NEW CONTRACT

[MichiganTruck_Mafia]

If we give up our right to strike over wages and benefits, we'll be screwed in the 2011 negotiations. They'll cut our pay AND our benefits and use the "parity with the foreign companies" line as the reason. That's what they're planning on right now by wanting this concession. If any of you can't see this then you're blind.

 

That's EXACTLY what's going to happen.

 

People were scared into voting yes earlier this year to "set the pattern" for GM/Chrysler, when those of us who live in the real world knew that they would be back after the GM/Chrysler contract and bankruptcy was finalized.

 

If we give up the right to strike, the 2011 contract will be a bloodbath. And who's to say Ford doesn't come back for even more concessions before the 2011 negotiations?

 

Expect to see more "vote yes" people coming out of the woodwork over the next days/weeks, only to disappear after the ratification.... just like last time.

[Pioneer]

Now they want to give us the membership a $1000.00 bonus. How is that going to give them an edge?

 

It won't. It's "hush" money. A bribe. I hope everybody can see through it.

[chriper]

concessions

Bryce G. Hoffman / The Detroit News

The United Auto Workers has summoned local union leaders to Detroit on Tuesday to discuss calls by Ford Motor Co. to match recent concessions the UAW gave to its cross-town rivals.

 

A UAW source said the union's national leadership is expected to ask for permission to begin formal negotiations with the Dearborn automaker on the proposed contract changes, which include a freeze on entry level wages, fewer job classifications for skilled trades workers and a "no strike" pledge.

 

The two sides have been talking informally for several weeks

 

 

This is all I could find in the Detroit News or FreePress. Sounds like bad news for Trades.

 

we have an existing contract,,being reopened to vote on four concessionary points{that we know of ...could be more},,,,AGAIN SINCE WE HAVE AN EXISTING CONTRACT AND THESE ARE SINGLE POINT CONSESSIONS,,,WHY CANT WE VOTE ON EACH ONE SEPERATELY{LIKE ISSUES ON A LOCAL CITY BALLOT????????? TRADES ON TRADE ISSUES ,,PROD ON PROD ISSUES,,AND BOTH ON ISSUES THAT AFFECT BOTH

Edited October 10, 2009 by chriper

[TheEagle]

If we give up our right to strike over wages and benefits, we'll be screwed in the 2011 negotiations. They'll cut our pay AND our benefits and use the "parity with the foreign companies" line as the reason. That's what they're planning on right now by wanting this concession. If any of you can't see this then you're blind. Screw the foreign companies! I don't care what they do, they're not us! VOTE NO on more concessions!

 

 

They can't cut your pay in arbitration...we can't improve it either...unless the uaw and ford agree to...the way i understand arbitration.

 

I am not an expert..I just think we ought to listen first and judge after. Why is that so hard ?

 

Also I am very proud of our president for getting the eastside commitment to work..that is all he is there for in my opinion to get us all work..just like the rest of the negotiators.

 

So what wrong for giving credit where credit is due..he has been stuck negotiating for almost 2 years out of the 3 years term and assholes say he has'nt been doing anything. That is just a flat out disgrace and bold face lie.

 

While uniondick just loves him some Cal Clark, Neil Wallyn, Frank Saez and Tim Williams..you know the dream team...because they are all dreaming if they think they are getting re-elected.

[hi-lo feva2]

It won't. It's "hush" money. A bribe. I hope everybody can see through it.

It's clearly a bribe and a 1000 bucks won't get concessions. Hopefully no more buyouts, because that swayed the "yes" votes in prior concessions. If another buyout reaches, for instance, 140000 we might be screwed on concessions, otherwise "steady as she goes."

[whereswaldo]

Got to ask yourself why the company wants a no strike guarantee for wages and benefits. Could it be that they already know their plan for the next contract? Could their plan be to come after our wages and benefits in a couple years at which time we will have no ability to strike? Ford motor has a long term plan.

Hmmm.....could be by 2011/12 that VEBA will be so underfunded due to accepting such a big cut to it that by next contract, Ford(as well as the little 2) will have to go after our health bennies and we will not be able to do a thing about it. Oh yeah....send it to the Arbitrator. They all have a plan alright.

[whereswaldo]

They can't cut your pay in arbitration...we can't improve it either...unless the uaw and ford agree to...

Bingo ! And what about benefits(health,dental,etc) ?? If the transplants start a trend of cutting their bennies over time then that doesnt bode well either.

[whereswaldo]

?Now they are back wanting the exact same thing gm and chrysler got are they not?

If Ford wants what GM got, then I guess Mullaly would be fired and Ford would get , what was it ??, $60 bil. at very favorable rates from us taxpayers. Sounds like a winner.........

[vmpp]

The only thing left to take is our wages and benefits for next contract. I can totally see them wanting us to pay into our benefits a set rate every week. It also would not suprise me if they get away with cutting our wages by taking so many dollars an hour and applying that toward out pension. This way they knock off a bunch of money they would have to pay into pension and we get screwed by making less an hour.

[justme]

No, they'll just put them on "Warm Idle", right? My ass!

I'm sure it states something like: As long as market conditions allow. They(Ford) have no integrity, so it's hard to believe anything they say.

Vote no! My plant has been promised a new product twice now, but we have yet to hear Ford make an announcement. They also put our new body shop on "hold". What a joke.

Yet, they went to China a few weeks ago and made an announcement there. Makes me sick.

[nsidetrk]

They can't cut your pay in arbitration...we can't improve it either...unless the uaw and ford agree to...the way i understand arbitration.

 

I am not an expert..I just think we ought to listen first and judge after. Why is that so hard ?

 

Also I am very proud of our president for getting the eastside commitment to work..that is all he is there for in my opinion to get us all work..just like the rest of the negotiators.

 

So what wrong for giving credit where credit is due..he has been stuck negotiating for almost 2 years out of the 3 years term and assholes say he has'nt been doing anything. That is just a flat out disgrace and bold face lie.

 

While uniondick just loves him some Cal Clark, Neil Wallyn, Frank Saez and Tim Williams..you know the dream team...because they are all dreaming if they think they are getting re-elected.

 

hey Eagle give your keyboard a rest, everyone can see what your up to! Terry had nothing to do with any promises of work. The way your pushing this for him one might think YOU AND TERRY were given the promise of a "bright" future at the region. And you are correct you are no expert! The second you heard that Ford wants to limit our right to strike is the second any conversation should be over. The reason GM and Cry. did is because the tax payer owns them. We(the tax payer) cannot strike ourselves, their union membership obligated themselves to the taxpayers. WE DID NOT. A NO STRIKE clause does not bring Ford any money to pay down debt. On the other hand if we did wagea strike and it was forcing Ford to loose money and move toward bankrupcy Ford could go to Court and we could be force back to work legally.

 

Let me set EVERYONE straight about arbitration... NO NO NO When you agree to arbitration you agree to remove yourselves from the United States Court system. You will never have any Legal recourse!!! NO appeal This comes right from the mouth of my attorney NEVER agree to any kind of arbitration, not in hospital not buying anything etc... NEVER We will never get that right to strike back Come on ASSHOLE do you think Malully or Fields or Hiendricks have a arbitration agreement or do they have a contract that they could go to court and inforce? Aunion contract is not worth the paper it is printed on with a NO STRIKE clause. But maybe Eagle you could wipe Terry"s ass with it as soon as you get done kissing it.

 

With a no strike clause we have NO leverage. This is an insult from Ford. We were the first in line and have been giving back over and over again over the past several years with out any threat of a strike

 

I cannot believe Gettlefinger would even bring this. Our union leadership told him No already! If we give up our strike leverage we will be worse off than Wallmart or Toyota, at least they will be able to use the laws of the land in our court system, WE WILL NOT. A Strike brings emediate attention arbitration could take months or years. Ford will out LAWYER us every time!!!

 

Is this what our UAW was founded on NO STRIKE? What a joke. A NO strike clause does not bring any money to Ford to pay down debt.

 

You two need to stop thinking about your own personal gain and think about the ENTIRE membership not just STERLING. If you beleive that work coming your way has anything to do with these consessions I have some ocean front property in Arizona to sell you. Maybe at the time your head was up Terrys ass but we all saw this in 2007.

 

How we vote on this will effect every union member, everywhere we will NEVER get the right to strike back.

If they do not seperate the issues DO NOT even consider the other issues Just vote NO!!! I guarentee they will remove the NO STRIKE ISSUE and come back.

 

If ANY and I mean ANY of your Union leadership promotes this NO STRIKE BULLSHIT... THROW THEIR ASS OUT of OFFICE.

 

REMEMBER.. Those who came before us fought for us to have the right to strike Stand up and fight for those who will come after us!

 

Does'nt it make you wonder.. If Ford wants us to give up our right to strike.. Maybe they are about to do something that would cause us to STRIKE!!! Go ask Terry how you should feel about that.

[nsidetrk]

They can't cut your pay in arbitration...we can't improve it either...unless the uaw and ford agree to...the way i understand arbitration.

 

I am not an expert..I just think we ought to listen first and judge after. Why is that so hard ?

 

Also I am very proud of our president for getting the eastside commitment to work..that is all he is there for in my opinion to get us all work..just like the rest of the negotiators.

 

So what wrong for giving credit where credit is due..he has been stuck negotiating for almost 2 years out of the 3 years term and assholes say he has'nt been doing anything. That is just a flat out disgrace and bold face lie.

 

While uniondick just loves him some Cal Clark, Neil Wallyn, Frank Saez and Tim Williams..you know the dream team...because they are all dreaming if they think they are getting re-elected.

 

Are you saying we should all be impressed that Terry has been negotiating for two years to come up with a proposal that includes TAKING AWAY the most important LEVERAGE the UNION has?? SORRY WE don't think that is anything to BRAG about. For that reason alone he should be Tossed OUT!!!

[Jaah]

They can't cut your pay in arbitration...we can't improve it either...unless the uaw and ford agree to...the way i understand arbitration.

 

Arbitration provides a method of solving disagreements between management and unions by using the decision of an independent person who does not side with either the company or the union.

 

The arbitrator listens to both arguments in the case. The company and the union provide information to support their position. The arbitrator then makes a decision based on the information he/she has been given. The arbitrator’s decision is final and binding and both sides must accept the decision.

 

I would expect that should Ford make a strong enough case for a wage reduction, an arbitrator could reduce wages. However wages could be excluded from the arbitration process but then that would either give the union the right to strike again or if it truly is a no strike contract then this would mean a wage freeze for the duration. I am no expert but thats how I see it.

Edited October 10, 2009 by Jaah

[lquidspine]

They can't cut your pay in arbitration...we can't improve it either...unless the uaw and ford agree to...the way i understand arbitration.

 

I am not an expert..I just think we ought to listen first and judge after. Why is that so hard ?

 

Also I am very proud of our president for getting the eastside commitment to work..that is all he is there for in my opinion to get us all work..just like the rest of the negotiators.

 

So what wrong for giving credit where credit is due..he has been stuck negotiating for almost 2 years out of the 3 years term and assholes say he has'nt been doing anything. That is just a flat out disgrace and bold face lie.

 

While uniondick just loves him some Cal Clark, Neil Wallyn, Frank Saez and Tim Williams..you know the dream team...because they are all dreaming if they think they are getting re-elected.

UAW wants parity , no disadvantage Eagle you want the facts this is complete parity

 

That's right from Chrysler's contract, you have stated that your friend said ours is different ....It can not be different and not put Ford at a "disadvantage" bottom line.

 

All negotiators have failed us they do not represent the rank and file period, if they did they would have taken the word that the counsel gave in August and decided not to modify.

 

They are out of touch with their membership, they all need to go.

 

 

I am sorry Cap for my previous comment.

Edited October 10, 2009 by lquidspine

[TheEagle]

hey Eagle give your keyboard a rest, everyone can see what your up to

REMEMBER.. Those who came before us fought for us to have the right to strike Stand up and fight for those who will come after us!

 

Does'nt it make you wonder.. If Ford wants us to give up our right to strike.. Maybe they are about to do something that would cause us to STRIKE!!! Go ask Terry how you should feel about that.

 

Again, I am going to repeat myself..I am not for or against the agreement yet. I am not for a NO Strike clause, I would also turn it down.

 

Jeff was not excited about this deal but has an obligation. He has been working on getting work for our plant for for a while now. Infact, he said we were about to get work and many of us did not believe him. So you understand, I am glad he was not bullshitting us. Again, many of us believed he was.

 

I am glad he was being honest, I see proof of that in the news article. I did'nt create this thread.

 

I know for a fact he did not even want to go down there to negotiate, so he felt the same way everyone of us feel. He was elected to do so, so he really has no choice and if he was'nt there would Sterling get work or would we be forgotton like the last 4 agreements before he was at the bargaining table?

 

You think louisville assembly and cleveland rouge and wayne/mich assy did'nt get work because their negotiators were at the table???

 

How about skilled, looks like they got a decent deal by comparison to GM and Chrysler agreement. There negotiator had nothing to do with that?

 

So what do Negotiators do??? Maybe I am confused about this?

Edited October 11, 2009 by TheEagle

[TheEagle]

I'm sure it states something like: As long as market conditions allow. They(Ford) have no integrity, so it's hard to believe anything they say.

Vote no! My plant has been promised a new product twice now, but we have yet to hear Ford make an announcement. They also put our new body shop on "hold". What a joke.

Yet, they went to China a few weeks ago and made an announcement there. Makes me sick.

 

 

Which plant are you from? We did 2 coa's and 2 national agreements at our plant and recieved nothing in return. we havent had new work in almost 10 years. I mean somthing we didnt make already. RDU would be great for our plant.

 

I can see permanent layoffs without it, in our plant, we just picked up almost 200 local 400 people and rumor is we are getting more.

 

Where are we going to work if we don't get work? sub lasts 21 weeks then I would be on tap for 21. I don't want any concessions but I want to work.

 

New Work is the best job security is'nt it?. I would be pissed off too if sterling was promised work and did'nt recieve it. That one has'nt happend to us yet. I hope we don't see that one either. I did not relize that you were promised work and not recieved it.

 

We were alwyas promised to "look for work" we thought that was just bullshit until now. I am not farmilar with many other plants except on the eastside.

[chriper]

Which plant are you from? We did 2 coa's and 2 national agreements at our plant and recieved nothing in return. we havent had new work in almost 10 years. I mean somthing we didnt make already. RDU would be great for our plant.

 

I can see permanent layoffs without it, in our plant, we just picked up almost 200 local 400 people and rumor is we are getting more.

 

Where are we going to work if we don't get work? sub lasts 21 weeks then I would be on tap for 21. I don't want any concessions but I want to work.

 

New Work is the best job security is'nt it?. I would be pissed off too if sterling was promised work and did'nt recieve it. That one has'nt happend to us yet. I hope we don't see that one either. I did not relize that you were promised work and not recieved it.

 

We were alwyas promised to "look for work" we thought that was just bullshit until now. I am not farmilar with many other plants except on the eastside.

 

ford wants us to give the best of both worlds to them,,they want the bankruptcy terms that gm and chrysler got ,,but what everyone is missing here is there is no equity of sacrifice,,,a fed judge in bankruptcy would take from both sides equally {called equity of sacrifice}ford wants us to freely give them those terms without them having to give nothing,,,I SAY TELL FORD TO GO BANKRUPT!!! WE GET THE SAME TERMS AS GM AND CHRYSLER,,,then the judge will take from both sides equally,GEE WHATS THE WORST THAT COULD HAPPEN WE GET WHAT THEY WANT NOW???

[buster6969]

Dude.....don't associate me with this fk!

He does sound like some salaried I know....I think his real name is Paul K....just a guess.

I thought you were leaving this site? See ya!

[lquidspine]

Again, I am going to repeat myself..I am not for or against the agreement yet. I am not for a NO Strike clause, I would also turn it down.

 

Jeff was not excited about this deal but has an obligation. He has been working on getting work for our plant for for a while now. Infact, he said we were about to get work and many of us did not believe him. So you understand, I am glad he was not bullshitting us. Again, many of us believed he was.

 

I am glad he was being honest, I see proof of that in the news article. I did'nt create this thread.

 

I know for a fact he did not even want to go down there to negotiate, so he felt the same way everyone of us feel. He was elected to do so, so he really has no choice and if he was'nt there would Sterling get work or would we be forgotton like the last 4 agreements before he was at the bargaining table?

 

You think louisville assembly and cleveland rouge and wayne/mich assy did'nt get work because their negotiators were at the table???

 

How about skilled, looks like they got a decent deal by comparison to GM and Chrysler agreement. There negotiator had nothing to do with that?

 

So what do Negotiators do??? Maybe I am confused about this?

How many times do the same work allocations need to be renegotiated.....

 

From the unpublished letters in the 2007 contract,

and ....

 

From the 2009 modifications agreement.

 

 

I mean come on Eagle the sterling work was already allocated they are simply repackaging it like its new.

Edited October 11, 2009 by lquidspine

[228Milwright]

Which plant are you from? We did 2 coa's and 2 national agreements at our plant and recieved nothing in return. we havent had new work in almost 10 years. I mean somthing we didnt make already. RDU would be great for our plant.

 

I can see permanent layoffs without it, in our plant, we just picked up almost 200 local 400 people and rumor is we are getting more.

 

Where are we going to work if we don't get work? sub lasts 21 weeks then I would be on tap for 21. I don't want any concessions but I want to work.

 

New Work is the best job security is'nt it?. I would be pissed off too if sterling was promised work and did'nt recieve it. That one has'nt happend to us yet. I hope we don't see that one either. I did not relize that you were promised work and not recieved it.

 

We were alwyas promised to "look for work" we thought that was just bullshit until now. I am not farmilar with many other plants except on the eastside.

 

 

Eagle,

 

I can live with entry level. I don't understand the arbitration and the more people talk the more confused I get.

 

What did Jeff say about the trades? Are we getting two trades like GM and Chrysler? Is the fab shop going away? What about overtime? Will we have to break up into production teams with seperate ovetime?

 

228elec,

You are being a little hard on Jeff.

 

Presidents don't have duties in the plant. Neil let us down on shafts and cases like the eagle said, that is one of the reasons he will be working back with us.

 

Eagle,

If there is a NO Strike clause I am a No vote even with new work. We have to be able to strike over product commitments in 2011 if we don't get everything we were told we were getting. or I am a no vote. Thats the only power we have. It sounds like too many plants were promised work and have yet to get it. If we lose that power we are finished. We are not getting a raise anyway because of GM and Chrysler taking our tax dollars. I don't care about wages, we never strike over wages anyway. What about health and safety?

 

If plants don't get the product that was committed then we must have the ablility to strike over it in 2011 contract deadline or we have no power as a union. I am sure Jeff and the rest of them understand that! Pass it on to him! Thanks.

[VDTRANSMAN]

New Work is the best job security is'nt it?. I would be pissed off too if sterling was promised work and did'nt recieve it. That one has'nt happend to us yet. I hope we don't see that one either. I did not relize that you were promised work and not recieved it.

 

We were alwyas promised to "look for work" we thought that was just bullshit until now. I am not farmilar with many other plants except on the eastside.

 

 

Van Dyke has yet to see the extremely low volume hybrid job that was already promised either. Nothing going on except a ton of empty floor space. No prep work going on or anything. I am sure the Mexicans are busy little fuckers getting the new 6F Dual Clutch Powershift Trans ready for launch.

Edited October 11, 2009 by VDTRANSMAN

[Dale143]

Its late and im tired and i don't feel like going back through this thread to see if you all have touched on this yet.Did anyone catch in the last minute or so of the Gettelfinger interview were the host asked him if he would be meeting with the Obama car team any time soon? He said yes he would be meeting with them next week.

There's your third party arbitrator.And you know witch way that will go. Vote no and keep your house.

[long donkey]

Eagle,

 

I can live with entry level. I don't understand the arbitration and the more people talk the more confused I get.

 

What did Jeff say about the trades? Are we getting two trades like GM and Chrysler? Is the fab shop going away? What about overtime? Will we have to break up into production teams with seperate ovetime?

 

228elec,

You are being a little hard on Jeff.

 

Presidents don't have duties in the plant. Neil let us down on shafts and cases like the eagle said, that is one of the reasons he will be working back with us.

 

Eagle,

If there is a NO Strike clause I am a No vote even with new work. We have to be able to strike over product commitments in 2011 if we don't get everything we were told we were getting. or I am a no vote. Thats the only power we have. It sounds like too many plants were promised work and have yet to get it. If we lose that power we are finished. We are not getting a raise anyway because of GM and Chrysler taking our tax dollars. I don't care about wages, we never strike over wages anyway. What about health and safety?

 

If plants don't get the product that was committed then we must have the ablility to strike over it in 2011 contract deadline or we have no power as a union. I am sure Jeff and the rest of them understand that! Pass it on to him! Thanks.

 

I got an uncalled for cussing from Eagle over the strike question. No apology followed, that is fine with me, as he has proven himself an idiot.

The reason I was vocal is he is not accurate(on many issues), and the last thing we need at this time is to not understand our contract and what we can or cannot do, especially when it comes to renegotiating concessions.

 

Even if we keep the right to strike you cannot strike over product commitment.

 

The contract outlines what you strike over. I gave the Article and Sections numbers of our contract that outline this. It was the post before he told me to kiss his penis, called me an ass, f-off, oh and my favorite blow him in solidarity. This is why we struggle.

 

There is a reason we do not strike over wages, see art. and sec. mentioned above.

 

Why do I care, it is my union also. Why would I post again after being humiliated? This stuff is more important than my ego. But, what do I know. I'm just some dumb hillbilly that has moved halfway across the country for this job. Other qualifications like being active in our union, holding elected positions and negotiating a local contract pale in comparison to Mr. Eagles experience.

 

People like Eagle are the reason I have only posted 20 times in 3 years. This is why a lot of other knowledgeable people choose not to post here.

So in closing, be careful who you get your info from. Don't think I wanna put up with the crap on here for a while again.

[BroncoLover]

Arbitration means that we are going to get the same pay as everybody else. Ford will make the case that we do equal work as the transplants and the bankrupties, why should why receive extra pay. Once again another contract with out a raise or worse, how about a pay cut down to their level. Why would he give us a raise when nobody else is getting one. Why give this power over to someone else. With out the right to strike they can force you to work for months with out a national contract all in the name of negotiations. Promise you that your plant will keep it's product through its life cycle only to change the name and send it to Mexico. What good is a product commitment if the Escort becomes say the Marxman. We was promised the Escape thru it's life cycle, The next generation Escape is the Kuga, where is it going. We don't know. This generations life cycle ends in 2011, how convenient is that. So like evrybody else we have no idea of what our next vehicle is or if we even get one. They are in the drivers seat not only for the 2011 contract but let's not forget that this runs thru 2015 which is the next contract so we will face the same thing. Like I said why give up this power. Based on that one line I say NO. Take a $3000 bonus away just to give you a $1000 based on quality. That worked out in our favor.

[EX_SLAP]

I guess after many years of UAW contracts I just don't trust them to give us all of the information. You

never really know completely what you are voting on. Usually they only tell you the good parts or

at least what we want to hear. We find out the details of how we were screwed after the

contract has passed. Count me as another no vote.