New RWD platform

[1520 man]

I keep hearing Ford wants to invest in RWD cars, but when will this happen and where?

[donzuchowski]

I keep hearing Ford wants to invest in RWD cars, but when will this happen and where?

 

First rumor is the next generation of the Ford Falcon from Austrlia. However since Ford had to mortage even the light bulbs I would not count on any new Rear wheel drive products. Now Ford could do a cheap redo of the DEW98 platform that the Mustang is on perhaps for a small or mid size rear wheel drive car. But other then The F-series I cant see Ford spending any money on a completly new platform. I would work for Ford to become debt free first. Have them maybe share some Jag stuff and sell everything but Ford Mercury and Lincoln and just have them forget the rest they cant afford it. As Dave Ramsey would say if you have a car sell it to get debt free and buy some $200 piece of junk and use it until you build wealth.

[akirby]

First rumor is the next generation of the Ford Falcon from Austrlia. However since Ford had to mortage even the light bulbs I would not count on any new Rear wheel drive products. Now Ford could do a cheap redo of the DEW98 platform that the Mustang is on perhaps for a small or mid size rear wheel drive car. But other then The F-series I cant see Ford spending any money on a completly new platform. I would work for Ford to become debt free first. Have them maybe share some Jag stuff and sell everything but Ford Mercury and Lincoln and just have them forget the rest they cant afford it. As Dave Ramsey would say if you have a car sell it to get debt free and buy some $200 piece of junk and use it until you build wealth.

 

You haven't been paying attention. The new RWD platform is being developed in Australia and would have been done regardless of the situation in North America. What Mulally is doing is making sure the platform can be used globally (at least in the U.S.) without significant re-engineering. They're doing the same with the next Mondeo/Fusion and Focus - engineer the platform once and use it in multiple markets.

 

And the mustang is not on the dew98 platform at all - in fact it only has a few parts that are similar.

 

This new platform will allow Ford to build performance RWD sedans like the interceptor and probably mustang at some point plus allowing replacement of the Panthers (GM, CV, TC) and allowing Lincoln to build a new flagship sedan (or two).

[donzuchowski]

You haven't been paying attention. The new RWD platform is being developed in Australia and would have been done regardless of the situation in North America. What Mulally is doing is making sure the platform can be used globally (at least in the U.S.) without significant re-engineering. They're doing the same with the next Mondeo/Fusion and Focus - engineer the platform once and use it in multiple markets.

 

And the mustang is not on the dew98 platform at all - in fact it only has a few parts that are similar.

 

This new platform will allow Ford to build performance RWD sedans like the interceptor and probably mustang at some point plus allowing replacement of the Panthers (GM, CV, TC) and allowing Lincoln to build a new flagship sedan (or two).

 

Americans will not get the next generation Mondeo or the Focus. And the current North American Focus has nothing to do with the current 2nd generation European Focus that is just comming out in Europe. Also the next North American Fusion and Mazda 6 will be based off the current platform which will have nothing in common with the European versions. The platforms will not converge until after 2010 at the earliest for the next North American Focus.

 

I say Ford needs to get its spending under control and let the bean counters run the company so that they dont over spend, Ford needs to stick with what it has for now and later merge all Seven Ford operations (Brazil, Europe, Austrila, Etc) into one company so what is in North America (N.A.) is also in China (each can have a little bit of difference like spring rates). Bean counters know how to save money and car guys dont

[SysEng]

I say Ford needs to get its spending under control and let the bean counters run the company so that they dont over spend, Ford needs to stick with what it has for now and later merge all Seven Ford operations (Brazil, Europe, Austrila, Etc) into one company so what is in North America (N.A.) is also in China (each can have a little bit of difference like spring rates). Bean counters know how to save money and car guys dont

 

Totally agree with this. Economy and efficiency in manufacturing are now paramount.

 

And bluntly stated, anything other than the current ( or a larger ) BOF RWD "panther" platform simply won't fly with the customer base.

 

Ford has had many a very good RWD platform. Only the "panthers" and the Mustang have had any staying power in N.A. Think there might be a very broad hint there for Ford planners?

[Traveler]

I must admit that I tend to flip-flop on my opinion on what Ford should do. This market isn't going to be a big seller anyway. If an imported replacement car fails to win support from law enforcement, its not going to be a successful seller for Ford, in general.

 

I think Ford finds itself in between a rock and a hard place with the Panther, however I still think that the Panther is probably more of a sure thing for them with substantial exterior/interior/mechanical improvements.

 

Loyalists will probably keep returning to the Panther as long as it represents something desirable to them. That also includes police. The Panther is a great car to most people who own them. They are, however, short on the trendy looks that the Japanese and Europeans help to determine for the N.A. market. I think Ford should just perhaps consider keeping the Panther platform and just doing an all-new body and interior. Build it up with HD transmission, optional diesel and a tow package. Offer a performance-oriented model with a supercharged or turbocharged engine. Ford should really see that the market for these cars are changing. Its not about stereotypical age-oriented marketing here. You either like the Panther or you don't. Young enthusiasts, middle aged and seniors who like Panthers, period. Find the likes and dislikes of the majority of owners who are the most vocal for keeping it around and those committed to buying the car for a long period of time and market to them. The rest can either conform or move to the Taurus.

 

I think what the majority of Panther enthusiasts want is shared sentiments with law enforcement. More power, good handling, decent mileage, plenty of room and comfort.

 

I say...new body, new interior and revised powertrain and drivetrain and just keep the current frame.

[stapking]

The panther platform has lasted so long because it's too good. Can the CV and GM be tweeked to get better fuel economey yes but thats up to Ford. Hey you want new customers maybe a little more harder look "tough enough".

 

People want bigger cars not little shit boxes. The Panther platform is nothing but gravey for Ford. Some people think the Crown Victoria name is for old people, well change the name to the Ford CV 700 whatever get creative. The CV and GM are the best diamonds in the ruff and Ford I think are missing it. Time will tell.

[armadamaster]

I must admit that I tend to flip-flop on my opinion on what Ford should do. This market isn't going to be a big seller anyway. If an imported replacement car fails to win support from law enforcement, its not going to be a successful seller for Ford, in general.

 

I think Ford finds itself in between a rock and a hard place with the Panther, however I still think that the Panther is probably more of a sure thing for them with substantial exterior/interior/mechanical improvements.

 

Loyalists will probably keep returning to the Panther as long as it represents something desirable to them. That also includes police. The Panther is a great car to most people who own them. They are, however, short on the trendy looks that the Japanese and Europeans help to determine for the N.A. market. I think Ford should just perhaps consider keeping the Panther platform and just doing an all-new body and interior. Build it up with HD transmission, optional diesel and a tow package. Offer a performance-oriented model with a supercharged or turbocharged engine. Ford should really see that the market for these cars are changing. Its not about stereotypical age-oriented marketing here. You either like the Panther or you don't. Young enthusiasts, middle aged and seniors who like Panthers, period. Find the likes and dislikes of the majority of owners who are the most vocal for keeping it around and those committed to buying the car for a long period of time and market to them. The rest can either conform or move to the Taurus.

 

I think what the majority of Panther enthusiasts want is shared sentiments with law enforcement. More power, good handling, decent mileage, plenty of room and comfort.

 

I say...new body, new interior and revised powertrain and drivetrain and just keep the current frame.

 

Hey! Traveler's even coming around to using the existing Panther platform. Don't forget the Panther's popularity in the Middle East.

 

Good points also Stapking.

[BillyTheKid]

Hey! Traveler's even coming around to using the existing Panther platform. Don't forget the Panther's popularity in the Middle East.

 

Good points also Stapking.

 

 

:shades: Long live the RWD! :reading:

[akirby]

Americans will not get the next generation Mondeo or the Focus. And the current North American Focus has nothing to do with the current 2nd generation European Focus that is just comming out in Europe. Also the next North American Fusion and Mazda 6 will be based off the current platform which will have nothing in common with the European versions. The platforms will not converge until after 2010 at the earliest for the next North American Focus.

 

I say Ford needs to get its spending under control and let the bean counters run the company so that they dont over spend, Ford needs to stick with what it has for now and later merge all Seven Ford operations (Brazil, Europe, Austrila, Etc) into one company so what is in North America (N.A.) is also in China (each can have a little bit of difference like spring rates). Bean counters know how to save money and car guys dont

 

Sorry - when I said the "next" platforms will be shared I was talking about the next all new models which, as you say, won't show up for a few years. The point is that the groundwork has been laid for that global platform sharing to take place instead of each market doing their own unique platforms. That in itself will save billions if it's done correctly.

[Topgun]

The panther platform has lasted so long because it's too good. Can the CV and GM be tweeked to get better fuel economey yes but thats up to Ford. Hey you want new customers maybe a little more harder look "tough enough".

 

People want bigger cars not little shit boxes. The Panther platform is nothing but gravey for Ford. Some people think the Crown Victoria name is for old people, well change the name to the Ford CV 700 whatever get creative. The CV and GM are the best diamonds in the ruff and Ford I think are missing it. Time will tell.

The chop for the Grand Marqius comes in 09 MY,get em while you can.

[Traveler]

Hey! Traveler's even coming around to using the existing Panther platform. Don't forget the Panther's popularity in the Middle East.

 

Good points also Stapking.

 

I've been a proponent for the Panther all along, but its just obvious that the Panther is not a long-term commitment for Ford any longer. They want common unibody platforms that can be used on a variety of models. The BOF would probably linger if CV, GM and TC were selling big retail numbers, but they aren't and I still lay some of that blame at the feet of Ford. However, what is done is done. I just hope they give us something remotely 'American' in both style and substance like the 300 and Charger. I'm not really that excited about a import that has bland styling. I want American flair.

 

The Panther is as good as it ever has been. Sadly, its just not coming back in popularity. I still wonder about how law enforcement will take to losing the Crown Vic as an option. Can Ford maintain dominance in the police fleet market?

[96towncarcartier]

Since when is it said that the CV is being phased out?? For 2007, 91% of CV sales were fleet sales... 94% of all taxicabs in New York City are Crown Vics...running 24 hours a day, for 95,000 miles a year.

 

That's why CV is fleet only for 2008. GM sold 50% retail, 50% fleet in 2007. So it's still good with the average Joe.

 

Where's this notion of the GM dying after 2009? I'm hearing a new look for CV in 2009 as well.

[Topgun]

Since when is it said that the CV is being phased out?? For 2007, 91% of CV sales were fleet sales... 94% of all taxicabs in New York City are Crown Vics...running 24 hours a day, for 95,000 miles a year.

 

That's why CV is fleet only for 2008. GM sold 50% retail, 50% fleet in 2007. So it's still good with the average Joe.

 

Where's this notion of the GM dying after 2009? I'm hearing a new look for CV in 2009 as well.

Not a notion, told by suppliers and BASF paint personnel,also told of this way back in May at our stand down meetings.

[armadamaster]

Since when is it said that the CV is being phased out?? For 2007, 91% of CV sales were fleet sales... 94% of all taxicabs in New York City are Crown Vics...running 24 hours a day, for 95,000 miles a year.

 

That's why CV is fleet only for 2008. GM sold 50% retail, 50% fleet in 2007. So it's still good with the average Joe.

 

Where's this notion of the GM dying after 2009? I'm hearing a new look for CV in 2009 as well.

 

Liberal Mayor Bloomberg is taking care of the CV taxis in New York, after 2012 you be forced to squeeze into a hybrid, period.

[twintornados]

You may see a hybrid Taurus step up to the daily rigors of taxi duty in NYC...there certainly is room to make a V6/Hybrid in a panther chassis, but Ford has already stated that it is not in the cards...too bad since it would really be a winner.

 

Liberal Mayor Bloomberg is taking care of the CV taxis in New York, after 2012 you be forced to squeeze into a hybrid, period.

[twintornados]

The panther platform has lasted so long because it's too good. Can the CV and GM be tweeked to get better fuel economey yes but thats up to Ford. Hey you want new customers maybe a little more harder look "tough enough".

 

People want bigger cars not little shit boxes. The Panther platform is nothing but gravey for Ford. Some people think the Crown Victoria name is for old people, well change the name to the Ford CV 700 whatever get creative. The CV and GM are the best diamonds in the ruff and Ford I think are missing it. Time will tell.

 

I have always supported the notion that if CV is fleet only, then the name should be retired to preserve it's elegance. Rename the car LTD and put the Crown Victoria name on a 6 inch stretch version of Taurus as the top model in the Taurus range.

[suv_guy_19]

You may see a hybrid Taurus step up to the daily rigors of taxi duty in NYC...there certainly is room to make a V6/Hybrid in a panther chassis, but Ford has already stated that it is not in the cards...too bad since it would really be a winner.

 

 

Actually, according to Igor, it has been revived, and will go into the Edge, Flex, Taurus.

[Topgun]

Not a notion, told by suppliers and BASF paint personnel,also told of this way back in May at our stand down meetings.

Breaking News 2009 Grand Marquis is a Go.....minus the pin stripe in 09.

[taxman100]

Still holding hope that I purchase a new Grand Marquis when the time is right to replace my 2002 Grand Marquis - ideally not before the 2012 model year. I'd like to buy a new one in the final model year, but I guess I could buy used if I had to do so.

 

No pin stripe? I suppose next Ford will be replacing the seats with wooden benches to save a few dimes per unit.

[stapworker]

Still holding hope that I purchase a new Grand Marquis when the time is right to replace my 2002 Grand Marquis - ideally not before the 2012 model year. I'd like to buy a new one in the final model year, but I guess I could buy used if I had to do so.

 

No pin stripe? I suppose next Ford will be replacing the seats with wooden benches to save a few dimes per unit.

 

 

Wood is not enviromentally friendly so they are going to recycle milk crates.

[Rob M.]

I just got my 2008 CV - fit and finish is miles above the 2004 CV I previously had - great paint, comfortable and quiet interior - when the pedal hits the firewall I have action with a nice roar - this car is a contender for the full size Mercedes, BMW, Lexus market - at half the price! It's all about marketing -

 

Ford management, if your reading this and have any interest in keeping the panther platform around and boosting sales for St. Thomas, you should contact me - marketing and public relations is my Job 1!

 

Rob

[Traveler]

I think much of that is due to the throttle by wire system. From the time of this system's introduction, it seems to have made a big difference in throttle response and the car's desire to move out. Congrats. We need to get out there and sell America on Panthers.

[armadamaster]

I just got my 2008 CV - fit and finish is miles above the 2004 CV I previously had - great paint, comfortable and quiet interior - when the pedal hits the firewall I have action with a nice roar - this car is a contender for the full size Mercedes, BMW, Lexus market - at half the price! It's all about marketing -

 

Ford management, if your reading this and have any interest in keeping the panther platform around and boosting sales for St. Thomas, you should contact me - marketing and public relations is my Job 1!

 

Rob

 

 

Good stuff. I was very impressed with a 2007 GMQ/LS with 9K miles I test drove and the 2004 P71 with 90K miles I drove home for a friend a few months back, much tighter, quieter, better steering feel, and more responsive versus the various retail and police 1995/97/99 Panthers I had driven before. Good purchase!

Edited October 21, 2007 by Armada Master