A million protest against 'Obama the socialist'

[Len_A]

Sorry, but I don't agree with you on the public works spending...it is sorely needed. Out of that $891 billion, about 66% will be going toward public works projects and energy efficiency.

Just the piss poor condition of a largest portion of the roads and bridges around here justifies the public works spending. As a whole, the country is years, if not decades, behind just maintenance spending on some of these roads.

[fmccap]

I have never used it as an "excuse", because it's not an excuse, it's a reason why things got so out-of-control. Capice?

 

The GOP held that regulation prevented a "free" market from functioning optimally, when its curtailment allowed all the abuses to happen, even as the average American was fed propaganda that a regulatory-free America was the Way It Should Be. IIRC, Bush II wanted to privatize Social Security.

What parts do you think are out of control?

 

Wouldn't you rather be in control of your future as far as SS? What do you have now besides a bankrupt program?

[RangerM]

Just the piss poor condition of a largest portion of the roads and bridges around here justifies the public works spending. As a whole, the country is years, if not decades, behind just maintenance spending on some of these roads.

Wouldn't it be nice if the taxes extorted by the Federal Government for that very purpose, actually went for that purpose?

 

Maybe we don't need as many "bicycle paths, scenic landscape designs, pedestrian walkways, parking garages, and any number of non-highway projects."

 

Note: I used the word "extorted" because that's exactly what you call it when your taxes don't fulfill their promised use.

Edited September 19, 2009 by RangerM

[Len_A]

Wouldn't it be nice if the taxes extorted by the Federal Government for that very purpose, actually went for that purpose?

 

Maybe we don't need as many "bicycle paths, scenic landscape designs, pedestrian walkways, parking garages, and any number of non-highway projects."

 

Note: I used the word "extorted" because that's exactly what you call it when your taxes don't fulfill their promised use.

That's how I feel about My state not getting back 100% of the money we pay the feds. I doubt much federal highway money in Michigan goes for nonhighway projects.

[napfirst]

mustang said: Both industrial and housing production was up in August. The economy is still weak, but we are coming out of the recession at a slow and steady pace. The stimulus has done more than Republicans choose to give credit for...all you have to do is read the monthly data reports and follow the upward trend of DJIA and S&P. Naturally, job recovery has about a 6-12 month delay from market recovery, and we will begin seeing improvement next year in that area.

 

How can you say that the stimulus bill has had any effect?...only 8% will be spent in fiscal '09

 

I think what we'll see when the stimulus is fully implemented is a high inflation rate...followed by unemployment going up...and anthoer economic downturn....however when the dems lose control of Congress in 2010 and obama is neutered this money can be given back to the working people of this country...small businesses in the form of tax breaks and we'll see real economic recovery

[mustang84isu]

How can you say that the stimulus bill has had any effect?...only 8% will be spent in fiscal '09

 

I think what we'll see when the stimulus is fully implemented is a high inflation rate...followed by unemployment going up...and anthoer economic downturn....however when the dems lose control of Congress in 2010 and obama is neutered this money can be given back to the working people of this country...small businesses in the form of tax breaks and we'll see real economic recovery

When I said stimulus, I was talking about TARP.

 

Your numbers are off. $107.1 billion will be spent in 2009, which is 12%. Next year, another 25% in the form of $236 billion will be spent.

 

Alright, let's make a bet...one year from now, September 2010, if unemployment is higher and we are in a second economic downturn, then I will admit the stimulus was a failure. However, I and many economists don't think we will be.

[Mark B. Morrow]

The argument that race matters:

 

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/75694.html

 

"I don't think anybody has used the symbols of race and racism to criticize this president more than the individuals on the right," said D'Linell Finley, a political science professor at Auburn University at Montgomery. "Listen to the radio, look at the signs and listen to their individual words. It comes through both in a subtle and not-so-subtle manner."

 

The not-so-subtle incidents are numerous:

 

 

 

Last October, John McCain's campaign ousted a Buchanan County, Va., McCain campaign official, Bobby May, for writing a newspaper column that said that if Obama were elected he'd hire rapper Ludacris to paint the White House black and change the national anthem to the "Negro National Anthem" by James Weldon Johnson.

 

 

Diane Fedele, who was then the president of a Republican women's club in San Bernardino County, Calif., resigned last October after she sent out a newsletter with a drawing of Obama on a bogus food-stamp coupon surrounded by ribs, watermelon and fried chicken.

 

 

In May, Sherri Goforth, an aide to Republican state Sen. Diane Black of Tennessee, sent an e-mail to Republican staffers showing the first 43 U.S. presidents in stately poses, but Obama's image, as the 44th president, was a pair of bright white cartoonish eyes on a black background.

 

 

In June, Diann Jones, the vice chairman of the Collin County Republican Party in Texas sent an e-mail to local Republican clubs calling a proposal for a $50 gun tax "another terrific idea from the black house and its minions."

 

 

Also in June, South Carolina Republican activist Rusty DePass compared an escaped gorilla from a Columbia zoo to first lady Michelle Obama's ancestors.

 

 

At an August political forum, Republican U.S. Rep. Lynn Jenkins of Kansas denied any racial intent when she said that the party was looking for a "great white hope" to lead the party into the future.

[napfirst]

The argument that race matters:

 

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/75694.html

 

"I don't think anybody has used the symbols of race and racism to criticize this president more than the individuals on the right," said D'Linell Finley, a political science professor at Auburn University at Montgomery. "Listen to the radio, look at the signs and listen to their individual words. It comes through both in a subtle and not-so-subtle manner."

 

The not-so-subtle incidents are numerous:

 

 

 

Last October, John McCain's campaign ousted a Buchanan County, Va., McCain campaign official, Bobby May, for writing a newspaper column that said that if Obama were elected he'd hire rapper Ludacris to paint the White House black and change the national anthem to the "Negro National Anthem" by James Weldon Johnson.

 

 

Diane Fedele, who was then the president of a Republican women's club in San Bernardino County, Calif., resigned last October after she sent out a newsletter with a drawing of Obama on a bogus food-stamp coupon surrounded by ribs, watermelon and fried chicken.

 

 

In May, Sherri Goforth, an aide to Republican state Sen. Diane Black of Tennessee, sent an e-mail to Republican staffers showing the first 43 U.S. presidents in stately poses, but Obama's image, as the 44th president, was a pair of bright white cartoonish eyes on a black background.

 

 

In June, Diann Jones, the vice chairman of the Collin County Republican Party in Texas sent an e-mail to local Republican clubs calling a proposal for a $50 gun tax "another terrific idea from the black house and its minions."

 

 

Also in June, South Carolina Republican activist Rusty DePass compared an escaped gorilla from a Columbia zoo to first lady Michelle Obama's ancestors.

 

 

At an August political forum, Republican U.S. Rep. Lynn Jenkins of Kansas denied any racial intent when she said that the party was looking for a "great white hope" to lead the party into the future.

Yeah...all household names there.......why do you keep making this an issue...obama himself says it's not....

[xr7g428]

Mark knows the best defense is a strong offense. He wants anyone to who might consider criticizing Obama to know that they will be called a racist. This is a perfect example of Mark as party rep at work.

[RangerM]

You guys all need to see things from a different perspective.

 

May I recommend this link?

[Mark B. Morrow]

You guys all need to see things from a different perspective.

 

May I recommend this link?

[Roadtrip]

When I said stimulus, I was talking about TARP.

 

Your numbers are off. $107.1 billion will be spent in 2009, which is 12%. Next year, another 25% in the form of $236 billion will be spent.

 

Alright, let's make a bet...one year from now, September 2010, if unemployment is higher and we are in a second economic downturn, then I will admit the stimulus was a failure. However, I and many economists don't think we will be.

 

So they're holding back $236 billion in spending until 2010, which, coincidentally, happens to be an election year. Go figure. . . .

 

I predict that they (meaning Congress) will earmark funds for highly contested districts that will create several hunded thousand temporary make-work jobs in those districts, which they hope will bring the unemployment rate down to 9 percent or so, for which they they will claim "presto!," and that they brought the economy back from the brink.

 

It's a short-term fix to be sure -- owing to economist John Maynard Keynes, who disregarded the long-run implications of deficit spending and taxpayer-sponsored make-work programs by saying, "In the long run, we're all dead." Keynes was a smart guy, but I'm not sure he would have uttered such a statement had he had children and grandchildren who would inherit a $1.8 trillion deficit and entitlement programs such as Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid, all three of which are soon to become insolvent, and all three of whose liabilities are forecast to exceed their incomes at a velocity that not even the rosiest of economic growth scenarios, nor the the Fed, with its "quantitative easing" (i.e., M1 money supply), can accommodate.

[Mark B. Morrow]

Things Only a Republican Could Believe:

 

* Parents who don't want their children to pray in school are Anti-American zealots -- parents who don't want their children to listen to a speech by the President of the United States telling them to work hard and get good grades are noble patriots.

 

 

* Peacefully demonstrating against the country starting an international war is treason -- showing up with automatic weapons to protest healthcare reform is democracy at its finest.

 

 

* Any government official with a desk job should have every action scrutinized -- any government official with a badge and a gun should never be questioned or disrespected. At all. Ever.

 

 

* Questioning the legitimacy of an election because the "winner" was selected by the Supreme Court is sour grapes -- questioning the legitimacy of an election because the winner (by the largest number of votes in American history) is really a Kenyan born Muslim despite all evidence to the contrary is being a vigilant American.

 

 

* Lying about a blowjob is an impeachable offense -- lying about a war is no big deal, really.

 

 

* Investigating a shady land deal involving the First Lady is a matter of National Identity -- investigating the use of torture at the direction of the Executive Branch is a partisan witch hunt.

 

 

* Executing Japanese officers for waterboarding prisoners during WWII shows that we have the moral high-ground on human rights -- waterboarding prisoners of our shows that we have the moral high-ground on human rights.

 

 

* Sitting two rows in front of Jane Fonda in a 1970 anti-war rally is an OUTRAGE! Shaking Saddam's hand in 1983...meh, not so much.

 

 

* Anyone who questions the president during a time of war is giving aide and comfort to the enemy and should be deported...unless the president in question has a (D) next to their name in which case you should undermine them at every turn even if you have to routinely make shit up to do it.

 

 

* Socialism, Marxism, Communism and Fascism are all interchangeable words that mean pretty much the same thing.

 

 

* Anyone who abuses drugs should be locked up indefinitely...unless they are a popular Republican radio host in which case they need your prayers as they recover from the illness of addiction.

 

 

* Health Insurance companies have your best interests in mind and anyone who thinks otherwise is trying to turn America into the Godless heathen nation of Sweden where EVERYONE in the country dies (eventually).

 

 

* Obama is an atheist communist muslim who attended a radical christian church.

 

 

* Believing that human activity could impact the global environment is crazy talk -- believing that an invisible man in the sky personally told George Bush to invade Iraq to fulfill Biblical prophecy is logically sound.

 

 

* The verdict is still out on evolution -- but Jesus Christ returning in our lifetimes is a pretty much a given.

 

 

* The media are unquestionably biased against Republicans -- Talk Radio, The Washington Times, The Weekly Standard, The Wall Street Journal, Rightwing Blogs, Fox News and NewsCorp are not part of the media.

 

 

* The government should have no part in regulating multi-national corporations as they make decisions that impact the lives of millions of people -- government should regulate individuals by determining who they can marry, what kind of intercourse they can have, what they can smoke, how to manage their pregnancy and how to proceed with end of life decisions.

 

 

* Communicating with hostile nations is a stab in the back to our great nation -- Reagan communicating with the USSR during the Cold War was Political Genius.

 

 

* Iran is a mortal threat to our nation and anyone who attempts to talk to them is traitorous scum -- selling weapons to Iran and then funneling the money to start wars in South America is clearly in our National interest.

 

 

* George Bush kept the nation safe after 9-11 (NOTE: the Anthrax attacks, the DC Sniper and Hurricane Katrina don't count. Also, the fact that 9-11 happened on his watch despite receiving a security briefing specifically warning of the attack doesn't count either.)

 

 

* Social Security, Medcare, public schooling, public libraries, fire departments, police departments and the US Military are as American as Apple Pie -- universal healthcare is ZOMGDEATHPANELSOCIALISM!!

 

 

* George W Bush is a regular 'ole Texas rancher just like you and me despite the fact that he was born in Connecticut, attended two Ivy League schools, bought the Crawford ranch just before running for president, sold it immediate after leaving office and is terrified of horses.

 

 

* The two guys at the center of the Watergate and Iran-Contra scandals are trustworthy voices in discussions of current national policy and should be taken at face-value.

 

The preceding was lifted from http://www.dvorak.org/blog/

[suv_guy_19]

Priceless

[mustang84isu]

So they're holding back $236 billion in spending until 2010, which, coincidentally, happens to be an election year. Go figure. . . .

 

I predict that they (meaning Congress) will earmark funds for highly contested districts that will create several hunded thousand temporary make-work jobs in those districts, which they hope will bring the unemployment rate down to 9 percent or so, for which they they will claim "presto!," and that they brought the economy back from the brink.

 

It's a short-term fix to be sure -- owing to economist John Maynard Keynes, who disregarded the long-run implications of deficit spending and taxpayer-sponsored make-work programs by saying, "In the long run, we're all dead." Keynes was a smart guy, but I'm not sure he would have uttered such a statement had he had children and grandchildren who would inherit a $1.8 trillion deficit and entitlement programs such as Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid, all three of which are soon to become insolvent, and all three of whose liabilities are forecast to exceed their incomes at a velocity that not even the rosiest of economic growth scenarios, nor the the Fed, with its "quantitative easing" (i.e., M1 money supply), can accommodate.

They're not "holding it back." Most of these funds will be distributed to state and local levels and there is plenty of bureaucracy involved in the distribution process. You're talking about thousands of different offices and departments this money will be going to that they have to divide up who gets what. In my state, we had an economic development program approved approved a few years ago that paid for by money from our casino revenue, but it took almost a year for the funds to be distributed to all the different communities. And that was on the state level. We're talking federal level here with money going to 50 states.

[mustang84isu]

I really liked these

 

* Lying about a blowjob is an impeachable offense -- lying about a war is no big deal, really.

 

* Anyone who abuses drugs should be locked up indefinitely...unless they are a popular Republican radio host in which case they need your prayers as they recover from the illness of addiction.

 

* The government should have no part in regulating multi-national corporations as they make decisions that impact the lives of millions of people -- government should regulate individuals by determining who they can marry, what kind of intercourse they can have, what they can smoke, how to manage their pregnancy and how to proceed with end of life decisions.

 

* Health Insurance companies have your best interests in mind and anyone who thinks otherwise is trying to turn America into the Godless heathen nation of Sweden where EVERYONE in the country dies (eventually).

[napfirst]

They're not "holding it back." Most of these funds will be distributed to state and local levels and there is plenty of bureaucracy involved in the distribution process. You're talking about thousands of different offices and departments this money will be going to that they have to divide up who gets what. In my state, we had an economic development program approved approved a few years ago that paid for by money from our casino revenue, but it took almost a year for the funds to be distributed to all the different communities. And that was on the state level. We're talking federal level here with money going to 50 states.

Thanks...very descriptive...exactly how obamacare will be managed....a bureaucratic nightmare

[mustang84isu]

Thanks...very descriptive...exactly how obamacare will be managed....a bureaucratic nightmare

So you'd rather have them rush the money to the states without placing provisions on what it can be used for?

[Ron W.]

So you'd rather have them rush the money to the states without placing provisions on what it can be used for?

 

 

Why when I read that does the word "pork" come to mind.

[napfirst]

So you'd rather have them rush the money to the states without placing provisions on what it can be used for?

Well that went over your head...how about we not spend the money in the first place.....but my point was that the govt. can't manage anything...epecially money....thus national healthcare...

[retro-man]

the govt. can't manage anything

A simplistic line for the simple minded, repeated ad infinitum by the brainwashed.

 

"The government" built 90% of the schools, 98% of the roads and highways, most of the electrical grid, municipal sewer and water systems most of which have been in continuous and reliable service for nearly 100 years, the postal system - since privatized, libraries, fire stations, one of the greatest networks of national parks in the world. "The government" successfully prosecuted WWI, WWII. "the government" took us to the moon. You don't trust the government to run your neighborhood school (a relatively simple thing), but you trusted it, in the hands of the neo-cons, to magically transform the Middle East into a safe place for democracy (never gonna happen), didn't you? As Mark's string of contradictions points out, the right's capacity for mental contortion and selective ignorance knows no bounds.

 

All I see from these protesters, and for that matter from the Republican Party in general, is a single minded attempt to shoot Obama down (figuratively if not - God forbid - literally) at every turn. Shoot down the health care. Shoot down the economic policy. Shoot down the foreign policy. Shoot down the election results. Where are the ideas? (a childlike drawing of an assault rifle accompanied by a threat does not constitute an idea.) Private solutions for healthcare? Excuse me; isn't that where we just came from?!?!

 

The bottom line is - and the thing these toothless inbred morons keep forgetting - is that we've just "enjoyed" 30 years of trickle-down Reaganomics (that did the exact opposite from trickle down), culminating in 8 years of rule by the guy who was advanced by the Republican Party as Reagan's successor, and here we are. You lost. Not only did you lose, you failed! Man up and deal with it.

Edited September 20, 2009 by retro-man

[mustang84isu]

Well that went over your head...how about we not spend the money in the first place.....but my point was that the govt. can't manage anything...epecially money....thus national healthcare...

Let's do like we did for the last eight years and let the infrastructure crumble some more. While we're at it, let's stop funding the schools, fire stations, police stations, national parks, energy development, space exploration, the military, etc. All that wasteful socialistic stuff. I mean, the private sector can do it better, can't they? They sure did a bang up job with the financial sector.

 

There have always been people who don't want to spend money on anything. People opposed the railroads, opposed aviation, opposed space exploration, opposed medical research, opposed urban revitalization...anything they had to contribute toward they whined about. Yet in the end, the majority pushed forward and advancements were made that benefited all Americans. Some of our greatest achievements were made by the most progressive thinkers and leaders.

 

A large percentage of this stimulus money will be going toward modernization programs for our energy, water, communication, and transportation infrastructure. Expansion of broadband into rural areas. Renewable energy programs. Improving energy efficiency of our government buildings (which will save tax dollars in the end). Alternative transportation. Community development. Modernization of the power grid. School renovations. All things we have fallen behind on maintaining, yet will benefit us years down the road. I don't know about you, but I want future generations to live in a country better than the one I lived.

Edited September 20, 2009 by mustang84isu

[napfirst]

A simplistic line for the simple minded, repeated ad infinitum by the brainwashed.

 

"The government" built 90% of the schools, 98% of the roads and highways, most of the electrical grid, municipal sewer and water systems most of which have been in continuous and reliable service for nearly 100 years, the postal system - since privatized, libraries, fire stations, one of the greatest networks of national parks in the world. "The government" successfully prosecuted WWI, WWII. "the government" took us to the moon. You don't trust the government to run your neighborhood school (a relatively simple thing), but you trusted it, in the hands of the neo-cons, to magically transform the Middle East into a safe place for democracy (never gonna happen), didn't you? As Mark's string of contradictions points out, the right's capacity for mental contortion and selective ignorance knows no bounds.

 

All I see from these protesters, and for that matter from the Republican Party in general, is a single minded attempt to shoot Obama down (figuratively if not - God forbid - literally) at every turn. Shoot down the health care. Shoot down the economic policy. Shoot down the foreign policy. Shoot down the election results. Where are the ideas? (a childlike drawing of an assault rifle accompanied by a threat does not constitute an idea.) Private solutions for healthcare? Excuse me; isn't that where we just came from?!?!

The bottom line is - and the thing these toothless inbred morons keep forgetting - is that we've just "enjoyed" 30 years of trickle-down Reaganomics (that did the exact opposite from trickle down), culminating in 8 years of rule by the guy who was advanced by the Republican Party as Reagan's successor, and here we are. You lost. Not only did you lose, you failed! Man up and deal with it.

A simplistic line for the simple minded, repeated ad infinitum by the brainwashed.....

 

and the thing these toothless inbred morons keep forgetting .....

 

Where does this sterotyping condescension come from?.....I thought you libs were the party of inclusion and free thought....what happened to that.....

and what are people suppose to do if they don't agree with obama...sit on their hands and hope it gets better.....there have been several alternatives to the house and senate healthcare plans...the reason that you don't know about them is because the main stream media don't report them....

[napfirst]

Let's do like we did for the last eight years and let the infrastructure crumble some more. While we're at it, let's stop funding the schools, fire stations, police stations, national parks, energy development, space exploration, the military, etc. All that wasteful socialistic stuff. I mean, the private sector can do it better, can't they? They sure did a bang up job with the financial sector.

 

There have always been people who don't want to spend money on anything. People opposed the railroads, opposed aviation, opposed space exploration, opposed medical research, opposed urban revitalization...anything they had to contribute toward they whined about. Yet in the end, the majority pushed forward and advancements were made that benefited all Americans. Some of our greatest achievements were made by the most progressive thinkers and leaders.

 

A large percentage of this stimulus money will be going toward modernization programs for our energy, water, communication, and transportation infrastructure. Expansion of broadband into rural areas. Renewable energy programs. Improving energy efficiency of our government buildings (which will save tax dollars in the end). Alternative transportation. Community development. Modernization of the power grid. School renovations. All things we have fallen behind on maintaining, yet will benefit us years down the road. I don't know about you, but I want future generations to live in a country better than the one I lived.

 

 

I don't know about you, but I want future generations to live in a country better than the one I lived.

 

If you really mean that, why would you want to saddle the future generations with this debt?....

[mustang84isu]

If you really mean that, why would you want to saddle the future generations with this debt?....

Were you this up in arms when the Bush administration wastefully spent billions invading Iraq, spent billions developing military hardware that is no longer needed, and increased the national deficit by $5 trillion? If we hadn't wasted all that money on empire building abroad, it could have been spent back here within our borders.

 

You also fail to comprehend that much of the investment will help us save money in the long run in terms of energy consumption.