Spring Posted August 5, 2007 Share Posted August 5, 2007 Is anyone else concerned with these guys supposedly "safeguarding" our rights and our futures (e.g. pensions)? After all, it's not like they are going to be affected to the extent that we will. They have their own contract and secondary pension protection so they will not be hit as hard as we will. I am curious to see what they bring to us and I'd like to see a breakdown of how they've cut costs in the pork at Solidarity House. What percentage of "representatives" did they get rid of in proportion to the manpower cut loose at the plant level? Boy, if their jobs were dependent on keeping plants open you'd see some work getting done then! Just some thoughts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 5, 2007 Share Posted August 5, 2007 (edited) Is anyone else concerned with these guys supposedly "safeguarding" our rights and our futures (e.g. pensions)? After all, it's not like they are going to be affected to the extent that we will. They have their own contract and secondary pension protection so they will not be hit as hard as we will. I am curious to see what they bring to us and I'd like to see a breakdown of how they've cut costs in the pork at Solidarity House. What percentage of "representatives" did they get rid of in proportion to the manpower cut loose at the plant level? Boy, if their jobs were dependent on keeping plants open you'd see some work getting done then! Just some thoughts... Brother I feel you and, I personally will fight to sustain what has been promised. Although if cuts are forced on us I think they need to be equitable to all parties concerned, the management, hourly's, and retirees! I will not however sit back and watch you guys take a cut to save us from concessions. You make a valid point as far as UAW size reduction to match our current hourly members! I wish I had the numbers to give you but, they likely have not reduced in size! Another point is Our hourly employ, out of 80,000 active workers 42,000 remain. There needs to be an increase in our strike pay, there are 38,000 retired employees that will never receive strike pay! They need to increase the strike pay to at least 60% of our current pay scale! Edited August 6, 2007 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imawhosure Posted August 5, 2007 Share Posted August 5, 2007 Is anyone else concerned with these guys supposedly "safeguarding" our rights and our futures (e.g. pensions)? After all, it's not like they are going to be affected to the extent that we will. They have their own contract and secondary pension protection so they will not be hit as hard as we will. I am curious to see what they bring to us and I'd like to see a breakdown of how they've cut costs in the pork at Solidarity House. What percentage of "representatives" did they get rid of in proportion to the manpower cut loose at the plant level? Boy, if their jobs were dependent on keeping plants open you'd see some work getting done then! Just some thoughts... Sister Spring, Just like our congress in Washington, they do not have the same benefits, therefore are disconnected from those they represent. It is much easier to SCREW others out of money for the betterment, than it is to screw yourself, lololol. Maybe, that is why it was set up this way, but any UAW member who complains about the exhorbant amounts of money the CEOS and managers on down make, are making ridiculous statements until they CLEAN their own house of excess in the UAW. A deal will be cut, someone (s) will get screwed deeply, but it won't be CEOs, or the international UAW. This is the way of the world............or at least the way according to business and unions. For those of you who read this that suggest that GW Bush; or any other president for that matter, is on the oil take........or anything else, if you actually believe this, what are the odds your union leaders are not too since the international is not even elected, but rather dictators who can NOT be voted out, lololol. P.S. I am not laughing because I think it is funny, rather because if I didn't laugh, I would probably cry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 Sister Spring, Just like our congress in Washington, they do not have the same benefits, therefore are disconnected from those they represent. It is much easier to SCREW others out of money for the betterment, than it is to screw yourself, lololol. Maybe, that is why it was set up this way, but any UAW member who complains about the exhorbant amounts of money the CEOS and managers on down make, are making ridiculous statements until they CLEAN their own house of excess in the UAW. A deal will be cut, someone (s) will get screwed deeply, but it won't be CEOs, or the international UAW. This is the way of the world............or at least the way according to business and unions. For those of you who read this that suggest that GW Bush; or any other president for that matter, is on the oil take........or anything else, if you actually believe this, what are the odds your union leaders are not too since the international is not even elected, but rather dictators who can NOT be voted out, lololol. P.S. I am not laughing because I think it is funny, rather because if I didn't laugh, I would probably cry! The government is the only other f-cked up parallel bureaucracy to the UAW that I can think of. Our delegates are suppose to be able to vote on the international reps at the conventions, but when I asked about voting the delegates said that the outcome is already arranged! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Bennet Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 Is anyone else concerned with these guys supposedly "safeguarding" our rights and our futures (e.g. pensions)? After all, it's not like they are going to be affected to the extent that we will. They have their own contract and secondary pension protection so they will not be hit as hard as we will. I am curious to see what they bring to us and I'd like to see a breakdown of how they've cut costs in the pork at Solidarity House. What percentage of "representatives" did they get rid of in proportion to the manpower cut loose at the plant level? Boy, if their jobs were dependent on keeping plants open you'd see some work getting done then! Just some thoughts... want to know what's coming? UAW to manage healthcare benefits for members Lazard retained by UAW Investment bank will assess retiree and health-care costs at Chrysler http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?A...0335/-1/ARCHIVE first it will be the retirees, then the working does this make you warm and fuzzy or sick and woozy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 want to know what's coming? UAW to manage healthcare benefits for members Lazard retained by UAW Investment bank will assess retiree and health-care costs at Chrysler http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?A...0335/-1/ARCHIVE first it will be the retirees, then the working does this make you warm and fuzzy or sick and woozy? I'll vote against that because there is noway that any gains on this money through investment, will offset health care inflation! If you guys allow this you will be screwing your brothers, and when you retire the d-ck you feel will be you own! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spring Posted August 6, 2007 Author Share Posted August 6, 2007 The government is the only other f-cked up parallel bureaucracy to the UAW that I can think of. Our delegates are suppose to be able to vote on the international reps at the conventions, but when I asked about voting the delegates said that the outcome is already arranged! I tried to get the message out well in advance of the Constitutional Convention so that individual locals could put in their resolutions to have the referendum vote. If enough delegates got together at the Convention, believe me, we could get it out on the floor. But it must not be that important to people if the sorry delegates that have been sent are any indication. It's an undertaking that will not be easily accomplished but it is possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 I tried to get the message out well in advance of the Constitutional Convention so that individual locals could put in their resolutions to have the referendum vote. If enough delegates got together at the Convention, believe me, we could get it out on the floor. But it must not be that important to people if the sorry delegates that have been sent are any indication. It's an undertaking that will not be easily accomplished but it is possible. They also need a regular term like the government, but to make that happen would also take the same collective effort! That's why I refuse to vote for who is popular, but rather the guy I think will get the job done! That's like with the COA's when people opposed them then it's supporters made them feel as if they where going against the grain. I am the grain, and Vote How I feel popular or not! I'll be damned if I'm going to let some kiss c-ck management or representative hopeful vote for me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spring Posted August 6, 2007 Author Share Posted August 6, 2007 They also need a regular term like the government, but to make that happen would also take the same collective effort! That's why I refuse to vote for who is popular, but rather the guy I think will get the job done! That's like with the COA's when people opposed them then it's supporters made them feel as if they where going against the grain. I am the grain, and Vote How I feel popular or not! I'll be damned if I'm going to let some kiss c-ck management or representative hopeful vote for me! Would that majority thought like you. But what are you going to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamCaan Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 Maybe, that is why it was set up this way, but any UAW member who complains about the exhorbant amounts of money the CEOS and managers on down make, are making ridiculous statements until they CLEAN their own house of excess in the UAW. A deal will be cut, someone (s) will get screwed deeply, but it won't be CEOs, or the international UAW. This is the way of the world............or at least the way according to business and unions. Ford Management is out right stupid no wonder this company has become a big loser. Norfolk Assembly Plant has shut down but Ford Management continues to pay the Union Chairman (a thug), the Union President (an incompetent), the Union Safety Representatives, the Union Health Benefits rep and others. Why? This company will go bankrupt then no one (except UAW reps) will get nothing especially the retirees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 (edited) Would that majority thought like you. But what are you going to do? I have to read the proposal myself and decide for myself how to vote and encourage everyone to do the same! No one else but you knows whats right for you and all considered! Only you can make that determination. They will threaten your job, and tell you it will pass anyway. Just don't let what others say affect your decision. I'm sure the day before the vote they will say if it doesn't pass we will all be out of a job! Just stay focused on the proposal you read and vote what you feel! Don't let some one tell you how to vote! Edited August 6, 2007 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spring Posted August 6, 2007 Author Share Posted August 6, 2007 I have to read the proposal myself and decide for myself how to vote and encourage everyone to do the same! No one else but you knows whats right for you and all considered! Only you can make that determination. They will threaten your job, and tell you it will pass anyway. Just don't let what others say affect your decision. I'm sure the day before the vote they will say if it doesn't pass we will all be out of a job! Just stay focussed on the proposal you read and vote what you feel! Don't let some one tell you how to vote! Furious1Auto, it's obvious that you don't know me very well. If you did, you would know that no one tells me how to think or how to vote (in spite of what some people might think to the contrary). I too like to read things for myself. I like to see the language as it is written. It's all well and good after the fact for people to come up and say you were correct about something and then they ask you to help fix it. How do you get people to listen to you BEFORE the wrong decision is made and disaster befalls everyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 Furious1Auto, it's obvious that you don't know me very well. If you did, you would know that no one tells me how to think or how to vote (in spite of what some people might think to the contrary). I too like to read things for myself. I like to see the language as it is written. It's all well and good after the fact for people to come up and say you were correct about something and then they ask you to help fix it. How do you get people to listen to you BEFORE the wrong decision is made and disaster befalls everyone? All I can do is encourage others to think for themselves. My future just as yours lies in the hands of the majority! I'm afraid that I'm in the minority but it still won't change my vote! I keep telling everyone that I hear talking about the new purposel the same as I just did you. "Hey guys, don't let anyone tell you how to vote". We all have our own financial circumstances, but I don't plan on going down without my ship! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattack Posted August 6, 2007 Share Posted August 6, 2007 All I can do is encourage others to think for themselves. My future just as yours lies in the hands of the majority! I'm afraid that I'm in the minority but it still won't change my vote! I keep telling everyone that I hear talking about the new purposel the same as I just did you. "Hey guys, don't let anyone tell you how to vote". We all have our own financial circumstances, but I don't plan on going down without my ship! furious you are right.......one can only hope most will do the same and think and do what is right. if when the contract is explained and the questions you have aren't answered and someone says you HAVE to pass this contract tell them to keep walking and THINK what is best for you and all. not everything will be perfect in the new contract but you alone got to decide for yourself and be able to live with that decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imawhosure Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 All I can do is encourage others to think for themselves. My future just as yours lies in the hands of the majority! I'm afraid that I'm in the minority but it still won't change my vote! I keep telling everyone that I hear talking about the new purposel the same as I just did you. "Hey guys, don't let anyone tell you how to vote". We all have our own financial circumstances, but I don't plan on going down without my ship! Furious, Let me interject please. Your theory of being controlled by the majority is wrong. You rather, are being controlled by THOSE IN POWER. Truth be known, they ARE THE MINORITY. From Washington on down to the State Congress.....not to mention the lowly unions, it is not what you stand for, what you are willing to accept, what you won't vote for, or for that matter.......what you will; rather it is about if YOU CAN GET ELECTED!!!!!! My suggestion--------------->with the fire you breathe, the desire you have, the logic you possess, maybe you should try to get elected. Spring did and WON!!!!!! If elected------------->always remember where you came from, why you wanted to be there, and where you could be forced to return to if you lose your way. It is called CHARACTER!!!!!!! Something that those on high lose as they feel their power grow, and their adversarys curry their favor to isolate you from those that have elected you, and given/granted you the power that is enjoyed. I can NOT say it more forcefully. Everything is for sale, even your character for the right price. Some for cheap, some for not so cheap, some for so much, the adversaries are not willing to pay the price for your conversion. I am hoping that you run, you win, and you are one of those that the price is to high for them to buy you. If so, there is not to many of you that the price is to high, but Spring is one of them. May I suggest that if you decide to try your hand, you stay in touch with her, take her counsel, and good luck to both of you, and may you two be the start or continuance of change in this neandrethal, old boy, organization!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spring Posted August 7, 2007 Author Share Posted August 7, 2007 Furious, Let me interject please. Your theory of being controlled by the majority is wrong. You rather, are being controlled by THOSE IN POWER. Truth be known, they ARE THE MINORITY. From Washington on down to the State Congress.....not to mention the lowly unions, it is not what you stand for, what you are willing to accept, what you won't vote for, or for that matter.......what you will; rather it is about if YOU CAN GET ELECTED!!!!!! My suggestion--------------->with the fire you breathe, the desire you have, the logic you possess, maybe you should try to get elected. Spring did and WON!!!!!! If elected------------->always remember where you came from, why you wanted to be there, and where you could be forced to return to if you lose your way. It is called CHARACTER!!!!!!! Something that those on high lose as they feel their power grow, and their adversarys curry their favor to isolate you from those that have elected you, and given/granted you the power that is enjoyed. I can NOT say it more forcefully. Everything is for sale, even your character for the right price. Some for cheap, some for not so cheap, some for so much, the adversaries are not willing to pay the price for your conversion. I am hoping that you run, you win, and you are one of those that the price is to high for them to buy you. If so, there is not to many of you that the price is to high, but Spring is one of them. May I suggest that if you decide to try your hand, you stay in touch with her, take her counsel, and good luck to both of you, and may you two be the start or continuance of change in this neandrethal, old boy, organization!!!!!! Imawhosure, thanks for the kind words. I do what I can. I do need to correct you on one thing, though. I didn't win in the Constitutional Convention. Came in close but not quite there. It did, however, give me the reassurance that the membership does want innovative leadership and people who are interested in representing the people on the floor. I will be running for District Committeeperson in the General Election next spring. Again, thank you for your confidence in me and rest assured that I will continue my efforts to bring the referendum vote to fruition. There are quite a few people that are committed to this venture, in fact, I think the International would be rather surprised by the numbers. Hopefully by the time the next Convention rolls around we will have everything in place to make that difference. As for Furious1Auto, anything I can do to help just ask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 (edited) Imawhosure, thanks for the kind words. I do what I can. I do need to correct you on one thing, though. I didn't win in the Constitutional Convention. Came in close but not quite there. It did, however, give me the reassurance that the membership does want innovative leadership and people who are interested in representing the people on the floor. I will be running for District Committeeperson in the General Election next spring. Again, thank you for your confidence in me and rest assured that I will continue my efforts to bring the referendum vote to fruition. There are quite a few people that are committed to this venture, in fact, I think the International would be rather surprised by the numbers. Hopefully by the time the next Convention rolls around we will have everything in place to make that difference. As for Furious1Auto, anything I can do to help just ask. I met you once breifly, For now this forum is the best place for me to carry on. It's the one place that people can't easily disregard what I'm saying without affording me the oppertunity to expose their ignorance, and put it on display! At some point I will reveal myself wearing T'shirts baring my username. Imawhosure, you have my respect. Although what I meant by being at the mercy of the majority, was pertaining to the outcome of the contract vote! Edited August 8, 2007 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longball Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 I met you once breifly, For now this forum is the best place for me to carry on. It's the one place that people can't easily disregard what I'm saying without affording me the oppertunity to expose their ignorance, and put it on display! At some point I will reveal myself wearing T'shirts baring my username. To do so at this time could cost me because, I make many controversial statements on this forum! I'm sure that even the management would like to know who I am. Imawhosure, you have my respect. Although what I meant by being at the mercy of the majority, was pertaining to the outcome of the contract vote! You sound as egotistical as the ego-maniacs that run our union now....WHY do you think that management gives a darn what you write? You seem to express yourself on every topic ...even at plants that you don't know anything about. You've written things that make me disregard your comments as idle chatter...I think you just like to hear your keyboard go tap tap tap.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy G Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 You sound as egotistical as the ego-maniacs that run our union now....WHY do you think that management gives a darn what you write? You seem to express yourself on every topic ...even at plants that you don't know anything about. You've written things that make me disregard your comments as idle chatter...I think you just like to hear your keyboard go tap tap tap.... Longball! How are you doing over there? Long time between post.................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 (edited) You sound as egotistical as the ego-maniacs that run our union now....WHY do you think that management gives a darn what you write? You seem to express yourself on every topic ...even at plants that you don't know anything about. You've written things that make me disregard your comments as idle chatter...I think you just like to hear your keyboard go tap tap tap.... Thanks for the insult, although I have made enough allies on this forum to disregard your post without feeling slighted! I'm just curious why you said I come off egotistical, I'm really quite humble! Edited August 8, 2007 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmccap Posted August 7, 2007 Share Posted August 7, 2007 Thanks for the insult, although I have made enough allies on this forum to disregard you post without feeling slighted! I'm just curious why you said I come off egotistical, I'm really quite humble! From what you say"It's the one place that people can't easily disregard what I'm saying without affording me the oppertunity to expose their ignorance, and put it on display!". I've seen alot of your ignorance on display without ever getting a response of any kind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted August 8, 2007 Share Posted August 8, 2007 (edited) From what you say"It's the one place that people can't easily disregard what I'm saying without affording me the oppertunity to expose their ignorance, and put it on display!".I've seen alot of your ignorance on display without ever getting a response of any kind. I geuss that may seem like an arrogant statement, but that was not my intent. I meant that if I make a statement and am insulted for it, on this forum I can reply in my defense. Where as in person people try to change the subject to cover their ass. You got some nerve. Lets see you believe America attacked itself. You believe that we should do nothing about health care inflation. You also suggest that others should not pay their income tax while failing to have the balls to quit yourself. Shall I continue? Don't think that just because I made a statement that made me sound arrogant, and another user called me on it. That it will provide you an opportunity to embarrass me. In a battle of whits you are unarmed! You attacking me is the equivalent of shooting a BB gun at a tank! We make better allies then adversaries! What is you motivation to do so anyway? Edited August 8, 2007 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmccap Posted August 8, 2007 Share Posted August 8, 2007 I geuss that may seem like an arrogant statement, but that was not my intent. I meant that if I make a statement and am insulted for it, on this forum I can reply in my defense. Where as in person people try to change the subject to cover their ass. You got some nerve. Lets see you believe America attacked itself. You believe that we should do nothing about health care inflation. You also suggest that others should not pay their income tax while failing to have the balls to quit yourself. Shall I continue? Don't think that just because I made a statement that made me sound arrogant, and another user called me on it. That it will provide you an opportunity to embarrass me. In a battle of whits you are unarmed! You attacking me is the equivalent of shooting a BB gun at a tank! We make better allies then adversaries! What is you motivation to do so anyway? First I never said America attacked itself, that is how you spun it in your head. Second I never said we should do nothing about healthcare, you could not figure out what I was saying after countless times explaining it to you. I gave you an easy answer and your predetermined ideas about government intervention into our lives shadowed the light from you. Lastly I never told anyone to not pay taxes, I simply showed the evidence to the scam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longball Posted August 8, 2007 Share Posted August 8, 2007 Thanks for the insult, although I have made enough allies on this forum to disregard your post without feeling slighted! I'm just curious why you said I come off egotistical, I'm really quite humble! The ego comment comes from the fact that you think the company cares what you write...."At some point I will reveal myself wearing T'shirts baring my username. To do so at this time could cost me because, I make many controversial statements on this forum! I'm sure that even the management would like to know who I am." Now excuse me...I have other things to do Hi Jimmy G....hows retirement treating you...I'm sure you miss the warm enviroment of the shop right about now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy G Posted August 8, 2007 Share Posted August 8, 2007 The ego comment comes from the fact that you think the company cares what you write...."At some point I will reveal myself wearing T'shirts baring my username. To do so at this time could cost me because, I make many controversial statements on this forum! I'm sure that even the management would like to know who I am." Now excuse me...I have other things to do Hi Jimmy G....hows retirement treating you...I'm sure you miss the warm environment of the shop right about now. It's all good. I sure don't miss the heat! Heard you guys are going big time with all the new PMEA's over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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