stephenhawkings Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 Not true by any stretch. well it has been true since WWII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 well it has been true since WWII Did you see the chart that was just posted? Obviously it has not even been the case since WW2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 He has said since the beginning that short term increases in the deficit are necessary to get the economy running since there is no other source at this time to supply the stimulus. Short term. He has also been consistent in stating that the deficits must be reduced in the long term after the current economic crisis is over. You're not paying attention. He also said he would prevent infanticide and would not increase spending which increases abortions. He wants to reduce abortions. So he voted for infanticide, increased spending for abortions, and believes his daughter should not be punished with STD's or a baby if she makes a mistake. How is she gonna abort and STD? Punished?! By a baby? So what morals and values is he going to teach his daughters? Maybe his waffle shop is where Princes Pelosi got her 5 statements wrong about the CIA? He also says we should come to a civil common ground and be able to talk about stuff. After he forces laws through to get what he wants that is. Then Gethner must be everyones hero now... GEITHNER: We face again this deep recession, damaged financial system. And our immediate imperative still is to get growth back on track. That requires us to do things that are expensive, that cost money, in the short term will raise deficits. At the same time we do that, we have to commit to Americans, to investors around the world that we're going to be able to get back to living within our own means when the crisis passed and when the recovery is established, we're going to have to get back to living within our means. And that's going to require demonstrating to people we're willing to stop doing things they've been doing, give up things that we don't want to give up, and that will be a challenge. Wow. Obama's clan is going to show US how to give up things that WE have been doing. How to give back Obama style per a RICH Hoyt toty. I am really starting to wake up more and more to this guys agenda. He wont be back for a second term. Hopefully we will be able to undue all of this junk he is forcing upon us. Wait till he starts pushing UN treaties! Peace and Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Is the University doing the wrong thing? Is Obama? Yea. I think babies born alive and left to slowly die is great. Slavery all over again. One group not considered human by another group. That's POWER! Now not even the born alive one are considered human and deserving of medical care. OBAMA for KING. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Every time he stops using that thing he messes up so badly. Pretty soon, he will just sit in a room behind one of those things and just do radio speeches and such. Peace and Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 What were income taxes supposed to be capped at when they came out? What are they at now? What is cap and trade set at? What will it be like in 20 years? And Health ins. taxation. Which states have worst budget deficits? Which states have the highest taxes? Which states have the least budget deficits? Which states have the least taxes? Peace and Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 What were income taxes supposed to be capped at when they came out? What are they at now?What is cap and trade set at? What will it be like in 20 years? And Health ins. taxation. Which states have worst budget deficits? Which states have the highest taxes? Which states have the least budget deficits? Which states have the least taxes? Peace and Blessings *just a quick note...which states are the most populated and thus the hardest to run and budget........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 There are two problems with this defense. One, his projections of future economic growth are very optimistic. It would be nice if these projections did pan out, but I wouldn't bet on it. And, two, his plans for health care, along with other items on the agenda, will increase federal spending, not decrease it. Per the chart above Reagan and Bush 41 balooned the deficit and Clinton brought it to new lows. The economy isn't static and projections change. If the stimulus results in a shorter recession, Obama's projections may turn out to be correct. In any event, the recession started with W and his policies and the Republican Congress from 2000-2007. The Dems slight majority in 2006 did not give them control over anything wioth W in the Whitehouse. Obama got handed this turd sandwich and he's trying to do something about it. The future will tell if his plan is correct. What do you think McCain would have done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Obama got handed this turd sandwich and he's trying to do something about it. The future will tell if his plan is correct. What do you think McCain would have done? McCain, unfortunately, probably would have done much of the same thing. He's hardly a traditional small-government Republican. And frankly, Obama trying to do something about it doesn't really help if he's trying all the wrong things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 McCain, unfortunately, probably would have done much of the same thing. He's hardly a traditional small-government Republican. And frankly, Obama trying to do something about it doesn't really help if he's trying all the wrong things. We won't know if they are the wrong things for a while. We do know all the wrong things that got us into this mess in the first place. 6 years of Republicans spending like drunken sailors in an effort to produce a permanent Republican majority. Bush didn't veto a single spending bill produced by the Republican Congress. Spending billions on two wars based on the assertion that Iraq oil would pay for the cost while cutting taxes on the wealthiest. Sweetheart no-bid contracts with no enforcement mechanism for when they were breached. I don't know if Obama is right or wrong. He isn't outside the mainstream of Keynsian economic thought. The government is the stimulator of last resort. We are at the last resort. We had plenty of "Trickle Down" that never trickled down to the middle class. Middle class buying power based on earnings has continuously dropped since Reagan despite increases in U.S. productivity. Our entire economy has been based on debt and the belief that housing prices would continue to go up. Where is the Republican Plan? They don't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenhawkings Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 i looked at said chart and was wondering which president didn't operate at lest one year w/o deficit. and if memory serves clinton may have not been spending more money than his tenure took in, but the deficit they inherited was too large for them to totally wipe out, but they did shrink it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 i looked at said chart and was wondering which president didn't operate at lest one year w/o deficit.and if memory serves clinton may have not been spending more money than his tenure took in, but the deficit they inherited was too large for them to totally wipe out, but they did shrink it. I think you are confusing national debt and national defecit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 (edited) We won't know if they are the wrong things for a while. We do know all the wrong things that got us into this mess in the first place. 6 years of Republicans spending like drunken sailors in an effort to produce a permanent Republican majority. Bush didn't veto a single spending bill produced by the Republican Congress. Spending billions on two wars based on the assertion that Iraq oil would pay for the cost while cutting taxes on the wealthiest. Sweetheart no-bid contracts with no enforcement mechanism for when they were breached. I don't know if Obama is right or wrong. He isn't outside the mainstream of Keynsian economic thought. The government is the stimulator of last resort. We are at the last resort. We had plenty of "Trickle Down" that never trickled down to the middle class. Middle class buying power based on earnings has continuously dropped since Reagan despite increases in U.S. productivity. Our entire economy has been based on debt and the belief that housing prices would continue to go up. Where is the Republican Plan? They don't have one. We're at the last resort in your opinion. And once again, I'm not a Republican. So don't pit all of this as a you against me, because frankly, both of their ideas lately suck. From an economic standpoint, Obama so far has been no different than Bush. They are both about nothing more than SPEND SPEND SPEND. Edited May 19, 2009 by NickF1011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 *just a quick note...which states are the most populated and thus the hardest to run and budget........... Please, what Fact are you implying? I know of no Fact that says larger is harder to run and budget. Size does not dictate ease or difficulty in running a business or a govt. It simply brings with it different challenges. Peace and Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Please, what Fact are you implying? I know of no Fact that says larger is harder to run and budget. Size does not dictate ease or difficulty in running a business or a govt. It simply brings with it different challenges. Peace and Blessings sorry MAC but I call bollocks on that, more people, more issues , more responsibility...more of everything....smaller ALWAYS means simpler..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 smaller ALWAYS means simpler..... which is simpler: a laptop computer or a 15 year old mainframe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bored of Pisteon Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 LOVE IT! "Even effective mopping up prior Administration mess's..." seriously though, seeing how obviously passionate/ differing in opinion as everyone obviously is here, this thread MAy last longer than the ubiquitous Mhlm thread.....we shall see..... Page length... Got a ways to go. Time length... This thread is just a tad older than the MLHM thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bored of Pisteon Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Every time he stops using that thing he messes up so badly. Pretty soon, he will just sit in a room behind one of those things and just do radio speeches and such. Peace and Blessings Actually I can't wait until he starts to do this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 which is simpler: a laptop computer or a 15 year old mainframe? we are talking persons here Jimmy Neutron ( NICKleodian ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Not sure the Democrates are that on board with Federal Health Care services. In fact, few appear to want Govt health care if it means they loose what they already have and enjoy. Peace and Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 which is simpler: a laptop computer or a 15 year old mainframe? old ford or new ford..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 sorry MAC but I call bollocks on that, more people, more issues , more responsibility...more of everything....smaller ALWAYS means simpler..... Me too. More money, more people to deal with issues, more skills, more resources, more economies of scale, etc. Fact is, they are all equally difficult. It comes down to management and expectations. CA is the worlds ~7th largest economy. So by your implication the US should be a great failure? Or is CA just run poorly? Because there is a huge disconnect between the US economy and CA economy. Fact is, that CA spending is out of control. Its a perfect example of the Fed Govt with out the ability to print money. CA usually has a republican Gov. Mostly because a Democrat Gov in such a liberally run state creates...Al Davis and a $70 to $90 billion deficit. Peace and Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Actually I can't wait until he starts to do this: That is killing me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 we are talking persons here Jimmy Neutron ( NICKleodian ) But what inherently makes it more difficult to manage more people? You still need all the same systems in place. The only difference (if done properly) should be scale. Complexity should remain the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bored of Pisteon Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 That is killing me! O.K. then... Try this one on for size! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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