International wants to raise dues

[newworld]

When the uaw members in michigan can stop paying dues, iuaw is in for a rude awakening. They have no one blame but themselves.

and if we are not carefull, all of us could be in for a rude, difficult reality.

[fordktpworker]

Its easy to say screw the union I'm not paying no more I'll just sign out, we don't need the union. You think Ford is going to keep paying you and keep giving you the benefits you have now without the union?

[bigphish]

I agree with you completely. I am just saying the iuaw needs to start listening to the membership. These people have the audacity to give themselves raises and then want an increase in dues. If the iuaw worked harder for its members then themselves, they would have workers standing in lines to join. Sadly that is not the case. How many transplants have you organized bob? They will lose members in Michigan, how many is anyones guess. I will be a dues paying member in good standing till the day i die or the uaw ceases to exsist. They will have no one to blame but themselves if the latter happens first.

[fordktpworker]

They will not lose as many as you think, a lot of people talk crap but will not sign out. I've said many times f**** the union and get tired of their bs but I would never sign out. It starts at your local to be heard and damn people go f**king vote when it comes time to vote, we had less than a 1000 people out of over 4000 vote on our local contract a couple of weeks ago.

[Redwings_rule]

I'm new to whole RTW thing so if you could please answer me this. If people decide to opt out of paying dues then they are opting out of the Union completely and won't be helped by the union if they get fired or whatever else issue they have? And what about contract negotiations if they opt out then will they get the same benefits that the union negotiates?

Edited November 18, 2013 by Redwings_rule

[SU-FI]

I'm new to whole RTW thing so if you could please answer me this. If people decide to opt out of paying dues then they are opting out of the Union completely and won't be helped by the union if they get fired or whatever else issue they have? And what about contract negotiations if they opt out then will they get the same benefits that the union negotiates?

 

Nope, everything is the same. they'll still represent you, you just wont be paying for it.

[littlecountry]

They gonna milk us after the next contract...

[uaw12]

Has it been confirmed when the vote for the increase in dues will occur with the membership?

[Decker]

Has it been confirmed when the vote for the increase in dues will occur with the membership?

 

You, as a due`s paying member will not have the ability to cast a vote on any increase.... directly that is.

 

Decker

[newworld]

. directly that is.

 

Decker

YES, .........Key 3 words....."DIRECTLY THAT IS" Local officials need to know that their interactions with the international are being watched.

They are the link between the rank and file and the international and must be held accountable for the internationals dictates.

[Ktp1989]

This guys at the local level will give them whatever they want cause they are trying to suck up for a international job eventually so how you think that will work out?

[Decker]

YES, .........Key 3 words....."DIRECTLY THAT IS" Local officials need to know that their interactions with the international are being watched.

They are the link between the rank and file and the international and must be held accountable for the internationals dictates.

 

"must be held accountable" good luck with that......

 

You guys at Michigan locals have some type of meeting to hear what the views and stances on the proposed motions at the con con, of the canadates for delegates are? Before the voting begins? You do realize there is no record of how your delegates vote?

 

Decker

[newworld]

One way to encourage transparency is to hold them accountable no matter what. If the locals cannot prove they resisted bad decisions or voted in poor leaders then they are out.PERIOD It's the only way. Make them prove it. When the international visits your local, do they cave to them, suck up to them, or debate them and question them. Do they ask "why", "NO WE disagree", etc..etc.. Do they speak out in public, against decisions that they and thier membership don't like? (newspapers, online forums, social media, etc..etc.)

The only way to insure a democratic union is to make sure we the membership are heard, and the local is the most efficient way to voice your opinion. If a leader cannot prove he communicated membership positions to the international........Then they re out. PERIOD!

 

This does not mean I am against a dues increase or for one.. It's complicated. I don't think a membership that has gone as long as we have without a raise, made significant concessions, should be seeing our union dues go up, not now.......However, a bankrupt Union does not serve us either. I don;t have enough information to really have an opinion as yet.

[littlecountry]

They can do that

[Langston Hughes]

One way to encourage transparency is to hold them accountable no matter what. If the locals cannot prove they resisted bad decisions or voted in poor leaders then they are out.PERIOD It's the only way. Make them prove it. When the international visits your local, do they cave to them, suck up to them, or debate them and question them. Do they ask "why", "NO WE disagree", etc..etc.. Do they speak out in public, against decisions that they and thier membership don't like? (newspapers, online forums, social media, etc..etc.)

The only way to insure a democratic union is to make sure we the membership are heard, and the local is the most efficient way to voice your opinion. If a leader cannot prove he communicated membership positions to the international........Then they re out. PERIOD!

 

This does not mean I am against a dues increase or for one.. It's complicated. I don't think a membership that has gone as long as we have without a raise, made significant concessions, should be seeing our union dues go up, not now.......However, a bankrupt Union does not serve us either. I don;t have enough information to really have an opinion as yet.

 

Some moderation until we see what is being done might be well served.

[americanmade]

 

 

 

Another education session for decker----

 

 

In the last few (way to many) contracts have you "TT" found any clause or item returned, reversed or reinstated?

 

Yes, several—

1. COLA was returned in the form of $1,500 per year starting in 2012 per the 2011 CBA. (Please follow cost of living adjustments that would have adjusted no increase since December 2011) a $6,000 cola payment or .75 cents per hour based on a 2,000 work year. Again COLA adjustments would have been zero but thanks to our contract we gained $6,000 more in COLA.
2. $250 Competitive bonus paid over the 4 years equals $1,000 over the agreement or 12.5 cents per hour based on a 2000 hour working year
3. $6000 signing bonus another .75 cents per hour based on 2,000 hour working year over the 4 years of the agreement
4. More open, increased and transparent profit sharing that will most likely average $8,000 per year for each of the 4 years of the agreement equaling $32,000 total over four years of the agreement. Translates to $4.00 per hour wage increase based on a 2000 hour work year
5. Lower office visits to $20 per visit and no cost shifting to us on prescriptions or medical coverage while these increased costs based on an average family of 4, balloon to $2,000 per year no cost to us which translates to a wage increase of $1.00 per hour

Just these few returns added over $6.00 per hour to our wage structure.

Do you really think that without the UAW these items would be given to us because the company is generous??

Without the UAW, we as well as transplants would be working for $15.00 per hour with no seniority, less vacation, no personal time, no voice in the workplace, no more 20 paid holidays every year, little to no benefits etc, etc,….

Please uneducated one, stop your division and tactics of destroying this great union. Lies and deceit is cruel to those that believe your garbage.

 

 

 

TT, I may be wrong (more times then I want to remember) but, in the past you have made reference to being apart of the Trades...? With your teaching skills you have mastered, could you enlighten me to the possible changes you see for the contract that would reverse the lanuage on the mechanical work groups?

We are doing mechanical work groups now when the boss aint around. We care about equipment uptime and efficiency to better keep work in the UAW and improve profit sharing for all. I know many of my past co-workers/trades that transferred to MAP that are successfully doing the mech teams. They are engaged in all aspects of properly running maintenance and embrace this tool to get rid of the supervisors that ruin efficiency gains. I hope it launches in all facilities and gives us trades the voice and respect we deserve. If it’s successful like I’m hearing at MAP then it should be a good benefit. I have not heard of these teams anywhere else so I don’t know of any other examples.

 

 

 

Is it your opinion, backed by years of education, this membership will see gains in their hourly rates of compensation? In my opinion gains established above as I believe more gains should be attainable with our plants flooded with products and investments thanks to the 2007 and 2011 agreements, a well-funded war chest “strike fund” and a sound economy.

First tier members? All should be gaining as shown in the examples above. Entry Level got a $4.50 rate of pay increase and possibly entry level/legacy rates increase in 2015

Can you give some insight into the possible reinstating of the cost of living factor? See post above. I will reiterate again, the UAW had the foresight to see the cost of living factor was not going to gain any benefit (the economy improves, cola goes down) but guaranteed our $1,500 per year or $6,000 per member over the life of the agreement. My personal opinion is that the $1,500 per year is far better than a cola formula (which netted 0 since 2011) that hurts us financially as described above

 

Possibly you could express your knowledge on the manner in which the IUAW will announce (to the world) that they have completely reversed their stance on aiding the companies at our cost and have come to the educated conclusion that their membership`s pockets are empty when it comes to giving up their earned compensation and benefits?

Don’t know about your pockets but I (most trades as well) will have made over $150,000 per year and over the past 2 years mostly because the UAW guaranteed our job security, great benefits and retirement. I made $13,500 in profit sharing last year and should break $15,000 this year. Most trades I work with enjoy this windfall of earnings from our UAW and great benefits. Production I work with are making close to $70,000 up to $85,000 this year and entry level are enjoying their raises and earning potential. Cant speak for the UAW but things are good in the Rouge.

 

 

 

TT, with my lower level of education I have to rely on deductive reasoning to move through the mase of cooperation, that over the years the IUAW and the companies have built their relationship on. Being a member for a few years, I have witnessed the slow removal of compensation and benefits. I`ve watched as both company and IUAW have proven that our hourly rate is excessive, by lowering the rate of compensation to members doing the same tasks as first tier members. We have witnessed the giving and helping one side of the negotiations table has done while the other side manipulates its way to even higher profits.

Your opinion above is nothing more than an effort to destroy this great union. Might I add that deductive reasoning and half-truths are no basis of any opinion.

Please educate yourself as I have respectfully asked in the past. This board is a good tool TO SHARE INFORMATION not spread lies and innuendo.

 

 

 

Our efficiency rates are at or higher than any other manufacturer. The level of quality that the managers will allow, is always met. In your educated terms, could you tell the members how these two facts may or will be used as the tools/strategies to secure or reinstate any lanuage in the next contract?

I can only speak to language I can read and understand and not suppositions, hypotheticals and innuendos.

 

 

 

Once again, (possibly another time) I may be wrong but, I can`t deduce that we will see much if any change in the negotiation methods we have witnessed in the past. I just had the pleasure of listening to members of the IUAW and not one gave anything remotely like a strong sence of hope for the next contract....

Good luck Professor, with that "positive" outlook on filling our plants with product and investment, through the 2007 & 2011 contract. You do realize that we had plants close, right?

UAW doesn’t close plants, it fights to keep them open, lower market share, unorganized transplants and unorganized parts plants will close higher paid/compensated UAW plants.

 

 

 

WAR CHEST? Take an educataed guess to the amount this bank account has been tapped at the last few constitutional conventions, then read how much has been pulled off in between the Con Con`s.... War chest or possibly VEBA`s solvency?

 

Lowest level of members since the 1960s will result in lower dues income while costs skyrocket and eat away at the general fund. The war chest is depleted and you are against funding the strike fund yet ask for bargaining greatness in 2015-------- hmmmm, I would have to say there is no educating your closed mind.

The 3 VEBAs are all separately funded and have no attachment to the UAW operating budget.

 

 

 

Professor, what is the schedule for the next ECON lecture?

No lectures, just correct information sharing and not anti-union rhetoric

Ahhhh yes, a pissing contest on who has more knowledge and education. Im guessing your a man with small girth and a premature trigger. Oh but keep spouting your superior knowledge to us silly little peasants. We are all humbled and impressed. No to raises! See how simple that is? I don't need a lecture on what opinion I should have.

[TigerFan]

Decker, TT is obviously a very bright guy and like you I have not been in school in a long time, but here we go the IUAW had all the foresight as he says and that is why we should be okay with a dues increase? I just have a couple concerns, but with TT that means Union breaker. First off with all of their foresight what happened to the retirees, X-Bonus taken away, for the first time in history no raise to their retirement checks. Clarification of fact the only reason the US Ford plants have product is that we have become the low wage producers of autos, with shipping included. With benefits and wages the average cost per hour is $51 dollars per hour for a UAW-Ford plant, the transplants are about $6 dollars more. So the foresight to suppress our wage structure , no raises, VEBA takes over retiree health care, over 20% Entry Level and LTS in our plants(IUAW even have a weasel clause for this they excluded Rawsonville, Steerling ect.). And finally they want a dues increase to fill the strike coffers, A. where did the fund go it was 1 billion and is now down over 400 million, this same group 4 years ago told the membership we should vote for the 2009 concession package which would have given up the right to strike, except health and safety. TT come out from under the desk and join us in reality!

[mmichael305]

Jimmy needs to help parts distribution centers get local contracts before asking for more money some have gone without for 8 years...

[jej52375]

The union says the strike fund is low due mostly to the cost of organizing but that it is what they collect vcap money for also. I know me and a lot of people I know pay vcap every month.

[bigphish]

The union says the strike fund is low due mostly to the cost of organizing but that it is what they collect vcap money for also. I know me and a lot of people I know pay vcap every month.

Organizing what ? did some nuns in a convent decide to join the uaw. They haven't organized anything but the money in their wallets. Bob King is a failure. 100's of thousands of dollars wasted not one transplant organized. If more time was spent trying to get our concessions back and maybee getting us a raise, outsiders might want to join the uaw. Sadly all they really care about is more members paying dues, instead of taking care of the ones they already have.

Edited December 15, 2013 by bigphish

[Ktp1989]

HIGHER SALARY....MORE DUES! WE CAN ALL AGREE TO PAY MORE DUES THIS WAY! $1 MORE ON THE HOUR...$24 MORE PER MEMBER PER YEAR TO THE COFFERS.

[Pioneer]

Don't forget Black Lake. Our dues are subsidizing a golf course and vacation spot for the chosen few that go there for "education". Should be closed down or sold.

[Langston Hughes]

Organizing what ? did some nuns in a convent decide to join the uaw. They haven't organized anything but the money in their wallets. Bob King is a failure. 100's of thousands of dollars wasted not one transplant organized. If more time was spent trying to get our concessions back and maybee getting us a raise, outsiders might want to join the uaw. Sadly all they really care about is more members paying dues, instead of taking care of the ones they already have.

 

LOL. Many outsiders don't want to join us because they see us as greedy and only out for ourselves, which is reinforced by what we say here and elsewhere. I would like a raise too, but constantly whining about getting raises while a large group of people are going to get their unemployment cut isn't winning the PR battle, although I'm guessing that your not interested in winning that battle. You likely only throwing that out because all you interested in is your raise, and the hell with gaining new members.

 

I guess it's a sign of the times that we openly bitch about what anti-union people have said over the years we have always done in private. Now we just prove them right. Once an angry group of people would coalesce into a group of radical thinkers who would attempt to move the conversation into what was best for those in and out of the union. Now we just bitch online and talk about how our wages aren't enough in front of people who think we are overpaid and only out for ourselves.

[bigphish]

The title of this thread is International wants to raise dues. My complaint isn't so much i want a raise as it is why should the international get one. They have already voted themselves one with our dues paying for it. Now they want to waste more of our money trying to organize people who have made it clear many times over, they don't want to join us. Would i like to see new members, of course i would. I would also like to see equal pay for equal work. This fraterity of appointed azzhats have drained the strike fund and now they want us to replenish it so they can waste more. They will never approve a strike, they will take what the company offers them and shove the highlights in our face and say this is the best we could do. They will pit plant against plant, worker against worker to get a yes vote. Then they will have a brand new strike fund full of our money. I wonder what they will do with that.

Edited December 22, 2013 by bigphish

[hee haw]

OK I have read 99 pages in this thread, I'll make it 100. Would you want someone negotiating on your behalf who can't get one for themselves?