Moby Vic Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Yeah, so what's the excuse for doing that on the clean-sheet new Camaro design? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Yeah, so what's the excuse for doing that on the clean-sheet new Camaro design? Yeah, because Ford didn't do that, . . . did they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Yeah, because Ford didn't do that, . . . did they? At least the Ford's gauges are actually IN FRONT OF YOU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Yeah, because Ford didn't do that, . . . did they? He's talking about the ones in the center console. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 At least the Ford's gauges are actually IN FRONT OF YOU. On that I agree. I'm not so sure about how the guages down on the center console around the shifter idea will work. It's different, or at least we haven't seen it in a long time and therefore it gets attention. But in driving the car how does it work out? But again, it's not like this is the first time a car company took an interior from their old pony car and put it in their new retro-pony car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 On that I agree. I'm not so sure about how the guages down on the center console around the shifter idea will work. It's different, or at least we haven't seen it in a long time and therefore it gets attention. But in driving the car how does it work out? But again, it's not like this is the first time a car company took an interior from their old pony car and put it in their new retro-pony car. Well, there's a difference between using things inspired by the past and applying them in a functional and modern way, and using things from the past for the sake of using them like the Camaro's gauges. I would agree that at least some bits on the Mustang's gauges could have been better executed though. They are a bit difficult to read under certain light conditions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Well, there's a difference between using things inspired by the past and applying them in a functional and modern way, and using things from the past for the sake of using them like the Camaro's gauges. I would agree that at least some bits on the Mustang's gauges could have been better executed though. They are a bit difficult to read under certain light conditions. Yeah, ok, whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 (edited) Yeah, ok, whatever. Looks like inspiration to me. Exactly what I said. The original gauge binnacle on the Mustang was a memorable and PRACTICAL styling cue. There's really no reason not to immitate it without much change. The Camaro's secondary gauges on the lower center console, on the other hand, were a dumb idea in the 1960's and they're still a dumb idea today. If you'll notice, Ford didn't carry over the secondary gauge placement in the photo you so graciously provided. Why? Because there was a better solution today. That's the thing about retro design. You take what still works and use it again. What worked then but wouldn't work today, you either rework to make it work today or you abandon it. What didn't work then and STILL doesn't work today, you definitely throw out. Edited January 10, 2008 by NickF1011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Looks like inspiration to me. Exactly what I said. The original gauge binnacle on the Mustang was a memorable and PRACTICAL styling cue. There's really no reason not to immitate it without much change. The Camaro's secondary gauges on the lower center console, on the other hand, were a dumb idea in the 1960's and they're still a dumb idea today. If you'll notice, Ford didn't carry over the secondary gauge placement in the photo you so graciously provided. Why? Because there was a better solution today. That's the thing about retro design. You take what still works and use it again. What worked then but wouldn't work today, you either rework to make it work today or you abandon it. What didn't work then and STILL doesn't work today, you definitely throw out. Yeah, ok, whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 From this .. to this Is just Ford being inspired and masterfully creative. It is a pure stroke of design genius. But!!! From this . . . to something very similar to this. Is just Chevy being stupid and doing the wrong thing and it's completely botched up. And this is somebody who's full of shit. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 For a retro theme, I think that's pretty good. Probably take a bit for the modernists to get used to but traditional buffs will love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 From this .. to this Is just Ford being inspired and masterfully creative. It is a pure stroke of design genius. But!!! From this . . . to something very similar to this. Is just Chevy being stupid and doing the wrong thing and it's completely botched up. I have a feeling you spend a lot of time looking at the floor. Gauges on the floor are stupid, period. It was stupid for Mercury to do that with the Marauder, but they didn't have anywhere else to put them. They had to adapt an existing gauge cluster. Where did anybody (other than you) say the Mustang dash design was pure genius? It's merely not dangerous. The new Camaro is an all-new car. There's no excuse for designing in something potentially dangerous like that for the sake of being retro. But hey, I hope you buy several Camaros and check your auxiliary gauges frequently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I have a feeling you spend a lot of time looking at the floor. Gauges on the floor are stupid, period. It was stupid for Mercury to do that with the Marauder, but they didn't have anywhere else to put them. They had to adapt an existing gauge cluster. Where did anybody (other than you) say the Mustang dash design was pure genius? It's merely not dangerous. The new Camaro is an all-new car. There's no excuse for designing in something potentially dangerous like that for the sake of being retro. But hey, I hope you buy several Camaros and check your auxiliary gauges frequently. Spare me the spin and try actually reading what I've posted. On that I agree. I'm not so sure about how the guages down on the center console around the shifter idea will work. It's different, or at least we haven't seen it in a long time and therefore it gets attention. But in driving the car how does it work out? But again, it's not like this is the first time a car company took an interior from their old pony car and put it in their new retro-pony car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I did read it. The issue is the gauges on the floor. That's stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I did read it. The issue is the gauges on the floor. That's stupid. Precisely. Other than the auxiliary guages (well, and the silly looking audio/HVAC bubble) I don't see anything wrong with the retro cues on the Camaro's interior. Like I've said...retro is fine if it actually still WORKS. Those gauges don't work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Precisely. Other than the auxiliary guages (well, and the silly looking audio/HVAC bubble) I don't see anything wrong with the retro cues on the Camaro's interior. Like I've said...retro is fine if it actually still WORKS. Those gauges don't work. Oh really Nick. Remember you said that. Because this is everything else you had to say about the Camaro interior. Looks like GM looked at a Scion xD for inspiration.....and that's definitely not a good thing. That center stack design looks horrible. Only problem there is....I thought the concept's interior was pretty horrendous too. And you just KNOW the media (and probably customers) are going to throw a hissy fit about the god-awful location of the secondary guages -- they are novel, but completely impractical. And look at that shifter surround (on the spy shot -- it actually looks decent on the concept). WTF? Even with a different texture or trim, that shift bezel looks incredibly cheap and "tacked on". Yeah. That center stack still completely kills it. The gauges look terrible and useless and that whole bulbous extrusion around the HVAC/radio "thing" looks completely 1995-ish. Yes!!! I knew I had seen it before somewhere!!! That center "bulb" reminds me of our old 1994 Saturn SL2 beater. Meanwhile you have plenty of praise for the Mustang interior which is equally as retro and uninspired as the Camaro. I tend to agree about the placement of the auxillary guages. I have my doubts as to how well that will work in diriving the car. However to be fair, I've never heard an owner of a 69 Camaro say they got into an accident because they were looking at their fuel guage. It would be different if Ford had never built a retro-themed Mustang and Chevy did this retro Camaro anyway. But given that Ford not only did but they did it first it really doesn't leave any room for the Ford fans to be critical of Chevy for doing something Ford already did. Don't cry to me either about the splitting hairs over the placement of the guages. Let's concentrate on the steak and not the peas. Ford did it, now Chevy is going to do it, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, so shut up about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 You're right. Once again Chevy is a copycat. Only this time they're 4 years late instead of 2.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 You're right. Once again Chevy is a copycat. Only this time they're 4 years late instead of 2.5. On that I agree. Or is it just that Ford did the retro thing because of the PT Cruiser? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 The '94 Mustang was retro long before Chrysler imitated a '37 Ford with the Prowler and morphed it into a tiny Mexican minivan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Oh really Nick. Remember you said that. Because this is everything else you had to say about the Camaro interior.Meanwhile you have plenty of praise for the Mustang interior which is equally as retro and uninspired as the Camaro. I tend to agree about the placement of the auxillary guages. I have my doubts as to how well that will work in diriving the car. However to be fair, I've never heard an owner of a 69 Camaro say they got into an accident because they were looking at their fuel guage. It would be different if Ford had never built a retro-themed Mustang and Chevy did this retro Camaro anyway. But given that Ford not only did but they did it first it really doesn't leave any room for the Ford fans to be critical of Chevy for doing something Ford already did. Don't cry to me either about the splitting hairs over the placement of the guages. Let's concentrate on the steak and not the peas. Ford did it, now Chevy is going to do it, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, so shut up about it. Yes Master Blackhorse. You have way too much time on your hands. I like the Mustang's interior. I don't particularly like the Camaro's. It's really as simple as that. Go blow wind up someone else's ass for a change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Actually, they both are crap. Having to look down a "Big-Gulp" cup to read the gauges is retarded as is the extremely cheap materials and the Camaro's interior is just wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Yes Master Blackhorse. You have way too much time on your hands. I like the Mustang's interior. I don't particularly like the Camaro's. It's really as simple as that. Go blow wind up someone else's ass for a change. Thats all you gotta say Nick. Instead of trying to pass yourself off as some interior design expert. It's perfectly cool to say "Hey, IMO, it's just me, I just don't like it." Just don't try to pass yourself off as the all seeing all knowing car interior guy who just comes off sounding like you make excuses for Ford for doing the same thing Chevy is about to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 (edited) The '94 Mustang was retro long before Chrysler imitated a '37 Ford with the Prowler and morphed it into a tiny Mexican minivan. This is retro? To what? At best it kinda, sorta, maybe if you lean sideways and the lighting effects are just right and you have a cold looks something vaugely similar in a pseudo sort of way to a Mustang II. But then, naaaaa. Edited January 11, 2008 by BlackHorse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 This is retro? To what? At best it kinda, sorta, maybe if you lean sideways and the lighting effects are just right and you have a cold looks something vaugely similar in a pseudo sort of way to a Mustang II. But then, naaaaa. It is retro under the skin...How long did Ford use the Fox platform (1979-2004?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 They used the Fox platform for a long time, but they're still using the Panther platform. So what? And the SN95 chassis was substantially modified. The SN95 cars are much, much stiffer than the '79–'93 Fox bodies. But of course you know that, you're just spreading your usual Ford hate. Ford played heavily on the styling heritage of the '94 Mustang, whether a Bowtie guy can see it or not. Chevy chose to go the bloated Geo Storm route with the '93 Camaro, so maybe that affects your vision. Ford used the "It is what it was ... and more" tagline. And no, it didn't directly ape the old design because it was the first of the retro cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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