Leaderboard

Perhaps the American manufacturers shouldn’t have allowed their technology transfer when they originally entered the Chinese market and partnered with Chinese companies as required by the Chinese government in order to do so. Much easier to focus on developing one aspect of a vehicle, when you don’t have to focus on developing any other aspect of it, because you stole the rest of the technology. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

Correct. As I see it, the 100 hp motor that replaces the torque converter in the 10R is probably too small to work properly in a Super Duty application which is exactly why Ford went for the motor generator set up. part of the issue with the rumoured EREV Super Duty is the too small battery and range but understandable considering that the larger the battery, the smaller the freight component of the GWR and GCWR. I really feel for fleet owners trying to do the right thing here but if they’re offered a vehicle that’s hopelessly compromised, then what are they to do? Bottom line should be improved fuel / energy efficiency, if that means a smaller more fuel efficient diesel must take the bulk of the load with supporting HEV or PHEV, then perhaps that’s a better solution for Super Duty applications. But I accept that everyone is entitled to their own opinion on this, maybe smaller engines and diesel are not the answer.

But that requires transmissions, driveshafts, differentials and axles and compromises EV packaging and performance. It’s essentially just a large PHEV.

Lots of good points in your above post, Jpd. But, the 10R modular transmission in the Ranger PHEV houses an electric motor that produces just over 100 HP which and produces gobs of torque. I was thinking of a Super Duty HEV or PHEV with the same ICE that they currently offer in the Super Duty (just like the Ranger PHEV utilizes the same 2.3 Ecoboost). That implementation would eliminate any concerns with large load up the Ike Gauntlet but also allows for some EV only driving for a Super Duty PHEV in urban/city conditions. It also would have Pro Power Onboard which customers love.

Absolutely agree, Farley is keeping Ford on safe ground with smaller battery compact/Mid Sized BEV development but remember that CE1 was developed in silence as a separate side bet, Ford could deny it project was a bust.. Again agree but for the moment, Ford has to recognise and accept the things it cannot do economically instead of blindly forging ahead hoping something changes to make its larger vehicles somehow more cost effective. The biggest fear Ford has is that its next Gen TE1 F Truck gets laughed off stage and doesn’t sell worth a lick. It may as well keep evolving Lightning with better batteries, motors and control systems, use it as the test bed until battery technology evolves to a point where it becomes more economical and a direct replacement for ICE. I think the real answer is a next Gen solid state battery with much higher energy density, smaller size and weight. Everything hinges on that more so than incremental efficiency gains and cost reductions in motors transmissions and control systems, those are important bu to a less degree than the battery. That’s a great innovation but the problem remains with actual charging stations, the quick high capacity power draw required for public charge stations will be an huge ongoing challenge for power utilities and their distribution networks. Fine to perfect the onboard power charging systems but the power supply has to be able to deliver maximum required.

Came here to say this as well, I see it's been discussed and I'm not really convinced, but I never did finish my engineering degree so... Seems to me adding the cost and complexity and relatively low tq numbers of a DOHC v8 doesn't really make sense in a generator application. Smaller displacement godzilla or even one of the smaller ecoboost v6s with big tq numbers make more sense in my head, though that would add even more complexity and fuel consumption under heavy load with a turbo is tricky. Honestly don't like these EREV things, seems like a lot of different crap to go wrong. It's a good stop gap measure, but I personally think they'll end up obsolete sooner than later as battery tech evolves. A superduty one does fit my personal use case right now though. 99% <100 miles a day towing ~10k with a couple big road trips towing several hundred miles per year.

The Coyote part doesn’t really make much sense to me, especially when they have the 6.8 available. The Coyote is a big package and it’s more complex than the baby Godzilla, plus the 6.8 is already in the Super Duties, so you wouldn’t be adding more logistical complexity. Also, the 5.0 doesn’t really come alive until it’s up in the revs, and you’d think you’d want something that’s happier at lower revs, like a big ol’ pushrod V8.

If the tax/tariff is higher than the actual cost difference then that absolutely allows the domestic company to increase prices. But with the Chinese government subsidizing R&D and other things combined with Chinese companies selling super cheap to get market share (possibly even below cost) not imposing some type of restrictions and/or tariffs would be completely suicidal.

If China gets a foothold in to America selling by super low cost BEVs made in Mexico, it won’t be game over for GL or Ford but this companies will be squeezed until they retreat to most profitable trucks and SUVs….that’s something nobody other than the Chinese wants to see.

The only way that China got that tech is because it was developed in the US. The Chinese are good at making things, not actually innovating with new tech. If that was the case they'd be actually able to build jet engine fan blades that could compete with what is done in the US or come out with CPUs that are in the sub 17nm segment that aren't kluges-they still depend on Western tech and manufacturing to do that.

Agree on the consumer front. Too many people just want the lowest price and don’t care about anything else. However, there are major issues with both Wal-Mart and Chinese companies on the business side. WalMart bullies suppliers. They almost put Vlasic out of business by selling gallon jars of pickles as a loss leader. When Vlasic complained they couldn’t keep up with demand and it was hurting their regular business WalMart threatened to stop selling all their products. They finally gave in right before the company went bankrupt. Another time 3 guys showed up to bid on tube socks. Walmart put them all in a room and told them to fight it out to be the lowest bidder. That’s why I refuse to shop there. The problem with Chinese companies is in addition to cheap labor they are hugely subsidized by the government, so nobody can compete with that head to head. Thats why Tariffs and other restrictions are needed to simply level the playing field.