OHV 16V Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 For those counting: Prius PIH at 540 miles, Volt at 380 http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/16/ford-c-max-energi-plug-in-hybrid-is-certified-at-620-miles-of-range/ Even garnered a congrats from Toyota... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 FordBuyer rant coming in 3...2...1... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkisler Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 For those counting: Prius PIH at 540 miles, Volt at 380 http://wheels.blogs....miles-of-range/ Even garnered a congrats from Toyota... And during those long 640 mile trips, here's something sweet you guys might consider buying for your SO: http://www.magic-cone.com/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OHV 16V Posted October 16, 2012 Author Share Posted October 16, 2012 And during those long 640 mile trips, here's something sweet you guys might consider buying for your SO: http://www.magic-cone.com/ LMFAO! http://www.shewee.co.nz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 LMFAO! http://www.shewee.co.nz hmm, first sweaters for penguins now more Kiwi ingenuity..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 hmm, first sweaters for penguins now more Kiwi ingenuity..... But can they write their name in the snow with it? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 But can they write their name in the snow with it? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiSjQ7iWhMA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
03 LS Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 For those counting: Prius PIH at 540 miles, Volt at 380 http://wheels.blogs....miles-of-range/ Even garnered a congrats from Toyota... Aren't gas tank size and mixed driving mpg the deciding factors, and battery size/capacity almost irrelevant? And how do they calculate this EPA "certified" range? Take C-Max Hybrid for example ("certified" 47mpg accross board), 47mpg * 13.5g = 634.5 miles, yet its "certified" range is 571 miles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkisler Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Aren't gas tank size and mixed driving mpg the deciding factors, and battery size/capacity almost irrelevant? And how do they calculate this EPA "certified" range? Take C-Max Hybrid for example ("certified" 47mpg accross board), 47mpg * 13.5g = 634.5 miles, yet its "certified" range is 571 miles. The EPA estimate assumes that 10% of the fuel will remain in the tank. So 47*13.5*0.9=571. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
03 LS Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Thanks for the info, Austin. But why 10%, a bit arbitrary, isn't it? My own experience, when my Milan Hybrid's "Miles to Empty" was down to 5/6 (only twice, miles driven was ~615), I still had 2~2.5 gallon left in the tank (filled up 15~15.5g to a 17.5g tank). So, if manufacturors don't pick 10% as empty, why did EPA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkisler Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Thanks for the info, Austin. But why 10%, a bit arbitrary, isn't it? My own experience, when my Milan Hybrid's "Miles to Empty" was down to 5/6 (only twice, miles driven was ~615), I still had 2~2.5 gallon left in the tank (filled up 15~15.5g to a 17.5g tank). So, if manufacturors don't pick 10% as empty, why did EPA? Like so many things, it's just an assumption; I'm guessing most people probably leave more than 1.3 gallons in the tank but I have no data (that would be around 60 miles to empty for the C-Max (just a bit befoe all the warning chimes go off at 50) EPA also has other assumptions. For instance, the combined city/highway assumes 45% highway and 55% city. The EPA website (www.fueleconomy.gov) allows you to customize your annual mileage, the percentage of city/highway, and the cost of fuel to get a better estimate for your personal driving.situation. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 And during those long 640 mile trips, here's something sweet you guys might consider buying for your SO: http://www.magic-cone.com/ What? How was this not posted by Dean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 (edited) Whats becoming clearer in discussions is that the longer you travel with a Ford energi or basic hybrid, the better it is compared to a Volt. II like what Ford is doing, making the energi an extension of the hybrid systems, I wonder if better batteries can be retro fitted as they become available.. Edited October 18, 2012 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timf Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 The breakeven point between a fully charged Volt and C-Max Energi is 90 miles. If you never travel more than 90 miles between charges the Volt is the way to go, but for longer trips the C-Max Energi is superior. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Why such a small gas tank? Why not a 15 or 16 gallon tank for more range closer to 700 miles. It's a pain to stop for gas, so key is to give your vehicles long as range as possible before stopping for gas, especially forced to in some strange are/neighborhood you know nothing about. The fuel tank capacity on my Taurus is 19 gallons and 17 gallons on my Boxster, a 2,780 pound vehicle and much smaller than C Max. I can go close to 500 highway miles on my Taurus and still have a few gallons left when gauge shows empty. I can see a 13.5 gallon tank on a Fiesta, but not a C Max. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkisler Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Why such a small gas tank? Why not a 15 or 16 gallon tank for more range closer to 700 miles. It's a pain to stop for gas, so key is to give your vehicles long as range as possible before stopping for gas, especially forced to in some strange are/neighborhood you know nothing about. The fuel tank capacity on my Taurus is 19 gallons and 17 gallons on my Boxster, a 2,780 pound vehicle and much smaller than C Max. I can go close to 500 highway miles on my Taurus and still have a few gallons left when gauge shows empty. I can see a 13.5 gallon tank on a Fiesta, but not a C Max. It's only 13.5 gallons because that's all you need with this fantastic fuel economy to get a very high range. Why carry any extra fuel (and weight) around if you don't need it; that only hurts fuel economy. Of course there could have been some packaging issues and/or some weight issues to keep the car in the Intertial Test Weight Class, but we won't hear about those if they were a factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 It's only 13.5 gallons because that's all you need with this fantastic fuel economy to get a very high range. Why carry any extra fuel (and weight) around if you don't need it; that only hurts fuel economy. Of course there could have been some packaging issues and/or some weight issues to keep the car in the Intertial Test Weight Class, but we won't hear about those if they were a factor. Could be the battery takes up room where extra capacity fuel tank would have gone. With $4 gas, I doubt if many fill their tank when at gas station except for long trips. So I don't see extra couple gallon gas tank as big deal if it will fit nicely in a hybrid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Why such a small gas tank? Why not a 15 or 16 gallon tank for more range closer to 700 miles. It's a pain to stop for gas, so key is to give your vehicles long as range as possible before stopping for gas, especially forced to in some strange are/neighborhood you know nothing about. So I guess that makes the Volt with it's 380 mile range downright dangerous, eh? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 It's only 13.5 gallons because that's all you need with this fantastic fuel economy to get a very high range. Why carry any extra fuel (and weight) around if you don't need it; that only hurts fuel economy. Of course there could have been some packaging issues and/or some weight issues to keep the car in the Intertial Test Weight Class, but we won't hear about those if they were a factor. HELL the Fiestas are only 12.4............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 What? How was this not posted by Dean? guess Im behind the times....lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoser768 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 With $4 gas, I doubt if many fill their tank when at gas station except for long trips. Wut? I'm not making 2 or 3 stops a week to put $10 in the tank. When the tank nears empty, I stop and fill it up. Even when it's 17.5 gallons into the 19 gallon Five Hundred tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Wut? I'm not making 2 or 3 stops a week to put $10 in the tank. When the tank nears empty, I stop and fill it up. Even when it's 17.5 gallons into the 19 gallon Five Hundred tank. Everytime I pull up to a pump the display on pump shows previous customer put in anywhere from $10 to $35 in most cases. Very seldon do I see $60-70 fillups. And the higher gas prices go the more I notice it. I once saw a guy in a Chevy SUV SS in line in front of me at gas station give the clerk about 85 cents in dimes and pennies to "gas" up. Must be a Metro Detroit thing. Not a lot of people willing to spend $75 everytime they enter gas station. Anyway, I remember having Taurus as company car when working and having Focus also before Taurus. Even though the Focus got 26mpg average compared to Taurus 22mpg, I fueled up at about same interval because Focus gas tank was so much smaller than Taurus. I once heard Ford engineer say that to Ford interval between fill up was just as important as mpg. The less time at gas station the better. They are usually crowded, increased chance of someone backing into you, and sometimes hard to get back onto very busy street with major intersection nearby. So less time better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenCaylor Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 This reminds me of my second car, an 83 Escort GT with the 88 hp, 1.6L EFI, 5-speed manual drivetrain. Back in the post gas crises days, most manufacturors offered extended range fuel tanks. The standard tank was 11 gallons. The optional tank, which was the one I ordered, was 13.5. I remember driving from Inglewood (near LAX) to Hearst Castle and back on one tank. Turned out to be 39 MPG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkisler Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 (edited) This reminds me of my second car, an 83 Escort GT with the 88 hp, 1.6L EFI, 5-speed manual drivetrain. Back in the post gas crises days, most manufacturors offered extended range fuel tanks. The standard tank was 11 gallons. The optional tank, which was the one I ordered, was 13.5. I remember driving from Inglewood (near LAX) to Hearst Castle and back on one tank. Turned out to be 39 MPG. I had one of those "bad boys" also. This will relate back to my comment that the size of the tank could be due to weight. I'm embarassed to say the tank on the Escort was a trick. Ford needed to keep the car within an inertia weight class. Weights are based on all options over 33%. So Ford created a "base" lower capacity tank by pushing the filler down further. In the "optional" tank, they left the filler at normal height but they knew the optional tank would have a low installation rate. That way, the weight for EPA testing was based on the weight of the fuel in the smaller capacity tank. So the relatively small tank on C-Max could be due to package or weight. Edited October 19, 2012 by Austin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 I had one of those "bad boys" also. This will relate back to my comment that the size of the tank could be due to weight. I'm embarassed to say the tank on the Escort was a trick. Ford needed to keep the car within an inertia weight class. Weights are based on all options over 33%. So Ford created a "base" lower capacity tank by pushing the filler down further. In the "optional" tank, they left the filler at normal height but they knew the optional tank would have a low installation rate. That way, the weight for EPA testing was based on the weight of the fuel in the smaller capacity tank. So the relatively small tank on C-Max could be due to package or weight. tank and That's the same reason Lincoln removed the rear headrests and audiophile stereo from the Lincoln LS sport package in late 1999. They had to get the weight down to keep it in a lower class. That was temporary though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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