Interesting facts on the Mondeo

[johnnyb82]

well, 1) it doesn't look the part, 2) CD3 needs Milan volume, and 3) you could no more sell the Milan alongside the Mondeo than you could the Fusion.

 

They do it in Mexico.

[RichardJensen]

They do it in Mexico.

It's a marginal market for both models.

 

In the U.S., the Fusion and Milan are the face of Ford and Mercury.

[630land]

Next Opel Corsa to be sold in U.S

 

Saturn to import opel wagon

 

 

The asnwer to GM: "EUCD may well spawn both the 2nd gen Five Hundred as well as the 2nd gen Fusion."

 

Also, by the time the Corsa is here, the new Ford B class car will be also. But, I don't see GM dropping Korean made Aveos, the Corsa will surely have a 'Saturn' label and higher price tag on it, not Chevy. So, there goes that theory.

 

Why keep harping on something that time has passed by, like the current Mondeo? It is a declining segment over there and eventually will get dumped in favor of the EUCD, so again, case closed!

[RichardJensen]

No. The F150 is.

Whoops. Should've said "Cars".

[RichardJensen]

If you specify cars, then Mustang.

I dunno.

 

To me, the Mustang's its own brand. I'm not entirely sure, but I believe the only Ford logos on the Mustang's exterior are on the wheels.

 

Yeah, it's a Ford, but it's sort of its own Ford.

 

Next summer, you walk into a Ford dealership, and you'll have all this chrome that's the Fusion, the Fusion's Dad (Five Hundred), the Fusion, Jr. (Focus), the Fusion's fat brother (Edge), and the Fusion's weird uncle (Freestyle).

 

That's what I mean by the Fusion as the face of Ford's cars---it's going to be the vehicle that sets the tone for Ford's look. All the keys are going to start saying "Ford family of chrome grilles"

 

The Mustang's great but very little of it translates well to other cars.

[RichardJensen]

No offence, but if I walk into a Ford dealer and all the cars have that chrome face, I'm walking right back out. Chrome belongs on 2 things. Bumpers and wheels, and I hate chrome bumpers.

Which, of course, is why they've got that Mustang.

 

 

 

 

 

Oooooh.

 

 

Almost forgot.

 

You could also get a Police Interceptor with the blackout grille!

 

 

(tonight's L&O Criminal Intent had--gasp--a Grand Marquis dolled up as a cruiser, oh the horror)

[one2gamble]

Which, of course, is why they've got that Mustang.

Oooooh.

Almost forgot.

 

You could also get a Police Interceptor with the blackout grille!

(tonight's L&O Criminal Intent had--gasp--a Grand Marquis dolled up as a cruiser, oh the horror)

 

 

sorry but chrome chrome chrome chrome isnt going to fly, they do need to offer a body color option

[Roadrunner]

Next summer, you walk into a Ford dealership, and you'll have all this chrome that's the Fusion, the Fusion's Dad (Five Hundred), the Fusion, Jr. (Focus), the Fusion's fat brother (Edge), and the Fusion's weird uncle (Freestyle).

 

Brilliant!

[RichardJensen]

Brilliant!

All them chrome faces out in the sun, shining.........

 

For the first time in a decade, Ford will have a consistent look across their 4-door lineup.

 

This gives their advertising and marketing people a lot to work with.

[silvrsvt]

sorry but chrome chrome chrome chrome isnt going to fly, they do need to offer a body color option

 

 

But thats the whole point that the head of North American design wants...polarizing design, not 500 blandness

[Roadrunner]

All them chrome faces out in the sun, shining.........

 

For the first time in a decade, Ford will have a consistent look across their 4-door lineup.

 

This gives their advertising and marketing people a lot to work with.

 

I was commenting about what a funny statement you had made.

 

However, you are right that this is the first time since the 1996 fishface Taurus messed it up that Ford has had a standard look.

 

Here's the lineup in 1993 (400k file):

Edited October 4, 2006 by Roadrunner

[Biker16]

I dunno.

 

To me, the Mustang's its own brand. I'm not entirely sure, but I believe the only Ford logos on the Mustang's exterior are on the wheels.

 

Yeah, it's a Ford, but it's sort of its own Ford.

 

Next summer, you walk into a Ford dealership, and you'll have all this chrome that's the Fusion, the Fusion's Dad (Five Hundred), the Fusion, Jr. (Focus), the Fusion's fat brother (Edge), and the Fusion's weird uncle (Freestyle).

 

That's what I mean by the Fusion as the face of Ford's cars---it's going to be the vehicle that sets the tone for Ford's look. All the keys are going to start saying "Ford family of chrome grilles"

 

The Mustang's great but very little of it translates well to other cars.

this is great because the fusion's Design ain't that strong.

 

All them chrome faces out in the sun, shining.........

 

For the first time in a decade, Ford will have a consistent look across their 4-door lineup.

 

This gives their advertising and marketing people a lot to work with.

our 3 cars that we sell. plus mustang.

[Biker16]

But thats the whole point that the head of North American design wants...polarizing design, not 500 blandness

design is overrated. If al you are doningis wrapping th same basic thing that everyone else has in a slightly fancier wrapper. are you really bold.

[RichardJensen]

our 3 cars that we sell. plus mustang.

Oh come off it.

 

And Ford's CD3 underpinnings are superior to the Epsilon and the Camry, even if not as good as the Accord; while D3 bests the creaky W, and the Camry derived Avalon.

 

Design can't substitute, long term, for solid underpinnings, but pining away for the Mondeo and acting as though CD3 is at the bottom of its class, is far from a well-grounded view of the situation. Ford has sold 100k of these things retail, in the first 3 quarters of the year. They haven't done that with a midsize sedan in half a dozen years, or more.

 

----

 

And anyway, what would you have had Ford do, instead of using the Mazda6?

 

Should they have:

 

1) adopted the existing Mondeo platform for launch in 2005, knowing that the existing Mondeo platform was going to be replaced in 2007?

 

2) held off launching the Fusion until 2007, using the new Mondeo platform?

 

3) pulled ahead replacement of the Mondeo to 2005 or 2006, and moved both Fusion and Mondeo to the new Mondeo platform?

[Biker16]

Oh come off it.

 

And Ford's CD3 underpinnings are superior to the Epsilon and the Camry, even if not as good as the Accord; while D3 bests the creaky W, and the Camry derived Avalon.

 

Design can't substitute, long term, for solid underpinnings, but pining away for the Mondeo and acting as though CD3 is at the bottom of its class, is far from a well-grounded view of the situation. Ford has sold 100k of these things retail, in the first 3 quarters of the year. They haven't done that with a midsize sedan in half a dozen years, or more.

 

----

 

And anyway, what would you have had Ford do, instead of using the Mazda6?

 

Should they have:

 

1) adopted the existing Mondeo platform for launch in 2005, knowing that the existing Mondeo platform was going to be replaced in 2007?

 

2) held off launching the Fusion until 2007, using the new Mondeo platform?

 

3) pulled ahead replacement of the Mondeo to 2005 or 2006, and moved both Fusion and Mondeo to the new Mondeo platform?

 

#3 was the best option, but It takes Ford too long to make decsions, the leadership can't decide anything quickly. If we could make prompt decsions, we could of had a EUCD based Fusion spring 2006. yes 6-8 months after the CD3 fusion. I don't think ford has the people tha could have undertaken a EUCD fusion, The likely result would have been a rebadged mondeo, Mazda did alot of the work on the Fusion. plus Mazda engineers are cheaper, than Ford engineers and "Rumored" more productive.

 

Lack of leadership and direction.

 

The fusion is good, I have driven my dads many times. It isn't the best, the steering is waay too light for my tastes. NVH could be better, and would be better on a EUCD based car.

 

The advantages of the C1 Global archtechture for all FWD/AWD ford cars is as evident today as it was yesterday. don't you agree?

Edited October 5, 2006 by Biker16

[RichardJensen]

Mazda did alot of the work on the Fusion.

 

The fusion is good, I have driven my dads many times. It isn't the best, the steering is waay too light for my tastes. NVH could be better, and would be better on a EUCD based car.

 

The advantages of the C1 Global archtechture for all FWD/AWD ford cars is as evident today as it was yesterday. don't you agree?

1) So says..............?????????????

 

2) Many reviewers have noted the steering as rather heavy on the Fusion, ergo, it's unlikely that a EUCD Fusion would have heavier steering. Also, on what basis do you make the claim that NVH would be better? isolated front sub assembly is a plus, Mac struts is a minus on EUCD.

 

3) To the extent that EUCD2 can underpin a vehicle the size of the Five Hundred, and to the extent that EUCD2 can be called "the C1 Global architecture", yes.

[Biker16]

1) So says..............?????????????

 

2) Many reviewers have noted the steering as rather heavy on the Fusion, ergo, it's unlikely that a EUCD Fusion would have heavier steering. Also, on what basis do you make the claim that NVH would be better? isolated front sub assembly is a plus, Mac struts is a minus on EUCD.

 

3) To the extent that EUCD2 can underpin a vehicle the size of the Five Hundred, and to the extent that EUCD2 can be called "the C1 Global architecture", yes.

 

1) Says Wards auto.

 

2) whatever, "Mac struts is a minus on EUCD" BMW use "Mac struts " they have tons of NVH issues, Since even the lowly Focus has a" isolated front sub assembly". and it's NVH still sucks. The Steering thing is waht FoE does well, thats is why The Mazda6 fairs poorly when compared to Old mondeo, FoE is commited to making the superb handling mondeo ride, handle , and steer better than anything else. nuff said.

 

3) EUCD underpins the S80 and eventually the XC90, the 500 has nowhere else to go. there will not be a bastard archtecture for the 500. It will ride on EUCD 2 or D3. RJ is EUCD based on C1?

[RichardJensen]

1) Says Wards auto.

 

2) whatever, "Mac struts is a minus on EUCD" BMW use "Mac struts " they have tons of NVH issues, Since even the lowly Focus has a" isolated front sub assembly". and it's NVH still sucks. The Steering thing is waht FoE does well, thats is why The Mazda6 fairs poorly when compared to Old mondeo, FoE is commited to making the superb handling mondeo ride, handle , and steer better than anything else. nuff said.

 

3) EUCD underpins the S80 and eventually the XC90, the 500 has nowhere else to go. there will not be a bastard archtecture for the 500. It will ride on EUCD 2 or D3. RJ is EUCD based on C1?

1) Ah. Wards Auto, the Motor Trend of industry rags. I haven't seen any allegation of the sort, elsewhere, therefore, I'm not inclined to put too much stock in what you say was in a Wards article.

 

2) Yeah, and BMWs are great ones for the thump-thump (even if it's muted) whenever you go over the tiniest of pavement irregularities--that's the consequence of having the spring, shock, and a mounting point all in the same place. With the Focus, the largest NVH issue, as far as I'm concerned is the apparent absence of any sound damping between the passenger compartment and the engine, but then, I don't own one, and haven't driven them much either. Also, I had a Contour, so I know about FoE and steering. I also know that you can't cram heavy steering down the throats of 150k+ sedan buyers in this country, so in the absence of a sport model, ANY Ford midsize, EUCD or CD3, is going to have lighter steering than the FoE counterpart.

 

3) EUCD2 will be a pretty long way from C1--it's not as bad as saying that the Cosworth DFV was just a souped up Cortina engine, but it's headed in that direction.

Edited October 6, 2006 by RichardJensen

[630land]

"The Steering thing is waht FoE does well, thats is why The Mazda6 fairs poorly when compared to Old mondeo, "

 

That's just an effete "Euro" biased opinion. The whole "Europeans are better then us" is just pure eliteism. Just like Marie Antoinette, "let them eat cake".

 

If this idea that "Europe is so much better and more enlightened" was true, then there would have been no migration to the New World in the past 500 years.

 

Rather have a car that doesn't fall apart after 70K miles and have no $5000 engine replacements, then an "old Mondeo".

[Biker16]

1) Ah. Wards Auto, the Motor Trend of industry rags. I haven't seen any allegation of the sort, elsewhere, therefore, I'm not inclined to put too much stock in what you say was in a Wards article.

 

2) Yeah, and BMWs are great ones for the thump-thump (even if it's muted) whenever you go over the tiniest of pavement irregularities--that's the consequence of having the spring, shock, and a mounting point all in the same place. With the Focus, the largest NVH issue, as far as I'm concerned is the apparent absence of any sound damping between the passenger compartment and the engine, but then, I don't own one, and haven't driven them much either. Also, I had a Contour, so I know about FoE and steering. I also know that you can't cram heavy steering down the throats of 150k+ sedan buyers in this country, so in the absence of a sport model, ANY Ford midsize, EUCD or CD3, is going to have lighter steering than the FoE counterpart.

 

3) EUCD2 will be a pretty long way from C1--it's not as bad as saying that the Cosworth DFV was just a souped up Cortina engine, but it's headed in that direction.

 

 

1) And your point is?

 

2) you ignored the point that your statement was wrong. The focus has damned heavy steering like the euroepean one does. And thats is the reason it doesn't sell well here.

 

3) how much do you know about EUCD2? about as much as I do. nothing.

 

 

 

"The Steering thing is waht FoE does well, thats is why The Mazda6 fairs poorly when compared to Old mondeo, "

 

That's just an effete "Euro" biased opinion. The whole "Europeans are better then us" is just pure eliteism. Just like Marie Antoinette, "let them eat cake".

 

If this idea that "Europe is so much better and more enlightened" was true, then there would have been no migration to the New World in the past 500 years.

 

Rather have a car that doesn't fall apart after 70K miles and have no $5000 engine replacements, then an "old Mondeo".

LOL :cheerleader:

 

NO I am saying the europeans are better than the japanese. there is a difference.

 

what is the last all-american car Ford made? mustang is DEW thats alot of Jag.

Edited October 8, 2006 by Biker16

[silvrsvt]

what is the last all-american car Ford made? mustang is DEW thats alot of Jag.

 

The started with the DEW, but for the most part, besides the fuel tank and other bits, its an orginal design.

 

What it boils down to is that there is a lot of should ofs and could of's, but we are stuck with what we got now and at least there seems to be some indication that Ford will do those Should of's and could of's in the Future.

 

Nothing is going to change that.