THE LIST?

[norfolkbutcher]

There are 4 toolmakers out on 85% from AAP, have been now for about 5 weeks.

 

Hey Gixxer, Thanks for the heads up. They didn't offer you transfers? Are there no openings at any Ford facilities in the united states for toolmakers? How many plants have toolmakers? Why all the secrecy?

[Tsquare]

Hey Gixxer, Thanks for the heads up. They didn't offer you transfers? Are there no openings at any Ford facilities in the united states for toolmakers? How many plants have toolmakers? Why all the secrecy?

There are about 9 tool and die makers sitting in GEN at the closed Maumee stamping plant with no transfer offers at all. Well I take that back one did move. The one with the lowest seniority. He was the international union mans son. He moved with no posting. No favors going on at our plant.

[gixer44]

Hey Gixxer, Thanks for the heads up. They didn't offer you transfers? Are there no openings at any Ford facilities in the united states for toolmakers? How many plants have toolmakers? Why all the secrecy?

Yeah, they offered KCAP,CAP,and OHAP. I put in for 2 of the offers, excuse me (opportunities), but have not heard from them since they put us out the door on 85%.

I really don't think they are being secretive about it, they just don't know what they're doing. They don't have a clue. It's a matter of having too many people for too few jobs. They told us we would get our first choice, hands down. 5 weeks later nothing, not even a peep out of them. Give me a shout if you hear anything.

Edited April 18, 2008 by gixer44

[gixer44]

[:

Edited April 18, 2008 by gixer44

[whiteford]

There are about 9 tool and die makers sitting in GEN at the closed Maumee stamping plant with no transfer offers at all. Well I take that back one did move. The one with the lowest seniority. He was the international union mans son. He moved with no posting. No favors going on at our plant.

 

 

No Favors for Junior

[level]

There are about 9 tool and die makers sitting in GEN at the closed Maumee stamping plant with no transfer offers at all. Well I take that back one did move. The one with the lowest seniority. He was the international union mans son. He moved with no posting. No favors going on at our plant.

 

You should not make false statements. That was the topic of a whole other thread a month ago.

 

You are wrong that it was a favor. For the last time, he was a classified "machining specialist" the only one with that classification in the JSP bank.

 

There is no need for a posting to get him a job, since he is the only classified one in the JSP bank records, and this is one of the few places that that classification even exists

. On an open requisition for three "machining specialists", he took one job. The other two were posted.

 

If you are going to accuse people of wrongdoing. make sure you know what the hell you are talking about and have your facts straight from now on "brother".

[norfolkbutcher]

Yeah, they offered KCAP,CAP,and OHAP. I put in for 2 of the offers, excuse me (opportunities), but have not heard from them since they put us out the door on 85%.

I really don't think they are being secretive about it, they just don't know what they're doing. They don't have a clue. It's a matter of having too many people for too few jobs. They told us we would get our first choice, hands down. 5 weeks later nothing, not even a peep out of them. Give me a shout if you hear anything.

 

Talked to a fellow worker at NAP yesterday. He said all the production people still in GEN went to KC. He's an electrician on 85% . He had 4 choices OAP, CAP KC and DTP. He put in for KC or DTP and has been waiting for 2 months now.

[Tsquare]

You should not make false statements. That was the topic of a whole other thread a month ago.

 

You are wrong that it was a favor. For the last time, he was a classified "machining specialist" the only one with that classification in the JSP bank.

 

There is no need for a posting to get him a job, since he is the only classified one in the JSP bank records, and this is one of the few places that that classification even exists

. On an open requisition for three "machining specialists", he took one job. The other two were posted.

 

If you are going to accuse people of wrongdoing. make sure you know what the hell you are talking about and have your facts straight from now on "brother".

He was Layed off then put in put in GEN as a TMO

[level]

He was Layed off then put in put in GEN as a TMO

 

That is absolute bullshit. You are put in GEN in the classification in which you are laid off from, including promotional, you do not revert back to any formerly held classification just because you went into JSP. Besides that, I saw the JSP bank list at the time so I know you do not know what you are talking about. He was a machining specialist, went to a machining specialist opening, and took his DOE with him.

 

Do you just take whatever secondhand hype someone tells you and go spreading it on a world wide web? Maybe you have a future with the National Enquirer as a reporter.

 

[jerrymaker]

You should not make false statements. That was the topic of a whole other thread a month ago.

 

You are wrong that it was a favor. For the last time, he was a classified "machining specialist" the only one with that classification in the JSP bank.

 

There is no need for a posting to get him a job, since he is the only classified one in the JSP bank records, and this is one of the few places that that classification even exists

. On an open requisition for three "machining specialists", he took one job. The other two were posted.

 

If you are going to accuse people of wrongdoing. make sure you know what the hell you are talking about and have your facts straight from now on "brother".

 

 

Machining specialist, this classification is only at Dearborn tool&die and R&E center, not maumee.

Need to check ford skilled trades agreement, pg. 12b appendix f and pg. 342c. maumee has or had tmo, tool machine operator, mills,lathes and grinders. machining specialist operates a 5 axis milling machines which are only at the above locations.

[MSP_M/R]

You should not make false statements. That was the topic of a whole other thread a month ago.

 

You are wrong that it was a favor. For the last time, he was a classified "machining specialist" the only one with that classification in the JSP bank.

 

There is no need for a posting to get him a job, since he is the only classified one in the JSP bank records, and this is one of the few places that that classification even exists

. On an open requisition for three "machining specialists", he took one job. The other two were posted.

 

If you are going to accuse people of wrongdoing. make sure you know what the hell you are talking about and have your facts straight from now on "brother".

 

I read alot of your posts and find the info fairly accurate, but I have to disagree with you on this one. I know this person as well as others on this thread. He never operated our 5-axis in the 12+ years I've been at Maumee. He (_ _ _ _) was in Weld Repair when he went to JSP (formally GEN). He was a TMO before he bid on WR. We had 3 guys at Maumee that ran the 5-axis and they all retired. He didn't gain that classification from our plant!

 

isn't this kinda off of what this thread was intended for?

[level]

Machining specialist, this classification is only at Dearborn tool&die and R&E center, not maumee.

Need to check ford skilled trades agreement, pg. 12b appendix f and pg. 342c. maumee has or had tmo, tool machine operator, mills,lathes and grinders. machining specialist operates a 5 axis milling machines which are only at the above locations.

 

That is incorrect Jerrymaker.

 

5 axis machines still exist at most of the Stamping plants, and so are and were Machining Specialists. Maumee was a Stamping plant, had machining specialists there. Have 2 of them at Walton Hills Stamping, some at Buffalo stamping, etc....

 

The fact that a lot of the die work used to be done at the Stamping plants, and the fact that a lot of "tweaking" is still done there, has left remnants of a few of these classified machining specialist around. While they still exist, a lot of the equipment they operate has become antiquated but still in use. While the contract states they will only exist at R&E, there are agreements that are attempting to expand that once again, and it does not mean that those already classified could not remain so.

[MSP Worker]

I have to agree with the others Level. Maumee had TMO's but like it has been stated, they ran the mills, lathes and grinders. They ran a few of the larger mills but nothing like the 5-axis. The people who did that function were called Machining Specialist Heavy's. The one in question was a TMO, and Welder Repair at one time, but never a Heavy. He did go in to JSP as a TMO though not as a W/R. At one time he went into GEN as a W/R. Since then he had returned to TMO up until he was placed in GEN/JSP.

 

Was it a blatant favor done despite the contract? As much at it would seem to be, I believe it was more likely a nice grey area that exsisted inside the mentioned classifications. When the move first happened I was as mad as anyone. You have to understand there is alot of bitterness at Maumee. We were one of the best stamping plants around, but when push comes to shove, money and cost was way more important than performance. So yes some of us were quick to just attack and say FAVOR! To be honest I was over it about a week later, and now, like I said, I think he just got lucky to be in a classification that carries different meaning at different places. Heavy's were exclusive to Maumee I think. Even if they were not, the new contract combined aot of similar classifications. He just happened to be in the right classification so I am over it.

 

Lets keep this on the topic it started as. Placement of us left in JSP as opposed to those that are gone. Level, any idea of a time frame for when the list may be put out? I had heard by late last week but obviously that has passed. Well for some, One of our Power Service guys has left for Ford land. Any clue on the rest?

[level]

I have to agree with the others Level. Maumee had TMO's but like it has been stated, they ran the mills, lathes and grinders. They ran a few of the larger mills but nothing like the 5-axis. The people who did that function were called Machining Specialist Heavy's. The one in question was a TMO, and Welder Repair at one time, but never a Heavy. He did go in to JSP as a TMO though not as a W/R. At one time he went into GEN as a W/R. Since then he had returned to TMO up until he was placed in GEN/JSP.

 

Was it a blatant favor done despite the contract? As much at it would seem to be, I believe it was more likely a nice grey area that exsisted inside the mentioned classifications. When the move first happened I was as mad as anyone. You have to understand there is alot of bitterness at Maumee. We were one of the best stamping plants around, but when push comes to shove, money and cost was way more important than performance. So yes some of us were quick to just attack and say FAVOR! To be honest I was over it about a week later, and now, like I said, I think he just got lucky to be in a classification that carries different meaning at different places. Heavy's were exclusive to Maumee I think. Even if they were not, the new contract combined aot of similar classifications. He just happened to be in the right classification so I am over it.

 

Lets keep this on the topic it started as. Placement of us left in JSP as opposed to those that are gone. Level, any idea of a time frame for when the list may be put out? I had heard by late last week but obviously that has passed. Well for some, One of our Power Service guys has left for Ford land. Any clue on the rest?

 

One of the biggest problems MSP WORKER, is that regardless of what you call them locally, it goes by the actual classification code. A lot of local unions had their own "unique" names they developed over the years, even called them by different names in their locals, but the classification code is the real story. I have heard Machining specialists called BMOs or boring mill operators, TMOs or tool machine operators at different locals........but what the locals really classified them as to get certain pay rates...or because it was the next closest type of classification....that is what the JSP list shows. It shows a numeric classification code, such as 3856720. That code is what gets you placed. That code is what you are. And you are correct when you say that this area had a lot of grey....trying to make all parts of the template fit everyone isn't easy, especially when many of the local were able to freelance for so long without any uniformity or governance.

 

So regardless of what they called him locally, he had the machining specialist code number. You should see the mess that was under that rug of 322 classifications. It was very ugly. I appreciate your honesty with the whole consolidation process also. But I can tell you that they all go by code, and that was his code.

 

 

NOW LIKE YOU SAID, I TOO AM DONE WITH THIS, LET'S GET BACK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND:

 

 

As far as that last question, I have to check. I know that some receiving plants got names and/or report dates on late Friday, I would assume all lists were released not just some. But I cannot verify until Monday.

Edited April 19, 2008 by level

[MSP Worker]

I have to check. I know that some receiving plants got names on late Friday, I would assume all lists were released not just some. But I cannot verify until Monday.

 

 

 

Fair enough, thanks for the info. One more quick question that may not have an answer. As one of the people who will not be placed in this round, any thoughts on when another round may be comng? Machine Repair is my trade.

[S.Knight]

One of the biggest problems MSP WORKER, is that regardless of what you call them locally, it goes by the actual classification code. A lot of local unions had their own "unique" names they developed over the years, even called them by different names in their locals, but the classification code is the real story. I have heard Machining specialists called BMOs or boring mill operators, TMOs or tool machine operators at different locals........but what the locals really classified them as to get certain pay rates...or because it was the next closest type of classification....that is what the JSP list shows. It shows a numeric classification code, such as 3856720. That code is what gets you placed. That code is what you are. And you are correct when you say that this area had a lot of grey....trying to make all parts of the template fit everyone isn't easy, especially when many of the local were able to freelance for so long without any uniformity or governance.

 

So regardless of what they called him locally, he had the machining specialist code number. You should see the mess that was under that rug of 322 classifications. It was very ugly. I appreciate your honesty with the whole consolidation process also. But I can tell you that they all go by code, and that was his code.

 

 

NOW LIKE YOU SAID, I TOO AM DONE WITH THIS, LET'S GET BACK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND:

 

 

As far as that last question, I have to check. I know that some receiving plants got names and/or report dates on late Friday, I would assume all lists were released not just some. But I cannot verify until Monday.

 

Level...I appreciate you more every day. I want to go ahead and voice my opinion that the IUAW should start using the uawford.com web site to release timely information to the membership. I would also like to propose that you be put in charge. I have really appreciated you posting what you know... but if the IUAW totally supported the initiative we would all be much better off. Thanks...

[MSP Worker]

So regardless of what they called him locally, he had the machining specialist code number. You should see the mess that was under that rug of 322 classifications. It was very ugly. I appreciate your honesty with the whole consolidation process also. But I can tell you that they all go by code, and that was his code.

 

 

Yes Level that is what I was trying to say. Although it appeared to some he got special treatment, he really just lived within the confines of tha National Contract. In my statement I was just trying to agree that he was not a Specialist. You just put it much more clearly than my classification grey area :unsure: Sorry if it appeared I still had an issue with the move. I was just trying to explain my theory that he benifited from his classification nationaly and not his job localy or his family ties.

 

Anyways, thanks again as usuall for trying to keep this board civil. Not all of us are hatefull as some others on here. I agree with S. Knight atleast some are trying to pass on usefull information.

[level]

Fair enough, thanks for the info. One more quick question that may not have an answer. As one of the people who will not be placed in this round, any thoughts on when another round may be comng? Machine Repair is my trade.

 

I could not tell you for sure. IMO, it will take a combination of in-sourcing work, pulling ahead the bodyshop installs, further targeting, etc... to create the jobs we need to place remaining members. I know it is being worked on every day, all day.

 

I look at it like this. If you are being paid to sit on your ass (so to speak) in a JSP, you can do zero to benefit the Company and it costs Ford about 40 hours.

 

If you are placed in a plant as an extra, for project and/or pm/preventaive/predictive maintenance, you can do a lot of benefit to the Company, and it costs Ford about 40 hours.

 

When we can successfully drive this fact into the hardened heads of upper management based on total cost, everyone would/should be working.

I mean, it is not like we don't have anything to work on. Most plants are being neglected pm-wise now a days.

[nvsked]

If you are placed in a plant as an extra, for project and/or pm/preventaive/predictive maintenance, you can do a lot of benefit to the Company, and it costs Ford about 40 hours.

 

When we can successfully drive this fact into the hardened heads of upper management based on total cost, everyone would/should be working.

I mean, it is not like we don't have anything to work on. Most plants are being neglected pm-wise now a days.

 

 

Amen Brother / Sister!!! That's what I'm talking about! Truer words have never been spoken.

 

:bowdown:

 

 

 

We here on the web truly appreciate the help Level

[whereswaldo]

I could not tell you for sure. IMO, it will take a combination of in-sourcing work, pulling ahead the bodyshop installs, further targeting, etc... to create the jobs we need to place remaining members. I know it is being worked on every day, all day.

 

I look at it like this. If you are being paid to sit on your ass (so to speak) in a JSP, you can do zero to benefit the Company and it costs Ford about 40 hours.

 

If you are placed in a plant as an extra, for project and/or pm/preventaive/predictive maintenance, you can do a lot of benefit to the Company, and it costs Ford about 40 hours.

 

When we can successfully drive this fact into the hardened heads of upper management based on total cost, everyone would/should be working.

I mean, it is not like we don't have anything to work on. Most plants are being neglected pm-wise now a days.

We agree on something........

[S.Knight]

One of the biggest problems MSP WORKER, is that regardless of what you call them locally, it goes by the actual classification code. A lot of local unions had their own "unique" names they developed over the years, even called them by different names in their locals, but the classification code is the real story. I have heard Machining specialists called BMOs or boring mill operators, TMOs or tool machine operators at different locals........but what the locals really classified them as to get certain pay rates...or because it was the next closest type of classification....that is what the JSP list shows. It shows a numeric classification code, such as 3856720. That code is what gets you placed. That code is what you are. And you are correct when you say that this area had a lot of grey....trying to make all parts of the template fit everyone isn't easy, especially when many of the local were able to freelance for so long without any uniformity or governance.

 

So regardless of what they called him locally, he had the machining specialist code number. You should see the mess that was under that rug of 322 classifications. It was very ugly. I appreciate your honesty with the whole consolidation process also. But I can tell you that they all go by code, and that was his code.

 

 

NOW LIKE YOU SAID, I TOO AM DONE WITH THIS, LET'S GET BACK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND:

 

 

As far as that last question, I have to check. I know that some receiving plants got names and/or report dates on late Friday, I would assume all lists were released not just some. But I cannot verify until Monday.

 

Suspense .... Intrigue.... this thread has it all.... except for that monday update.

[MSP Worker]

Level has been one of the few on here willing to answer questions honestly, so I am more than willing to cut him some slack on the Monday deadline.

[S.Knight]

Level has been one of the few on here willing to answer questions honestly, so I am more than willing to cut him some slack on the Monday deadline.

 

I concur...

[level]

Level has been one of the few on here willing to answer questions honestly, so I am more than willing to cut him some slack on the Monday deadline.

 

Sorry for the delay.

 

You should see it by tomorrow (Friday).

[Sparkycat]

Sorry for the delay.

 

You should see it by tomorrow (Friday).

 

 

 

 

Many thanks, Level, for your reply and to know there is an end to our tunnel!