Too many CUV's coming out

[foxrun]

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/arti...E/60410001/1041

[Red Star]

Its a fastest growing market so everybody wants to be part of it.

[fllcobra]

It looks like Saturn came prepared to appeal to the under 35 years-of-age crowd. The Outlook looks like it is going to be prepared to go head to head with the Edge. Not too sure about the Aura though... looks like Saturn tamed down the front end and blanded it up a bit.

[RangeRover]

It looks like Saturn came prepared to appeal to the under 35 years-of-age crowd. The Outlook looks like it is going to be prepared to go head to head with the Edge. Not too sure about the Aura though... looks like Saturn tamed down the front end and blanded it up a bit.

 

I agree that the outlook is a nice vehicle. However, everytime I see it I think "It's a Saturn". Does anyone else feel that way? I think that if this vehicle has limited success it will be because people don't realy think about Saturn when they are car shopping. They are kind of this mystical brand that a friend of a friend drives.

[Michael Reynolds]

I agree that the outlook is a nice vehicle. However, everytime I see it I think "It's a Saturn". Does anyone else feel that way? I think that if this vehicle has limited success it will be because people don't realy think about Saturn when they are car shopping. They are kind of this mystical brand that a friend of a friend drives.

 

I agree, and I'm not really sure how that came to be. Not because I think of the brand as rubbish, but because they've never made a vehicle that appeals to me.

[2005Explorer]

I predict that Ford will have a lot of success with the Edge and an updated Freestyle. If there is one thing that Ford has always been good at is these types of vehicles. What is happening to the CUV market is the same thing that happened to the SUV market in the early 1990's. The Edge should compete well and I would not be suprised if it does not quickly jump to the head of it's class. It all depends if Ford got the packaging, price, and style right. By next year at this time we should have some idea where it is going.

[BORG]

The Outlook is as large as the Explorer, it's not going for the Edge.

 

The Freestyle is a failed venture and Ford will attempt to phase in a corrected D3 CUV before this decade is over. Ford tried but failed to get a jump on the large CUV market.

Edited April 12, 2006 by BORG

[bec5150]

I agree that the outlook is a nice vehicle. However, everytime I see it I think "It's a Saturn". Does anyone else feel that way? I think that if this vehicle has limited success it will be because people don't realy think about Saturn when they are car shopping. They are kind of this mystical brand that a friend of a friend drives.

Saturn was a fantastic idea, a great investment by GM to get the Japanese business. HOwever, they never showed a profit in the first years and GM got nervous, turning it into a rebadged GM brand. When they came out with the midsized car (name escapes me) which was a rebadged Opel and was JUNK that was the end of Saturn. Now they are just another GM division.

 

Sad, really.

[BORG]

They are taking the same approach with Saturn as they took with Oldsmobile before the end of its life.

[NickF1011]

The Outlook is as large as the Explorer, it's not going for the Edge.

 

The Freestyle is a failed venture and Ford will attempt to phase in a corrected D3 CUV before this decade is over. Ford tried but failed to get a jump on the large CUV market.

 

Freestyle? Failed venture? It's already the best-selling CUV on the market if I recall.

[Bluecon]

I predict that Ford will have a lot of success with the Edge and an updated Freestyle. If there is one thing that Ford has always been good at is these types of vehicles. What is happening to the CUV market is the same thing that happened to the SUV market in the early 1990's. The Edge should compete well and I would not be suprised if it does not quickly jump to the head of it's class. It all depends if Ford got the packaging, price, and style right. By next year at this time we should have some idea where it is going.

Isn't that what you said about the 500?

[Michael Reynolds]

Isn't that what you said about the 500?

 

This coming from someone that has about as much insight as Miss Cleo. Why don't you give it up already?

Edited April 12, 2006 by Michael Reynolds

[Bluecon]

This coming from someone that has about as much insight as Miss Cleo. Why don't you give it up already?

You ever think of MYOB.

 

You're like the Barney Fife of BON.

Who gave you the job of telling people what they should write on BON.

 

And just in case you didn't notice, the 500 is a failure the Fusion sales are weak. As I predicted.

 

And the Edge is not going to be no 200k seller.

Make Oakville flex and give them the 4 door Mustang.

[Michael Reynolds]

You ever think of MYOB.

 

You're like the Barney Fife of BON.

Who gave you the job of telling people what they should write on BON.

 

And just in case you didn't notice, the 500 is a failure the Fusion sales are weak. As I predicted.

 

And the Edge is not going to be no 200k seller.

Make Oakville flex and give them the 4 door Mustang.

 

Again funny. When have I said what people should and should not write about around here? Quote me on it and I'll shut up.

 

You predicted that the Fusion wouldn't sell over 10K units for the month of March, then when you were called out on it you doubled back and made up some random excuse. The quality of your posts are lacking, and the only thing we end up with from you is sarcastic banter and gross over generalizations. To top it all off you see that Jeep made a 4 door version of the Wrangler, and then you immediately jump the gun and to make it seem as if the same thing can be done with the Mustang platform (talk about comparing apples to oranges).

 

Why all of a sudden does Ford need to move 200,000 Edges a year? Oh I forgot it's all volume with you, if the volume isn't there then the car is a failure, the hell with economic profits and bottom lines. For the last time VOLUME does not always equal HIGH PROFITS. What part of that do you not understand?

 

If you are going to BS at least be consistent with it. :rolleyes: Call me what you want to, but you are tiresome.

Edited April 12, 2006 by Michael Reynolds

[Bluecon]

Again funny. When have I said what people should and should not write about around here? Quote me on it and I'll shut up.

 

You predicted that the Fusion wouldn't sell over 10K units for the month of March, then when you were called out on it you doubled back and made up some random excuse. The quality of your posts are lacking, and the only thing we end up with from you is sarcastic banter and gross over generalizations. To top it all off you see that Jeep made a 4 door version of the Wrangler, and then you immediately jump the gun and to make it seem as if the same thing can be done with the Mustang platform (talk about comparing apples to oranges).

 

If you are going to BS at least be consistent with it. :rolleyes: Call me what you want to, but you are tiresome.

The Ford attack ostrich crowd makes it impossible to have an intelligent debate on this forum.

 

I find it humorous that if anybody makes any mention that the Fusion is not a great seller (the truth despite the Ford spin) or if Ford management is criticized they are immediately and rudely attacked.

 

Is this a Ford inferiority complex?

Or are you people Ford employees who cannot withstand honest critisism?

Or does Ford pay you to defend the indefensible?

Do you people really think Ford is on the track to success?

 

Ford is a company without a plan and attacking the messenger will not solve the problem.

 

If you go on Allpar and say the Commander is not selling or the Charger is not selling you will not have some obnoxious windbag attack the post. There will be an intelligent discussion of the facts.

[Michael Reynolds]

How can you formulate an 'intelligent debate' on a vehicle that hasn't even been on sale for a year? Better yet how do you expect for people to respond to your posts when you predict failure of a product, based upon the fact that you don't like it?

 

Why is it that anytime anyone around here attempts to use basic logic they are accused of being paid by Ford or working for the company (neither are applicable)? Do you actually think Ford would pay someone to provide good PR on a message board? If I did work for Ford, you would be damn'd right that I would take pride in the organization that puts food on the table and a roof over my head, especially if I were happy there.

 

For someone that is so intelligent and insightfull, I've always found it funny how quickly you jump to call people out of their name. It's either one or the other, if you're head was screwed on so tight I would think the facts and ideas you post would be sufficent enough to stand on their own.

 

For someone that is so intelligent you sure tend to ignore basic economics, make blanket statements without having financials or numbers in front of you, and make wild comparisions and assumptions.

 

Who here claims that Ford is perfect, again if I (or anyone else has said it) I'd like to know when and where? Ford has had more than it's share of screw ups: the LS and Focus are good examples of those screw ups. I've never said the Five-Hundred is a run away hit, same can be said with the Fusion, but they aren't the total failures that you try to make them out to be.

 

If it's so hard here to conduct an intelligent debate, then Allpar is all yours.

Edited April 12, 2006 by Michael Reynolds

[Bluecon]

Why is it that anytime anyone around here attempts to use basic logic they are accused of being paid by

If it's so hard here to conduct an intelligent debate, then Allpar is all yours.

You don't get it.

 

It is not up to you to decide what my opinions are or where I will post.

Are you totally incapable of minding your own business?

 

You move around this site admonishing people who disagree with you and suggesting they

go to other sites.

 

You have decided this is a "I love Ford management site".

 

In the USA and Canada I have every right to my own opinion even if differs from a

busybody such as yourself.

[Michael Reynolds]

In the USA and Canada I have every right to my own opinion even if differs from a

busybody such as yourself.

 

Thanks for that revelation.

 

The CUV is the latest craze of fads to hit the market, let's just hope this time around the Big 3 introduce and lead markets into the next latest and greatest thing

[hoss96racing]

I wouldn't say the fusion or 500 is a success or failure untill the taurus is dead. If I was in the market and had the choice of a 500, fusion or a taurus with cash on the hood, I would go for the better deal. For the commuting I do as long as it goes down the road and has the room I need in it i'm happy... if when the taurus dies, 500 and fusion sales don't increase then I will question there success but untill then I will hold my judgment

[156n3rd]

:boring: CUV=w a g o n, by any other name :shrug:

[kevinb120]

I wouldn't say the fusion or 500 is a success or failure untill the taurus is dead. If I was in the market and had the choice of a 500, fusion or a taurus with cash on the hood, I would go for the better deal. For the commuting I do as long as it goes down the road and has the room I need in it i'm happy... if when the taurus dies, 500 and fusion sales don't increase then I will question there success but untill then I will hold my judgment

 

Ummm, we have 1300 new vehicles in stock, not a single one is a Taurus :shrug:

 

The Edge will do VERY well, I think its got the right combo of style/power/options/flair for the right price at the right time.

Edited April 13, 2006 by kevinb120

[llog215]

I wouldn't say the fusion or 500 is a success or failure untill the taurus is dead. If I was in the market and had the choice of a 500, fusion or a taurus with cash on the hood, I would go for the better deal. For the commuting I do as long as it goes down the road and has the room I need in it i'm happy... if when the taurus dies, 500 and fusion sales don't increase then I will question there success but untill then I will hold my judgment

 

I wouldn't expect to see much of an increase in retail sales of Fusion or 500 due to Taurus going away. Almost 100% of Taurus sales are fleet sales. Fusion and 500 will increase their fleet sales to compensate for the loss of the Taurus.

[NickF1011]

I wouldn't expect to see much of an increase in retail sales of Fusion or 500 due to Taurus going away. Almost 100% of Taurus sales are fleet sales. Fusion and 500 will increase their fleet sales to compensate for the loss of the Taurus.

 

Retail sales no. Might see a slight uptick when the 3.5's are available across the board, but factoring in an increase in fleet sales, it would be safe to say sales for both should increase when fleet buyers no longer have the Taurus as an option.

[kevinb120]

I think the better bet in the long run is to keep the Taurus around for a few more years for a solely fleet car rather then flooding the market with 500/Fusion sales at or below cost. The only change I see for the 07 fleet only Taurus is they dropped the FFV option.

 

Retail sales no. Might see a slight uptick when the 3.5's are available across the board, but factoring in an increase in fleet sales, it would be safe to say sales for both should increase when fleet buyers no longer have the Taurus as an option.

 

 

A 'sales' increase to rental units means nothing for Ford or a vehicle's reputation.

[NickF1011]

I think the better bet in the long run is to keep the Taurus around for a few more years for a solely fleet car rather then flooding the market with 500/Fusion sales at or below cost. The only change I see for the 07 fleet only Taurus is they dropped the FFV option.

A 'sales' increase to rental units means nothing for Ford or a vehicle's reputation.

 

A quiet and gradual sales increase to fleets (there are plenty of NON-rental fleet sales) would certainly help the reputation against people constantly calling the vehicle a failure because of tepid sales. I'm sure Ford wants to avoid going the 80+ percent fleet sale route that the Taurus ended up at, so it's not like the D3's and CD3's will suddenly become the rental car of choice.

 

Fleet sales can be a VERY positive thing when executed properly. I don't see anyone complaining about the LX cars going 20-25% to fleets.