Blue Oval Blues - trying to buy honestly

[Deanh]

Eh, I didn't think it was too off-topic. Even if it were, that's par fer the course on BON is it not? :shades:

Dean, I appreciate your insight. Especially the case of how Pat Kain ended up egging himself... really, I didn't have anything against him or the dealer personally until that came off as a flagrant, stankpile lie. I mean... I'm human. We're ALL human. So a dealer can make an honest mistake. Just own up to it!

 

And Bob's mistakes were many. He was too full of himself, put all his faith in one deal that fell though on his end, apparently kept expecting other people to give him details, and just flat-out wouldn't listen to me toward the end.

It's a shame because the dealer with "shiny new state of the art facilities" came across as a shyster.

 

And the one whose service department had done everything a customer could possibly hope for, had its sales staff shoot itself in the foot.

 

This all just goes to show that it takes 100% on all sides.

 

And honestly... I could well be in the market for a brand-new car some day. And where might I be inclined to start? Perkins Eastside Chrysler - which wouldn't be good for Ford, would it?

you should see our dealership...not impressive in the least...no shiny new facilities here oh no! but just as clothes do not make the man...well you get my drift....and unfortunately there are a lot of blowhards in this business.....just glad you finally got handled , AND in the right way!

[rmc523]

CONCLUSION

 

Now, I’m not stupid enough to have all my irons in one fire. While I was waiting for Bob to come around, I spent a lot of time (maybe too much) trolling on Autotrader. I must have looked at 500 Freestyles, all in the name of comparison and evaluation. I considered buying from places as far as Indianapolis. When I discovered that Chicago cars are about $2000-3000 cheaper on average, I considered buying from there as well.

 

But here’s one question I gotta ask: Why the hell would a dealer pay to list a car on Autotrader and then list nothing about it? There were at least 4 cars close to me that had a bare listing such as “2005 Ford Freestyle SE $19,750. You must contact Joe Blow for this price”. No info, no options, no photos, nothing. Yeah, now THERE’S a perfect use of the internet for ya.

 

Regardless, there were 4 other nearby listings I inquired about. Two of them never got back to me (yeah, what are they paying money for again). The third replied quickly but was ruled out for other reasons (no fault of theirs). The fourth was actually the first one I inquired, back when the adjustable pedals were on the “must have” list. The salesman replied to inform me that his car did not have them (it was an SEL). But he was the quickest to reply, very thankful for our inquiry, offered his help in any way and just seemed like a nice guy. His name was Bill. His dealership was in Louisville.

 

This exchange first took place shortly after Bob offered to find us a car. As I said, pedals were high on the want list at that time but as the days went on, we rethought our position. I sort of forgot about Bill in Louisville until I realized that, hey, wow, their SEL is damn near a Limited in every way except for the pedals (and heated seats and 18” wheels). And it is about $4000 less than all the others… is there a reason for that?

 

On Friday Sept 28, when we got to our hotel (after Bob once again dropped the ball) I had an email from Bill, asking if we were still interested. Very nice of him… so I replied and said that we were working on another lead, but thanks to his inquiry I would put his car on the short list, but we would no be able to look until Tuesday (I was hoping Bob would come through on Monday). Bill thanked me for that info and said he would let me know if anything developed.

 

Well, you all know what happened Monday AM.

 

So I called Bill’s dealership to speak to him. Another guy answered and said Bill was in a meeting; what car was I interested in? I told him, and he paused – “Er, huh, I thought we sold that over the weekend – no it’s still here. I’ll let him know, may he call you back?”

 

Now my first thought was “Oh, they’re going to play the “competing bidder” game and work me, forget it.” But there was enough tone of confusion in the salesman’s voice that he seemed genuinely sincere and not up to something.

 

Bill called me back an hour later. I introduced myself verbally as the guy who’d been emailing him about the Freestyle. Bill also had the mometary pause of surprise: “Someone told me it might be sold – let me verify that so you don’t come all the way here then”. Again, he sounded sincere. But it was not sold, so I told him we would be in later that evening, but probably not before 6.

 

Instead, we got there at 5. Bill was expecting us – and had the car staged in the sold lot, waiting just for our test drive. He didn’t have to do that, but he said “I didn’t want you to come here for nothing so I figured I would hide it for a day”. Nice!!

 

Bill was wonderful. Possibly even nicer than Pat Kain. He waited patiently while we fiddled with the blasted child seats, and let us drive anywhere we wanted. It took almost an hour to get the test drive done between installing the seats and trading divers and inspecting the vehicle.

 

How was the car? MUCH better than expected. It truly was a “baby Limited” in every way – fully optioned, $32K window sticker still in the glovebox - only lacking the heated memory seats, 18” wheels, adjustable second row… and cheesy fake wood trim of a true factory Limited. So yeah, who cares?

 

And I don’t know if these venerable Duratec3.0’s are just that tight in the D3s and take forever to break in, but man, this one was SMOOTH! All the others at the Ford Challenge events at KY Speedway (2004 and 2005), my in-laws’ 2006, and the others I’ve test-driven all seemed tight and noisy. But with just 40K on the clock, this one was silk. By far the best-riding and handling of the 7 Freestyles we’d driven. No joke. It was perfect. And in another happy coincidence, it just happened to be blue.

 

So WHY was it so much cheaper than the others? Carfax had it as a one-owner. NADA, Kelly, and other dealer listings had this car priced several thousands higher. Save for a few very minor paint scratches, this car seemed brand new, and was impeccably detailed. Bill explained: “We rely heavily on volume internet sales, and monitor the market. We always price ourselves well below anyone else in the area. We do quick turnaround and have only have cars for about 3 weeks. We have people like you who come from hundreds of miles away. It’s been tremendously successful for us.”

 

He drew up the bottom line in 5 minutes – NO surprises! – and left us to discuss. Everything had been perfect – he provided documentation (carfax, nada guides, the works) and we liked the car. The price really was a bargain even straight-up – nearly $4000 less than others we had seen with the same options/miles/etc. Still, nobody just buys a car straight-up unless they’re made of money, right? So we made an offer to essentially wipe out the tax, title, and license/reg fees. They accepted it within $200 on the spot.

 

Sold! :happy feet:

 

We had our paperwork stamped, filed, and approved, and had the deal done in half an hour. They gassed up the car, removed the windshield papers and we drove it home.

 

Now THAT was a perfect experience! Bill was the consummate professional – respectful of our time and situation. Knew we were coming, had the car saved and ready. No pressure whatsoever. Patiently waited and helped while we fought with the second of our two child seats. We made an offer we liked and they took it on the spot. They had the car in perfect shape and ready to go by the time the papers were signed. It took longer to drive there and back and test drive.

 

So who was this dealer?

 

Perkins Eastside Chrysler/Jeep/Dodge of Crestwood (Lousville), KY. :yup:

 

...Which is kind of funny because the LAST Ford we bought (my green ’97 T-bird) also came from a Mopar dealer :shrug: (but they were scum).

 

So concludes this odyssey. Now that the purchase experience was damn near perfect, I can only hope this 2005 Freestyle is as reliable as our warrior Thunderbirds have been (you'll note we've still kept both of them).

 

For Ford’s sake… since their own dealers blew it… it had better be.

 

congradulations on your purchase. I'm glad you finally found the car you wanted AND a salesperson that treated you right.

[rmc523]

AHH... I ALMOST FORGOT THE BEST PART OF THE STORY!

So, I have discovered that my almost-3-year-old daughter, is TRULY a girl after her daddy's heart.

 

Because at both Ford dealerships we visited, she was INSTANTLY drawn to just ONE car on the sales floor.

 

Each time, it was the Shelby Cobra.

 

(she especially liked the logo: "Look daddy... a SNAKE!") :D

 

 

...has to be one of the coolest emblems ever created.

 

and how could you not be drawn to a Shelby Cobra? :shrug:

[Ovaltine]

No, they get pissed because like I said, you aren't talking about buying a set of wheels or a small ticket item here. You're talking about buying a 20 to 40 thousand dollar car on average and for the vast majority of people that is a hell of a lot of money. .......

 

Dealerships as a general rule are shitty as hell on customer service, especially the domestic car dealers and that's a huge problem in a market where they are selling what amounts to most buyers second biggest purchase and for some buyers it's their single biggest purchase. It's a industry ridden with shaddy underhanded slick ass car dealers that will rip you off and lie to you.....

 

At a certain large Ford dealership in Toledo, the sales staff taught my nephew who was new to auto sales the following deception/sales tactic.

 

My nephew was married at the time time, but didn't have any children yet. At that point in his life, he was driving some small coupe, not even a Ford if I remember correctly.

 

Well the old-timers there taught him that to sell a vehicle like a Windstar to a family, he had to puff up his credibility by claiming things like "Oh yes, this Windstar is exactly like the one my wife drives (a lie). She just loves the space and convenience in back for our two children" (an even BIGGER lie)!

 

That's the one anecdote I remember him telling me, but I'm sure he had mentioned a few more that they had taught him.

 

So the lesson learned is, when salespeople tell you about their own experiences with a vehicle, be sure to ask a few follow up questions about the details of that experience. Like perhaps the name and ages of his/her "kids", what kind of kids stuff the spouse likes to take with them in the back to Grandma's house, etc. If you get any hesitation or stammering at all, you've just BUSTED them.

 

-Ovaltine

Edited October 8, 2007 by Ovaltine

[Pioneer]

large Ford dealership in Toledo

 

 

There are 4 dealerships in Toledo. None of them are very large. You might be thinking of the one in Oregon.

[Ovaltine]

There are 4 dealerships in Toledo. None of them are very large. You might be thinking of the one in Oregon.

 

No, it was a Toledo one. But you are right... it isn't large in a Varsity or Village Ford kind of way. But... it is good sized for the Toledo market. Not one of the smaller rural stores.

 

In all fairness... the technique I described isn't exclusive to the Blue Oval, on that you can be certain. But it is one concrete example of the genre that Blackhorse and the original poster refers to.

 

For the record, my nephew decided that he didn't want to sell cars for very long. He had trouble sleeping at night. :lol:

 

-Ovaltine

Edited October 7, 2007 by Ovaltine

[Pioneer]

No, it was a Toledo one. But you are right... it isn't large in a Varsity or Village Ford kind of way. But... it is good sized for the Toledo market. Not one of the smaller rural stores.

 

 

Brondes.

[joihan777]

Dealers are Ford's second biggest problem, but if Deanh reads this post I am dead.

 

I'va got to say, I've seen some CRAPPY Ford dealers. I even wanted to hit one once because he was a fat lazy jerk who couldn't be bothered to even look at me when he talked out of the side of his fat lazy mouth!

 

THAT being said, the nicest, most friendliest dealer I ever had the pleasure of buying with was Mr.Phil Johnson of Hayward Ford, CA. He was kind, informative, honest, punctual and helpful. He helped me pick out the exact right features on my first ever new car. He showed me features I hadn't known about but only offered the information, never pressuring. If I could, I'd buy from him again in a New York second. I was truly sad when I heard he retired a few years ago.

 

It was such a pleasant experience as that that will have me back in a showroom soon for my next family car and again for my next personal luxury sport vehicle (wink wink bring back the T-Bird!!!), regardless of my experience with the wannabe Boss Hogg salesman.

[Noah Harbinger]

At a certain large Ford dealership in Toledo, the sales staff taught my nephew who was new to auto sales the following deception/sales tactic.

 

My nephew was married at the time time, but didn't have any children yet. At that point in his life, he was driving some small coupe, not even a Ford if I remember correctly.

 

Well the old-timers there taught him that to sell a vehicle like a Windstar to a family, he had to puff up his credibility by claiming things like "Oh yes, this Windstar is exactly like the one my wife drives (a lie). She just loves the space and convenience in back for our two children" (an even BIGGER lie)!

 

That's the one anecdote I remember him telling me, but I'm sure he had mentioned a few more that they had taught him.

 

So the lesson learned is, when salespeople tell you about their own experiences with a vehicle, be sure to ask a few follow up questions about the details of that experience. Like perhaps the name and ages of his/her "kids", what kind of kids stuff the spouse likes to take with them in the back to Grandma's house, etc. If you get any hesitation or stammering at all, you've just BUSTED them.

 

The first time I ever went to a car dealership -- a Ford dealership -- when I asked the guy what he drove, he said "A Dodge Ram". I was quite surprised that he didn't make something up. In fact I think the only place a salesperson has said they drove the car they were selling me is the scuzzy Toyota dealership.