relatives and friends as well,but i dont pay union dues to them. The local knew there was gonna be new hires for quite some time,plenty of time to come up with a fair plan for distribution,so im not sure what excuses the memberships willing to accept. As for the facebook page all the posts about the applications,where lorenzo was saying they were workin on a fair solution,deleted. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelprime Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 (edited) Since 228 continues to censor their face book page,this will have to do. It appears Neil and Lorenzo have decided the way to get an application is to have had,or willing to have,one of them in your mouth.(no application 4 me) Those 2,against the recomendations of the other officers,who suggested a lottery was the only fair way,came up with giving the locals alotted applications to the committeemen and appointees to hand out at their discretion.By the time anyone knew what was going on they were all handed out.There might be some info following about how to get one of the other apps,im sure the ones that went to management and h.r. are being handed out to their relatives and friends as well,but i dont pay union dues to them. The local knew there was gonna be new hires for quite some time,plenty of time to come up with a fair plan for distribution,so im not sure what excuses the memberships willing to accept. As for the facebook page all the posts about the applications,where lorenzo was saying they were workin on a fair solution,deleted. This whole situation is ridiculous. In the past a lottery system was used at Sterling and thats what should have happened this time. Any argument that there was some time constraint in getting applications in fast is BS. There is not one person working at Sterling that if told they needed to have a application filled out and returned the next day that would not have done so. The union officials who rewarded themselves with the applications that should have belonged to all the members should be ousted from office. I do not know if there is any recourse to recall elected officials but it is a option that should be explored and probably will be. This type of Nepotism by union officials at sterling is exactly they kind of thing the union is suppose to be against. If you work at sterling you need to help hold these people accountable for their actions!! Edited April 6, 2012 by grendelprime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goongala Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 This whole situation is ridiculous. In the past a lottery system was used at Sterling and thats what should have happened this time. Any argument that there was some time constraint in getting applications in fast is BS. There is not one person working at Sterling that if told they needed to have a application filled out and returned the next day that would not have done so. The union officials who rewarded themselves with the applications that should have belonged to all the members should be ousted from office. I do not know if there is any recourse to recall elected officials but it is a option that should be explored and probably will be. This type of Nepotism by union officials at sterling is exactly they kind of thing the union is suppose to be against. If you work at sterling you need to help hold these people accountable for their actions!! I know several LTS temps who have yet to be hired in that would love a full-time job at the Sterling Plant. I'm usre it is an "out of zone" job for them, and they'd rather be hired in somewhere closer, but I doubt they'd have much problem with relocating for full-time work. What happen to preferential hiring based on LTS seniority?! I know damn well Ford still has all kinds of temps in the system. Hell, temps were recently brought into the Brownstown PRC and Woodhaven Stamping. Some were brand new temps, others weren't, they'd probably like an opportunity for full-time work as well. I guess Sterling goes by a different contract though. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
statts Posted April 9, 2012 Share Posted April 9, 2012 I know several LTS temps who have yet to be hired in that would love a full-time job at the Sterling Plant. I'm usre it is an "out of zone" job for them, and they'd rather be hired in somewhere closer, but I doubt they'd have much problem with relocating for full-time work. What happen to preferential hiring based on LTS seniority?! I know damn well Ford still has all kinds of temps in the system. Hell, temps were recently brought into the Brownstown PRC and Woodhaven Stamping. Some were brand new temps, others weren't, they'd probably like an opportunity for full-time work as well. I guess Sterling goes by a different contract though. [/quo only two teir can hired at sterling from now on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stugots Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 1st of all, lets stop calling them 2nd tier.…….......................... They are entry level, and with attrition be moved to top pay levels one at a time........................... Agree or disagree on the method used to distribute the referrals, however the way it was done ensures that the new hires will be dedicated to our union as opposed to more company suck asses who write articles in the newspaper advocating the demise of this union...................... ...Thank you...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morepie Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 (edited) they don't use a lottery system anymore because the company couldn't get in their own workers. Edited April 10, 2012 by morepie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelprime Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 1st of all, lets stop calling them 2nd tier.…….......................... They are entry level, and with attrition be moved to top pay levels one at a time........................... Agree or disagree on the method used to distribute the referrals, however the way it was done ensures that the new hires will be dedicated to our union as opposed to more company suck asses who write articles in the newspaper advocating the demise of this union...................... ...Thank you...... Really?!?? You sir sound like someone that might have benefited from this underhanded method of handing out referrals. At this point I could care less if the new hires come from the company family members. The company family could be no worse than the family of a bunch of elected officials who have no integrity and obviously have no problem enriching themselves at the expense of every other member of 228. Maybe you might want to go troll the next 228 union meeting trying to get people who agree with you but I can assure you most of the membership think what happened was BS! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Geez,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Never seen so much interest in $19.50 jobs with a transition to our wages. The haters on here are the same ones bitching about entry level last year (and trying to get people hired) that saved our jobs and industry in this country wow, kind of ironic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelprime Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Geez,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Never seen so much interest in $19.50 jobs with a transition to our wages. The haters on here are the same ones bitching about entry level last year (and trying to get people hired) that saved our jobs and industry in this country wow, kind of ironic Well if you have haven't noticed besides not being too many $30hrs jobs around the same goes for $19hr jobs. Everyone knows someone who is out of work or needs a job. So that might explain why there so much interest in a $19hr job. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
228electrician Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 they don't use a lottery system anymore because the company couldn't get in their own workers. we still have a list that they are suppose to pull from, but it was leftover from when we were Visteon, and Neil decided that since it was Visteon when that list was pulled, that they would not use it (here is a shaft to those that worked 89 days with the promise of a call in the future for full time work!!!!), even thou those people would have been Ford workers if they were pulled while the plant had Visteon on the sign. Company handed over decision of the hiring process to lets make a Deal Neil, and he decided it was in HIS best interest if he could get another 80 votes in the next election, so he is only letting people he thinks is better than the others, and let them get people in. So how do you feel now? Neil thinks your useless to him, if you did not get a chance to get someone in, his words, otherwise why would it only go to a select few!!!!! Sounds the same as what happened in the early 90's to the Savallie gang, before they got their hand smacked and started the lottery drawing, WELCOME TO THE NEIL WORLD ORDER!!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grendelprime Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 we still have a list that they are suppose to pull from, but it was leftover from when we were Visteon, and Neil decided that since it was Visteon when that list was pulled, that they would not use it (here is a shaft to those that worked 89 days with the promise of a call in the future for full time work!!!!), even thou those people would have been Ford workers if they were pulled while the plant had Visteon on the sign. Company handed over decision of the hiring process to lets make a Deal Neil, and he decided it was in HIS best interest if he could get another 80 votes in the next election, so he is only letting people he thinks is better than the others, and let them get people in. So how do you feel now? Neil thinks your useless to him, if you did not get a chance to get someone in, his words, otherwise why would it only go to a select few!!!!! Sounds the same as what happened in the early 90's to the Savallie gang, before they got their hand smacked and started the lottery drawing, WELCOME TO THE NEIL WORLD ORDER!!!! You correct I know people who won the lottery 10 years ago and had kids waiting to be called after going through all the MESC tests and never got called. Just another example why all the elected officials in 228 have to go. I could give you a whole list of lies Neil as spoke to people only latter to say he didn't say that or back tracked on what he said. The Pyro-Electrcian cross training, the new electrical lab was supposed be a posted job,skilled trades was not supposed to be part of the production alternate work schedules coming to sterling. and those are just the few things I can think of at the top of my head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goongala Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 only two teir can hired at sterling from now on Those people I spoke of are tier 2. All pre Nov 07 temps were cut down to Tier 2. They were not grandfathered in. So those people I mentioned shouled be eligible for work at Sterling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goongala Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Geez,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Never seen so much interest in $19.50 jobs with a transition to our wages. The haters on here are the same ones bitching about entry level last year (and trying to get people hired) that saved our jobs and industry in this country wow, kind of ironic To be fair, if these jobs only paid $10 an hour there would probably be the same amount of interest. Michigan's economy ain't so great right now and people need work. The fact Ford has the 80/20 cap makes entry level work at Ford desirable because it holds the promise that at some point you'll be bumped up to the traditional wage ( unlike GM and Chrysler who are "un-capped"). Whats unfortunate is when they cut our wages to achieve parody, those workers at Toyota still make $10 an hour more than us. If they wanted true parody, tier 2 would of been around $25 an hour, but it isn't. The raise scale for the life of this contract is decent, and after 2 years we'll be topped out at just over $19 an hour (a raise every 26 weeks pr 6 months). But if we're being honest, $15 an hour isn't all the great and is definitely a slap in the face to everything the union is supposed to stand for (equal pay for equal work). You can argue that it saved the company, and maybe it did, but that doesn't change the fact that having 2 tiers is shitty. The people who are in favor of Tier 2 would probably change their tune if they were dropped down to tier 2. Its fine for now, Ford got what it wanted and is doing really well now. In four years if Ford is still doing well, it'll be time for the Union to fight to get rid of Tier 2 or at the very least bring us Tier 2 people up to parody with Toyota workers($25 an hour). I know Henry Ford was anti-union, but he would be rolling over in his grave over tier 2 since us tier 2 people can hardly afford to buy a brand new Ford car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unionguy963 Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Geez,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Never seen so much interest in $19.50 jobs with a transition to our wages. The haters on here are the same ones bitching about entry level last year (and trying to get people hired) that saved our jobs and industry in this country wow, kind of ironic Wow for sure.... The complaining last year wasn't about new entry level employees..... It was about the sell out on wages and benefits for these new employees/ union members..... Now the complaining is about the 228 union leadership doing just whatever they want..... This time jobs for their hand picked people.... It would seem that selling us out, one way or the other, never gets old with this slate that's taken control of our local union..... Oh, and just so you know.... The entry level union workers at Sterling and Rawsonville will never transition to our wages.... That's what the complaining was about..... I'm not a hater.... Not afraid to tell the truth either.... Solidarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goongala Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 (edited) Wow for sure.... The complaining last year wasn't about new entry level employees..... It was about the sell out on wages and benefits for these new employees/ union members..... Now the complaining is about the 228 union leadership doing just whatever they want..... This time jobs for their hand picked people.... It would seem that selling us out, one way or the other, never gets old with this slate that's taken control of our local union..... Oh, and just so you know.... The entry level union workers at Sterling and Rawsonville will never transition to our wages.... That's what the complaining was about..... I'm not a hater.... Not afraid to tell the truth either.... Solidarity Complaining that Tier 2 workers got a raise to put us up to $19 an hour while Tier 1 makes $28 an hour is beyond silly in my opinion. How will the Sterling and Rawsonville people never transition to Tier 1?!? The 80/20 cap is in the contract. Is their local different or something? Whats the reason for this? If that is indeed the case, and you think its bullshit, then you should be all for Tier 2 people getting another "raise" next contract to bring us closer to you, which will probably mean you guys will go another contract without one because they'll never catch Tier 2 up if they are constantly giving Tier 1 a raise as well ( unless of course the Tier 2 raise structures are larger, but even then people would complain that tier 2 got a "bigger" raise). Edited April 11, 2012 by Goongala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unionguy963 Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Complaining that Tier 2 workers got a raise to put us up to $19 an hour while Tier 1 makes $28 an hour is beyond silly in my opinion. How will the Sterling and Rawsonville people never transition to Tier 1?!? The 80/20 cap is in the contract. Is their local different or something? Whats the reason for this? If that is indeed the case, and you think its bullshit, then you should be all for Tier 2 people getting another "raise" next contract to bring us closer to you, which will probably mean you guys will go another contract without one because they'll never catch Tier 2 up if they are constantly giving Tier 1 a raise as well ( unless of course the Tier 2 raise structures are larger, but even then people would complain that tier 2 got a "bigger" raise). The language for Sterling and Rawsonville is master agreement language..... I'm for all union members being paid the same wages..... Solidarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
228electrician Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Complaining that Tier 2 workers got a raise to put us up to $19 an hour while Tier 1 makes $28 an hour is beyond silly in my opinion. How will the Sterling and Rawsonville people never transition to Tier 1?!? The 80/20 cap is in the contract. Is their local different or something? Whats the reason for this? If that is indeed the case, and you think its bullshit, then you should be all for Tier 2 people getting another "raise" next contract to bring us closer to you, which will probably mean you guys will go another contract without one because they'll never catch Tier 2 up if they are constantly giving Tier 1 a raise as well ( unless of course the Tier 2 raise structures are larger, but even then people would complain that tier 2 got a "bigger" raise). Sterling and Rawsonville are set up by contract to be 100% tier 2, and those numbers do not get added to the company wide 80/20 numbers. Next contract they at least will probably up that to 50/50, and as long as they offer a big signing bonus and promise of work again, everyone is gonna vote yes for it again. Look at the last contract, everyone made it an issue about money, and how many people called all the no voters greedy when some of the no voters were focusing on the other parts of the contract, like how they labeled full time workers at Sterling, Rawsonville and ACH workers as surplus, and these surplus employees must be moved out of the plant to make room for second tier workers, (yes its all in the contract, thank you yes voters!!!) its called divide and conquer, you get 22,000 voters to vote for a contract that negatively effects 4000 workers, and how you do it is by giving them money and telling them they won't have new work if they don't and have the media calling them greedy, so we effectively dismantle all the progress unions have worked for, in a matter of a coulpe contracts, all for a quick check. If you add up the possible numbers of voting members at the next contract, your getting close to a 50/50 tier 1 and tier 2 voting line when you look at the the eligible voting members, and it only takes 50.1% of the vote to change something. You offer joining the two tiers at $23.00 an hour, it will pass, everything is falling into place for this to happen, and if you vote no, your greedy. mark my word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long forker DTP FINAL Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Sterling and Rawsonville are set up by contract to be 100% tier 2, and those numbers do not get added to the company wide 80/20 numbers. Next contract they at least will probably up that to 50/50, and as long as they offer a big signing bonus and promise of work again, everyone is gonna vote yes for it again. Look at the last contract, everyone made it an issue about money, and how many people called all the no voters greedy when some of the no voters were focusing on the other parts of the contract, like how they labeled full time workers at Sterling, Rawsonville and ACH workers as surplus, and these surplus employees must be moved out of the plant to make room for second tier workers, (yes its all in the contract, thank you yes voters!!!) its called divide and conquer, you get 22,000 voters to vote for a contract that negatively effects 4000 workers, and how you do it is by giving them money and telling them they won't have new work if they don't and have the media calling them greedy, so we effectively dismantle all the progress unions have worked for, in a matter of a coulpe contracts, all for a quick check. If you add up the possible numbers of voting members at the next contract, your getting close to a 50/50 tier 1 and tier 2 voting line when you look at the the eligible voting members, and it only takes 50.1% of the vote to change something. You offer joining the two tiers at $23.00 an hour, it will pass, everything is falling into place for this to happen, and if you vote no, your greedy. mark my word. do the tier 2 worker ever make tier 1 pay and not the benefits ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goongala Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) Sterling and Rawsonville are set up by contract to be 100% tier 2, and those numbers do not get added to the company wide 80/20 numbers. Next contract they at least will probably up that to 50/50, and as long as they offer a big signing bonus and promise of work again, everyone is gonna vote yes for it again. Look at the last contract, everyone made it an issue about money, and how many people called all the no voters greedy when some of the no voters were focusing on the other parts of the contract, like how they labeled full time workers at Sterling, Rawsonville and ACH workers as surplus, and these surplus employees must be moved out of the plant to make room for second tier workers, (yes its all in the contract, thank you yes voters!!!) its called divide and conquer, you get 22,000 voters to vote for a contract that negatively effects 4000 workers, and how you do it is by giving them money and telling them they won't have new work if they don't and have the media calling them greedy, so we effectively dismantle all the progress unions have worked for, in a matter of a coulpe contracts, all for a quick check. If you add up the possible numbers of voting members at the next contract, your getting close to a 50/50 tier 1 and tier 2 voting line when you look at the the eligible voting members, and it only takes 50.1% of the vote to change something. You offer joining the two tiers at $23.00 an hour, it will pass, everything is falling into place for this to happen, and if you vote no, your greedy. mark my word. I totally agree with you on the "divide and conquer" statement. The adding of a 2nd tier basically created a division among the union with the traditional workers and the 2nd tier workers voting based on different interests. As a 2nd tier worker, it would be hard for me to vote no on a cotract that gave me a raise to $23.00 even though it would mean all the traditional folks would get bumped down. Although as long as the 80/20 rule stays in effect I could possibly justify voting no on it on the basis that eventually I'd be moved up. I had't realized that those parts plants were going to be entirely tier 2 and that they wouldn't count towards the 80/20 cap. To be honest, I voted no on the contract, even though it meant that if the contract didn't pass I wouldn't get hired. I didn't end up with a dime of settlement money either, even though other temps got either $5,000 or $2,500. We were told where I was at the time of retification that no temps would get $5,000, but of course that was a lie as MAP temps got the full signing bonus. People who had been with the company for only 8 months or so while us LTS temps who had worked for Ford for years got nothing. Its unfortunate that in the last 10 or so years most of the stuff my father and his father fought for are being taken away at such an alarming rate. Voting yes on adding a 2nd tier was probably the worst thing you could do, but since at the time everyone ffigured that it wouldn't effect them, they went ahead and voted it through. Now all those same people are afraid that eventually they'll be bumped down to a universal "tier 2"wage". What did they expect?! That was probably the plan right from the get-go. It's sad that the union is standing by letting this happen as if they don't notice it's going on. I've got to believe that our leadership is smarter then that. Then again, what do they care? From what I hear Union members are paid well, much better than us lowly production workers. Until one of these future contracts hurts them in the pocket book, they'll likely contrinue to let this stuff happen. They bitch about how Toyota treats their workers, but a non union Toyota worker makes$10 more then me. Of course thats because of the unions, its still ridiculous that the union would allow a tier 2 that dropped us below even what the foreign companies pay. Me making $15 an hour and a Toyota non union worker making $25 an hour isn't parody to me. Thats not to mention that the Japanese traditionally treat their workers very well. They understand that moral is the key to good work and quality, something the American company's don't understand and probably never will. Edited April 16, 2012 by Goongala Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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