DeluxeStang

Exactly, it's very touch and go at the moment. I think they're running into the same issues other EV startups are. The only reason I'm even considering it is I see Fisker making some smart moves that a lot of other EV startups aren't. For instance, they're going after the electric truck market like everyone else, but instead of jumping into the full sized segment where there are a ton of rivals, they're planning on entering the midsized EV truck space. A space which they would have to themselves, at least for several years if they stick to their 2025 release schedule. They're going after profitable and high volume segments, in a way that doesn't put them directly head to head with established OEMs which would rip them apart. The pear is another example, an affordable EV that could potentially beat Tesla and Ford to the market. It's a difficult decision for sure, there are a ton of things about this company that are sketchy, but also a lot of areas that show promise. It's very hard to predict at this point in time of the company is gonna rebound, or go belly up.

Do you guys think it's worth investing in fisker? On one hand, they're dealing with financial issues currently, and are having to pause production for a little over a month while they try to find their footing. Like most startups, they could go belly up any minute now. On the other, they came out today and said they've secured a 150 million dollars in additional funding, have over 200 million dollars in inventory that they're working to sell, and are in talks with collaborating with another brand, likely Nissan, to produce electric trucks and using Nissan's dealership network to sell their cars direct to consumers. Most importantly, unlike so many other startups who have nothing more than renderings and empty promises, Fisker is actually producing and selling thousands of cars. Not to mention they're investing in high volume segments like crossovers, midsized trucks, and affordable EVs, all of which actually have demand from consumers. I'm not exactly in a rush to run out and give them all of my life savings. But their current share price is about as low as it could possibly get, 15 cents a share down from a 52 week high of over $7. Which means if you invest a grand or two, you're going to own literally thousands of shares. I've never invested in a high risk, high reward company before, it's not the type of game I usually play. But I feel like it's worth the risk of investing a couple thousand. If you lose it, it's not fun, but it's not the end of the world. Let me know what you guys think.

I saw this story in my local news cycle, really cool.

But discussions on past Ford engines aside, I do think we're getting slightly off topic here.

Exactly, literally millions of engines, and people want to act like it's bad because a few hundred people on forums have complained about the water pump.

Our explorer is nearing that decade old mark. While the water pump could go out at 40k miles, weirder things have happened, I'm not overly worried about it. If it happens, it happens. There are literally millions of 3.5 and 3.7s in existence. I'm not saying it's a flawless engine, but it seems like the percentage of 3.5s with water pump failures is quite small relative to, again, the millions of motors in existence. Everyone I've met who's had a Ford with that motor loves it.

True. What makes it even worse is some of the most reliable vehicles are also the most popular. Your Ford trucks and Toyota Camry's, things like that. Yet because they're so popular, you tend to hear more stories of people having issues. Which ironically makes people think they're less reliable.

Ford is targeting a price of 25-30k for their compact affordable CE1 evs according to people involved in their development. Ford hasn't come out and said what those EVs are, but we know from insiders one of them is an EV maverick.

They might flood the market with cheap EVs, cheap here means low 20s for an EV. But who's gonna look at that little shitbox for 23 grand, and an actually decent vehicle like a maverick for 26, and say "I'll take the shitbox please".

That's stunning to me. The 3.5 duratec seems to be about as reliable as it gets. The water pump thing seems to be more common on earlier versions of that motor. I've heard people say they changed the timing chain design in 2012 or something and that somehow reduced the failure rates on newer 3.5s.

I wonder if the puma EV is the affordable EV utility ExplorerDude was describing. I highly doubt it, but we know a lot of people want the puma here. It would certainly be more appealing than the ecosport. As for the BYD Seagull and Dolphin, those low prices basically only apply to the Chinese market. I'm fairly certain those EVs are also being sold throughout several European nations, and they're in the mid 20s or low 30s after it's all said and done, for a car designed originally to be sold in the low five figures. There's no appeal to the BYD dolphin once I'm paying 30 grand for it.

Ford quality is a roller coaster, highs and lows. Let's hope these changes endure after Farley and the rest of Ford's current upper management are gone. I want to see lasting changes made to the culture of the company, not policies which only last until the end of the current CEO's run.

He's probably not happy. I know multiple past Boeing engineers, including my grandfather, who devoted their entire careers to Boeing in the 60s through the early 2000s, and they're just shaking their heads at the nonsense going on right now. Boeing is a textbook example of why engineers should be the ones making all the important decisions in a company. I'm gladly put my hands in the life of an engineer, an accountant, not so much.

I agree with you there. What you're describing is called confirmation bias, it's seeking out information and data that supports your position to make it seem more credible, and it's a problem that goes both ways unfortunately.

Hard to say. While we haven't seen any prototypes with finalized production body work, there were some prototypes testing the platform for the three row, just using the mach-e body. That was years ago, but we haven't seen much sense. It is worth noting that unlike ICE products, where you have to create a Frankenstein's monster hacked up prototype to fit around the mechanicals, with how packaging friendly modern EV platforms are, brands can test upcoming EV platforms under existing bodies, and no-one can really tell. T3 has apparently been testing on public roads for months, if not years by this points, using the current lightning body to blend in with traffic. That's what some insiders have claimed at least.

Well let's cut them a little slack. You have to look at where the industry was a few years ago. Practically every EV being released was having waiting lists, they were being sold at a massive markup. So we can't really blame people from a few years ago making predictions driven by current trends that turned out to not be accurate long term. Hell, I was guilty of that myself. When Ford was expanding production of the lighting and mach-e, I thought they were going to be run away successes. I'd say they were still successful, just not to the degree I, and others, thought they would be.

He'd being calling everyone an idiot and saying how the lack of growth, meant there was growth, or something like that.

Agreed. I think what Ford, and their competitors are gonna find, is that the sweet spot for EVs is in that 30-50k price range. Affordable enough so that they're not completely unobtainable, expensive enough to be profitable, and high quality. What Ford does better than literally every other car brand in the world is making affordable aspirational products. No-one even gets close to them there. Making products that people would describe as dream cars, but ones where they can say "I can actually afford to buy one of those". When Ford themes it's products around those principles, they're unbeatable. That's what their EVs should be, something that gives me an experience no other brand offers, at the price where I don't have to think twice.

The weight is also insane, over 5,800 lbs for the EV version. We don't know the weight for. The ICE version yet, but I'm betting it's on the high side of 4k, maybe even in the low 5s. I'm predicting even the high output 550 hp V6 is going to struggle to match the GT in acceleration, and track performance.

So the limit for the e-cvt is around 300 lb ft and 400 hp, interesting.

I suppose time will tell. I could have sworn I saw insiders claiming it was going to be a plug in, but maybe I'm mixing things up. It sounds like that's what a lot of potential buyers want. I personally prefer our mild hybrid setup and not having to charge. But I get why some people would want something that could go further on electric only range.

Yeah, it doesn't make a ton of sense. I believe he said they were redesigning the three rows to ride on the CE1 platform. That would essentially mean they were starting over from scratch to design and engineer around a completely different platform. That would be insane considering the three rows are nearing the end of their development. If we look at what others have said, it sounds like he heard people talking about the CE1 EVs being pushed back by a few years, and someone else talking about the three rows, and somewhere along the way, he thought it meant the three row was getting delayed to to built on CE1. Just getting information mixed up, I don't believe he has an ill intentions, just bad info.

Seeing as the maverick AWD hybrid will likely be a plug in, it sounds like they'll be going for a setup similar to what the Corsair has.

Not to mention I bet the upcoming AWD maverick hybrid still uses that same e-cvt, just with an additional electric motor powering the rear wheels or something. I bet that setup pushes 250-300 hp. I don't know where the torque/hp limit for Ford's e-cvts lies. But it definitely sounds like something that's overbuilt, and under stressed by design. I could see a beefier e-cvt working well for a ranger hybrid. But I don't see that setup working well for an F-150 or super duty.

As others have suggested, it seems like EVs aren't in your future, or at least, not your near future. That's ok, EVs aren't for everyone. But in the interest of trying to give sound advice, would you consider a hybrid instead? They offer noticable levels of fuel economy improvements, with virtually none of the long term reliability and maintenance concerns considering Ford hybrids have a reputable for lasting basically forever. The best of both worlds for someone in your position. I know you said you were worried about the maverick being too small, but I can assure you, unless you're hauling and towing heavy and very bulky items frequently, the maverick is more than capable enough in the utility department. I believe you said you own a 90s ranger. So the maverick, which is basically just a 90s ranger, but better in just about every way, might appeal to you if you could learn to live with the smaller bed. Beyond the maverick, Ford seems to have plans for tons of mild and plug in hybrids that will be coming to market over the next few years. I highly recommend giving those a fair chance whenever they arrive. I genuinely believe partially electrified products are the best option for someone like you, and are worthy of consideration.