Brazil is roadmap for U.S. rebound

[RichardJensen]

http://www.detroitnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a.../708220406/1148 Edited August 22, 2007 by RichardJensen

[pcsario]

Like I said, they'll need to make a drastic improvement if they're basing their future on this.

[RichardJensen]

Like I said, they'll need to make a drastic improvement if they're basing their future on this.

Didn't I see you at the fair this weekend giving rides to kids?

 

 

You, who clamors for the elimination of the UAW, for flex assembly, blah blah blah, have the nerve to get all snippy at an actual real life demonstration of the things you want?

 

----

 

On an unrelated note, this looks surprisingly similar to Henry's Rouge complex scaled back a bit. Just about everything assembled on side lines and fed into the central vehicle assembly line.

 

The more things change.........

[RichardJensen]

The comments above refer to this Detroit News article: http://www.detroitnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a.../708220407/1148

 

already posted by ANTAUS

[pcsario]

You, who clamors for the elimination of the UAW...

Actually, if you've noticed I haven't mentioned them for weeks now, wanna know why?

 

Because I changed my mind, noticed Ford was awfully close to getting the worldwide record for recalls a few months back, long before the 3.6m incident, which just made it official.

 

That kinda enlightened me a bit. I figured out I was being unfair with the UAW. Sure, I think some changes need to take place, but lets not kid ourselves. Whatever savings come from raping the UAW won't go back to product, Ford NA will just pocket the savings and not change a thing. Why?

 

Simple, that's the Ford NA way: "Save now, pay later."

Edited August 22, 2007 by pcsario

[mlhm5]

The Ford family controls about 40% of Ford's outstanding shares, and if they don't think it is a good idea, it is not going to happen.

 

Methinks if they unloaded 50% of their holdings, now the stock would jump 20+% or more overnight.

[RichardJensen]

Actually, if you've noticed I haven't mentioned them for weeks now, wanna know why?

No.

[pcsario]

[Kev-Mo]

Actually, if you've noticed I haven't mentioned them for weeks now, wanna know why?

 

Because I changed my mind, noticed Ford was awfully close to getting the worldwide record for recalls a few months back, long before the 3.6m incident, which just made it official.

 

That kinda enlightened me a bit. I figured out I was being unfair with the UAW. Sure, I think some changes need to take place, but lets not kid ourselves. Whatever savings come from raping the UAW won't go back to product, Ford NA will just pocket the savings and not change a thing. Why?

 

Simple, that's the Ford NA way: "Save now, pay later."

 

 

Real Life Example # 1

Ford recalls my 10 yr old F-150 to replace a cruise control switch that might be faulty and cause a fire. Replaced free of charge with a better design that will greatly reduce the probably of failure.

 

Real Life Example # 2

My wife’s Lexus SC 300 has two glaring safety defects; first, the wheels corrode around the beads and the tires won’t hold pressure. Second, the headlight housings fill up with water. I say to the guy at the Lexus service counter “these are safety issues, should there not be some kind of recall”? He just laughs at me and says: “Lexus does not have recalls, our customers like their cars so much, they just pay to have them fixed”.

 

Pcsario, tell me, based on the two stories above, which auto company cares more about the customer?

Edited August 22, 2007 by Kev-Mo

[jpd80]

When Ford launched its Brazil turnaround, most of the cars and trucks it sold were older models that had not kept pace with Brazilian consumers' increasingly sophisticated tastes. The company knew it needed better products to drive its recovery. So, even as Ford moved to close older factories, it invested millions in a new plant and new products as part of its top secret "Project Amazon."

 

The plant, completed in October 2001, was built in Camaçari, in the rural northeastern state of Bahia, where labor was cheap and government incentives rich. It is one of the most advanced auto factories in the world, leaner and more flexible than any other Ford plant.

 

The "Way Forward" formula was proved in Brazil. We're only seeing the first part of it, the plant closures and reductions. Reading the article I noticed that a cornerstone to the Ford Brazil turrnaround was the new Factory and new products that consumers raved over.

It's this second part that most are anxious to see in North America.

 

Rather than building a new super plant like in Brazil, I see Ford increasing the flexibility of remaining plants and the new products arriving progressively from 2009 on.

 

To the average person, it looks like Ford is dying but that's the exact opposite to what's actually happening.

 

If you live in the negative, every day is a disaster, yet Ford made a profit last quarter while only using half of the sale proceeds from Aston Martin. I know the Q2 and Q4 results will be tough but I sense that Mulally and the critics were genuinely surprised by the Q2 profit

Edited August 22, 2007 by jpd80

[pcsario]

which auto company cares more about the customer?

 

I doubt your problems would make your Lexus burst into flames.

 

As some member proved here with a topic that was bumped, Ford plays dumb as much as it can too, and the poor little guy only got denial & torches here, instead of help and support.

 

I really don't defend recalls for any automaker, but lets face it, Ford is among the worst.

Edited August 22, 2007 by pcsario

[BlackHorse]

Ford played dumb as much as it could.

 

Well, they'll never be as good at is as you pc old buddy. But then you have natural talent to fall back on in that area.

[igor]

I doubt your problems would make your Lexus burst into flames.

 

As some member proved here with a topic that was bumped, Ford played dumb as much as it could.

how about unintended acceleration or airbags that do not deploy .... have you been IGNORING the news just to avoid the information about two HUGE issues with Lexus that Lexus refuses to recall?

 

Igor

[RichardJensen]

As some member proved here with a topic that was bumped, Ford played dumb as much as it could, and only got denial here.

You tool. The failure of the brake pressure switch would not cause the sudden unintended acceleration described in that topic.

[pcsario]

igor I'm not defending what Lexus is doing.

Edited August 22, 2007 by pcsario

[jpd80]

how about unintended acceleration or airbags that do not deploy .... have you been IGNORING the news just to avoid the information about two HUGE issues with Lexus that Lexus refuses to recall?

 

Igor

That's because pcsario has issues with Ford and wants to single them out.

What type of recall doesn't matter to him - a recall is a recall is a recall.

Yet some involve potential problems with no incident

while others are actual life threatening problems that have occurred.

[igor]

igor I'm not defending what Lexus is doing.

but you positioned it as "better in the post I quoted" - which it is not ... not in terms of recalls - Ford has not had a major recall on post 2004MY vehicle (that is 3 modely years of cars now) .... few other automakers can say that.

 

Igor

[Kev-Mo]

I doubt your problems would make your Lexus burst into flames.

 

As some member proved here with a topic that was bumped, Ford plays dumb as much as it can too, and the poor little guy only got denial & torches here, instead of help and support.

 

I really don't defend recalls for any automaker, but lets face it, Ford is among the worst.

 

 

I think rims that allow air to leak from tires to the point of going flat is about as serious a safety defect as you can possibly have!

 

Funny thing, the guy at Lexus admitted that the rims were defective! Even while he told me in complete arrogance that they don't do recalls. When I called around for aftermarket rims, I would describe the problem, and the guys at the tire/wheel dealers would say "Lexus"?.

[Kev-Mo]

Name one company that makes a perfect product/service.

 

 

Compared to every other product/service that I spend my money on - my two 10 year old Fords are by far, and I mean BY FAR the most reliable products I have.

 

Folks who trash Ford for recalls ought to start minding their own shop!

Edited August 22, 2007 by Kev-Mo

[FordBuyer]

how about unintended acceleration or airbags that do not deploy .... have you been IGNORING the news just to avoid the information about two HUGE issues with Lexus that Lexus refuses to recall?

 

Igor

 

Don't forget the Nissan Altima of last year that could not be sold for about 6 weeks as Nissan engineers tried to figure out why engine was prone to oil fires. Sales fell drastically of course, and then Nissan comes out with new Altima this year and all is forgiven. Ditto for Nissan 350Z which has had many issues too many to even list here. And don't forget Honda's massive recall of few years ago with faulty ignition switches that meant possible fires a la Ford.

[FordBuyer]

I think rims that allow air to leak from tires to the point of going flat is about as serious a safety defect as you can possibly have!

 

Funny thing, the guy at Lexus admitted that the rims were defective! Even while he told me in complete arrogance that they don't do recalls. When I called around for aftermarket rims, I would describe the problem, and the guys at the tire/wheel dealers would say "Lexus"?.

 

 

I don't think Toyota is capable of handling massive recalls with its skimpy dealer force. Each dealership sells thousand of cars/year and have limited number of service bays. Recently Automotive News reported that each Toyota Dealership would have to add six service bays, and many of the dealerships want to sue Toyota over this as many don't even have enough room to build that many extra bays, and expense is considerable even if they do have room. Maybe Toyota knows something about how far its quality has dropped and knows it will need many more service bays in future to keep customers happy, and most Toyota customers are happy with their car, but not their dealership. In fact, many Toyota customers after turning in their vehicles buy competitors vehicle next time because of lousy Toyota Dealership service. Every valid quality survey shows Toyota quality dropping. It may still be best with Honda, but the gap is narrowing significantly between them and the domestics. Ford just needs to stay on top of things and stay in business to catch up sooner than later.

[BlackHorse]

I agree with what you said about Toyota service FordBuyer. But I would strongly caution you not to underestimate them. For example, we have a Toyota dealer here that for some years was offering up the usual crappy service in the service department. But then a dealer 20 miles down the road came along and they made emphasis on giving top notch customer service in the service department. Pretty soon buyers were going there and taking their cars the distance for the better service. Now the more local dealer is making great strides to improve their own customer service. Toyota will look at the issue, figure out they have a customer service problem, and fix it. The advantage they have is that their company doesn't have nearly the levels of bureaucracy to cut through that the domestics do. So they can see a problem, come up with a solution and implement a fix pretty quickly.

[RichardJensen]

Now the more local dealer is making great strides to improve their own customer service. Toyota will look at the issue, figure out they have a customer service problem, and fix it.

That's not Toyota. That's the local dealer. Look at SSI scores for Toyota. They are consistently in the crapper.

[FordBuyer]

I agree with what you said about Toyota service FordBuyer. But I would strongly caution you not to underestimate them. For example, we have a Toyota dealer here that for some years was offering up the usual crappy service in the service department. But then a dealer 20 miles down the road came along and they made emphasis on giving top notch customer service in the service department. Pretty soon buyers were going there and taking their cars the distance for the better service. Now the more local dealer is making great strides to improve their own customer service. Toyota will look at the issue, figure out they have a customer service problem, and fix it. The advantage they have is that their company doesn't have nearly the levels of bureaucracy to cut through that the domestics do. So they can see a problem, come up with a solution and implement a fix pretty quickly.

 

 

Let's hope not to the benefit if Ford. And don't forget building six new service bays as Toyota has ordered will be vexing at best. I don't know where you live Blackhorse, but the Honda and Toyota dealers around me had been open 7 days a week from 9-10 pm except for Sundays when they closed at 6 pm. I was talking to some sales people who were pretty upset over this as were the service people who had to work those hours also. Morale was terrible. So about year ago those dealerships around me closed on sundays and cut back their hours during week to avoid a mutiny. The customers loved those Walmart hours, but the employes hated it. And I'm sure service suffered wtih burnt out employes having enough. Not much of an existence for the employes being at dealerships all the time with no days off. I know many of their best employes quit and went to dealerships with sane hours even if it meant less money. Maybe it saved their marriages and kids.

[jpd80]

How do your warranties work in the USA?

Over here in Aus, you can have your car serviced by any reputable company and

provided you keep up your services and have hand book signed, your warranty is valid.

Where I live Reef City Ford were servicing their own Fords as well as disgruntled Nissans,

Holdens (GM), Hyundais and Mazdas. That really shook up dealers, now they're much better.

Our local Ford dealer is that busy, you have to book your service 1-2 weeks ahead.

Edited August 22, 2007 by jpd80