macattack Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/05/06/bu...ry4996099.shtml Chrysler may be off the hook. IF they didn't pay it back...then neither would GM and so why would FORD go to such lengths so as not to take any gov.money? In 1978 Chrysler had to pay it back and I'm sure 10/15 billion dollars now won't be forgiven. I'm sure Chrys.will try not to pay it back but I think there's no other way for them not too. People are mad enough about them getting the money in the first place....not to pay it back would start a avalanche of business' to do the same thing.Rest assured the Gov.will get their money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hard-Drivin' Man Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 IF they didn't pay it back...then neither would GM and so why would FORD go to such lengths so as not to take any gov.money? In 1978 Chrysler had to pay it back and I'm sure 10/15 billion dollars now won't be forgiven. I'm sure Chrys.will try not to pay it back but I think there's no other way for them not too. People are mad enough about them getting the money in the first place....not to pay it back would start a avalanche of business' to do the same thing.Rest assured the Gov.will get their money. I wouldn't be so sure about that. It's my understanding that the initial loan which helped Chrysler get to court, and the next loan which will get them through court(debtor-in-possession financing), will be forgiven completely. Now, the final loan, which will be given as Chrysler exits bankruptcy court, will be expected to be paid back. But, only the third and final loan, given as exit financing will repaid. I could be wrong, but that is the way I read it. Hell, Daimler forgave something like $2 billion just days ago, plus they contributed something like $600 million to the UAW VEBA. Then, the bondholders just capitulated and gave up all demands for any kind of profit off of their investments. They're all going to take a bath on this thing. Everybody is giving away the store in order to get Chrysler back in business. Also, someone(Len A?) made a good point earlier about why Ford will not take any government money, and it seemed to make sense. The Ford family would have to give up their super voting rights if the government got involved. And I don't think the Fords want the government meddling in any of their family business, unless it's absolutely necessary. Plus, Ford is gaining market share because they've got all of their ducks in a row, including working capital, quality vehicles, new models due soon, Ford Motor Credit Leasing, and the blessing of the American public because they are not taking any government money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0824sgt Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Another reason Ford did not want money from the tarp is they now qualify for low interest reinvestment loans that is being made available by the govt to companies that need capitol to make their products greener and more fuel efficient! The name of program escapes me right now but any companies that took tarp money do not qualify for this separate stimulous money! So right now Ford is the only one of the D3 that can apply for it! This should be good for all of us at some point! :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Goose Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 If you look at the Chrysler concessions and to our, the only big difference is that Chrysler is going to a two trade system (Electrical and mechanical). I wonder if that is what Ford wants. I agree with you pioneer. The dual trades agreement seems to be the biggest difference. That and the elimination of dental and vision from retirees healthcare is my best guess what Ford is after here. On all this vote no chatter...I'll vote no as well on any further givebacks except for what Chrysler has with their new trade agreement, but we should all realize if we do it will surely mean Ford will close more plants and move more jobs overseas unless The International grows some balls and decides to stop them. This outsourcing has to stop and right now the ball is in The Internationals court.....what ya gonna do Brother Gettlefinger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lquidspine Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 That and the elimination of dental and vision from retirees healthcare is my best guess what Ford is after here. Unfortunately the VEBA committee when they take control can make adjustments to the benefits to keep inline with the funds current assets. So in short they will simply take dental and vision from the retiree's and there is nothing even the active worker can do about it, and I would say its a safe bet as soon as they can they will cut these benefits. If only we had a committee to oversee outgoing leaderships benefits, and make adjustments as we saw fit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duanesz Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 Chrysler got the mech/elect thing but they also pay skilled their rate when or if they return to the line. Ford now pays what ever the job you go to rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlk725 Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 LOL, I AGREE WITH YOU 100%! I TOLD THESE SPINELESS FUCKERS IF YOU VOTE "YES" IT WON'T BE THE END OF IT, IN 6 MONTHS TIME THEY'LL BE BACK FOR MORE..............AND IT AIN'T EVEN BEEN 6 MONTHS! EXCACTLY, NOW THEY WANNA CRY ABOUT GIVING UP MORE.....FUCKIN' PLEASE! NOW IS THE TIME TO GO GET YER BALLS OUT OF YER WIFES PURSE AND BE A MAN AND VOTE "NO"!!!!!! When you go back to 2005 with the 3% raise we gave up and the cola diversions and everything we recently gave up and calculate it to 2011 that adds up to almost $35000 apiece. this is a savings to ford of nearly 1.5 Billion dollars. Dont you think it is time the union and company sacrifices a similar amount before they ask for more. you know "equity of sacrifice" and all that BS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Wahrheit Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 When you go back to 2005 with the 3% raise we gave up and the cola diversions and everything we recently gave up and calculate it to 2011 that adds up to almost $35000 apiece. this is a savings to ford of nearly 1.5 Billion dollars. Dont you think it is time the union and company sacrifices a similar amount before they ask for more. you know "equity of sacrifice" and all that BS. WOW! YOU still dont get it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 VOTE YES! You are that dumb. Let me explain something to you while you are so bent on this voting thing. If the UAW bring anything back in front of us to vote, you can believe its going to pass. So dont worry yourself with which way yoyu are going to vote cause it wont matter. Like I said before show up at work and do your job. That is all you can do. Such sheep. I suppose the Germans told the Jews on the train the same thing. So much for "The Truth". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2feet Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 WOW! YOU still dont get it! I keep reading your posts but there is never any clarification of your wonderful insights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplesituations Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I keep reading your posts but there is never any clarification of your wonderful insights. I have asked the same but still no response Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 I have asked the same but still no response Then you must not get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplesituations Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 Then you must not get it. do you?????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rn4 Posted May 13, 2009 Share Posted May 13, 2009 do you?????????? Yea I"m retired. :reading: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.