bzcat

Here is the base MSRP for the whole lot of them... Jeep Renegade has an artificially low starting MSRP (with manual transmission and no AC). Otherwise, everyone is basically starting at $20k across the board. B-segment Mazda CX-3 base MSRP $19,960 - $24,990 Buick Encore base MSRP $24,065 - $30,935 Chevy Trax base MSRP $20,120 - $26,530 Fiat 500X base MSRP $20,000 - $29,000 Honda HR-V base MSRP $19,115 - $25,840 Jeep Renegade base MSRP $17,995 - $26,795 Kia Soul base MSRP $15,190 - $20,790 (note: FWD only - you can see that Kia is probably leaving money on the table here) Mini Countryman base MSRP $22,750 - $27,850 (excluding JCW version) Nissan Jule base MSRP $20,250 - $30,020 The real bargains are Jeep Compass and Patriot twins and Mitsubishi Outlander Sport... bigger and cheaper, at least as far as base MSRP is concerned (also, don't forget the massive rebate and discounts). C-segment hatchback size CUV Jeep Compass base MSRP $19,395 - $26,690 Jeep Patriot base MSRP $17,295 - $26,290 Mitsubishi Outlander Sport base MSRP $19,595 - $24,995 Subaru XV base MSRP $21,959 - $29,295 VW Tiguan base MSRP $26,255 - $39,625 You can also see how out in the left field VW is with Tiguan's ridiculous (lack of) value proposition.

Yea... all those are E-segment cars under the EU classification, which doesn't take into account the interior volume. But more to the point, Ford has said that Continental is intended to compete with those cars, and they all have LWB version in China.

If there is enough interest, Ford will just build the car in Flat Rock. In fact, I'm going to guess LWB Conti will be part of US line up. Maybe not at first but surely at some point during the model run.

Not the first, thought for sure not the last either. 1st FAW Audi A6L 2nd BAIC Mercedes ExxxL 3rd Brilliance BMW 5xxLi and 530Le 4th Chang'an Volvo S80L 5th SAIC Cadillac SLS (LWB version of the defunct STS, and was since been replaced by the XTS)

I'm curious if Ford will sell the Escort in other emerging markets like South America, India, or Turkey. Seems like that's the kind of compact car that will do well in those places in addition to the fancy Focus.

I agree... leave that name in Brazil and India. It's not that great.

V6 was retained mainly for rental fleets. But even the rental car companies are ordering mainly Ecoboost models because they don't want to get stuck with the V6 and likely horrible residual value 2 or 3 years from now.

Soul is not niche anything... it has sold over 100,000 units for several years now (145k in 2014). It's a force to be reckon with when you are talking about B-segment CUVs (since most of them are FWD like Soul). I'm guessing the next generation Soul will have AWD option. Juke is very much in the segment, although on the sporty end. Mini is the god father of the segment and they will be back with stronger push next year when the new Countryman arrives. FCA has said they expect about similar volume with 500X and Jeep Renegade twins. We'll see if that happens. For sure 500X will be the biggest seller for Fiat. The one to watch is Mazda CX-3...

MAP Focus and C-Max production were set when gas was nearly $4 a gallon, and Ford got US Energy Department grant to convert it from truck to car production. Part of the deal was to make alternate fuel version of the C-car (i.e. Focus EV and C-Max Energi). To call receiving free Govt money that also matched your business objective a "mistake" is kind of stretching it. Business environment change, and you change your production strategy with it. Moving the next Focus to Mexico may make sense... it probably does. All this arguing is kind of pointless because we don't yet know what Ford will assemble at MAP once Focus and C-Max are gone.

But a potential Ecosport with proper US market friendly execution and designs could sell a lot more... Honda sold almost 8,000 HR-V last month (and 14k in 45 days since mid May). We are on pace to see this segment boom to 300,000 units on annualized basis by September (~4,000 monthly sales from each of the volume competitors: Buick, Chevy, Jeep, Fiat, Honda, Mazda; ~2,000 monthly sales each from Nissan and Mini). When I made that prediction last year in another EcoSport thread, let's just say there were plenty of doubters. YTD sales Buick Encore 30,549 Chevy Trax 24,815 Nissan Juke 14,647 Jeep Renegade 14,431 (since April) Honda HR-V 14,141 (since Mid May) Mini Countryman/Pacman 9,116 Fiat 500X 332 (just went on sale) Mazda CX-3 (on sale mid summer) Total B-segment CUV YTD 108,031 Not counting Kia Soul (67,986), which is sort of the same thing as the others but lacks AWD option.

Stop, you are making silly contradictory arguments. $23k EcoSport will be either SE AWD with options or Titanium FWD while the $23k Escape is the base S FWD model. So how is any different than a $30k Escape Titanium vs. Edge SE? Ecosport will probably start at $19k (S FWD) and goes up to $26k (Titanium AWD) - see MSRP for Honda HR-V or Chevy Trax for comparison Escape base MSRP starts at $23,450 (S FWD) and goes up to $31,485 (Titanium AWD) Edge base MSRP starts at $28,100 (SE FWD) and goes up to $40,095 (Sport AWD) Explorer base MSRP starts at $30,700 (base FWD) and goes up to $52,600 (Platinum AWD)

Why didn't they go with the Tahoe/Suburban front end?

Escape overlaps with Edge too... Edge overlaps with Explorer. Earth revolves around the sun. The world doesn't end... $20k Ecosport is a step up vehicle for people coming out of a $17k Focus from a few years ago. Just like $25k Escape is similarly positioned vs. midsize sedan replacement buyers.

Relevant news: Nissan will introduce SWB Qashqai to complement LWB Rouge. That makes Nissan the 4th company in the US to sell both short and long version C-segment CUVs in the US. Mitsubishi Outlander Sport + Outlander Subaru VX + Forester Jeep Compass/Patriot + Cherokee Nissan Qashqai + Rouge http://www.autonews.com/article/20150713/RETAIL/307139917/nissan-will-boost-production-by-100k-units-add-two-variants BTW, Nissan is projecting 300,000 unit sales for both Rouge and Qashqai...

Encore sales is slowing because it is a 3 year old car now... it's supposed to slow. Trax sales is probably negatively impacted by Honda HR-V. EcoSport is based on the Fiesta so it's not inherently "cheap". It's just the design and execution fell short of 1st world expectation.

Ford sold 643 Fusion in Brazil in June 2015, down 33% from a year ago (so it sold about 1,000 units in June 2014). So I'm guessing Ford probably sold around 10,000 units last year. It is the best selling large sedan in that country. Focus and Ranger are made in Argentina for the Mercosur countries. Ka, Fiesta, Ecosport are made in Brazil for the Mercosur countries.

Ford lists Ecosport in India as under 4 meter (3,999mm) but the rest of the world, it is longer than 4 meters (4,245mm everywhere else). I wonder if the the India number includes the spare tire? I'm sure Ford will do exactly what you are saying next time but without playing games with the spare tire. We already seen it with the new Figo Aspire sedan, which is identical to Ka+ sedan in Brazil (4,254mm) except it has a much shorter trunk to get the overall length under 4 meter.

The bottom line is C-segment CUV market is not any different than the C-segment car market... Some people will prefer a hatchback size CUV, some people will prefer a wagon size CUV. Ford would be foolish to ignore this market trend development, especially since Ford is a major player in Europe where this segment divergence is already very far down the road. C-segment "hatchback" CUV: VW Tiguan, Opel Antara, Nissan Qashqai, Renault Kadjar, Mitsubishi ASX (Outlander Sport), Peugeot 4008, Citroen C4 Aircross, Subaru XV, Jeep Compass, Hyundai iX35 (Tucson), Kia Sportage, Skoda Yeti, Ford ???? C-segment "wagon" CUV: Chevy Capitva7, Nissan X-Trial (Rouge), Renault Koleos, Mitsubishi Outlander, Subaru Forester, Jeep Cherokee, Honda CR-V, Toyota Rav4, Ford Kuga

We are talking about a potentially new one based on C-car platform

True too... the stillborn Chrysler 100

Well, not really. A tall Focus will be a hatchback CUV. Escape is more of a wagon CUV. They are two distinct markets; but both C-segments. Neither will offer what Ford needs in the B-segment CUV market.

Correct... I don't see Fusion moving out of Hermosillo. And it makes sense to do the 2nd Escape plant in Cuautitlán for the same reason.

First, none of those vehicles are likely to be only 25-50k a year. They would all be more than 50k a year easily. Second, you do realize all those vehicles are basically just the same car with several different body styles right? Not any different than what's going on now with Focus hatchback, sedan, and tall wagon (C-Max). They will be all based on the same platform, and share similar drivetrain, and most of the interior trim.

Well, I'm sure C-Max will land in China eventually. But we won't be getting it from China anytime soon. Ford can't build enough cars in China to satisfy demand there so they are a long ways away from exporting cars from China.

Ford is probably expecting the new C3 hybrid/PHEV to be a big seller. Let say 100k worldwide? Seems achievable. Ford is selling 50k Transit Connect in the US now with a very long supply chain. If production is localized (therefore, better inventory mix) and let say Ford wins the USPS van contract, you can easily see sales reach 75k a year. Plus Canada and Mexico (I'm going to guess 15k). Now add Transit Connect pickup truck, which add 30k a year? Maybe a little more? Now we are up to 220~230k... enough to keep MAP busy.