Police Departments Look to Trade

[rscalzo]

Police Departments Look to Trade in 'Gas Hogs'

Posted: October 9th, 2008 10:54 AM EDT

 

BEN JONES

USA TODAY

 

 

Last year at this time, Mike Cochran, assistant chief of the Lauderhill, Fla., police department, was driving a Ford Crown Victoria cruiser that he says got about 14 miles per gallon.

 

Now, as municipalities count every penny amid the economic crisis, he drives a four-cylinder Chevrolet Malibu that, according the Environmental Protection Agency, gets about 30 mpg on the highway.

 

"We started trying to segue away from the gas hogs," Cochran said. "When we can, and where we can, we are trying to put officers in more fuel-efficient vehicles."

 

A growing number of law enforcement agencies across the USA also are chasing better fuel economy:

 

*The New York City Police Department has about 100 hybrid vehicles in its 5,800-vehicle fleet, Deputy Commissioner Paul Browne said. The vehicles include Toyota Priuses driven by officers who issue parking tickets, he said. Also in the city's fleet are hybrid Honda Accords, GMC Yukons and Ford Escapes, he said.

 

*Seattle police now have 38 hybrids, including Toyota Highlanders, Ford Escapes and Toyota Priuses, according to Bob Miller, the department's fleet analyst. Administrators and detectives use the vehicles.

 

*The St. Landry Parish Sheriff's Department in Louisiana will soon be driving some Nissan Sentras, which get about 35 mpg. The cars will be used by officers who serve court papers, according to Maj. Richard Williams, the department's fleet operations officer.

 

Traditionally, police agencies sought cars with powerful engines, strong suspensions and back seats big enough to haul away criminals. The Ford Crown Victoria Police Interceptor, long the backbone of police fleets nationwide, is still the "the police car of choice, with 80% of the market," said Ford spokesman Dan Jarvis.

 

Those requirements stand, but escalating gas prices have forced police managers to pay closer attention to fuel economy.

 

In Pennsylvania, the Berks-Lehigh Regional Police Department recently added three V-6 Dodge Chargers to its fleet.

 

"It's a savings," said Michael Weiser, chief of the 30-officer department. "Anytime you can save in the budget and save on gasoline, especially with (high) gasoline prices."

 

Stephen Marshall, a Berks-Lehigh officer, has been driving a Charger about six weeks. He said the car is comfortable, has good power and valuable safety features such as stability control.

 

"There is really nothing I can say negative about it," he said.

 

Marshall said his Charger is rated around 21 mpg, but his agency hasn't calculated the car's actual economy yet.

 

"We do use them harder than the average owner would, but we are getting much better (economy) I'm sure than we were from the Crown Vics," he said.

 

Patrol officers in Lauderhill still drive the Fords, but Cochran said his department is considering switching to Chargers to save gas.

 

"Every dollar counts," he said.

 

Jarvis said plans are in the works at Ford to develop a car that offers better fuel economy. "We believe the Crown Vics are the best-equipped police cars," Jarvis said. "We have longer-term plans to offer updated vehicles."

 

Bruce Wiley, products and marketing manager for GM fleet commercial operations, said gas mileage was not a consideration for police agencies in the past.

 

"But as the economy goes south, unfortunately, it is becoming more cause for concern, and people are looking at it," he said. "Fuel costs are a direct impact to their daily operating budget. That's real money they have to keep their arms around."

 

Wiley cautioned that fuel-economy estimates don't take into account differences in individual driver behavior or the demands of the job.

 

"That doesn't mean that the driver is going to see that (estimate) because they are hammering around town with their foot in the radiator constantly," he said.

 

Over the past two years, the Wisconsin State Patrol has purchased about two dozen Chargers. The original reason was so that approaching speeders wouldn't recognize the body style.

 

"Now the price of fuel has gone up, so we are looking more closely at miles per gallon," said Lt. Dave Pabst, the department's fleet manager.

 

Pabst said gas mileage is just one consideration.

 

"You must also factor, what is the overall repair history?" he said. "We're still analyzing that information to see what is the cheaper cost per mile, rather than the cost per gallon."

[wchain]

[rscalzo]

 

 

Bet the Yugo is in the shop......

 

Even my department is moving away from the CV and replacing the marked untis with Dodge Charger. They are too new to know what the result will be.

[chiefstang]

Check out the Cobra badge on the fender! Side exhaust, too!

[rscalzo]

Check out the Cobra badge on the fender! Side exhaust, too!

 

Missed that.........

[MIAMI-DADE]

Bet the Yugo is in the shop......

 

Even my department is moving away from the CV and replacing the marked untis with Dodge Charger. They are too new to know what the result will be.

 

Broward County has been getting a mixed fleet since 06. All Hemis. According to a deputy I spoke to a few weeks ago he said the 06 Chargers were very troublesome with brakes,suspension,hesitation on 3 point turns being some of the issues. The 07 Chargers were a bit better but not by much. The 08 Chargers are much better with most of the issues being addressed. He also said generally after only 20K miles issues start to come up.

 

As far as gas mileage goes the Hemis and the C.V. are getting the same mileage as they drive them very hard. The Sheriff said one of the reasons for getting the Hemis was to save gas as the Hemis drop down to a 4cyl mode when idling.

 

As far as the blind spots go he said you can get used to it. As far as the tiny trunk goes they took out the spare and just call for tow when needed.

 

I think the deputies were told to keep quiet on any issues they might have. It was like pulling teeth to make him talk about it.

Edited October 11, 2008 by MIAMI-DADE

[WC-MAN]

Is the chief having pursuits in that car? Look, I got no problem with anyone using more efficient cars. But, the problem is the insinuation that ALL police vehicles are going to become 4-cyl or hybrids. BTW, check, I doubt those meter readers were driving full-blown crown-vic interceptors.

 

Wasn't the Pacer Police Interceptor replaced by the LeCar PI model? :happy feet:

[Cocheese]

Band aid solution to appease the tree huggers.

 

Once these departments realize all their fuel savings will be spent on repairing their fleet, they'll switch back. My city's department looked at the Charger, but it didn't pass their head mechanic's inspection. I'm sure some departments have or will switch over to smaller cars. But those ones will be used by Officers who aren't on the "front lines".

 

And much like all the press about the CV and the fuel tank fires, the story of these departments switching back will be ignored.

[Bored of Pisteon]

At least they are not buying Toyota Prius vehicles! I just possibly can't see one being used as a cop car. Let alone used for high-speed pursuits!

[rscalzo]

High speed mprisuits are a thing of the past. Any department that gets involved in one is just looking for a civil suit down the road. It is a lose/lose situation.

 

Our chargers have held up as well as the CV they replaced. The old cars just get recycled to other town agencies, one being the Parking Enforcement. The gas mileage around town is much better than the older CV by a wide margin.

[packardbob]

Crown Vic sales were up 2% from last year for the month of September. Word is getting out that the Chargers are typical Chrysler JUNK.

[rscalzo]

2 percent isn't going to keep the CV in production. Some will continue to buy the cars although with the shape most municipal, county and state budgets are in, car purchases are going to take a hit. Add to that, leasing isn't as cheap or available as it once was for agencies. Leasing was the reason agencies purchased cars in greater numbers. Sales of both vehicle will be dropping in the coming months.

[MIAMI-DADE]

Word is getting out that the Chargers are typical Chrysler JUNK.

 

The word isn't getting out fast enough as Dodge is having no problem selling their junk to agencies. It seems I see more and more Chargers everyday in Broward County.

 

But in Miami Dade County where they have a much tighter budget and generally keep their cars for up to 10 years and 150K miles [they have take home cars] so far they are sticking to the Crown Vic. The only other car they use are Impalas but they are for the supervisors. From what I hear Miami isn't crazy about unibody cars for patrol work.

[donzuchowski]

 

priceless! Chrysler should bring back the amc name kill Dodge!

[rscalzo]

But in Miami Dade County

 

Are you with Dade County Public Safety? I good frined from back home is one of the bosses over there.

[MIAMI-DADE]

Are you with Dade County Public Safety? I good friend from back home is one of the bosses over there.

 

The answer to your question is no. I work in Dade County but live in Broward County.

 

From what I hear Dade County Public Safety does a super job.

[BillyTheKid]

Stop calculating all the idle time in the MPG formula, and the Crown Vic is just fine. :boring:

[rscalzo]

Our cars idle very little. They are tracked by GPS and the software will track the stop time in a few keystrokes. The chargers get better mileage. In our city enviroment, the V6 is no detriment to proformance. Cost is an issue at this point. budgets must be geared towards the lower priced vehicles. We get a 125K warrenty on the drivetrain so any problems are the dealers and to date they have been taking care of them.

 

The bottom line is that once we purchase the equipment for the Charger, it cannot be installed in a CV for the most part so our future is the Charger. Other towns are following suit more and more. No different than when the popular Chrysler line of LE faded from view many years back. Then the much more popular Chev. Caprice line. Now it is time for the CV to move over. It's got a few years left but the chances of the line continuing in its present state is nil.

[MIAMI-DADE]

We get a 125K warrenty on the drivetrain so any problems are the dealers and to date they have been taking care of them.

 

The bottom line is that once we purchase the equipment for the Charger, it cannot be installed in a CV for the most part so our future is the Charger. Other towns are following suit more and more. No different than when the popular Chrysler line of LE faded from view many years back. Then the much more popular Chev. Caprice line. Now it is time for the CV to move over. It's got a few years left but the chances of the line continuing in its present state is nil.

 

What kind of warrenty does Ford give to police departments?

 

I was surprised when Broward County went with Dodge while the C.V. is still around because of all the new equipment they had to buy with all the budget cuts. It took them months to figure out how to put the cages in them.

 

Since Broward County bought Hemi V8's instead of the V6's and I really think they should have stayed with the C.V. and that way they would have saved on equipment costs. Why they bought Hemi V8's for local stop and go county driving baffles me. The F.H.P. bought a bunch of Hemi V8's but they need Hemis out on the interstate.

[rscalzo]

I don't remember what the warranty was on the Fords. Standard was the 36000/36 months but we went through that in a matter of a few months. The 125K warranty is an added cost option from out state contract vendor. right out of the box the Chargers are $2000 less than the CV so the savings add up when you buy a few cars a year. That is a big selling point for a large department. I'm surprised that the NJ state Police have stayed with the CV for the time being. As you said, the cost of new supplimentary equipment can add up quickly when you fleet numbers in the hundreds

[WC-MAN]

Once these departments realize all their fuel savings will be spent on repairing their fleet, they'll switch back. My city's department looked at the Charger, but it didn't pass their head mechanic's inspection. I'm sure some departments have or will switch over to smaller cars. But those ones will be used by Officers who aren't on the "front lines".

 

We went through that once in the 80's.

 

BTW, every, let me repeat that, EVERY department in South West Virginia that has bought the Charger all have the same verdict. It makes a Hell of a police car, for about 15-20K miles. Then its totally used up and spends its days in the repair shop.

 

Also, nobody on freakin' earth is going to change from a V-8 Crown-Vic to a V-8 Charger for fuel mileage. The savings aren't there. And the V6 Impala has a better reliability record verses the V6 model.

 

I would worry more about the G8 being adapted to police service rather than anything from Chrysler. Town departments that don't have long high speed roads want vehicles that can stay in the fleet for several years, something the Crown Vic has proven it can do.

[rscalzo]

We had problems with our CV's when they hit the 75K mark. After that they becamse maintenance problems. The chargers aren't in the fleet long enough but with the 125K warrenty, it won't cost anything to keep them going.

 

One other major problem is that with department budgets being squeezed, cost is going to be a major issue. 2k per car is a big chunk of money. Most towns don't need the v-8. Highways units would be well served but in time the v-6 will be putting out v-8 power. One benefit that I'm hearing is the back seat is better in the charger and I found that myself.

 

now that the cab companies are dropping the CV as their mainstay, pd's can't make it worth continuing the production line.

[taxman100]

The Charger will be going away as well with the pending sell off/bankruptcy of Chrysler by their corporate overlords - I don't see their platform surviving the coming CAFE requirements, which will only become more onerous under a Democratic adminstration and Congress.

 

The question becomes will the the Charger die before 2011 and the death of the Panther.

 

What will be left is anybody's guess.

[Bob Rosadini]

We had problems with our CV's when they hit the 75K mark. After that they becamse maintenance problems. The chargers aren't in the fleet long enough but with the 125K warrenty, it won't cost anything to keep them going.

 

One benefit that I'm hearing is the back seat is better in the charger and I found that myself.

 

Problems at 75K??? That's a first! And what becomes of old CV's?? they become Taxis! You are from Epping NH? Go to Boston and 90% of the CV cabs you see still have the "police interceptor" badge on the trunk. And if you drive Rt 16 in Somerville there is a shop that converts them. One day the lot is full of black and whites, Ex Mass SP etc- two days later they are white then gone! And "Abdul" is picking up passengers at Logan!

My current CV is an 07 Sport that is pushing 69,000 miles. It has never been in the shop since it was new. It gets consistant 22+ mpg in average driving and 24.8 at 75 highway. the last one I had, was being driven by one of my kids when he sold it with almost 218,000. the guy who bought it was some sort of exporter who was sending it overseas! I don't think too many Chargers will hit 200k and end up going overseas- unless its scrap going to India!

[Topgun]

Problems at 75K??? That's a first! And what becomes of old CV's?? they become Taxis! You are from Epping NH? Go to Boston and 90% of the CV cabs you see still have the "police interceptor" badge on the trunk. And if you drive Rt 16 in Somerville there is a shop that converts them. One day the lot is full of black and whites, Ex Mass SP etc- two days later they are white then gone! And "Abdul" is picking up passengers at Logan!

My current CV is an 07 Sport that is pushing 69,000 miles. It has never been in the shop since it was new. It gets consistant 22+ mpg in average driving and 24.8 at 75 highway. the last one I had, was being driven by one of my kids when he sold it with almost 218,000. the guy who bought it was some sort of exporter who was sending it overseas! I don't think too many Chargers will hit 200k and end up going overseas- unless its scrap going to India!

Well said Bob, glad to hear the black 07 Sport going strong.