Fatso Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) Ford Motor pays around $7,000 a year per employee for medical insurance?Under the AHCA companies with 50 or more employees can either offer health insurance or pay a $2,000 per employee fine.Dont take much of a 'bean counter' to figure out how to save the company money.I wonder whats hidden in those thousands of pages in the way of new taxes.Wonder how many large international corporations like McDonalds and Wal-Mart will get an exemption for their hundreds of thousands of employees.I wonder what heathcare will look like 5 years from now.What is your opinion? Edited June 28, 2012 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Ford Motor pays around $7,000 a year per employee for medical insurance?Under the AHCA companies with 50 or more employees can either offer health insurance or pay a $2,000 per employee fine.Dont take much of a 'bean counter' to figure out how to save the company money.I wonder whats hidden in those thousands of pages in the way of new taxes.Wonder how many large international corporations like McDonalds and Wal-Mart will get an exemption for their hundreds of thousands of employees.I wonder what heathcare will look like 5 years from now.What is your opinion? Won't affect you at all, the health care you have from Ford is a negotiated benefit. As long as health care is part of the collective bargaining agreement you'll be fine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark270 Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Ford Motor pays around $7,000 a year per employee for medical insurance?Under the AHCA companies with 50 or more employees can either offer health insurance or pay a $2,000 per employee fine.Dont take much of a 'bean counter' to figure out how to save the company money.I wonder whats hidden in those thousands of pages in the way of new taxes.Wonder how many large international corporations like McDonalds and Wal-Mart will get an exemption for their hundreds of thousands of employees.I wonder what heathcare will look like 5 years from now.What is your opinion? (sigh) more fear and propaganda, awesome republican weapons! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X NAP MILLWRIGHT Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Facts and simple math. An inconvenient truth. If this stands kiss Cadillac, I mean Lincoln, health insurance goodbye. Prepare for the doctors office to mirror the DMV. The race to the bottom continues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Health Care will be forever changed.I know several middle aged people who currently have no insurance and ACA will definetly help them and that is good and moral.I also am realistic enough to understand that quality health care costs money,lots of it.I am not sure what is buried in the details of a 2000 page document.What about illegal immigrants?Last I heard they are covered too same as everybody else.I think our taxes are going to go up and the overall quality of health care will go down and 'bet me' Ford will hand us all over to the public option,ever seen the contract re-opened?Its gonna happen regardless of any of our opinions and by the way Dark 271,I am not a Republican and it was a Supreme Court Justice appointed by President Bush-R who was the deciding vote in favor.Something needed to be done I just dont think that 2000 plus pages of ??? is necessary.Also this sets a bad precedent as far as taxing and penalizing people`s behavior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 The law is not tight enough. Wal-Mart Corp is restricting they're employ to less then 50 people per location, and utilizing temp services for labor. They no longer hire directly for the purpose of doding the law. Temp services need to be outlawed. They exist to circumvent labor law, and now to dodge the medical law. BS They are the target that we who support the medical reform want to see pay in.They have the money to pay because they have sold out the American worker. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longball Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 I believe healthcare should be a priority in the US....National defense and health should be our priorities...If you don't have your health...nothing else matters...that said, I believe we should all have identical health benefits, and they should be paid for with a NEW tax on our pay stubs....just like SS...if costs go up...so does the tax....everybody pays and everybody has the same medical insurance 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 That is a good point Furious.I also hear that McDonalds is getting an initial waiver.Wal-Mart and McDonalds are very wealthy large corporations why do they deserve a waiver?If millions of poor people are going to be eligible for the new Medicaid program , illegal immigrants also,and they are kicking in $95 a year and treatment for cancer and AIDS etc. costs a hundred thousand dollars taxes are going to have to be raised.As far as illegal immigrants do you know how many, millions upon millions of people from all over the planet want to come to the USA!There are only so many resources in any society.I know the IUAW is in favor of a single payer system.That combined with the tremendous cost savings benefit to Fords bottom line and I could understand both the IUAW and the company turning us over to the public system and I am not fear mongering.I dont know what that will be like.Maybe its the same thing as a good HMO nowadays.Well,my opinion aside the ACA law is a godsend to many people with pre-existing conditions and who currently have no insurance.Guess time will tell how good the health care system will handle it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) Hi Longball thanks for your opinion.I like the general idea myself but in reality would that be feasible?I would say add this to your idea;people who use health care and who do not pay a certain amount of taxes into the system shall be required to perform community service.This way we are all contributing something towards the good of society and not continually taking from the system or in reality someones elses wages.Also I do not think that illegal immigrants-from any country-should be eligible, at least for the same health care, as any USA citizens.Any society only has so many resources.Set up free clinics with medical students for illegal immigrants and cap their dollar amount for the care they receive.They dont like it?Fine,then go back to your home country and get treatment.I just dont like the looks of this.Health Care definetly needed reform but things could get out of hand and this could become the largest entitlement program with ever increasing taxes,on the planet.Wonder how many m-i-l-l-i-o-n-s of human beings would love to come to the USA?The birth rate is not stagnant!USA has 'the richest poor people' in the world.One last point Longball,in the USA,all people will never,never,never have the 'same' health insurance.USA is a class society no matter how nice the politicians smile at the working-class.In other words,you or I blow out a knee and LeBron James blows out a knee, we aint all getting the same treatment.You get cancer,I get cancer,Oprah Winfrey gets cancer,we aint all getting the same treatment. Edited June 29, 2012 by Fatso 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 That is a good point Furious.I also hear that McDonalds is getting an initial waiver.Wal-Mart and McDonalds are very wealthy large corporations why do they deserve a waiver?If millions of poor people are going to be eligible for the new Medicaid program , illegal immigrants also,and they are kicking in $95 a year and treatment for cancer and AIDS etc. costs a hundred thousand dollars taxes are going to have to be raised.As far as illegal immigrants do you know how many, millions upon millions of people from all over the planet want to come to the USA!There are only so many resources in any society.I know the IUAW is in favor of a single payer system.That combined with the tremendous cost savings benefit to Fords bottom line and I could understand both the IUAW and the company turning us over to the public system and I am not fear mongering.I dont know what that will be like.Maybe its the same thing as a good HMO nowadays.Well,my opinion aside the ACA law is a godsend to many people with pre-existing conditions and who currently have no insurance.Guess time will tell how good the health care system will handle it. Their is no public option in this law for Ford to turn your health care over to. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgix Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 clownfish 8:35 AM on 6/29/2012 This comment is hidden because you have chosen to ignore clownfish . Show DetailsHide Details This comment is hidden because you have submitted an abuse report against it. Show DetailsHide Details So much misinformation floating around. If the bill is too complex for you to read, maybe you are not smart enough to comment on it. The info is out there if the bill is to complex for you. Use a website that is not a schill for the TP or the GOP to seek out the truth, it's not that hard. The mandate was a republican idea, until passed by a Black democrat. The law was partly based on Romneys plan in Mass, which appears to be WORKING. Illegal aliens will not be allowed to use the Exchanges, nor have access to insurance they do not already have access to. If you cannot afford the tax penalty, you will be exempt. You will not be required to change doctors, unless your insurance company has different "networks", same policy as are in existence now. There are no "death panels". The government will not be getting between you and your doctor (unless you need an abortion, then the GOP will be there with you passing judgment) The law requires PRIVATE insurance, not government health care. No new government hospitals are being built to supply "Obamacare". Unless you are a vet and access the VA you will not be seeing "government doctors". You will see the same physicians as you saw last year. Small businesses willhave access to tax credits to help them supply insurance to their employees . (stop by Downtown Home and Garden, speak to the owner about how it works for him. He HIRED BECAUSE of the new law) there will be no more rationing than currently exists, maybe less. Insurance companies will not be able to ration via dropping you just as you are diagnosed with illness. The "donut hole" created when GWB passed the unfunded Medicare Part "D" (aka as "socialized" prescription coverage) will be closed. Illegal immigrants will not be eligible for Exchanges OR Medicaid. Is this a perfect law? By no means. But, it is better than the alternative offered, which was ...tax cuts. Now we can work on modifying the new l 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) Hi redgix .Be cool okay?Dont try to label a person or shame a person,I am asking for opinions.You make it sound 'not so bad'.Concerning 'illegal immigrants' it is not so clear as what you {or Clownfish} say.There are many exceptions.First start with substituting the term resident alien for illegal immigrant.The idea of quality health care costing $$$$$ and new people coming into the system using health care some of whom are paying only $95 a year is a funding issue.Both major political parties usually raise taxes on the working-class to pay for new programs.Cadillac health care plans are defined as a policy which an employer pays $8,000 for an individual or $21,000 for a family and are subject to new taxes.I ask you this,are the current health benefits hourly employees receive through Ford Motor considered Cadillac health Plans?It it all so confusing,like Obama saying that he would never raise taxes on anyone making less than $250,000 a year and then his, historical trademark legislation, passes the Supreme Court when a supposedly conservative Justice calls the mandate to purchase health insurance a tax.This is history in the making!!!!!!!! Edited June 29, 2012 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Ford Motor pays around $7,000 a year per employee for medical insurance?Under the AHCA companies with 50 or more employees can either offer health insurance or pay a $2,000 per employee fine.Dont take much of a 'bean counter' to figure out how to save the company money.I wonder whats hidden in those thousands of pages in the way of new taxes.Wonder how many large international corporations like McDonalds and Wal-Mart will get an exemption for their hundreds of thousands of employees.I wonder what heathcare will look like 5 years from now.What is your opinion? A. This is not the correct forum. B. I'd prefer the additional cash from Ford and I'll go and get my own health insurance. Health insurance should not be tied to employment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niteeyes Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) A. This is not the correct forum. B. I'd prefer the additional cash from Ford and I'll go and get my own health insurance. Health insurance should not be tied to employment. LOL, What a fool you are, If ford had the intention of giving you cash, ( enough to cover a policy ) Why would they not just pay for the policy, Simple answer to that, What ever they offer cash wise won't cover half what your policy will cost. Democrats are so stupid. Edited June 29, 2012 by niteeyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glow Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 clownfish 8:35 AM on 6/29/2012 This comment is hidden because you have chosen to ignore clownfish . Show DetailsHide Details This comment is hidden because you have submitted an abuse report against it. Show DetailsHide Details So much misinformation floating around. If the bill is too complex for you to read, maybe you are not smart enough to comment on it. The info is out there if the bill is to complex for you. Use a website that is not a schill for the TP or the GOP to seek out the truth, it's not that hard. The mandate was a republican idea, until passed by a Black democrat. The law was partly based on Romneys plan in Mass, which appears to be WORKING. Illegal aliens will not be allowed to use the Exchanges, nor have access to insurance they do not already have access to. If you cannot afford the tax penalty, you will be exempt. You will not be required to change doctors, unless your insurance company has different "networks", same policy as are in existence now. There are no "death panels". The government will not be getting between you and your doctor (unless you need an abortion, then the GOP will be there with you passing judgment) The law requires PRIVATE insurance, not government health care. No new government hospitals are being built to supply "Obamacare". Unless you are a vet and access the VA you will not be seeing "government doctors". You will see the same physicians as you saw last year. Small businesses willhave access to tax credits to help them supply insurance to their employees . (stop by Downtown Home and Garden, speak to the owner about how it works for him. He HIRED BECAUSE of the new law) there will be no more rationing than currently exists, maybe less. Insurance companies will not be able to ration via dropping you just as you are diagnosed with illness. The "donut hole" created when GWB passed the unfunded Medicare Part "D" (aka as "socialized" prescription coverage) will be closed. Illegal immigrants will not be eligible for Exchanges OR Medicaid. Is this a perfect law? By no means. But, it is better than the alternative offered, which was ...tax cuts. Now we can work on modifying the new l Redgix......I know him very well, and yes, he has hired! And you are right again, this was "originally" a repub. idea, but think back to prez Bill Clinton who made a post campaign "promise" unviversal health care for all in the US, but he just never got around to it. (Wonder why)? At some point the health care situation had to be dealt with no matter which party the current or future president represented. We are within months of our next prez. election the repubs and dems are at each others throat, now they have dragged in the supposedly peace maker the supreme court and all the while gas prices are at a low of $3.38 p/g. I do agree that an influx of people will start arriving in the US because of this decision. Now watch out for a escalated debate concerning immigration. I will say that the healthcare issue (like it or not) will be a major deciding factor on election day. These are just my $.02. Stay Safe and enjoy the holidays! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 (edited) Hi Marginal Economist.Can I get a break?I am wondering how this historical law that was passed might affect mine and yours {if you are Ford Hourly} health care,retiree`s health care,future wages and taxes.So yes it is job related.You say you want Ford to just give you the money and then you will go buy your own health care and that method of delivery is also job related.I can see Ford and the IUAW getting together at some point and saying this;go on the public option for no charge or stick with Blue Cross or HAP for example and pay something.Just wondering if the combined cost that Ford pays for our current medical and dental exceeds $8,000 for an individual or $21,000 for a family because then it might be labeled a "Cadillac Health Plan" subjected to new taxes.The law passed. The Democratic Party won with the help of a "conservative",Supreme Court justice who was appointed by a Republican President.There are some opinions far more influential than mine but I pay taxes so I get one too and so do my fellow workers. Edited June 30, 2012 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 LOL, What a fool you are, If ford had the intention of giving you cash, ( enough to cover a policy ) Why would they not just pay for the policy, Simple answer to that, What ever they offer cash wise won't cover half what your policy will cost. Democrats are so stupid. Right now, Ford provides me with a policy that covers me and my family that is much more than we actualy need. I have a choice of 3 plans and choose the one that best fits my needs. If Ford offered a 4th option that was an annual lump sum of money, I'd then consider options that were offered in an exchange. I'd prefer a high deductible plan that offered catastrophic coverage. I'd then pay cash for preventitive and small visits, which are negotiable and much cheaper to cash buyers. Health costs will only go down if Americans have some skin in the game. As long as I have a $20 co-pay, I'll go to the doctor everytime I have a headache, a hangnail, or anything else. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Hi Marginal Economist.Can I get a break?I am wondering how this historical law that was passed might affect mine and yours {if you are Ford Hourly} health care,retiree`s health care,future wages and taxes.So yes it is job related.You say you want Ford to just give you the money and then you will go buy your own health care and that method of delivery is also job related.I can see Ford and the IUAW getting together at some point and saying this;go on the public option for no charge or stick with Blue Cross or HAP for example and pay something.Just wondering if the combined cost that Ford pays for our current medical and dental exceeds $8,000 for an individual or $21,000 for a family because then it might be labeled a "Cadillac Health Plan" subjected to new taxes.The law passed. The Democratic Party won with the help of a "conservative",Supreme Court justice who was appointed by a Republican President.There are some opinions far more influential than mine but I pay taxes so I get one too and so do my fellow workers. In the first post you asked about McDonalds and Walmart and what health care looks like 5 years from now. You didn't ask about Cadillac health care plans and where Fords options would rank. If you want to talk about the democratic party, the SCOTUS, and your taxes, this is not the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmccap Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Right now, Ford provides me with a policy that covers me and my family that is much more than we actualy need. I have a choice of 3 plans and choose the one that best fits my needs. If Ford offered a 4th option that was an annual lump sum of money, I'd then consider options that were offered in an exchange. I'd prefer a high deductible plan that offered catastrophic coverage. I'd then pay cash for preventitive and small visits, which are negotiable and much cheaper to cash buyers. Health costs will only go down if Americans have some skin in the game. As long as I have a $20 co-pay, I'll go to the doctor everytime I have a headache, a hangnail, or anything else. Would that be like a free market? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 (edited) Marginal economist you need to lighten up or complain to the Administrator.The way health care is going to be delivered in the USA as of right now is going to be fundamentally changed.My benefits and payroll deducted taxes do affect my job!$20 co-pay?Millions of people are going to be added to Medicaid and will have zero co-pay!If you dont have anything to add,,,,,,,,find another topic.Have a nice life! Edited June 30, 2012 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Okay - carry on. The sky is falling and your situation as a Ford employee will be dramatically different that the other 350 miliion Americans. I wish there was a section where I could read about politics and other opinions about health care reform. http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index.php?/topic/50115-individual-mandate-constitutional/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Economist Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 There are plenty of ways you caould have made this topic Ford related. If you want to discuss the UAW and how future negotiations will change based on possible health care changes, that would be great. If you need to discuss the value of your health care today and going forward, and if there will be a waiver to avoid paying a "Cadillac" tax, that would be appropriate. You did not go that path and you got called out. Nothing personal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gatorman925 Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 (edited) I like my insurance I have now. We need to vote REPUBLICAN and get that socialist OBAMA out ASAP!!!!!!! You think the US economy is bad now another 4 years of this socialist and we are doomed! Vote for ROMNEY or face higher taxes and lower pay. Edited July 1, 2012 by gatorman925 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted July 1, 2012 Author Share Posted July 1, 2012 (edited) Marginal Economist----you are acting like a nuerotic anal-nut and adding nothing to the topic but sarcasm and complaints.Put your complaints on a recording and sent them to an administrator. Edited July 1, 2012 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted July 1, 2012 Author Share Posted July 1, 2012 (edited) Hi gatorman925,I know this much change its kinda scary.I dont know if the IUAW and Ford will continue to offer us the health care package we have now especially if the public option is so much cheaper.Maybe the public option will be accepted by a wide range of good doctors.There are a couple positives I can think of;if you lose your job you still are covered;if you get a divorce you wont get stuck with providing your spouse healthcare;maybe we can get a raise if we go on the public option.Main question I have right now is will my taxes go up?To be sure,this legislation is a godsend to many who currently are without insurance but,but someone has got to pay.People making 20 babies and not paying taxes, entitled to the same health care as everybody?I dont believe in a free lunch.Time will tell if it is a good thing. Edited July 1, 2012 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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