Gin@Juice Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 hey just wondering what the work around Oakville is?? STAP minds think this is one of the shittest deals ever! Just wondering what you guys think?? I will be voting NO on sunday if there isn't any new vehicle coming our way.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oac bodyboy Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 (edited) hey just wondering what the work around Oakville is?? STAP minds think this is one of the shittest deals ever! Just wondering what you guys think?? I will be voting NO on sunday if there isn't any new vehicle coming our way.... THIS IS A BAD DEAL--- MY VOTE------ NO Edited April 29, 2008 by oac bodyboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAC_Sparky Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Need more information first. It has to be a balance between consideration of today's economy and what we're giving up for it. I won't be casting my vote based on the one-sided story that the media puts out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topgun Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 hey just wondering what the work around Oakville is?? STAP minds think this is one of the shittest deals ever! Just wondering what you guys think?? I will be voting NO on sunday if there isn't any new vehicle coming our way.... Just wondering why every Ford plant knows whats happening at there plant in the USA and Canada except STAP ,still hanging by a thread for another 3 years for new product or any kind of investment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charged92 Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 No one wants to tell us what we already know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topgun Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 No one wants to tell us what we already know. Well I guess so much for St Thomas to be at the fore front of the negotiations this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trimdingman Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 The money and benefits were pretty much as expected. My main concern is contracting out jobs. It is good that we resisted the two-tier wages. The most important part of the contract has been left out of the report. Are premium jobs going to be contracted out? Are workers going to work their whole lives on the line, or will they eventually get a premium job off the line after they have put in their time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oakville Insider Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Those are all local issues Trim, you of all people should know that, and the local issues will be dealt with this week. What everyone is forgetting is that this is a tentative economic deal, not the whole deal, just the economic part of it. Be patient, wait for the whole thing to come out, and ask to see the lowlights as well as the stuff they want us to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trimdingman Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 (edited) [be patient, wait for the whole thing to come out, and ask to see the lowlights as well as the stuff they want us to see. I don't care how much grease they apply, or how much they tickle me, if I don't go that way, I don't go that way. Edited April 29, 2008 by Trimdingman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davdog Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 The money and benefits were pretty much as expected. My main concern is contracting out jobs. It is good that we resisted the two-tier wages. The most important part of the contract has been left out of the report. Are premium jobs going to be contracted out? Are workers going to work their whole lives on the line, or will they eventually get a premium job off the line after they have put in their time? You know you're in the wrong field when you refer to "cleaning the shithouse" as a "premium job" Of course those jobs should be outsourced, if they aren't then your plants will be moving to mexico. What freeking company in the world pays top wages to janitors besides the dying big 3? If you don't want to work the line for the duration then get another gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAC_Sparky Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 You know you're in the wrong field when you refer to "cleaning the shithouse" as a "premium job" Of course those jobs should be outsourced, if they aren't then your plants will be moving to mexico. What freeking company in the world pays top wages to janitors besides the dying big 3? If you don't want to work the line for the duration then get another gig. Ask your garbageman or a school janitor or hospital cleaner how much he makes. If you don't already know you'll probably be surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davdog Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Ask your garbageman or a school janitor or hospital cleaner how much he makes. If you don't already know you'll probably be surprised. I do know how much the school janitor makes and it ain't close to what trim makes, not even half. Maybe things are different in Canada but Janitors in the US would be luck to break 38k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAC_Sparky Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 I do know how much the school janitor makes and it ain't close to what trim makes, not even half. Maybe things are different in Canada but Janitors in the US would be luck to break 38k. Things are different in Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuyfromSTAP Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Things are different in Canada. To be fair the School and hospital worker are gov't employees,so to compare them against us is a bit unfair.We don't like when teachers use the same rational against us when they are trying to get more money.To say anything the gov't does therefore equating our janitors pay to theirs doesn't make sense to me.Your local garbage man isn't making anything close to us. I agree with Davdog,hard to believe, but Ford doesn't want guys like Trim any longer.If you won't or can't do a productive job any longer they want you out and replace you with cheaper labour for menial jobs.Ford's money is made by cars going out the door and not an old fella staying past his 30 years getting the toilet shiny.It comes down to Ford paying for talent and paying alot less for joe jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davdog Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 Things are different in Canada. Then you should change jobs now because you've got no chance to compete against mexican labor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSVT Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 Then you should change jobs now because you've got no chance to compete against mexican labor. You're an idiot and why are you here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSVT Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 Our union has not said a thing about this and crickets are the only noise on the 707 website. I don't think we will be voting this weekend? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davdog Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 You're an idiot and why are you here? Why am I an idiot? If there was a single person on this thread who posted "screw this contract, I'm going to quit and get another job" then I would agree with you. but there ain't, and there never will be. Management could pee on you head on a daily basis and the only thing you'd do is file a grievance. You're overpriced manual labor, and you know it. You either price yourselves accordingly or your time is limited. And I'm here because I wasn't around to see the dinosaurs die off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinkaboutit Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 (edited) Ah the peanut gallery has finally arrived......and again nothing Intelligent to say. Never mind that, lets take a closer look at this tentetive agreement this far................ "No wage increases over the life of the agreement" - Well I never hear the people I work with say they are under paid without a smile on thier faces, and in all reality with the 1.36 cola to roll in right off the bat, thats not a bad little raise if i do say so for the first year, after that normal cola will resume for years 2 and 3. Given the state of the auto industry I can live with that no problem. I would only like to see FORD follow suit by not giving their executives those large bonuses they have been handing out and for that matter to us too. Keep the company alive and give me a place to retire from one day. New employees to start at 70% of the rate and take 3 years to get to full pay - It beats the hell out of the UAW's two tier wage system where new workers will never see the wages we have bargained over the years (unless there a revolution). Ok I'm thinking it so I might as well say it too........the new hires of late (and not all mind you), what a spoiled lot. Walk in the doors and after their 90 days probation become the most non productive workers I've ever seen. "Ford owes me this job", "I'm going to get a restriction", "the supervisor is harrassing me" bla bla bla.......maybe a little growing in period will do them some good and hey if it was up to me I'd make that 90 days 3 years too. (just a personal observation and you can't say it's not true) The loss of 40 hours EAA every year over the 3 years - Does it suck ......yup, Will you die.....nope.... Why not take a SPA week instead, well SPA's keep utility jobs, EAA on Friday's and Mondays can be covered by TPT's. Where can you walk in off the street and get 104 hours vacation plus two SPA weeks in the first year. Drug co-pay of 10% to a max of 250/270/290 yearly - I have been suprised we kept the 35cents for the last 2 contracts to be truthfull, I do feel for the retirees though and I wish they could be left out of it. We have a decent benefit package....seen much worse and some a little better. Cash on the barrel - As I said earlier I hate bonuses, but hey if they won't move on base rates I'll take what I can get. First off a $2,200 dollar signing bonus, second a one time $3,500 dollar payment to help off set the loss of vacation, finally our annuall 1700 dollar holiday bonus. Year one - 2200 + 3500 + 1700 = $7400 dollars Second year $1700 dollars Third year $1700 dollars Total cash before taxes = 10,800 dollars, put it in an RRSP to maximize it , pay off some debt, check yourself into the Betty Ford clinic to get off the OxyContin addiction......whatever you like. Buy out package increase 75,000 production / 90,000 trades and a $3500.00 car allowance - I hope we never have to use this, but it is their incase of permanent job loss, its not a bonus..........I hope it's not a big carrot to make senior members vote on outsourcing good off line jobs So looking at it as a package the ecconomics of making our position viable for future investment is there, will it hurt a little....sure. Kind of like Buckleys...taste like crap but it works Now this is where it gets intresting - Local issues So the frame work for an agreement is already in place, the National has done their jobs. Now our Local bargaining people are left stranded with nothing to hold Ford hostage with. I can imagine what Ford will do at the Local levels, I predict they will reject all or most of our ammendments put in by the membership, and will be out for more destruction in our workplaces. More restrictions on bidding More De classifing Reduce high rate classifications Multi Task Skilled Trades Outsource Our Cleaners Outsource Shipping Outsource all off line jobs Listen to me when I tell you, this is the time for Oakville to hold firm and vote NO to this agreement, we can all take the ecconomic package, but screw with our jobs and make us work 30 years on the assembly line. JUST SAY NO, GIVE YOUR BARGAINING COMMITTEE THE SUPPORT THEY NEED TO HOLD THEM BACK ON THESE ISSUES. MAKE THE NATIONAL SUPPORT OUR BARGAINING COMMITTEES See you all Sunday at the meeting, bring your Union cards, listen to the whole package, the stuff that will really effect you will be at the very end of the meeting. Edited April 30, 2008 by Thinkaboutit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAC_Sparky Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 Then you should change jobs now because you've got no chance to compete against mexican labor. Do you even have a clue? I'm not even in production, I'm in trades, we keep things running. I don't think you have the ability to even start to do my job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff355 Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 (edited) Anyone else but me think there pushing it through quickly so they can hire new employees for OAC under the new agreement? I know Im not giving up my 3 weeks vacation that my senior brothers and sisters fought hard for in the past without a fight! I wonder if 6 more months of bargaining could help us give up a little less... Edited April 30, 2008 by jeff355 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperPilot Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 It doesn't matter whether it's SPA or EAA, it still has to be covered. Reduce either and it means job loss. At least if it's the SPA week you still have time to book off when you want. Do you want to depend on luck to get that week off for your honeymoon, hunting, that trip you want? Like, what the hell do you do in the second week of January? Shovel snow? If the wife works, the kids are in school, it's not like you can do much. But that's what you'll get if it's a SPA week. You'll take it as a bonus -- but not instead of EAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff355 Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 For myself, I only get 3 weeks vacation. Since 2 are locked in for summer shutdown, I have to give up the only week I get to pick each year? Id also like many others rather have 2 tier, in STAP and at the Windsor site, with the amount of people on layoff, they wouldnt get to utilize it anyway. I see nothing positive in this for the Windsor site so unless Buzz lays a golden egg for us on Sunday, it will be a NO vote from me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViperPilot Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 For myself, I only get 3 weeks vacation. Since 2 are locked in for summer shutdown, I have to give up the only week I get to pick each year? That's the size of it. 20 years. 20 years dammit. 20 years to finally get that last week of vacation -- and I'll be 2 months shy when they take it away. Not too happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trimdingman Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 I do know how much the school janitor makes and it ain't close to what trim makes, not even half. Maybe things are different in Canada but Janitors in the US would be luck to break 38k. I put in my time on the line. If my job gets eliminated, then I will be taking the best job available that my seniority will get me. That means that someone else will have to spend more time on the line. I worked on the line in the 70s and 80s. In those days, if you mentioned ergonomics, you would get blank stares from management. The line to-day is a picnic compared to those days. I could do it standing on my head. Being a janitor requires more knowledge than doing a job on the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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