Any Regrets?

[Xerxes12]

Do any of the ex-employees wish they had stayed? I still wonder if I made the right decision when I took the $35k and retirement. Can't change the decision, but can't help thinking that maybe we weren't given honest info from the company and the union. Seems that a lot of this new contract was negotiated before the buyouts were offered. I now work for the Union Pacific where a two tier wage system has been in effect for some time. New employees at the UP can never achieve wage parity with the employees that worked for the CNW railroad, so the UP encourages the oldtimers to leave and rumors of buyouts are heard. Sounds a lot like Ford to me. :reading: :stats:

[gbg49229]

Do any of the ex-employees wish they had stayed? I still wonder if I made the right decision when I took the $35k and retirement. Can't change the decision, but can't help thinking that maybe we weren't given honest info from the company and the union. Seems that a lot of this new contract was negotiated before the buyouts were offered. I now work for the Union Pacific where a two tier wage system has been in effect for some time. New employees at the UP can never achieve wage parity with the employees that worked for the CNW railroad, so the UP encourages the oldtimers to leave and rumors of buyouts are heard. Sounds a lot like Ford to me. :reading: :stats:

I will tell you there have been times I wondered if I did the right thing. I can not tell you how many years I waited to get into Ford, then I got in and I was very happy to be working and making the money I made ( to clear 1000 a week!!!!!! ) was unreal, but I could not understand the 8th grade mentality of some folks! I knew what I was giving up when I left Ford and I am very grateful for my time there! I count my blessings to get into something I love to do instead of going in and just working at a job I disliked for a paycheck! I really think the people on the lines deserve ALOT of respect because I would NOT want to do that job! I was able to never work on an assembly line @ Ford because I worked in machining...........so to tell you a short answer, yes I am grateful, but very scary at times!

[tbldbxorntnap]

I will tell you there have been times I wondered if I did the right thing. I can not tell you how many years I waited to get into Ford, then I got in and I was very happy to be working and making the money I made ( to clear 1000 a week!!!!!! ) was unreal, but I could not understand the 8th grade mentality of some folks! I knew what I was giving up when I left Ford and I am very grateful for my time there! I count my blessings to get into something I love to do instead of going in and just working at a job I disliked for a paycheck! I really think the people on the lines deserve ALOT of respect because I would NOT want to do that job! I was able to never work on an assembly line @ Ford because I worked in machining...........so to tell you a short answer, yes I am grateful, but very scary at times!

Comming from a plant that has closed [NAP] I for myself really had only two options 1 , i could uproot my self and my wife and transfered to DTP, or 2 since I had a little over 28 years with FORD I chose to take the PRLP. of which I'm grateful to recieve a check from ford till I can retire fully, I wished they had kept us open,for truly they were A fine bunch of people to work with, my problem now is trying to find what kind of job I really want to do now, after spending 28 years in production it hard for me to really really determine what i want.

[wixommm]

Do any of the ex-employees wish they had stayed? I still wonder if I made the right decision when I took the $35k and retirement. Can't change the decision, but can't help thinking that maybe we weren't given honest info from the company and the union. Seems that a lot of this new contract was negotiated before the buyouts were offered. I now work for the Union Pacific where a two tier wage system has been in effect for some time. New employees at the UP can never achieve wage parity with the employees that worked for the CNW railroad, so the UP encourages the oldtimers to leave and rumors of buyouts are heard. Sounds a lot like Ford to me. :reading: :stats:

 

I would of stayed if my plant had remained open, but to do the drive and change plants was not for me. I had 15 years at Wixom and loved it, most of the people I truely miss. I took the education buyout and love school. Will I make the money I was making at Wixom, maybe, depends on how far I go with school. Will I tear up my body like I was at Wixom, no and that I am thankful for. Do I feel better and not ache like I did on the line, yes. I have two other friends who left and dont regret it either, miss it yes. Do I feel the union and company could of been more honest, yes on certain things. Would it of changed my decission, no. It will be a year in January since I left, it was a huge adjustment. I still get upset when I drive by that empty plant and wonder why? Life after Ford is fine for me and it will work out for those who did stay and those who left.

[fantasyfrank]

Comming from a plant that has closed [NAP] I for myself really had only two options 1 , i could uproot my self and my wife and transfered to DTP, or 2 since I had a little over 28 years with FORD I chose to take the PRLP. of which I'm grateful to recieve a check from ford till I can retire fully, I wished they had kept us open,for truly they were A fine bunch of people to work with, my problem now is trying to find what kind of job I really want to do now, after spending 28 years in production it hard for me to really really determine what i want.

Can you explain more about "PRLP" and how it works?

[Imawhosure]

Xerxes,

 

The decision was made because of Fords financial position; that is just reality. If they would have been making 2,3,4, or 10 billion a year, everyone would have told them to kiss their rearends. Being stuck there if the ship went down would've made it 5 times harder to continue on. No retirement to fall back on while you look for other employment if that is what you wish to do, no buyout, and no healthcare.

 

It is not IF it was the right decision, but rather WHY WAS IT the only LOGICAL decision offered by them, if you wanted to protect yourself and your family.

 

Finally----------->even if (and lets all hope they do) Ford comes back, one of the main reasons they will be able to do so is BECAUSE so many took the buyout, and now if they need to replace them it will be at a much lower rate.

 

The grass is always greener, that is true; but remember that this contracts stipulations for 2 tier etc, will now make working inside those walls a virtual battlefield if lower paying people are put in. With Fords policy leaning towards getting everyone they can out so as they can replace them, what do you actually think the work enviroment will be like? Who is going to do the hard jobs in the same classifications? Who is correct---------->make the high payed person do it because he/she makes more, or they are the new ones, let them do it?

 

It will be interesting, and it won't be long before we start reading on this forom which way the wind is going to blow in regards to that, which position the company will take, and if the union uses POLITICS to get out of taking any position at all since now both complaintants will be union!!!

 

An agonizing decision? Yes!!!!

 

A wrong decision after seeing what will probably go on? You have got to be kidding!!!!! As long as Ford keeps paying and supplying healthcare, you are a gun for hire with no worries. You can take less money and enjoy your work, or you can make lotsa money and enjoy the work less. They piss ya off, adios!!!!! What they gonna do if tell em to stick it, revoke your retirement, lololol. You can now act like the millenium generation my friend, demand your own hrs, how many days you wanna work, etc as long as you work small business, non-union. Why? Cause there isn't an employer alive who doesn't lick their chops when you say---------->I do not need your benefits, I can't collect unemployment, and if you want my work record, here is CAPs number and the extension to my former bosses. After that conversation my friend, you will have employers fighting over ya, trust me, it is how business works!!!!!!!!

 

Just for your experience and ability to save them money because of your unique situation, you will be held in much higher esteem than Ford ever held you in. That is FACT!!!!!!!!

Edited November 18, 2007 by Imawhosure

[objectsinmirror]

Xerxes,

 

The decision was made because of Fords financial position; that is just reality. If they would have been making 2,3,4, or 10 billion a year, everyone would have told them to kiss their rearends. Being stuck there if the ship went down would've made it 5 times harder to continue on. No retirement to fall back on while you look for other employment if that is what you wish to do, no buyout, and no healthcare.

 

It is not IF it was the right decision, but rather WHY WAS IT the only LOGICAL decision offered by them, if you wanted to protect yourself and your family.

 

Finally----------->even if (and lets all hope they do) Ford comes back, one of the main reasons they will be able to do so is BECAUSE so many took the buyout, and now if they need to replace them it will be at a much lower rate.

 

The grass is always greener, that is true; but remember that this contracts stipulations for 2 tier etc, will now make working inside those walls a virtual battlefield if lower paying people are put in. With Fords policy leaning towards getting everyone they can out so as they can replace them, what do you actually think the work enviroment will be like? Who is going to do the hard jobs in the same classifications? Who is correct---------->make the high payed person do it because he/she makes more, or they are the new ones, let them do it?

 

It will be interesting, and it won't be long before we start reading on this forom which way the wind is going to blow in regards to that, which position the company will take, and if the union uses POLITICS to get out of taking any position at all since now both complaintants will be union!!!

 

An agonizing decision? Yes!!!!

 

A wrong decision after seeing what will probably go on? You have got to be kidding!!!!! As long as Ford keeps paying and supplying healthcare, you are a gun for hire with no worries. You can take less money and enjoy your work, or you can make lotsa money and enjoy the work less. They piss ya off, adios!!!!! What they gonna do if tell em to stick it, revoke your retirement, lololol. You can now act like the millenium generation my friend, demand your own hrs, how many days you wanna work, etc as long as you work small business, non-union. Why? Cause there isn't an employer alive who doesn't lick their chops when you say---------->I do not need your benefits, I can't collect unemployment, and if you want my work record, here is CAPs number and the extension to my former bosses. After that conversation my friend, you will have employers fighting over ya, trust me, it is how business works!!!!!!!!

 

 

I knew there was some level headed people out here!...good post whosure. I've got to say though, about the way the "wind will blow" on the factory floor: This is the Toyota Production System to a tee (I've been studying that system ever since Mullaly said we'd do "more with less" and was quoted as being a big fan of the Toyota Production system...Here's generally how it works on the factory floor: Make teams that would include both tiers of workers. Give all the workers 90% of the materials they need to do the job...make each team 90% staffed...and give them 10% more work. At first sparks will fly between employees. The work is harder and more intense...this creates the natural need to INNOVATE thier way out of it. Once that is accomplished, there finally is idle time for the team...uh..oh! Idle time=WASTE. Time to cut back on more materials and staff the workers lower...you are automaticlally removing someone by INNOVATING thier job away to make the team more efficient. This happened at GMs NUMMI joint venture with Toyota...get ready for continuous improvement.

Edited November 18, 2007 by objectsinmirror

[Firefly]

Can you explain more about "PRLP" and how it works?

 

It's often referred to as the BRIDGE. It's in the contract, and listed with buy-outs when they're offered. Anytime between 28-30 years you can take (and not revoke after starting) this retirement. Full benefits, and I can't remember if it's 85% or full pay til your 30 years at which time you retire.

[Imawhosure]

I knew there was some level headed people out here!...good post whosure. I've got to say though, about the way the "wind will blow" on the factory floor: This is the Toyota Production System to a tee (I've been studying that system ever since Mullaly said we'd do "more with less" and was quoted as being a big fan of the Toyota Production system...Here's generally how it works on the factory floor: Make teams that would include both tiers of workers. Give all the workers 90% of the materials they need to do the job...make each team 90% staffed...and give them 10% more work. At first sparks will fly between employees. The work is harder and more intense...this creates the natural need to INNOVATE thier way out of it. Once that is accomplished, there finally is idle time for the team...uh..oh! Idle time=WASTE. Time to cut back on more materials and staff the workers lower...you are automaticlally removing someone by INNOVATING thier job away to make the team more efficient. This happened at GMs NUMMI joint venture with Toyota...get ready for continuous improvement.

 

 

Sadly, in highly competitive market, this is one of the solutions used. I am not suggesting it is right or fair, but am confident that this will be one of the methods used, along with a load of others that haven't even been thought of yet.

 

Hey objects------------->what do you think............many on here think that the second tier will become a revolving door of employees; and I tend to agree. What is your take on it?

[fordktpworker]

Do any of the ex-employees wish they had stayed? I still wonder if I made the right decision when I took the $35k and retirement. Can't change the decision, but can't help thinking that maybe we weren't given honest info from the company and the union. Seems that a lot of this new contract was negotiated before the buyouts were offered. I now work for the Union Pacific where a two tier wage system has been in effect for some time. New employees at the UP can never achieve wage parity with the employees that worked for the CNW railroad, so the UP encourages the oldtimers to leave and rumors of buyouts are heard. Sounds a lot like Ford to me. :reading: :stats:

 

 

why would you retire and go get another job? $35,000 is not much after taxes, you should be enjoying your retirement!

Edited November 18, 2007 by DTP

[eaglette88]

Xerxes,

 

The decision was made because of Fords financial position; that is just reality. If they would have been making 2,3,4, or 10 billion a year, everyone would have told them to kiss their rearends. Being stuck there if the ship went down would've made it 5 times harder to continue on. No retirement to fall back on while you look for other employment if that is what you wish to do, no buyout, and no healthcare.

 

It is not IF it was the right decision, but rather WHY WAS IT the only LOGICAL decision offered by them, if you wanted to protect yourself and your family.

 

Finally----------->even if (and lets all hope they do) Ford comes back, one of the main reasons they will be able to do so is BECAUSE so many took the buyout, and now if they need to replace them it will be at a much lower rate.

 

The grass is always greener, that is true; but remember that this contracts stipulations for 2 tier etc, will now make working inside those walls a virtual battlefield if lower paying people are put in. With Fords policy leaning towards getting everyone they can out so as they can replace them, what do you actually think the work enviroment will be like? Who is going to do the hard jobs in the same classifications? Who is correct---------->make the high payed person do it because he/she makes more, or they are the new ones, let them do it?

 

It will be interesting, and it won't be long before we start reading on this forom which way the wind is going to blow in regards to that, which position the company will take, and if the union uses POLITICS to get out of taking any position at all since now both complaintants will be union!!!

 

An agonizing decision? Yes!!!!

 

A wrong decision after seeing what will probably go on? You have got to be kidding!!!!! As long as Ford keeps paying and supplying healthcare, you are a gun for hire with no worries. You can take less money and enjoy your work, or you can make lotsa money and enjoy the work less. They piss ya off, adios!!!!! What they gonna do if tell em to stick it, revoke your retirement, lololol. You can now act like the millenium generation my friend, demand your own hrs, how many days you wanna work, etc as long as you work small business, non-union. Why? Cause there isn't an employer alive who doesn't lick their chops when you say---------->I do not need your benefits, I can't collect unemployment, and if you want my work record, here is CAPs number and the extension to my former bosses. After that conversation my friend, you will have employers fighting over ya, trust me, it is how business works!!!!!!!!

 

Just for your experience and ability to save them money because of your unique situation, you will be held in much higher esteem than Ford ever held you in. That is FACT!!!!!!!!

I feel this is one of the best posts I've seen in a long time. I sit here and ponder what could have/have not been.

I work at the Twin Cities Plant, with problems abound. When the buyouts came we had better than 200 of our skilled trades(out of about 240 total) and about 1300 production( out of 1500) take packages because we were going to be idled in May of 2008.

 

We had to act fast on how we were going to get transfers, people hired to run production, who would we get to take the skilled trades place in order to run until May 2008.

 

A lot of people's lives were going to change in less than an 8 month period, fast. Although the decisions on the part of our members was voluntary, after time, there was a feeling of confusion, because it was quick.

 

We advised our members to take their time, check with actuaries, cpa's etc. before you make your decisions. It was like a panic because everyone was in fear of not getting something to carry them to the next job.

 

We were able to get our skilled trades into the surrounding local skilled trades and brought back as outside contractors in order to run. At the same time we hired new long term TFT's off the street and were able to bring back those members that took the hundred thousand as rehires.

 

Now you know for sure if you take a package, you cut all ties with Ford motor Company. You are not hired back as a TFT or anything.

 

We now have about 250 new hires and 250 rehires as TFT's.

 

We continued to look at our long term possibilities and it didn't look good. We noticed the federal government extended the side crash test until 2012 or so and saw the business case to present to the company that up until the middle of 2009 we could complete and make money.

 

We submitted the business case and with the contract we were granted a few things never done before... we receive and extention to stay open until Septmeber 2009...an exception to the long term temporary employee letter of understanding, meaning our temps cound work longer than one year.. this exception also maintained their wage progression at the higher level...we suggested to the international that long term temporary members, including rehires receive the signing bonus and we got that... we requested the xmas bonus, but no word as of yet... and we requested the performance bonus for the first two years... no word yet

 

Every day I never forget were I came from...a line worker... given the opportunity to serve my membership..yes, I am part of the Union Leadership; I am Jim Eagle, the Chairman of one great local, UAW local 879.

 

We have done so much, with so little, that I feel we can almost do anything with nothing. When the new hires came in they had no guarantees. No they won't get hired, but they have a chance if Ford does hire in the future according to the letter for Twin Cities that is now part of the national contract. No our rehires will not get the chance to be rehired, because they took a package and cut ties with ford, but we did get them back for awhile, until 2009. Things that have and would not have happened had we not tried.

 

It's not the thanks that I and the rest of our Union Leadership is looking for, its the idea that we have and continue to try and get more for our members, and the need for our temporary members to understand that it was difficulty to accomplish but we did it all for them.

 

The reason for all this explaination? It is very difficult with some temporary members thinking they are entitled to everything. Its their right to have it all.

 

Although I, and the rest of the Union Leadership, of Local 879. will continue to get everything we can for our current members, long term temporary members and our rehired members, I fear it won't be enough to satisfy all.

 

Too all that suffer the trials and tribulations of a closing plant, I wish you all good fortiune and a long life.

 

:reading:

[objectsinmirror]

Sadly, in highly competitive market, this is one of the solutions used. I am not suggesting it is right or fair, but am confident that this will be one of the methods used, along with a load of others that haven't even been thought of yet.

 

Hey objects------------->what do you think............many on here think that the second tier will become a revolving door of employees; and I tend to agree. What is your take on it?

 

Revolving door yes...but not visible right away...There is an expected skilled job shortage crisis looming by 2010 (kids aren't interested in this type of career) The big three simply can't afford to lose the skill they have. Now, they can coheirce skilled people to move about the company (plant to plant) which is being called "human kanban" by Toyota Production fans. They can standardize processes that virtually de-skills certain operations (consolidating classifications) but they CAN'T afford to lose the core skills...look for a more aggressive push toward apprentice training and Ford using grants and "education salesmanship". I'm NOT just talking skilled trades here either...some line workers know way more than management ever will about certain parts and processes they personally "refined" throughout thier career. This is the company's virtual gold mine. That is why The Toyota Production System fits so well. Revolving door will be slow but STEADY.....

[Imawhosure]

why would you retire and go get another job? $35,000 is not much after taxes, you should be enjoying your retirement!

 

 

DTP, let me try and answer that one for you.

 

1. Your age= any decision to retire. Most people don't contemplate retirement until 60 or older. Some can retire from Ford by 48. If you sit home and do nothing, inflation will eat you alive by 60. Don't think so? Look back at what retirees 10yrs ago received, and see if you would like to try and live off that income today!!!!! Once more, you have to pay a penalty if you try and get into your 401K before 58 1/2 I believe it is, and who the hell wants to pay the government a 10% penalty of YOUR OWN MONEY, lol.

 

2. Retiring from Ford is predicated upon their survival. Are you POSITIVE they will be ok and keep paying? Until they turn REASONABLE PROFIT, everything is still a roll of the dice.

 

3. Unless you were in a huge overtime job, you actually make MORE money than you ever did at Ford by holding an even decent job. You figure it out!!!!!!! How much does the regular Ford worker take home for 40hrs after union dues etc, and how much does a retiree take home in 4 week months. How much does that retiree have to make BEFORE he passes up a person only working 40hrs, and he certainly isn't going to take a job where he works as hard as riding the ironhorse............unless he is daffy! Ergo, he/she gets paid more for doing less, and probably doesn't have to work 40hrs if he/she makes a decent salary.

 

4. Unless you are old, most of the people DID NOT retire to retire!!!! If Ford woulda been in good shape, it is highly unlikely most of them would've left at all; certainly not for quite awhile. No, most left because of reason number 2. They had no intention of retiring, but things being what they were, they didn't retire, just shifted their employment elsewhere.

 

I have personally talked to a handfull of people who retired under the buyout, and have not found 1 yet who did not take another job.

 

Therefore, retirement from Ford is just the word used. They get 2 checks, one from Ford, and one from their current employer. Most still have their visions set on quitting work between 60 and 62, just like they did at Ford. It is just for the time being, they collect money from 2 sources, one they earned for 28 to 30yrs of the past, and the hrs they work in the present. Most are happy with the current income situation, and enjoy an easier lifestyle too for it.

[Imawhosure]

Revolving door yes...but not visible right away...There is an expected skilled job shortage crisis looming by 2010 (kids aren't interested in this type of career) The big three simply can't afford to lose the skill they have. Now, they can coheirce skilled people to move about the company (plant to plant) which is being called "human kanban" by Toyota Production fans. They can standardize processes that virtually de-skills certain operations (consolidating classifications) but they CAN'T afford to lose the core skills...look for a more aggressive push toward apprentice training and Ford using grants and "education salesmanship". I'm NOT just talking skilled trades here either...some line workers know way more than management ever will about certain parts and processes they personally "refined" throughout thier career. This is the company's virtual gold mine. That is why The Toyota Production System fits so well. Revolving door will be slow but STEADY.....

 

I agree with what you have stated. I also think that Ford will survive IF they can keep/and/or raise current levels of quality along with design more readily accepted units.

 

The fly in the ointment as far as I am concerned is-------->fuel prices. None of the Big 3 were prepared for this spike, and their offerings are weak in high mileage vehicles. History has repeated itself as it happened in the mid 70s, and this is originally where our adversaries got their foothold.

 

While truck sales are down, they are still reasonably robust to keep cash flow going; although everyone on this board would like them to be better. But if fuel goes to much higher quickly, Houston, we have a problem we may not be able to solve.

 

Thanks for your input objects, it was greatly appreciated.

[objectsinmirror]

I agree with what you have stated. I also think that Ford will survive IF they can keep/and/or raise current levels of quality along with design more readily accepted units.

 

The fly in the ointment as far as I am concerned is-------->fuel prices. None of the Big 3 were prepared for this spike, and their offerings are weak in high mileage vehicles. History has repeated itself as it happened in the mid 70s, and this is originally where our adversaries got their foothold.

 

While truck sales are down, they are still reasonably robust to keep cash flow going; although everyone on this board would like them to be better. But if fuel goes to much higher quickly, Houston, we have a problem we may not be able to solve.

 

Thanks for your input objects, it was greatly appreciated.

 

I do remember the 70's (i was a pre teen then) I remember seeing suburbans, caddllacs, pickups, VANUPS(remember those?) outside for sale everywhere. I always said that sheet metal sells...example: say you are looking to buy a house, the house you stop in front of, has everything you ever wanted inside...but you'll never see it because the outside is ugly. This is sooo true with cars. When the 500 first came out dealers practically had to shove people inside so they could see the real "quality". Oh yes quality is a perception not nessesarily a fact...I'll bet most people don't even know the size engine they have in the car they're driving...lol

Edited November 18, 2007 by objectsinmirror

[Imawhosure]

I feel this is one of the best posts I've seen in a long time. I sit here and ponder what could have/have not been.

I work at the Twin Cities Plant, with problems abound. When the buyouts came we had better than 200 of our skilled trades(out of about 240 total) and about 1300 production( out of 1500) take packages because we were going to be idled in May of 2008.

 

We had to act fast on how we were going to get transfers, people hired to run production, who would we get to take the skilled trades place in order to run until May 2008.

 

A lot of people's lives were going to change in less than an 8 month period, fast. Although the decisions on the part of our members was voluntary, after time, there was a feeling of confusion, because it was quick.

 

We advised our members to take their time, check with actuaries, cpa's etc. before you make your decisions. It was like a panic because everyone was in fear of not getting something to carry them to the next job.

 

We were able to get our skilled trades into the surrounding local skilled trades and brought back as outside contractors in order to run. At the same time we hired new long term TFT's off the street and were able to bring back those members that took the hundred thousand as rehires.

 

Now you know for sure if you take a package, you cut all ties with Ford motor Company. You are not hired back as a TFT or anything.

 

We now have about 250 new hires and 250 rehires as TFT's.

 

We continued to look at our long term possibilities and it didn't look good. We noticed the federal government extended the side crash test until 2012 or so and saw the business case to present to the company that up until the middle of 2009 we could complete and make money.

 

We submitted the business case and with the contract we were granted a few things never done before... we receive and extention to stay open until Septmeber 2009...an exception to the long term temporary employee letter of understanding, meaning our temps cound work longer than one year.. this exception also maintained their wage progression at the higher level...we suggested to the international that long term temporary members, including rehires receive the signing bonus and we got that... we requested the xmas bonus, but no word as of yet... and we requested the performance bonus for the first two years... no word yet

 

Every day I never forget were I came from...a line worker... given the opportunity to serve my membership..yes, I am part of the Union Leadership; I am Jim Eagle, the Chairman of one great local, UAW local 879.

 

We have done so much, with so little, that I feel we can almost do anything with nothing. When the new hires came in they had no guarantees. No they won't get hired, but they have a chance if Ford does hire in the future according to the letter for Twin Cities that is now part of the national contract. No our rehires will not get the chance to be rehired, because they took a package and cut ties with ford, but we did get them back for awhile, until 2009. Things that have and would not have happened had we not tried.

 

It's not the thanks that I and the rest of our Union Leadership is looking for, its the idea that we have and continue to try and get more for our members, and the need for our temporary members to understand that it was difficulty to accomplish but we did it all for them.

 

The reason for all this explaination? It is very difficult with some temporary members thinking they are entitled to everything. Its their right to have it all.

 

Although I, and the rest of the Union Leadership, of Local 879. will continue to get everything we can for our current members, long term temporary members and our rehired members, I fear it won't be enough to satisfy all.

 

Too all that suffer the trials and tribulations of a closing plant, I wish you all good fortiune and a long life.

 

:reading:

 

Jim,

 

A very dicey situation indeed. Funny how the company puts everyone on the spot including the local union. As a local, when things like this happen, you do everything you can to solve the problem. I would never wish to be put in that situation, and to be honest; it takes a hell of a person to stand up to the strain.

 

I wish you well also, and hope some solution that is equitable can be found for your members. This is one reason we may not trust Ford, but we should down right HATE TOYOTY. Wixxom, Atlanta, St Louis, and a host of others; and possibly more. Those are REASONS, not excuses. They are our own!!!!!! Just as normal people and not even unionworkers, we should want to strangle the life out of Toyoty, and send them back from whence they came.

 

Good Luck Jim, and good luck to Twin Cities.

[Imawhosure]

I do remember the 70's (i was a pre teen then) I remember seeing suburbans, caddllacs, pickups, VANUPS(remember those?) outside for sale everywhere. I always said that sheet metal sells...example: say you are looking to buy a house, the house you stop in front of, has everything you ever wanted inside...but you'll never see it because the outside is ugly. This is sooo true with cars. When the 500 first came out dealers practically had to shove people inside so the could see the real "quality". Oh yes quality is a perception not nessesarily a fact...I'll bet most people don't even know the size engine they have in the car they're driving...lol

 

Tell me about it, I built them. (the 500s) Between the size of the car, how it looked, and the Chrysler 300, I knew it was in deep doo. It appears the rebadged Taurus is having a hard time also.

 

Fords advertising is terrible as far as I am concerned. I see that Honda commercial, and that damn song constantly goes through my mind, and now that song is tied to Honda. All the people I work with feel the same way.

 

If Ford could just design a way to get people to drive their cars, they might be fine. But except for a select few commercials, their attempts at it stink!!!!!

 

And the funny thing------------------->to this day, whenever I get gas and see someone with a 500 or Montego, I ask them how they like the vehicle. I must've asked 50 people who own them, and I have only gotten 1 negative response. Most are, "best vehicle I have ever owned, terrific, would recommend this car to anyone." So sad. A great car, good quality, and Ford can't even get anyone to test it by creative usage of advertising.

[tbldbxorntnap]

Can you explain more about "PRLP" and how it works?

you get 85% of your pay or 34 out 40 hr week, my take home is usually $688 a week, still get my vacation and personal time, signing bonus all holiday pay including the christmas bonus plus my medical and dental benifits.

[Imawhosure]

Xerxes,

 

So sorry, off topic, let me get back on it.

 

 

Regrets? Yep, that I couldn't do MORE for Ford before I left, and those that still toil there. To this day, I push Ford Motor Company vehicles to anyone looking to buy a new car offering X-plan.

 

For me, it is like being in business and using a network. I try, but the perception is that Ford is bad. This is why I posted in a thread I created how Fords quality is above the other two domestics as reported by a the most prestigious consumer magazine.

 

The only regret I will have if Ford fails with the new consumer surveys is------------------>I wasn't fast enough to help those I left behind keep their jobs, and keep an American company in business.

 

Whenever I see that plant, I remember where that check comes from, how hard those people work to support themselves and ME, then redouble my efforts to promote what keeps us all afloat, Ford vehicles.

 

Got a person wanting my X-plan within two weeks, chalk one up for me.

[objectsinmirror]

Tell me about it, I built them. (the 500s) Between the size of the car, how it looked, and the Chrysler 300, I knew it was in deep doo. It appears the rebadged Taurus is having a hard time also.

 

Fords advertising is terrible as far as I am concerned. I see that Honda commercial, and that damn song constantly goes through my mind, and now that song is tied to Honda. All the people I work with feel the same way.

 

If Ford could just design a way to get people to drive their cars, they might be fine. But except for a select few commercials, their attempts at it stink!!!!!

 

And the funny thing------------------->to this day, whenever I get gas and see someone with a 500 or Montego, I ask them how they like the vehicle. I must've asked 50 people who own them, and I have only gotten 1 negative response. Most are, "best vehicle I have ever owned, terrific, would recommend this car to anyone." So sad. A great car, good quality, and Ford can't even get anyone to test it by creative usage of advertising.

 

Well, Caddilac did have did have ZEPPLIN (oooh yea...OOoo yea) and we had "have you diven a FOOOORD lately!" and more recently Kermit the frog (sigh)....hope this new marketing guy does a little better. Got to go rake leaves (they're finally falling)...have a good day!

[whereswaldo]

why would you retire and go get another job? $35,000 is not much after taxes, you should be enjoying your retirement!

And $35,000 pension is not much esp. if you are only 48-58 yrs old.

[howie]

Do any of the ex-employees wish they had stayed? I still wonder if I made the right decision when I took the $35k and retirement. Can't change the decision, but can't help thinking that maybe we weren't given honest info from the company and the union. Seems that a lot of this new contract was negotiated before the buyouts were offered. I now work for the Union Pacific where a two tier wage system has been in effect for some time. New employees at the UP can never achieve wage parity with the employees that worked for the CNW railroad, so the UP encourages the oldtimers to leave and rumors of buyouts are heard. Sounds a lot like Ford to me. :reading: :stats:

 

Since this last buyout program wasn't the first offered to me in the 30+ years I've been at Ford, I treated it as all the others: not worth the time to even consider it. I felt it was silly, at age 53, to give up 5 weeks vacation, all the bennies and holidays for a monthly pension that I can gross in a working week. The crumbs they threw at us as an incentive were laughable. Give me 35K to "retire"? Shoot, I make that in 3 months easy. Give me 140K to "retire" without bennies and a pension that won't be worth squat in 5 years? Go seek the more gullible. If Ford were truly serious about getting me out, they better come up with a realistic plan. Something on par with how they treat fired CEO's (re:Nasser). Give me 2 years of my top gross pay, a decent pension and a F-350 King Ranch. Ford would recover payback in under 3 years on a deal as this. I would consider such a deal as Ford being serious and deem it acceptable. Will Ford ever consider such a deal? Nope, they are too entrenched in the "We on the mountaintop need only to look down on those in the valley" mindset. Therefore, I'll stay at Ford until a normal retirement age of 62 or so... costing Ford another million or so in the process. That doesn't include the monies they'll be paying out in the various plant to plant transfers they'll be giving me in the future. My gypsy ass has already worked at 4 different plants and is ready for more.

 

Are those whom took the buyout regretting it? Some aren't, many are. Talked with numerous union reps who've told me of the many who took buyouts. Many of them are calling and complaining of how the money is spent, spouses have divorced them and they are stuck in real world jobs of 10-12 bucks an hour. It got to a point that our Chairman was saying he would get them their job back, but they would have to pay the money back. No takers, so far.

[Jimmy G]

No regrets. Life is good.

[Captain723]

Since this last buyout program wasn't the first offered to me in the 30+ years I've been at Ford, I treated it as all the others: not worth the time to even consider it. I felt it was silly, at age 53, to give up 5 weeks vacation, all the bennies and holidays for a monthly pension that I can gross in a working week. The crumbs they threw at us as an incentive were laughable. Give me 35K to "retire"? Shoot, I make that in 3 months easy. Give me 140K to "retire" without bennies and a pension that won't be worth squat in 5 years? Go seek the more gullible. If Ford were truly serious about getting me out, they better come up with a realistic plan. Something on par with how they treat fired CEO's (re:Nasser). Give me 2 years of my top gross pay, a decent pension and a F-350 King Ranch. Ford would recover payback in under 3 years on a deal as this. I would consider such a deal as Ford being serious and deem it acceptable. Will Ford ever consider such a deal? Nope, they are too entrenched in the "We on the mountaintop need only to look down on those in the valley" mindset. Therefore, I'll stay at Ford until a normal retirement age of 62 or so... costing Ford another million or so in the process. That doesn't include the monies they'll be paying out in the various plant to plant transfers they'll be giving me in the future. My gypsy ass has already worked at 4 different plants and is ready for more.

 

Are those whom took the buyout regretting it? Some aren't, many are. Talked with numerous union reps who've told me of the many who took buyouts. Many of them are calling and complaining of how the money is spent, spouses have divorced them and they are stuck in real world jobs of 10-12 bucks an hour. It got to a point that our Chairman was saying he would get them their job back, but they would have to pay the money back. No takers, so far.

R U a tradesperson? Sounds like it with those huge expectations...Ford paying a hourly person CEO wages

I think the packages were good for those ready to retire, those with 28yrs- have skill- age to another job, or those whose spouce works there and take 140k or someone young and take the education.

Your right, if you are not ready then you should stay on and work....thats what is so nice about it. Unfortunately there were many that took it for the wrong reason and they are sitting broke right now!!

I hope all that took it are doing ok and I can't wait until I can say that I am retired!! I will get another job if and when I leave but it will be at a golf course and it will be on my own terms!!

[fantasyfrank]

you get 85% of your pay or 34 out 40 hr week, my take home is usually $688 a week, still get my vacation and personal time, signing bonus all holiday pay including the christmas bonus plus my medical and dental benifits.

Are you allowed to go out and find another job if you want or do you have to wait until you get your 30yrs?