T-dubz

I wasn’t even considering Area 51 due to how it looks in some of the pictures we have seen, but it looks great in these pics.

It’s a pretty sweet ride, but I’d be happier if they shows actual production vehicles. This is another concept with a roof and wheels you can’t order. There are other trims that ford really hasnt shown off yet, like the big bend or black diamond. Why not outfit one of those with some ford accessories that you can actually order and show them off?

It seems like all new entries in this segment have a more aggressive design or more traditional suv shape. Ford seems to be going against the grain with the escapes design, but of course it also has the bronco sport to fall back on. Ford is either a genius or made a miscalculation in what the market wants. Its too early to tell if ford chose the right path, and I don’t envy the analysts at ford who are trying to interpret all of the data, especially with the wrench named COVID that was thrown at them. I’d guess our first indication would be how drastic a refresh the escape gets in a couple years. If ford keeps it relatively the same with just minor tweaks (think fusion refresh) then they are probably happy. If it’s more extensive then they probably weren’t.

The sport is the same size as the compass. The Cherokee is larger, the renegade is smaller. The sport is a subcompact (non premium subcompact utility) per the ford website. L x W x H jeep Cherokee - 182 x 73.2 x 65.7 Jeep Compass - 173 x 73.8 x 64.6 bronco sport - 172.7 x 74.3 x 70.2 Ford Escape - 180.5 x 74.1 x 66.1 the sports taller roof should give it more cargo capacity. Looking at the specs on ford and jeeps website, it has about 5 more cubic ft of capacity than the compass.

Both the rav4 (28/35) and crv (28/34) also get better gas mileage out of their 4 cyl then ford (27/33) does with the 3 cyl (according to epa). So what benefit did switching to the 3 cyl actually provide ford? Maybe it’s cheaper for ford to produce? the choice of power trains is big for the escape. I’m a big fan of the 2.0 and I’ve heard good things about the escape hybrid too.

Yeah. 2.0 and 2.3 would have been cool as the engine options for the bronco sport too.

1.5 in the escape is 181hp/170 tq. The 2.5 in the rav4 is 203hp/184. The 1.5 in the crv is 190hp/212. it’s close to the other base engines but it’s not better. My concern with the 1.5 in the escape is that I would always be in boost so my gas mileage would suffer. The 2.0 is a nice addition though. It’s a giant power bump. I believe you can also get the 2.0 on the SEL trim.

The escape SE at my local dealer ranges in price from 19k to 26k with most being around 22-23k. SELs are 21k to 27k with most being around $25k. They have an se sport hybrid for 25k which seems like a good deal. These are pretty big drops from msrp, but seem to fall in line with what a fusion buyer might have spent. Ecosports are selling for around 16k. I don’t remember what focus’ were selling for but I’d assume it was around that price, maybe a bit lower. One thing I found odd was the lack of titanium’s. They used to stock a ton of the older model titanium’s.

Weren’t ford sedan buyers supposed to migrate to the escape with its more car like design? I don’t know if ford really thought that or not, but I know we’ve at least speculated that here. If that were the case, the escape and sport need to do really well to cover both the compact suv and sedan buyers. Explorer, ranger and Corsair are rocking it. Corsair is up for the quarter and about even YTD. Explorer and ranger are both up big for the quarter and YTD. I’d say that’s pretty impressive.

Escape is overpriced in my opinion and apparently ford thinks so too based off of the almost 4K in incentives it’s had pretty much since it came out, but I was mainly referring to the Baby jeeps. I like the idea, I don’t like the execution. I personally would have liked it if they (escape and sport) were the same size, offered the same features, and were the same price. The only difference would be different interior and exterior styling. the way it is now, I can’t get what I want with either vehicle. I’m more likely to go to another vehicle then settle for either. I think it can be fixed though. We’ve seen from the fusion render in the other thread that the escape face can look good with some tweaks. The rear and body of the escape aren’t bad. I’d guess it will be very easy for Ford to add the escapes features to the sport too. I think both offerings will be much more compelling after their refresh.

Can I get 2 captains chairs in the second row instead of a bench? ??

Sure, but expedition didn’t have an xl trim previously. I think that’s really the bigger news here, the addition of the xl trim. It allows it to undercut the Tahoe in price. I also happen to like the wheels it will get too.

What ever happened to fuel cell vehicles? Refueling is similar to a gas vehicle so there wouldn’t be range anxiety or long waits to charge. I’d be interested in that if it could be made affordable.

The extended wheelbase is called MAX and the short wheelbase is regular. That would be a ton of cargo room if it was the MAX with only 5 seats though.

https://fordauthority.com/2020/10/2021-ford-expedition-will-introduce-a-new-stx-package/ The 2021 Ford Expedition STX package adds the following features/equipment: Five-Passenger Seating Five-bar chrome grille with Magnetic Secondary Bars STX badge SYNC 3 Enhanced Voice Recognition Communications and Entertainment System -8-inch LCD Capacitive Touchscreen in Center Stack with Swipe Capability -AppLink -911 Assist -Apple CarPlay and Android Auto Compatibility Tri-Zone Electronic Automatic Temperature Control 18-inch Magnetic Metallic-Painted Cast-Aluminum wheels (same as the FX4 Off-Road Package) P275/65R18 All-Terrain (A/T) outline white letter tires the article mentions it’s only available on the regular XL trim, and will only come with seating for 5. I wasn’t aware there was an XL trim on the expedition. Is that also new for 2021? It’s a bit big for my needs but it sounds interesting. The current XLT starts at $52,810. If there is an XL or STX trim, I’d guess that would be somewhere in the mid 40’s. I feel like that opens up the expedition to a much wider market.

I thought the escape was supposed to be marketed towards women, not the sport? As for the baby jeeps, they start a lot cheaper than the sport. The compass and renegade both start at 22k. The cherokee, which is larger than the sport starts at 26k. They can all be better equipped than the sport too. Power lift gate, glass roofs, ventilated seats, and memory seats are available on the jeeps but not the sport. A fully loaded compass trail hawk is $36k and comes with all the features I listed above. The compass also has 5k in incentives right now. a fully loaded cherokee comes in at 39k. They can also be optioned with fwd and a manual if you wish. The sport does best the compass in power with its 2.0L engine and its off-road system is better, however those advantages are only on the badland trim. I’m sure there are some other advantages like the lift gate glass opening that i am forgetting. ford needs to either lower its price to be competitive with the competition or keep the price the same and add the additional features. There are options that the much cheaper escape has that aren’t even available on the sport. I like the design of the sport, but I don’t think that will over come price and lack of features. I foresee incentives in year 2. Not as much as the escape or the compass, but 2-3k isn’t out of the question.

warthog looks pretty wide

Well it wasn’t just sedans I was referring to. Edge, expedition, and flex went long times without any substantial changes.

I might be reading this the wrong way, but isn’t this what Ford already does? All their money goes into their big name products like f150 and then let other vehicles languish for years. A lot of this seemed to be about AVs too. Ford should be spending less money on that and more money on quality products.

Exactly this. I’ve seen the pictures of Tesla’s waiting in line just to use the supercharger. Then you have to wait some more while you actually charge. I’m not going to spend my time hanging out at a charging station. If I were to buy an electric vehicle, it would be with the understanding that I would charge from home and the furthest I can drive from my home is about 100 miles. That gives me enough battery life to make it back home with some to spare in case of an emergency.

Utility is going to be tough G80 Escalade/GV80/Rav4 prime F-150

And there’s more competition now with the VW id4.

If the MME was a hybrid instead of a BEV and had a lower price, it’d probably be my next vehicle.

There’s also an extra $1000 available in incentives too. You can see it on the build and price for the Mach e when you look at the summary

With the tax credit, the Mach e premium would be 39,500, which is cheaper than any bronco I’ve been looking at. What’s the resale like on electrics? Is it better to lease? Ford’s first entry in full BEV makes me a bit nervous to get the first model year.