The Honda Prologue Is Already Proving Toyota Wrong

[Biker16]

It may be a GM car underneath, but the electric Honda Prologue is a hit. And it proves people want good EVs from brands they trust.

 

https://insideevs.com/news/740597/honda-prologue-toyota-bz4x-sales/

 

Quote

One of the more interesting—perhaps even baffling—studies that we've highlighted this year is the one that indicated most consumers are convinced that the Japanese automakers are the ones leading the way on electric vehicles. This, of course, is not true; while companies like Toyota, Honda and Nissan pioneered hybrid vehicles and do very well there (the first two, anyway) they are now playing catch-up when it comes to fully electric cars. 

 

But people still think of those brands as "green" and trust their generally excellent reputations for reliability and quality. Put simply, people want good EVs from the Japanese automakers. And Honda is proving that to be true more and more every month.

As we have reported before, the all-electric Honda Prologue is proving to be the unexpected EV hit of 2024. The most recent data running through the end of October had the Prologue at 18,309 sales this year; it outsold the Ford Mustang Mach-E that month and has already bested the Nissan Ariya and Toyota bZ4X with year-to-date sales. Not bad at all for a total newcomer to the modern all-electric space.

I feel Ford should have offered a rebranded version of the US-made Id.4 as a low risk EV. 

Edited November 13 by Biker16

[morgan20]

Yea, even though Honda is doin' EV development in-house now (last year they terminated plans to build mass market EV with GM), Prologue has been a hit. It actually outsells its GM sibling, the Chevy Blazer EV

Edited November 22 by morgan20

[Rick73]

I like it for what it is.  I’m not a Honda evangelist but have owned three of them, and can relate to the following statement in article and its implied sentiment:
 

“Unlike many EVs, the Prologue’s performance will set no one’s hair on fire, but it does feature thoughtful and elevated details of the kind Honda evangelists have come to love.“

 

Sometimes it seems there is a disconnect between what car designers want to design and what the majority of buyers actually want or are willing to pay for.  In the case of my three Hondas (all very different from each other), they provided what I wanted at the time and not much more I didn’t want.  The Prologue would work for me as a city car but I’d prefer a CR-V, Pilot or Passport for a road trip, which essentially rules the Prologue out for me.  It would be interesting to compare Prologue sales volume to other Honda SUVs.

Edited November 13 by Rick73

[Sherminator98]

6 hours ago, Rick73 said:

I like it for what it is.  I’m not a Honda evangelist but have owned three of them, and can relate to the following statement in article and its implied sentiment:
 

“Unlike many EVs, the Prologue’s performance will set no one’s hair on fire, but it does feature thoughtful and elevated details of the kind Honda evangelists have come to love.“

 

Here lies a possible problem-there might be a number of Honda evangelists that wanted an EV from Honda, but once that demand is satisfied...can they actually keep growing it?

 

That is why first 6 months or so of "great" sales often doesn't translate into longer term success. 

[Rick73]

Yes, I expect that applies to all brands and most vehicles as well.  Even Tesla may lose repeat buyers over time.

[jpd80]

On 11/14/2024 at 3:27 AM, Biker16 said:

It may be a GM car underneath, but the electric Honda Prologue is a hit. And it proves people want good EVs from brands they trust.

 

https://insideevs.com/news/740597/honda-prologue-toyota-bz4x-sales/

I feel Ford should have offered a rebranded version of the US-made Id.4 as a low risk EV. 

Ask yourself, why did Ford cut back its MEB supply agreement with VW 

and not sign up to VW and its public request for North American companies

to sign up for VW based EVs………answer: too expensive /all profit for VW only.

Edited November 15 by jpd80

[jpd80]

On 11/14/2024 at 1:23 PM, Rick73 said:

Yes, I expect that applies to all brands and most vehicles as well.  Even Tesla may lose repeat buyers over time.

Everyone just assumes that Tesla will just keep on growing but will it too hit a certain market depth

and just level off. The two door cyber taxi seemed to have a rather underwhelming response from

supporters and investors, the only thing that really buoyed stock price was third quarter profits.

[Rick73]

2 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Everyone just assumes that Tesla will just keep on growing but will it too hit a certain market depth

and just level off. The two door cyber taxi seemed to have a rather underwhelming response from

supporters and investors, the only thing that really buoyed stock price was third quarter profits.

Tesla still claims to be committed to lower-cost vehicles for next year, which should help a little with growth, though no one really knows what that may actually be.  I expect Tesla will reintroduce the base Model 3 (short range) but with battery pack that qualifies for tax credit — though tax credits and incentives may not even exist by next year, at least federal.  It’s also possible they introduce a smaller and lighter variant of Model 3, likely a hatchback.  It’s possible a Model 3 variant could get down to 50~55 kWh battery size and still offer 250+ miles of combined range.  That could make it tough on competition based on price.

 

A steerable or drivable version of the small 2 door Cybercab would be interesting but seems very unlikely to me (in 2- or 4-door).  Some renders based on Cybercab dimensions actually look nice; though too futuristic for traditional tastes.

[jpd80]

8 minutes ago, Rick73 said:

Tesla still claims to be committed to lower-cost vehicles for next year, which should help a little with growth, though no one really knows what that may actually be.  I expect Tesla will reintroduce the base Model 3 (short range) but with battery pack that qualifies for tax credit — though tax credits and incentives may not even exist by next year, at least federal.  It’s also possible they introduce a smaller and lighter variant of Model 3, likely a hatchback.  It’s possible a Model 3 variant could get down to 50~55 kWh battery size and still offer 250+ miles of combined range.  That could make it tough on competition based on price.

 

A steerable or drivable version of the small 2 door Cybercab would be interesting but seems very unlikely to me (in 2- or 4-door).  Some renders based on Cybercab dimensions actually look nice; though too futuristic for traditional tastes.

Sounds like Musk is all for removing govt tax credits, maybe competition BEV sales shrivel up without them.

[Rick73]

13 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Sounds like Musk is all for removing govt tax credits, maybe competition BEV sales shrivel up without them.

Possibly.  Day of reckoning may be approaching rapidly for BEV sales if incentives are removed, and auto manufacturers are not forced to sell them at a loss funded from ICE and Hybrid profits.  I have no idea what’s going to happen, or why Musk is pushing for end to tax credits.  I expect he has a reason, so I’m curious to see what happens under new administration.  Not just with BEV tax credits, but everything else that affects auto industry.

[AGR]

With a narrow majority in the House, it would only take a few Republican Reps to vote no on a repeal of EV tax credits that it may not happen. You know Ford will lobby the Congressman who represents the district where BOC is located. It is far from a done deal.

[akirby]

3 hours ago, AGR said:

With a narrow majority in the House, it would only take a few Republican Reps to vote no on a repeal of EV tax credits that it may not happen. You know Ford will lobby the Congressman who represents the district where BOC is located. It is far from a done deal.

I never supported them but certainly now they’re not needed.  Put that money towards charging infrastructure and battery research and US production.

[morgan20]

On 11/13/2024 at 3:50 PM, Rick73 said:

It would be interesting to compare Prologue sales volume to other Honda SUVs.

 

In October 2024, Prologue outsold Passport and all Acura SUVs

 

1. CR-V 30,826
2. Pilot 11,927
3. HR-V 11,512
4. Prologue 4,130
5. MDX 3,904
6. RDX 3,719
7. Passport 2,549
8. ZDX 1,212

[Rick73]

54 minutes ago, morgan20 said:

 

In October 2024, Prologue outsold Passport and all Acura SUVs

 

1. CR-V 30,826
2. Pilot 11,927
3. HR-V 11,512
4. Prologue 4,130
5. MDX 3,904
6. RDX 3,719
7. Passport 2,549
8. ZDX 1,212

Thanks, appreciate data.  Interesting yet not totally surprising.  We’ll see if volume holds or if that was just initial surge to a new product from Honda.  Passport is a bit low by comparison but a new 2026 is to be released in early 2025, which may explain low volume.  It’s also more expensive than larger Pilot so Motor Trend and others as example have recommended waiting. 

 

I received an ad from Honda this morning for a Prologue and the cost confirms I would not seriously ever consider one.  Lease payment was super low which made it look attractive, but it was based on very high upfront investment.  After 3 years at 10,000/year, the SUV can be purchased for ~$25k.  That means 50% of initial price after only 30,000 miles?  I’ve never leased so not familiar with what’s normal, but that level of effective depreciation seems extremely high to me. If EVs can’t retain much higher percentage of MSRP, they are going to face tough competition from ICE for many years to come.

 

Anyway, Prologue energy efficiency is not great either, so real-world highway range will leave many disappointed if attempting road trips.  EPA hwy rating is under 3 miles per kWh, and I expect steady 70~75 MPH Interstate driving below that.  Range at Interstate speeds would be insufferable on long trips. 😣