Obamacare-Because this needs it's own thread

[Langston Hughes]

You may think that Bush lied about WMD's, but being wrong isn't the same thing as a willful deception. I remember many in the media lamented Bush's inability/unwillingness to admit being wrong (about WMDs, etc).

 

If Obama (or his administration) was wrong about the policies being implemented, he/they should say so, But, I have yet to hear anyone admit that. All they're saying is that people didn't hear them properly when they said they could keep their insurance.

 

People may be fairly ambivalent about politics, but they don't like being lied to and then blamed (by Obama) for not knowing the truth.

 

Bush willfuly deceived the American people about WMD's. Wake up. He lied and had invading Iraq on his agenda long before 9/11.

[Langston Hughes]

 

 

The same person that thinks Bush lied should be equally upset at a few of these people as well*.

 

*If they had an "R" next to their name they would be.

 

LOL. Should i be upset at them for believeing the lies the Bush admin and his appointees presented them?

 

Same failed logic that you've offered the entire time, but democrats believed the lies the admin told them". By the way so did you?

[chevys]

 

Bush willfuly deceived the American people about WMD's. Wake up. He lied and had invading Iraq on his agenda long before 9/11.

Maybe Bush just should have said if you like your WMD's you can keep them period.

[FiredMotorCompany]

 

Bush willfuly deceived the American people about WMD's. Wake up. He lied and had invading Iraq on his agenda long before 9/11.

Obama promised 29 times that we could keep our plan.

We have the video.

 

HE WILLFULLY, KNOWINGLY and DECEITFULLY lied when he said it. Then tries to backpedal and claim he didn't say what the video showed. So, he lied about the fact he lied. And it's a minor detail to you.

What else has he lied about that you refuse to see?

 

 

 

And it's excusable. Because the Bush administration lied.

 

Well, the Clinton administration lied prior to that, so it should be ok for Bush, and therefore Obama as well.

 

 

How's that for accepting current behavior based on other's behaviors?

 

 

Hitler murdered Jews. So, it's ok for Obama now.

 

Not that far of a stretch of the premise.

[Langston Hughes]

Obama promised 29 times that we could keep our plan.

We have the video.

 

HE WILLFULLY, KNOWINGLY and DECEITFULLY lied when he said it. Then tries to backpedal and claim he didn't say what the video showed. So, he lied about the fact he lied. And it's a minor detail to you.

What else has he lied about that you refuse to see?

 

 

 

And it's excusable. Because the Bush administration lied.

 

Well, the Clinton administration lied prior to that, so it should be ok for Bush, and therefore Obama as well.

 

 

How's that for accepting current behavior based on other's behaviors?

 

 

Hitler murdered Jews. So, it's ok for Obama now.

 

Not that far of a stretch of the premise.

 

If only you guys were so worried about lying when conservatives were getting elected.

 

He said it and it ends up being not true, or only true on a limited technicality. What would you have happen after you so gleefully accepted others who lied and even voted for their re-election?

 

Should we start remaking the image of our politicians only when it's the ones you don't like?

 

Since we are on liars, when are we attacking Rand Paul? Let me know when the he can't run for president in 2016 because he's a liar tour comes to town. How about Donald Trump who had such interesting stuff on the Obama birth certificate and then suddenly stopped talking about it.

 

Yesterday was the birthday of a great man, Pat Tillman and a huge lying cover-up for the Bush admin.

[RangerM]

 

Bush willfuly deceived the American people about WMD's. Wake up. He lied and had invading Iraq on his agenda long before 9/11.

I'm sure you have evidence to establish that Bush knew what he was saying (about Iraq) at the time was untrue, correct?

 

Otherwise, you have nothing to support your opinion.

 

On the other hand, I can cite multiple occasions where Obama made statements about a law, written on paper, the HE signed. Now he's denying he ever said what has been recorded on video multiple times.

 

As George Will said, "Someone has to tell the president it's not clever to be seen trying to be clever"

[Langston Hughes]

I'm sure you have evidence to establish that Bush knew what he was saying (about Iraq) at the time was untrue, correct?

 

Otherwise, you have nothing to support your opinion.

 

On the other hand, I can cite multiple occasions where Obama made statements about a law, written on paper, the HE signed. Now he's denying he ever said what has been recorded on video multiple times.

 

As George Will said, "Someone has to tell the president it's not clever to be seen trying to be clever"

Really. Have evidence? There's tons of it. Have you spent the last 10 years under a rock watching only Faux news? You couldn't get on the net in the mid 2000's without seeing the evidence.

 

We can start with this link. (I'm on mobile or I'd quote it)

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/01/23/bush.iraq/

 

935, from admin, 200+ from Bush and 28 about Iraq and Al Quadda.

Edited November 7, 2013 by Langston Hughes

[FiredMotorCompany]

Really. Have evidence? There's tons of it. Have you spent the last 10 years under a rock watching only Faux news? You couldn't get on the net in the mid 2000's without seeing the evidence.

 

We can start with this link. (I'm on mobile or I'd quote it)

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/01/23/bush.iraq/

 

935, from admin, 200+ from Bush and 28 about Iraq and Al Quadda.

False and Lies are not the same.

 

Shall we start counting all the "false" statements Obama has made?

 

You are obfuscating and mixing the use of "LIES" and "FALSE" information.

 

Where is the evidence, and not accusations, of Bush knowingly LYING?

[RangerM]

Really. Have evidence? There's tons of it. Have you spent the last 10 years under a rock watching only Faux news? You couldn't get on the net in the mid 2000's without seeing the evidence.

The article you cite never says that Bush knew what he was saying was based on false data. It can only say it was false. That is not deception.

 

Please LH, I'm begging you.

 

WHERE DID BUSH KNOWINGLY SPREAD FALSE INFORMATION ABOUT IRAQ? The key word here is "KNOWINGLY".

 

You have to KNOW what you're saying is false to be lying. Simply being wrong isn't enough.

[FiredMotorCompany]

The article you cite never says that Bush knew what he was saying was based on false data. It can only say it was false. That is not deception.

 

Please LH, I'm begging you.

 

WHERE DID BUSH KNOWINGLY SPREAD FALSE INFORMATION ABOUT IRAQ? The key word here is "KNOWINGLY".

 

You have to KNOW what you're saying is false to be lying. Simply being wrong isn't enough.

Whereas, the Obama Administration KNEW for years that his promises were false, and/or he didn't exert the power of the office to ensure the promises he made were upheld.

[RangerM]

Whereas, the Obama Administration KNEW for years that his promises were false, and/or he didn't exert the power of the office to ensure the promises he made were upheld.

It's reasonable to expect that Obama can't know everything about the nuances of the law that bears his name.

 

But for something so basic.....so central to the law......that you really can't make your own choices..... it is beyond belief that he would not know. Nor is it believable that someone around him wouldn't correct him so he wouldn't repeat the same misinformation so many times. It goes well beyond a "57 states" gaff.

 

The American people were deceived. For some (like LH), the ends may justify it. But I hope others not so beholden to Obama will see the deception for what it really is.

 

From what I understand, the demographics of those signing up, aren't the ones the law needed to function. But without a true penalty (like denial of services or a much more severe financial penalty), the law cannot function as intended; unless the intention was a deception, as well.

 

But for a people believing they were going to get something for nothing, perhaps deception is expected, tolerated, and even encouraged.

Edited November 8, 2013 by RangerM

[cal50]

The "57" states blunder happened when Obama was off prompter and trying to think on his own vs reading a script.

The remarks about keeping your doctor and current health insurance was NOT off script, it was prepared and repeated.

 

Obama's words are always proof read and approved & he is advised of what should be changed. Since he made the same general statement multiple times it was no accident or blunder.

Obama either knew and lied outright about it of worse he is truly inept and did not know or care and made the same statement over and over again. The idiots in congress that voted for it with never reading it are just as guilty and all of them should be fired.

 

Trying to drag a comparison of what Bush said about WMD when the full congress is on record of believing the same things and voted for the use of force is just a feeble attempt to deflect the mess Obama has created.

Clinton lied to cover for his personal bad judgement and it only costed the tax payers an investigation to out him as a liar. Obama lied to pass a law that will affect everyone ( except himself of course).

 

Obama lied and tried to deceive the public. The irony is when the numbers of enrollment come out more people have likely been given cancellation notices facing higher insurance costs than the number people that actually sign up and pay for the ACA. The biggest signups are likely medicare which is not helping drive the system.

[FiredMotorCompany]

From what I understand, the demographics of those signing up, aren't the ones the law needed to function. But without a true penalty (like denial of services or a much more severe financial penalty), the law cannot function as intended; unless the intention was a deception, as well.

 

What has been effective is it's function as a new source of TAXES, without voting for higher taxes.

 

The young or those who choose to not participate as demanded in the law, become revenue sources.

 

The assertion that you can only be forced to pay if you expect a refund, if true, could backfire if people decide to not offer the government a free loan by having excess withholding.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, the dangers of unintended consequences.

[FiredMotorCompany]

So an outright lie, repeated dozens of times, then denied despite video evidence of their existence, can be assuaged with an apology?

Despite the countless articles, reports, blogs and public outcry that his assertions were mendacious?

While a little contrition may be good for the soul, his empty promises....."And, you know, that’s something I regret. That’s something we’re gonna do everything we can to get fixed ... We’re looking at a range of options.” don't impress me as truly sincere.


“Obviously we didn’t do a good enough job in terms of how we crafted the law," Obama said in the interview Thursday.

Perhaps the proper course of action would be to start from scratch......and read the law before you pass the law.

 

Let's see him take the stand that he WILL guarantee that those assurances made to "sell" the program are fulfilled.

 

Anything less is unacceptable and further evidence that he didn't mean what he said....when he said it.
Which means, he stands by his lies.


Exclusive: Obama personally apologizes for Americans losing health coverage

Edited November 8, 2013 by FiredMotorCompany

[chevys]

 

What has been effective is it's function as a new source of TAXES, without voting for higher taxes.

 

The young or those who choose to not participate as demanded in the law, become revenue sources.

 

The assertion that you can only be forced to pay if you expect a refund, if true, could backfire if people decide to not offer the government a free loan by having excess withholding.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, the dangers of unintended consequences.

This little tidbit of information is widely known by informed voters. The same goons that wrote the Ocare must have written the IRS regulations to collect the new taxes. The IRS cannot garnish wages, file a lien on property, nor levy a bank account to collect their new taxes if the taxpayer withholds more than they owe on tax day. Simply pay your taxes and deduct the fines and screw Obama out of his part of this monstrosity. They thought this through about as much as Ocare itself. Not paying will only help speed up the death spiral.

[chevys]

So an outright lie, repeated dozens of times, then denied despite video evidence of their existence, can be assuaged with an apology?

 

Despite the countless articles, reports, blogs and public outcry that his assertions were mendacious?

 

While a little contrition may be good for the soul, his empty promises.....

 

don't impress me as truly sincere.

 

Let's see him take the stand that he demands those assurances made to "sell" the program are fulfilled. Anything less is unacceptable and further evidence that he didn't mean what he said....when he said it.

Which means, he stands by his lies.

 

 

 

Perhaps the proper course of action would be to start from scratch......and read the law before you pass the law.

 

 

Exclusive: Obama personally apologizes for Americans losing health coverage

The only thing BHO is sorry about is that he has been caught in a huge lie. Nothing is going to change and that interview was for political reasons only. The game plan will be the same as always for the administration and that is to run the clock out till something else comes up. Its just like the IRS, Benghazi, and NSA scandals.

 

What I find interesting is the dozen or so D's that are in full panic mode right now. If they showed up with changes that actually made sense to the law and ask for Republican help the R;s would be smart to tell them to pound sand. The R's should demand all sorts of things while they have them on their knees.

 

These same D's voted against the changes they are asking for now back in 2010 and voted against the R's again as recent as the shutdown a month ago. When their asses are on the line with voters its funny how they suddenly woke up isnt it? Oh the hypocrisy of the libs.

[RangerM]

Perhaps when Obama said the average American family would save $2500 per year, he was referring to the premiums they'd no longer pay because their insurance was cancelled.

[FiredMotorCompany]

Perhaps when Obama said the average American family would save $2500 per year, he was referring to the premiums they'd no longer pay because their insurance was cancelled.

 

POW!!!!!

 

Knocked it outta da park!!!!!!

[xr7g428]

What about the press that knew what Obama was saying was not true, that never called him out on it?

[grbeck]

What about the press that knew what Obama was saying was not true, that never called him out on it?

It's hard to do your job with your lips planted on someone else's posterior. This is especially true for a reporter.

[chevys]

What about the press that knew what Obama was saying was not true, that never called him out on it?

The main stream media is the other branch of goverment that the conservatives will never control.

[fmccap]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qU-1PTYj9xA#t=56

 

 

According to Judge Napolitano, President Obama's lie is the most egregious. "Richard Nixon told a lie about his personal knowledge of a third-rate break-in, burglary. Bill Clinton told a lie about a personal sexual liaison. Barack Obama has told a lie repeatedly, readily, consistently, systematically, over and over again that will affect the wealth, the health of millions of innocent Americans. The first two [...] are so insignificant compared to these lies."

Edited November 8, 2013 by fmccap

[Langston Hughes]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qU-1PTYj9xA#t=56

 

Strange the judge forgot the Bush administration lies. Really, really strange that wouldn't be talked about. He's always so unbiased and never ever acts overly pro-conservative. LOL.

[RangerM]

This......

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDoA_vTxklI

 

 

....just doesn't jive with this......

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuEWrPwlyYw

 

...period.

[Langston Hughes]

well, we got an apology for both the Iraq war and people losing their healthcare plan this year so i guess it all shakes out.

 

One in the year it happened and one 10 years later.