Theology

[Versa-Tech]

Jesus. The fact that this topic is still going serves to prove that some people just can't let things go. I got bored of this months ago and I started it!

[Edstock]

STP has shown me the way.

Try peyote instead.

[macattak1]

Try peyote instead.

 

Ambian CR does not work for me like it used to.

Peyuote probably wont either!

 

Peace and Blessings

[J-150]

If one is hearing voices they should seek a mental health professional and more importantly God. Because that is either a huge mental health issue or a satanic issue.

 

There are definitely a lot of junk churches out there. Judgment will start at the house of God because it has failed so miserably. They failed when Paul was teaching and they are failing now. But church is not mandatory. It is not what saves you.

 

You may have been better off doing those drives then spending time in a broken church.

 

Peace and Blessings

 

 

actually, they flourished at the same time as Paul's church.

 

Paul won because it was his that Constantine chose over the other Christian theologies.

Edited March 24, 2009 by J-150

[J-150]

If Satan is in everything, is he in my toilet too? (I always asked that when my parents told me that God is "everywhere".) :lol:

 

 

I don't know.

 

I had a BM yesterday that could be described as unholy.

[NickF1011]

I don't know.

 

I had a BM yesterday that could be described as unholy.

 

 

TMI.

[macattak1]

actually, they flourished at the same time as Paul's church.

 

Paul won because it was his that Constantine chose over the other Christian theologies.

 

Why would the Catholics choose Paul over their man Peter?

 

Can you provide some things in the bible that are not too severely obscure that you have a challenge with? So that makes most of Revelations off limits for this discussion because virtually no one understands much of revelations.

 

But bring up two or three discussion points and lets talk about them. What is wrong. I can only show you one translation error that I know of and this causes people to follow a Saturday Sabbath by mistake.

 

Peace and Blessings

[macattak1]

I don't know.

 

I had a BM yesterday that could be described as unholy.

 

Holy means set apart, sacred, divine quality, etc.

 

I am pretty sure God has no sacred or set apart turds. So that would make them all UnHoly?

 

Peace and Blessings

[NickF1011]

Holy means set apart, sacred, divine quality, etc.

 

I am pretty sure God has no sacred or set apart turds. So that would make them all UnHoly?

 

Peace and Blessings

 

Well, if we were created in the image of God, would it be assumed that God also has BM's? Would those be Holy?

[J-150]

Why would the Catholics choose Paul over their man Peter?

 

Can you provide some things in the bible that are not too severely obscure that you have a challenge with? So that makes most of Revelations off limits for this discussion because virtually no one understands much of revelations.

 

But bring up two or three discussion points and lets talk about them. What is wrong. I can only show you one translation error that I know of and this causes people to follow a Saturday Sabbath by mistake.

 

Peace and Blessings

 

 

Paul and Peter - same thing. It's all Catholicism.

 

My issue with the Bible is the translation itself.

 

Too many biblical scholars to count have all agreed that the KJ version is corrupt. The translators took it upon themselves to interpret a passage where they could not directly ascribe English to the Greek.

 

Beyond that, before Guttenberg, all copies of the Bible were hand-written. Copy to copy, with minor errors to be continued for many hundreds of years so that by the time Guttenberg gets a copy, it is so full of errors.

 

And we do not have any source documents to prove one way or the other.

 

Then factor in the Nag Hammadi library, plus the societies that have survived from biblical times (such as the Mandeans) and we further see that what is in front of us is: 1) inaccurately translated and 2) missing Gospels

 

I have no problem with the Bible. But I do not like when it is quoted verbatim and told that the errors contained therein are truth. And furthermore, to be called a heretic that I do not believe the words verbatim.

 

 

You see, your understanding of Gnosticism is grossly outdated. What you are refeering to is actually the theology of the Cathars.

 

Gnosticism is Greek for "knowledge" As in Gnostics seek out the truth. We read the Old Testament, the New Testament, the Nag Hammadi Library. We read biblical scholars. We engage in discussions with each other. We read the holy texts of other world religions. All in an effort to understand what it all means. In turn we respect how others worship. Just because I disagree with some of the specifics of your belief system, doesn't mean I think mine is more correct than yours. Is is wrong for me. But that doesn't make it wrong for you. In fact, but the sounds of it, sounds like it works for you quite well.

 

You won't find a more open-minded group of people with regards to religion.

 

Gnostics are not heretics. Gnostics just don't want to take someone else's word for it.

[J-150]

Well, if we were created in the image of God, would it be assumed that God also has BM's? Would those be Holy?

 

 

if you have not done so, you should read the Gospel of Thomas. It is one of the Dead Sea Scolls.

 

It explains a little further what was meant by "In God's image" Which in Thomas' words was not physical. It was spiritual.

 

 

You should note that only John refers to The Christ as God. Mark, Matthew and Luke do not. And Thomas went so far as to say outright that The Christ was human.

 

Thomas also claims that Jesus said that Man is divine. All humans have divinity within them and can reach heaven without a church or rabbi.

 

Wow. 2 huge reasons for the RC Church to suppress this Gospel.

[macattak1]

Well, if we were created in the image of God, would it be assumed that God also has BM's? Would those be Holy?

 

Nope. The image is a spirit or soul. God made us in the image of Himself/ the Son. We have souls. Neither Dogs or Cats or Angels or BM's have souls. Just us. And no, we don't poop out just a little soul when we go.

 

Peace and Blessings

[NickF1011]

Nope. The image is a spirit or soul. God made us in the image of Himself/ the Son. We have souls. Neither Dogs or Cats or Angels or BM's have souls. Just us. And no, we don't poop out just a little soul when we go.

 

Peace and Blessings

 

How do you know dogs don't have souls? All dogs go to heaven! They even made a movie about it!

[J-150]

Nope. The image is a spirit or soul. God made us in the image of Himself/ the Son. We have souls. Neither Dogs or Cats or Angels or BM's have souls. Just us. And no, we don't poop out just a little soul when we go.

 

Peace and Blessings

 

 

that BM I had yesterday had no soul, but I still called out "holy Mary, Mother of God!" as it came out.

[J-150]

How do you know dogs don't have souls? All dogs go to heaven! They even made a movie about it!

 

 

the Hindus feel that animals have souls. That is the basis of reincarnation. To keep coming back as a higher form. Improving yourself each time until you reach Nirvana. Only then do you go to heaven.

 

 

Nick, I think you used to be a bulldog.

[NickF1011]

Nick, I think you used to be a bulldog.

 

Hey, I don't drool nearly as much as I used to! :P

[Trimdingman]

The soul is pure energy. If you die in this universe, your soul jumps to the alternate "you" in a parallel universe. In another 20 years or so, science will have found a cure for aging, and body parts will be regenerated. We do not die. We go on forever. People that have died in your conscious universe, still cohabit with copies of you in alternate universes. You are still alive as long as there is still one alternate "you" somewhere. This would be the same for all living things. It is just multi-dimensional nature.

[J-150]

The soul is pure energy. If you die in this universe, your soul jumps to the alternate "you" in a parallel universe. In another 20 years or so, science will have found a cure for aging, and body parts will be regenerated. We do not die. We go on forever. People that have died in your conscious universe, still cohabit with copies of you in alternate universes. You are still alive as long as there is still one alternate "you" somewhere. This would be the same for all living things. It is just multi-dimensional nature.

 

 

I always wondered how DC Comics came to justify the existence of Bizarro Superman

[macattak1]

Paul and Peter - same thing. It's all Catholicism.

 

My issue with the Bible is the translation itself.

 

Too many biblical scholars to count have all agreed that the KJ version is corrupt. The translators took it upon themselves to interpret a passage where they could not directly ascribe English to the Greek.

 

Beyond that, before Guttenberg, all copies of the Bible were hand-written. Copy to copy, with minor errors to be continued for many hundreds of years so that by the time Guttenberg gets a copy, it is so full of errors.

 

And we do not have any source documents to prove one way or the other.

 

Then factor in the Nag Hammadi library, plus the societies that have survived from biblical times (such as the Mandeans) and we further see that what is in front of us is: 1) inaccurately translated and 2) missing Gospels

 

I have no problem with the Bible. But I do not like when it is quoted verbatim and told that the errors contained therein are truth. And furthermore, to be called a heretic that I do not believe the words verbatim.

 

 

You see, your understanding of Gnosticism is grossly outdated. What you are refeering to is actually the theology of the Cathars.

 

Gnosticism is Greek for "knowledge" As in Gnostics seek out the truth. We read the Old Testament, the New Testament, the Nag Hammadi Library. We read biblical scholars. We engage in discussions with each other. We read the holy texts of other world religions. All in an effort to understand what it all means. In turn we respect how others worship. Just because I disagree with some of the specifics of your belief system, doesn't mean I think mine is more correct than yours. Is is wrong for me. But that doesn't make it wrong for you. In fact, but the sounds of it, sounds like it works for you quite well.

 

You won't find a more open-minded group of people with regards to religion.

 

Gnostics are not heretics. Gnostics just don't want to take someone else's word for it.

 

But you creat your own problem. If any part of scripture (not the translations) are false then it all may as well be false. So why do you read the NT and OT when you don't believe that the original copies from ~300 AD and earlier were accurate? That just does not make sense to me. If you doubt it you have to doubt it all.

 

Peter taught the Jews. Paul taught the Gentiles. Two totally different people and teachings.

 

Anyone who says the KJV is corrupt is correct. All Translations are Corrupt. It is not scripture. It is a translation. But the KJV was created from copies of the original manuscripts. The Textus Receptus. That Catholics also used this does not mean it is false. The catholics use many things. One of which being Latin. Something neither the gospels were ever recorded in or something that their own people could read. But if you believe that the Textus Receptus is corrupt then I really do not see how you can believe in anything 'Christ Like'??? You would have to have a Rosetta Stone. KJV is just a translation with errors. Far fewer errors than most any other bible because is uses the oldest copies of the originals possible. Again, if that is not good enough I easily understand. But then there is nothing to believe. I use Blueletterbible.com to correct translation errors such as Mat 28:1. Why they made that error I have no idea.

 

Further, it is written on a Child of God's heart to know the truth. And the Holy Spirit was sent as a helper to aid us in understanding.

 

Guttenburg translated his Latin from the Vulgate which is Latin commissioned by the pop. Not something I would use. TR is just a copy. But a copy of the original texts. Some of those texts were only ~100 years old at the time.

 

We have found many documents like the dead sea scrolls and they have in no way refuted the original copies that I know of.

 

Not to be rude. But what does reading texts that you claim are so broken and worthless and reading all of them or some of them and then adding in other world religions do? Open mindedness toward religion is not necessarily a good thing. Trying to read a 1000 things into one sentence of God's Word is not a positive. Your position just makes no sense to me. Nothing is accurate so I read all sorts of stuff to come up with my own version and we Gnostics all have our own versions to ourselves? Is that what I am supposed to understand?

 

If you know what is right you should be shouting sharing it as God says to do. If you know what is right and it conflicts with what I know then only one of us can have the truth. The Truth is not subjective. There is only one truth. For you to say you know it and it is true and mine is false does not bother me at all. I do not take it as an insult. I don't fight over the Word and I don't have to defend Scripture.

 

I won't call you heretic, etc. Insulting you won't help my/(what I believe God's) cause. If I insult you it is of my own sinful nature and stupidity. But just like you who do not want me to go astray and to lead others astray I am in the same position.

 

It is not a secrete that with our human wisdom we have to elevate ourselves to find the truth. It is not a competition, available only to the few. God protects His Word. Be it in the KVJ or even an NIV or others many of which I dislike greatly for their never ending errors. Regardless, God protects His Word. He does not show us to travel here or there or read this and this and that. He gave us the OT and the NT for a reason.

 

Again. Feel free to gather some NT topic in which you think the NT has wrong. Not that people today or the churches today has wrong, but what the NT has wrong.

 

I am not overly open minded towards other religions.

 

Islam is false and contradicts itself all over the place.

Hinduisms has like 300k gods.

Buddhism is not true. It is just man thinking highly of himself.

Mormonism was created by a lier and breaks against Jesus' teaching on nearly every page. Well, every page of the Book of Mormon.

JW's got half of it right and half of it wrong.

Same with 7th dayers.

Ancestry worship.

Current day Prophets worship.

Nation of Islam UFOs.

 

It is all very dangerous if you ask me. A lot of people believe in it. But there is only one truth, one way.

 

 

Peace and Blessings

[NickF1011]

It is all very dangerous if you ask me. A lot of people believe in it. But there is only one truth, one way.

 

See, this is the part I find most amusing about all of this:

 

You are just as convinced your way is the only way as anyone else who follows any other religion. You will change nobody's mind. They won't change yours. You have zero way of showing your way is any more right than anyone else's. Nobody else has any way of showing that their way is any more right than yours. It simply comes down to what you believe. If you believe you are right, so be it. But you're not going to convince anyone else that they are wrong.

[J-150]

Not to be rude. But what does reading texts that you claim are so broken and worthless and reading all of them or some of them and then adding in other world religions do? Open mindedness toward religion is not necessarily a good thing. Trying to read a 1000 things into one sentence of God's Word is not a positive. Your position just makes no sense to me. Nothing is accurate so I read all sorts of stuff to come up with my own version and we Gnostics all have our own versions to ourselves? Is that what I am supposed to understand?

 

 

I take all of those texts directionally, not verbatim.

 

And guess what? There is about 90% overlap between them, wwith basically the names, dates and places being the only difference.

[J-150]

Islam is false and contradicts itself all over the place.

 

Funny. The Jews same the same thing when the Cristians came along. And guess what? Christianity and the NT have just as many contridictions.

 

Hinduisms has like 300k gods.

define "gods" Christianity is panthionistic as well if you inclue the Trinity plus the divinity of angels. Many of those 300+ gods are very much like angels. So on an apples to apples comparison, they are the same.

 

Buddhism is not true. It is just man thinking highly of himself.

Buddhism is an offshoot of Hinduism. You should study it a bit more. It is about getting closer to God

 

 

Mormonism was created by a lier and breaks against Jesus' teaching on nearly every page. Well, every page of the Book of Mormon.

some Jews claimed that Jesus was a liar too. God sent many prophets over the years. Who are we to say that he didn't send prophets after Jesus to get us back on track?

 

JW's got half of it right and half of it wrong.

they say the same about you.

 

Same with 7th dayers.

Ancestry worship.

Current day Prophets worship.

Nation of Islam UFOs.

 

don't forget Christain Scientists, Scientology, Moonies, etc etc etc.

 

I don't give much support or respect to any sect that puts their own human leader above any supreme plan for their own advancement in life.

[macattak1]

See, this is the part I find most amusing about all of this:

 

You are just as convinced your way is the only way as anyone else who follows any other religion. You will change nobody's mind. They won't change yours. You have zero way of showing your way is any more right than anyone else's. Nobody else has any way of showing that their way is any more right than yours. It simply comes down to what you believe. If you believe you are right, so be it. But you're not going to convince anyone else that they are wrong.

 

That is incorrect. Love is the difference. God's love for us, His sacrifice for us. Our fall and evil nature. No other religion teaches that we Can Not save ourselves. All other religions are about us saving ourselves or are just about a higher level of existence, wisdom, etc.

 

Most other religions don't spread their teachings because they are not interested in spreading the faith, they are interested in high knowledge for each individual person however and where ever you get it.

 

Christianity is about being Christ Like. It in no way advocates Inquisitions, Crusades, Pops, secrete rituals, being rich or being poor, being smarter. Christianity is not about Me it is about Others.

 

And peoples minds are changed all the time. Ethiopia at one time was one of the most Christian nations. Then Islam came with its Old Wine testimony and did what Mohammad teaches.

 

Tibet is one of the most back world nations ever and not because its people are simply dumb. But because the elites used the ignorant for centuries as workers and providers while they saught out their Own spirituality and they would still be doing it today if China was not there. You want no electricity in Africa, there was not even a concept of it in Tibet.

 

No other religion has prophecy that has ever shown itself to be true. Scripture is full of this. Through quality missionary work people are changed every day. By the love and devotion and caring that Christians show the world in each of those peoples lives in all corners of the world.

 

There are no Atheists in a Fox hole.

 

Peace and Blessings

[NickF1011]

That is incorrect. Love is the difference. God's love for us, His sacrifice for us. Our fall and evil nature. No other religion teaches that we Can Not save ourselves. All other religions are about us saving ourselves or are just about a higher level of existence, wisdom, etc.

 

Most other religions don't spread their teachings because they are not interested in spreading the faith, they are interested in high knowledge for each individual person however and where ever you get it.

 

Christianity is about being Christ Like. It in no way advocates Inquisitions, Crusades, Pops, secrete rituals, being rich or being poor, being smarter. Christianity is not about Me it is about Others.

 

And peoples minds are changed all the time. Ethiopia at one time was one of the most Christian nations. Then Islam came with its Old Wine testimony and did what Mohammad teaches.

 

Tibet is one of the most back world nations ever and not because its people are simply dumb. But because the elites used the ignorant for centuries as workers and providers while they saught out their Own spirituality and they would still be doing it today if China was not there. You want no electricity in Africa, there was not even a concept of it in Tibet.

 

No other religion has prophecy that has ever shown itself to be true. Scripture is full of this. Through quality missionary work people are changed every day. By the love and devotion and caring that Christians show the world in each of those peoples lives in all corners of the world.

 

There are no Atheists in a Fox hole.

 

Peace and Blessings

 

What about ANY of that makes it any more true? You sure know the Christian talking points, I'll give you that. But none of that malarkey makes any of it more believable to me.

[J-150]

That is incorrect. Love is the difference. God's love for us, His sacrifice for us. Our fall and evil nature. No other religion teaches that we Can Not save ourselves. All other religions are about us saving ourselves or are just about a higher level of existence, wisdom, etc.

 

Most other religions don't spread their teachings because they are not interested in spreading the faith, they are interested in high knowledge for each individual person however and where ever you get it.

 

Christianity is about being Christ Like. It in no way advocates Inquisitions, Crusades, Pops, secrete rituals, being rich or being poor, being smarter. Christianity is not about Me it is about Others.

 

And peoples minds are changed all the time. Ethiopia at one time was one of the most Christian nations. Then Islam came with its Old Wine testimony and did what Mohammad teaches.

 

Tibet is one of the most back world nations ever and not because its people are simply dumb. But because the elites used the ignorant for centuries as workers and providers while they saught out their Own spirituality and they would still be doing it today if China was not there. You want no electricity in Africa, there was not even a concept of it in Tibet.

 

No other religion has prophecy that has ever shown itself to be true. Scripture is full of this. Through quality missionary work people are changed every day. By the love and devotion and caring that Christians show the world in each of those peoples lives in all corners of the world.

 

There are no Atheists in a Fox hole.

 

Peace and Blessings

 

 

You are very incorrect in your interpretation of world religions.

 

You should learn more about them before you make such claims.