New Crown Victoria Interceptor?????

[rscalzo]

Spoken by a true officer...waiting now for Rascalzo and Nickf1011 reply. :shades:

 

Zero cost. All vehicles were speced with a 100k warrenty. Costs to date are routine maintence by the town's service department which services over a hundred vehicles. Costs have been less overall.

[rscalzo]

Zero cost. All vehicles were spec'd with a 100k warranty. Costs to date are routine maintenance by the town's service department which services over a hundred vehicles. Costs have been less overall.

 

 

I don't ride in the backseat so I don't really care how much room is back there.

You don't mind spending ten minutes trying to get a unruly and uncooperative prisoner back there and secured. You don't mind exposing yourself and assisting officers to an extended period of a safety hazard. The Caprice was discontinued when you just got on the job. I spent years with them. The drive train was heads above the CV. The car itself was about equal.

 

The gearshift was the subject of a recall recently.

Edited January 4, 2010 by rscalzo

[Treadhead]

It's never taken more than a minute to get even unruly passengers in the back seat.

It doesn't take years of driving a Caprice to tell what problems are there. It was very nose heavy which induced heavy oversteer. The front suspension was overworked due the weight and consequently resulted in broken front end parts. The cooling system was a joke as well. If you were stopped for more than ten minutes you had to raise the hood to help keep it cool. Otherwise it would overheat and the A/C would quit working. No A/C here in the summer months is a no no. It's embarassing when a citizen stops and asks if you need help when you have the hood raised trying to keep your patrol car from overheating.

So, just because the Caprice was going out of service right after I started my career has nothing to do with my experience driving them. They were in our car pool for atleast 3 years of my career.

 

I haven't seen a whole lot about the new Caprice (Holden) but, it looks like it might be decent. Hopefully whatever we get to replace the CV is as good as the CV has been.

 

Not trying to get in a pissing match. These are my experiences with these vehicles.

[Topgun]

Zero cost. All vehicles were speced with a 100k warrenty. Costs to date are routine maintence by the town's service department which services over a hundred vehicles. Costs have been less overall.

Of course costs are less you paid for them up front with extended warranty, a no brainer for who ever ordered those Chargers.

Edited January 5, 2010 by topgun

[Topgun]

Zero cost. All vehicles were speced with a 100k warrenty. Costs to date are routine maintence by the town's service department which services over a hundred vehicles. Costs have been less overall.

Of course costs are less you paid for them up front with extended warranty, a no brainer for who ever ordered those Chargers.

[rscalzo]

Of course costs are less you paid for them up front with extended warranty, a no brainier for who ever ordered those Chargers.

 

Raising the hood was the cause of the overheating problem. Getting that across to the users was the problem. Unless you had a lack of maintenance, the Caprice Classic handled as well as any other vehicle in its class.

 

Getting someone into the seat isn't the problem. Getting him secured in a seatbelt is the problem. That isn't as big an issue with the molded seats. Ford as well as GM has had problems. Ford lost a multi million dollar suit for faulty underpowered power steering pumps. The had problems with manifolds cracking after a short time. The well published fire hazard didn't help. Any police unit is going to have it's share of problems. Our use is urban which creates a different set of problems and is a harsher use than the open country use. Today neither vehicle would be ideal in todays enviroment nor would it meet our needs. Nor is anyone's budget allowing a mass turnover of vehicles so departments are holding on to what they have. We will have CV's in outr fleet for three or four more years before they are finally retired. By then what we replace them with isn't an issue as the CV will be out of production.

 

Of course costs are less you paid for them up front with extended warranty

The cost per unit was just over 18k. The Crown Vics at the time were slightly under 20k. The additional costs were little compared to the benefits. Extended warrenty was also a part of most of the CV purchases. Our state contract dealer buys the cars a few hundred at a time so I would guess they are able to negotiate some decent deals.

Edited January 5, 2010 by rscalzo

[Vaquero28]

Raising the hood was the cause of the overheating problem. Getting that across to the users was the problem. Unless you had a lack of maintenance, the Caprice Classic handled as well as any other vehicle in its class.

 

Getting someone into the seat isn't the problem. Getting him secured in a seatbelt is the problem. That isn't as big an issue with the molded seats. Ford as well as GM has had problems. Ford lost a multi million dollar suit for faulty underpowered power steering pumps. The had problems with manifolds cracking after a short time. The well published fire hazard didn't help. Any police unit is going to have it's share of problems. Our use is urban which creates a different set of problems and is a harsher use than the open country use. Today neither vehicle would be ideal in todays enviroment nor would it meet our needs. Nor is anyone's budget allowing a mass turnover of vehicles so departments are holding on to what they have. We will have CV's in outr fleet for three or four more years before they are finally retired. By then what we replace them with isn't an issue as the CV will be out of production.

 

 

The cost per unit was just over 18k. The Crown Vics at the time were slightly under 20k. The additional costs were little compared to the benefits. Extended warrenty was also a part of most of the CV purchases. Our state contract dealer buys the cars a few hundred at a time so I would guess they are able to negotiate some decent deals.

 

 

The answer is of course very simple, Lobby your department to only purchase vehicles you wish to drive, that way all criticism of that vehicle will wind up right where it belongs. However you will be happy.

[rscalzo]

The answer is of course very simple, Lobby your department to only purchase vehicles you wish to drive, that way all criticism of that vehicle will wind up right where it belongs. However you will be happy.

 

 

Or buy your own like they do (or did) in Hawaii.

[WC Man]

I love when ad guys say ahead of time something will be more durable. You can't predict durability. Its proven over time. The panther is a durable vehicle. They take a beating and keep coming back for more. The Charger goes like stink, just as long as you don't mind replacing a tranny every 20k or so miles.

 

BTW, the Grand Fury was unit bodied. Chrysler abandoned frames on all but imperial in the 50's. All of the classic Chrysler cars, including the Bluesmobile, were unit bodied. However, they were not near as suceptible to minor collisions as today's unit body cars are. The Grany Fury had about a foot of body beyond suspension components though, D3's don't have near that much, esp. since the bumper doesn't extend to the edge of the car.

[ute]

Well it seems London Ont is wanting to buy and stockpile as many CVI's as possible................hmmmmmmm that says something for the old girl

[hee haw]

Well it seems London Ont is wanting to buy and stockpile as many CVI's as possible................hmmmmmmm that says something for the old girl

 

 

London ON city council OKed buying an extra years supply to stockpile, this 32 car order might be all they need to keep plant open! For another half hour.

[T'Cal]

Still no real news, huh? I'm really looking forward to this as now there is going to be some real competition in this market. The CVPIs are pretty good cars having been updated mechanically several times since 1992. Still, I loved the Caprice, which, despite being huge, handled better the faster you went. The power was never lacking allowing for smoky burnouts and plenty of guts for higher speed passing. While the quality of materials was behind Ford's, the added width of the Caprice allowed wide front seats as well - important since all uniformed cops carry a lot of equipment on their belts not to mention many are bigger people. I always figured Ford would update the power train at least with the 300+HP and 5 or 6 speed automatic from the Mustang and truck models.

 

FWD Impalas just didn't hold up under hard use with transmissions and front ends failing for my agency. They are peppy and they do get good FE but they are much better suited for Administrative and civilian use. I drove a Charger police car that was passed around my area as a test and while it was fast with the Hemi, few officers cared for it due to the closed in feeling front and back and large turning circle.

 

I'm still wondering if the Carbon Motors E7 will make it to the market. The most promising vehicle for cops right now is the 2011 Caprice from down under. If Chevy keeps the price reasonable, they'll have a winner on their hands and take over the market, especially of Ford comes to the market too late with their new PI or if it's FWD. If either happen, Chevy will have the market locked up so to speak.

 

One way Ford could retain their hold is to conduct a major overhaul on the Panther-based CVPI that still allows many of the currently used aftermarket parts to be used. This would save municipalities a bundle over having to sell off computer mounts, prisoner seats, prisoner partitions, light bars, consoles, rifle/shotgun mounts, video systems, etc. not to mention sending out Motor Pool mechanics for new certifications. Ford could replace the drive train with the 3.7L V6, 5.0L V8, and six speed automatic from the 2011 Mustang. They could add an IRS that could be shared with the Mustang, too. The platform could stretch a bit perhaps to the LWB that was optional for fleet CVs to allow for increased interior space.

Edited January 25, 2010 by T'Cal

[taxman100]

Still no real news, huh? I'm really looking forward to this as now there is going to be some real competition in this market. The CVPIs are pretty good cars having been updated mechanically several times since 1992. Still, I loved the Caprice, which, despite being huge, handled better the faster you went. The power was never lacking allowing for smoky burnouts and plenty of guts for higher speed passing. While the quality of materials was behind Ford's, the added width of the Caprice allowed wide front seats as well - important since all uniformed cops carry a lot of equipment on their belts not to mention many are bigger people. I always figured Ford would update the power train at least with the 300+HP and 5 or 6 speed automatic from the Mustang and truck models.

 

FWD Impalas just didn't hold up under hard use with transmissions and front ends failing for my agency. They are peppy and they do get good FE but they are much better suited for Administrative and civilian use. I drove a Charger police car that was passed around my area as a test and while it was fast with the Hemi, few officers cared for it due to the closed in feeling front and back and large turning circle.

 

I'm still wondering if the Carbon Motors E7 will make it to the market. The most promising vehicle for cops right now is the 2011 Caprice from down under. If Chevy keeps the price reasonable, they'll have a winner on their hands and take over the market, especially of Ford comes to the market too late with their new PI or if it's FWD. If either happen, Chevy will have the market locked up so to speak.

 

One way Ford could retain their hold is to conduct a major overhaul on the Panther-based CVPI that still allows many of the currently used aftermarket parts to be used. This would save municipalities a bundle over having to sell off computer mounts, prisoner seats, prisoner partitions, light bars, consoles, rifle/shotgun mounts, video systems, etc. not to mention sending out Motor Pool mechanics for new certifications. Ford could replace the drive train with the 3.7L V6, 5.0L V8, and six speed automatic from the 2011 Mustang. They could add an IRS that could be shared with the Mustang, too. The platform could stretch a bit perhaps to the LWB that was optional for fleet CVs to allow for increased interior space.

 

It will be a Ford/Volvo Taurus with a decontented interior. Ford is all about globalization today - someday they can import all of their products from 3rd world countries.

[jpd80]

It will be a Ford/Volvo Taurus with a decontented interior. Ford is all about globalization today - someday they can import all of their products from 3rd world countries.

Transport costs are too expensive, that's why Asian manufacturers set up plants in North America.

 

I'm really wondering whether Ford has the Police Interceptor covered with their proposed product or whether they are just toughing out their FWD/AWD policy for all large North American sedans. It must be nerve racking to see both Crown Victoria and RWD Falcon sitting there and chose neither one.

[rscalzo]

I'm still wondering if the Carbon Motors E7 will make it to the market.

 

 

I doubt you will ever see that vehicle in production.

[96towncarcartier]

The only real police car I have ever driven in my life was a 1973 Plymouth Gran Fury 440. Anything from 1974 up was a "wannabe cop car". Sadly enough though, I never had the pleasure of driving any of the pre-1973 Mopars.

 

Ford has NEVER had any power to the rear wheels. NEVER.

 

 

 

And I've talked to people who've driven those Chrysler products from the '60s and 70's...who admitted, yeah they were fast...as long as you were going in a straight line...

 

Try to turn that thing..... and Good Luck.

[T'Cal]

02/07/10: Still no news.

 

What with the high output version of the 3.7L DOHC coming in the 2011 Mustang and Lincoln FWD/AWD vehicles, I'm still guessing that the next PI will be Taurus based with this 305HP plant and AWD standard. Not my top choice, mind you, but more probable than a Falcon based model I fear. I hope I'm wrong. An AWD Taurus PI could be a pretty good vehicle with advantages in traction, balance, and fuel economy over the Caprice PPV, but the Chevy will likely have more interior and cargo space plus better handling and straight line performance.

[Bob Rosadini]

02/07/10: Still no news.

 

What with the high output version of the 3.7L DOHC coming in the 2011 Mustang and Lincoln FWD/AWD vehicles, I'm still guessing that the next PI will be Taurus based with this 305HP plant and AWD standard. Not my top choice, mind you, but more probable than a Falcon based model I fear. I hope I'm wrong. An AWD Taurus PI could be a pretty good vehicle with advantages in traction, balance, and fuel economy over the Caprice PPV, but the Chevy will likely have more interior and cargo space plus better handling and straight line performance.

Well my new ride is a Taurus. Amd after switching from an 07 CV Sport, I can say Ford will have to work miracles to make enough room in a Taurus to accomodate all of the high tech equipment today's LE vehicles carry. Plus the fact, just getting in an out- HA- if it happens I feel sorry for the cameraman on "Cops". If you thought he was heavy breathing after jumping out of a CV, just wait.

 

Oh one other thing- given the real likelihood cruisers are often forced to cross medians etc, the ground cleanrance on the Taurus is tight. Today I put mine up on the ramps I have used for 30 years and guess what- not even close to the ground clearance the CV has. With my 07 Sport I could roll the creeper back to the transmission. With this Taurus- I couldn't get past the plastic shroud that completely covers the bottom of the engine- this by the way traps an unbelievable amount of heat- Last week when I drove the car home and popped the hood, I couldn't understan why it was so hot- now I understand-there is no air flow under that engine.

 

If the Taurus does become the Interceptor, I say they have a ton of work to do to make it a satisfactory performer- unfortunately.

[Topgun]

Well my new ride is a Taurus. Amd after switching from an 07 CV Sport, I can say Ford will have to work miracles to make enough room in a Taurus to accomodate all of the high tech equipment today's LE vehicles carry. Plus the fact, just getting in an out- HA- if it happens I feel sorry for the cameraman on "Cops". If you thought he was heavy breathing after jumping out of a CV, just wait.

 

Oh one other thing- given the real likelihood cruisers are often forced to cross medians etc, the ground cleanrance on the Taurus is tight. Today I put mine up on the ramps I have used for 30 years and guess what- not even close to the ground clearance the CV has. With my 07 Sport I could roll the creeper back to the transmission. With this Taurus- I couldn't get past the plastic shroud that completely covers the bottom of the engine- this by the way traps an unbelievable amount of heat- Last week when I drove the car home and popped the hood, I couldn't understan why it was so hot- now I understand-there is no air flow under that engine.

 

If the Taurus does become the Interceptor, I say they have a ton of work to do to make it a satisfactory performer- unfortunately.

Say it ain't so Bob that you got rid of the 07 CV Sport that I babied thru the plant for you?

[rscalzo]

driven those Chrysler products from the '60s and 70's...who admitted, yeah they were fast

 

We had them with 440's. they were fast...right up until the A frame fell off. Now that our chargers are seeing high mileage, the same problem is cropping up.

[Bob Rosadini]

Say it ain't so Bob that you got rid of the 07 CV Sport that I babied thru the plant for you?

Fred- where have you been? Go to page three on the Ford Discussion thread.

[Topgun]

Fred- where have you been? Go to page three on the Ford Discussion thread.

I've had difficulty signing in and posting on here for at least a month. Love your pic Bob,same one I've got on my homepage.

[Bob Rosadini]

I've had difficulty signing in and posting on here for at least a month. Love your pic Bob,same one I've got on my homepage.

I'll send you some more of the family fleet.

[T'Cal]

I attended the Chicago Auto Show last month and spoke with someone from the Taurus/MkS/new Explorer plant. I asked him if he had any news on the next PI and he grinned sheepishly. I said that just as the CVPI fades away, Chevy is coming out with a great Police car ready to steal the market from Ford if it isn't ready to continue with a strong contender. He agreed. I told him I didn't want him to get in trouble for releasing any info too early and asked if he'd mind if I told him what I thought Ford would be doing. He graciously gave me the opportunity. I told him that based on what Ford has said so far about the next PI being designed and built in the US, I didn't think the Falcon would make it here from Downunder. I added that I thought Ford would likely use the Taurus powered by the new 3.7L 305HP V6 from the Mustang and Lincolns and that if they backed it with AWD, at least as an option, the Taurus PI would be a helluva package. I also said that rumors of the SHO engine being in the PI seemed pie in the sky - the TTV6 is too costly and complex for a fleet car, I said, and the 3.7 would be plenty powerful and efficient for the big Taurus.

 

He looked at me a moment and then said, "I can only tell you that the next PI will be built in Chicago." I said that that plant (actually in Melrose Park, a suburb of Chicago) built only FWD/AWD vehicles and he said, "The next PI will be built on a heavily modified current model." I said that he must mean the Taurus and his grin got bigger. I asked if I was close on the drivetrain and he said, "AWD? I haven't heard any talk about that, but think more power than the SHO."

 

From his comments I'm guessing the next PI will be a heavily modified Taurus converted to RWD and powered by the Mustang's new 5.0L DOHC V8 backed by a 6 speed automatic. That's the only engine that I can think of that makes more than 365HP at Ford. In addition I have to wonder if the body will be the same as the 2010 Taurus or perhaps instead the older design from a year or so ago. That older model had much more interior room and truck space, although it was a bit staid looking - not a bad thing for a cop car. If I'm wrong here, then I'm guessing that Ford will replace the back seats with smaller ones, maybe a moulded plastic seat like many agencies install aftermarket; it's pretty small in the back of the new ones and the roof line steals a lot of head room from the older model. With the new Caprice being a unibody, Ford could do the same.

 

About the only other scenario I can imagine is if Ford shifts building the CV to the Chicago plant where the Panther will be heavily updated. If Ford did this, they would be wise to keep some dimensions the same as the current CVPI so agencies could continue to swap out parts from the old cars to the new ones (computer mounts, rifle mounts, prisoner shields and seats, consoles, etc.). The 250HP 4.6L SOHC/4 speed auto powered CVPI's aren't underpowered but they aren't screamers either. Imagine a new one with the 2011 Mustang GT plant and tranny! I can also imagine Ford making the 305HP 3.7L V6 the standard plant - Chrysler does that with the Dodge Charger police package and many municipalities take the standard V6 rather than pay for the Hemi.

Does anyone know when Ford will make an offical announcement? I had hoped it would be at Chicago's Auto Show.

[Bob Rosadini]

 

Does anyone know when Ford will make an offical announcement? I had hoped it would be at Chicago's Auto Show.

I do believe there is some LE association meeting of some sort in March and that is when the news comes out..

 

Can't imagine it will be RWD. My guess? sad to say a Taurus with a bit different tin.