STEVE WILSON IS NOT A FRIEND!

[MTPGUY]

Good job Steve, I believe the individuals who trash you need to take a good look at what you are trying to expose. What these high up execs are still spending during a time of hardship at Ford Motoer is un excuseable. We the UAW memebers are going to pay the price due to poor management of the company. I believe as others that the money spent on perks and bonuses could be better spent on product development or saving a few jobs (which they are nor concerned about). I disagree with some of the attitudes towards you here on this site. The truth needs to be told and some of these individuals need to hear it and get with the reality of the situation. Things need to change from top to bottom as I believe I have heard before. By the way who said that? Hope you find the pumps.

 

MTPGUY

[Len_A]

Good job Steve, I believe the individuals who trash you need to take a good look at what you are trying to expose. What these high up execs are still spending during a time of hardship at Ford Motoer is un excuseable. We the UAW memebers are going to pay the price due to poor management of the company. I believe as others that the money spent on perks and bonuses could be better spent on product development or saving a few jobs (which they are nor concerned about). I disagree with some of the attitudes towards you here on this site. The truth needs to be told and some of these individuals need to hear it and get with the reality of the situation. Things need to change from top to bottom as I believe I have heard before. By the way who said that? Hope you find the pumps.

 

MTPGUY

You can disagree with some of the attitudes until you're blue-in-the-face. This crap is the outgrowth of the "competition is good forth the consumer" mentality that opened the door and let plenty of competition for the Detroit auto companies in. More competition for the consumer also means more competition to jack up the salary bidding of the execs, just like expanding the pro ball leagues helped jack up the free agent salaries. Get over it, because it's a fact of life. More competition is good for the consumer, and good for the execs, but crappy for people like us. hourly and salaried, employee and vendor alike.

 

 

 

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed we haven't heard a peep from the union on this?

[Len_A]

In fairness to Mark, this weekend is not the first time we've seen him in a smaller Falcon. I don't think we can conclude anything but that, regardless of which aircraft he picks for the fleet, he still intends to execisr his contractual right to head south for the weekends.

 

What will be more telling...will he continue with those statement's like "belt tightening across the board, absoluetly" and "definitely, we're ALL sharing the sacrifice" statements you've been hearing from him in the past.

Steve, I went back and reread your posts. It will be more tell if Fields and Company continue with the 'belt tightening across the board" statements. I'm betting we will.

 

 

 

Look, for one last time, I'm not on any crusade here other than to simply report what you'd never hear from the Ford p-r team. How you value or use that information, if at all, is entirely up to you. If what they've been found doing (while saying the opposite) means nothing to you because they're somehow "entitled," then fine...and I fully respect your view in this regard. My job is to find the truth and tell it as accurately and fair as I can.

 

On the other hand, if you're asked for more givebacks based on more promises--and Ford has said more givebacks will be requested in the near future--knowing the level of credibility of those doing the asking might be something that could help guide you the next time you or your union asks you to sacrifice just a little more.

Steve, those of us who are vendors to all the Detroit automakers, especially Ford, have been dealing with givebacks for many, many years. Those, like myself, who are the sales people calling on GM, Ford, and Chrysler, have watched our profits erode, and as a consequence our incomes, all the way back to a time when Ford was making good profits, and these hourly and salaried employees alike were getting nice profit-sharing checks.

 

 

 

What credibility does Ford have, as a company, when they were paying out profit sharing checks to the employees, and bonuses to the execs, while demanding steep price concessions from their vendors at the exact same time? Worse of all, Ford purchasing would routinely blame the costs of these employees as the justification for the price concessions. I'm not talking about about this year or last year. I'm talking about seven and eight years ago, when Ford was very much in the black, and all the way back to the late 1980's. They've been doing this for years and years. Where was the investigative journalism then?

Edited November 20, 2006 by Len_A

[J-150]

Steve, you did your job, and did it well. I would ignore the likes of j150 and trimdingman, especially when it gets downright nasty.

 

Oh, and Len A, could you be anymore longwinded? It's hard to read your posts the way you go on, and on, and on, and on...geez...

 

 

You don't get it, do you?

 

This guy is making EVERYONE look bad. Not just the execs.

 

All in the name of some ratings.

 

Good job Steve, I believe the individuals who trash you need to take a good look at what you are trying to expose.

 

 

 

he's an ambulance chaser trying to get ratings.

 

Don't think for a second that he actually gives a crap about you. If he did his expose would be about the Japanese government and US taxpayers propping up the Japanese carmakers. But he isnt, is he? Because that doesnt drive ratings as high as making the US auto industry look like chimps.

[Steve Wilson WXYZ Detroit]

I'm waiting to see that dirty fucking rat tell us what kind of perks the CEO of WXYZ gets.

Well? You dirty fucking rat, tell us what kind of perks YOUR boss gets. How about the CEO of the network itself? Care to tell us about that?

Oh wait, the TV industry isnt in trouble. They have protections. A little thing called the FCC makes TV stations a license to print money. I wonder how WXYZ would do if the government allowed free competition in broadcasting.

Care to answer that you dirty fucking rat?

 

Hey J, why don't you take a deep breath and drop the personal attacks...I'm here, I'm answering all sorts of questions, but, hey, a little mutual respect, eh? Can't you disagree without being disagreeable?

[dark270]

You don't get it, do you?

 

This guy is making EVERYONE look bad. Not just the execs.

 

All in the name of some ratings.

he's an ambulance chaser trying to get ratings.

 

Don't think for a second that he actually gives a crap about you. If he did his expose would be about the Japanese government and US taxpayers propping up the Japanese carmakers. But he isnt, is he? Because that doesnt drive ratings as high as making the US auto industry look like chimps.

 

 

just how was he hurting me ? i;m not the one flying to FL every weekend, in a company about to go belly up!!!!

 

 

WTF ???

 

you must be salary!

[Ovaltine]

I'm waiting to see that dirty fucking rat tell us what kind of perks the CEO of WXYZ gets.

Well? You dirty fucking rat, tell us what kind of perks YOUR boss gets. How about the CEO of the network itself? Care to tell us about that?

Oh wait, the TV industry isnt in trouble. They have protections. A little thing called the FCC makes TV stations a license to print money. I wonder how WXYZ would do if the government allowed free competition in broadcasting.

Care to answer that you dirty fucking rat?

 

Whenever I read his posts, I see this image in my mind for what J-150 must look like. B)

 

 

 

Seriously though, the last time I checked, the government DOES allow competition in broadcasting.... it's called C-A-B-L-E!

 

You ought to try it sometime!

 

I *hardly* watch ANYTHING on CBS, NBC, or ABC any more. They're just too #$%^# liberal for me.

 

 

-Ovaltine

[Len_A]

Whenever I read his posts, I see this image in my mind for what J-150 must look like. B)

 

 

 

Seriously though, the last time I checked, the government DOES allow competition in broadcasting.... it's called C-A-B-L-E!

 

You ought to try it sometime!

 

I *hardly* watch ANYTHING on CBS, NBC, or ABC any more. They're just too #$%^# liberal for me.

 

 

-Ovaltine

Then you're missing some good stuff. Broadcast networks have a few good shows, as does cable.

[NoMoVisteon]

The UAW has opened their contracts in recent months and given health care concessions, allowed more plant closings, and other givebacks at the plant level in the form of COA's. When is management going to do the same?

I have my answer to that one, Pioneer, they(management)WON"T!!! Simple as that. Just my thoughts after seeing that WXYZ Ch-7 report by Steve Wilson. Now here's another question that I have not heard anything about at all, what does the UAW International have to say about Steve Wilson's report? You'd think they would be raising all kinds of fucking hell wouldn't you? Back a few decades ago, the union would be in lock n' load mode...................... :gang: :slug:

[NoMoVisteon]

Gawd, have I done such a poor job making this clear, or are there just some blinded by loyalty, or something else, that just totally blocks their view of reality?

 

What I exposed: Executives of a corporation in serious trouble--some say on the verge of bankruotcy--asking workers for givebacks and extreme sacrifice on the promise that EVERYBODY is going to share the sacrifice, top to bottom. Instead, they accept the givebacks and quietly fail to keep their promise that it will no longer be "business as usual."

 

Is it enough to save Ford? Of course not! Given the billions the company is losing, it may well be a drop in the bucket. But it is also powerful symbolism and perhaps a guage of the credidibility of management who believes it isn't terribly important whether or not they actually do what they say. How they respond when asked--especially if THEY believe they are doing nothing at all improper--might be another indication of something, or not.

 

Look, for one last time, I'm not on any crusade here other than to simply report what you'd never hear from the Ford p-r team. How you value or use that information, if at all, is entirely up to you. If what they've been found doing (while saying the opposite) means nothing to you because they're somehow "entitled," then fine...and I fully respect your view in this regard. My job is to find the truth and tell it as accurately and fair as I can.

 

On the other hand, if you're asked for more givebacks based on more promises--and Ford has said more givebacks will be requested in the near future--knowing the level of credibility of those doing the asking might be something that could help guide you the next time you or your union asks you to sacrifice just a little more.

I have to say as a former lifelong Detroit area resident now down here in the Cleveland area, your report was an eye opener. Funny thing, I have not come across any info about this topic on any of the local news media at all, but I could be wrong. Just saying. The only way I got to find this out was being here on the BON and by a forwarded link too. As for the Ford P-R team, you are no different when it comes to getting info on things you should know, that goes for the local plant levels too on a daily basis. Nothing new there. As for my thoughts, whether anyone out here wants to believe it or not, Ford couldn't give a shit about any of us, they are going to do what they are going to do, period. And it doesn't matter whether they have a contract with us as UAW members or not too. We know that too. Now that you have opened your report on this, Steve, just out of curiousity, I wonder the public's reaction is to this. Just asking. If you can't tell it, I understand. GREAT JOB, Steve.

[Len_A]

I have my answer to that one, Pioneer, they(management)WON"T!!! Simple as that. Just my thoughts after seeing that WXYZ Ch-7 report by Steve Wilson. Now here's another question that I have not heard anything about at all, what does the UAW International have to say about Steve Wilson's report? You'd think they would be raising all kinds of fucking hell wouldn't you? Back a few decades ago, the union would be in lock n' load mode...................... :gang: :slug:

So, someone besides me noticed that the UAW has been silent on this issue. Well, don't be surprised. The days of "lock n' load mode" and "raising all kinds of fucking hell" are history. What the hell is the union going to do, threaten a strike when the contract comes up? I know Steve Wilson posted about questioning the credibility of those at the top, especially when they start demanding givebacks, but what exactly do you think can be done about this? It's not like Ford has this huge share of the market. Sales, and profits (or lack of profits) suck. What's the union going to do, dig in their heels and refuse any more givebacks? Sure. Then if profits don't improve, Wall Street will continue to make the financial markets miserable for Ford, and the help contribute to the red ink. Ford's bonds are already well into the junk grade as it is.

 

 

 

Besides, I think the union wants any scrutiny anyway. I'll be really surprised if the International says one word on this. The story is already dieing. Neither of the Detroit papers, none of Detroits other TV stations, nor this weeks Automotive News, nor the financial papers like the Wall Street Journal picked this story up.

 

 

 

I have to say as a former lifelong Detroit area resident now down here in the Cleveland area, your report was an eye opener. Funny thing, I have not come across any info about this topic on any of the local news media at all, but I could be wrong. Just saying. The only way I got to find this out was being here on the BON and by a forwarded link too. As for the Ford P-R team, you are no different when it comes to getting info on things you should know, that goes for the local plant levels too on a daily basis. Nothing new there. As for my thoughts, whether anyone out here wants to believe it or not, Ford couldn't give a shit about any of us, they are going to do what they are going to do, period. And it doesn't matter whether they have a contract with us as UAW members or not too. We know that too. Now that you have opened your report on this, Steve, just out of curiousity, I wonder the public's reaction is to this. Just asking. If you can't tell it, I understand. GREAT JOB, Steve.

Publics reaction that I've seen is "Who cares?". Like I posted, I haven't seen any other news outlet or printed media pick this story up. I think the public is indifferent, and already expects company execs to live high off the hog, so why would this story be a surprise? I think the whole topic is a waste of time, and actually, in a way, old news. If you Google "Ford Execs Use Company Planes", one of the first hits you get is from October of 2005, a Wall Street jourrnal article that got placed in their CareerJournal OnLine section, about execs using company planes for personal business, link here: CareerJournal | Company Planes Are Used As CEOs' Private Golf Shuttles Detroit's execs don't get mentioned, but you see how common a practice this is. You expect the public to be shocked or the union to say anything about a standard business practice?

 

 

This topic is really old news - why would the public give a shit?

Edited November 20, 2006 by Len_A

[Pit stop]

So, someone besides me noticed that the UAW has been silent on this issue. Well, don't be surprised. The days of "lock n' load mode" and "raising all kinds of fucking hell" are history. What the hell is the union going to do, threaten a strike when the contract comes up? I know Steve Wilson posted about questioning the credibility of those at the top, especially when they start demanding givebacks, but what exactly do you think can be done about this? It's not like Ford has this huge share of the market. Sales, and profits (or lack of profits) suck. What's the union going to do, dig in their heels and refuse any more givebacks? Sure. Then if profits don't improve, Wall Street will continue to make the financial markets miserable for Ford, and the help contribute to the red ink. Ford's bonds are already well into the junk grade as it is.

Besides, I think the union wants any scrutiny anyway. I'll be really surprised if the International says one word on this. The story is already dieing. Neither of the Detroit papers, none of Detroits other TV stations, nor this weeks Automotive News, nor the financial papers like the Wall Street Journal picked this story up.

Publics reaction that I've seen is "Who cares?". Like I posted, I haven't seen any other news outlet or printed media pick this story up. I think the public is indifferent, and already expects company execs to live high off the hog, so why would this story be a surprise? I think the whole topic is a waste of time, and actually, in a way, old news. If you Google "Ford Execs Use Company Planes", one of the first hits you get is from October of 2005, a Wall Street jourrnal article that got placed in their CareerJournal OnLine section, about execs using company planes for personal business, link here: CareerJournal | Company Planes Are Used As CEOs' Private Golf Shuttles Detroit's execs don't get mentioned, but you see how common a practice this is. You expect the public to be shocked or the union to say anything about a standard business practice?

 

 

This topic is really old news - why would the public give a shit?

I give a shit, my spouse gives a shit, my brother in law that worked at delphi until he took a buyout gives a shit, my mother and father (retired GM) give a shit, the people I owe money too give a shit and my children ALL give a shit

The story is far from dead even though you want it to be

[J-150]

I give a shit, my spouse gives a shit, my brother in law that worked at delphi until he took a buyout gives a shit, my mother and father (retired GM) give a shit, the people I owe money too give a shit and my children ALL give a shit

The story is far from dead even though you want it to be

 

 

 

this isn't a case of wanting it to go away.

 

Its about accepting that nothing we do can change it. CEOs at all Fortune 500 companies have the same deal. Ford is no different.

 

What I care about is that this kind of ambulance chasing "journalism" is just out to make the entire American auto industry look like chimps. You think just Bill, Alan and Marky Mark look foolish with this report? Guess again.

 

This makes Toyota look even more like a saint that can do no wrong. Great. Just what Ford and GM needed right now. A news piece that makes the Japanese look great.

[Pit stop]

this isn't a case of wanting it to go away.

 

Its about accepting that nothing we do can change it. CEOs at all Fortune 500 companies have the same deal. Ford is no different.

 

What I care about is that this kind of ambulance chasing "journalism" is just out to make the entire American auto industry look like chimps. You think just Bill, Alan and Marky Mark look foolish with this report? Guess again.

 

This makes Toyota look even more like a saint that can do no wrong. Great. Just what Ford and GM needed right now. A news piece that makes the Japanese look great.

What every hourly needs right now .... to be able to make lifetime decisions.....based on all the facts ......is the truth....not only about hourly abuses, international abuses and executive alike.

People need to know the truth!! And who cares what it looks like........ beside FO MO CO

[Len_A]

What every hourly needs right now .... to be able to make lifetime decisions.....based on all the facts ......is the truth....not only about hourly abuses, international abuses and executive alike.

People need to know the truth!! And who cares what it looks like........ beside FO MO CO

I think J-150 is saying this makes Ford look bad to potential car buyers, and it's another way that makes Toyota look like the auto company that can do no wrong.

 

 

 

Here's a "fact" that you should consider in making your decisions: whether any of us like it or not, the execs will always be well taken care of, no matter how crappy things get for us. You guys are seeing the brunt of this now. As a vendor, I've been going through this for over a decade.

 

 

 

Another fact: This bullshit story, and it is bullshit, is marketplace economics. Nothing more, nothing less. Get over it.

 

 

 

I give a shit, my spouse gives a shit, my brother in law that worked at delphi until he took a buyout gives a shit, my mother and father (retired GM) give a shit, the people I owe money too give a shit and my children ALL give a shit

The story is far from dead even though you want it to be

The story is dieing on the vine. Your brother-in-law worked for Delphi? The UAW went in to bankruptcy court, and objected up one side and down the other over executive compensation packages, including retention bonuses. Delphi's response was "We need to do this to attract and retain executive talent.' Sound a lot like what Ford's PR department told Steve Wilson? The bankruptcy court, which has held off ditching the unions contract, agreed on this point with Delphi management.

 

 

 

This is a standard business practice and the fucking story is a non-issue and a nonevent. Period.

Edited November 20, 2006 by Len_A

[NoMoVisteon]

I think J-150 is saying this makes Ford look bad to potential car buyers, and it's another way that makes Toyota look like the auto company that can do no wrong.

 

 

 

Here's a "fact" that you should consider in making your decisions: whether any of us like it or not, the execs will always be well taken care of, no matter how crappy things get for us. You guys are seeing the brunt of this now. As a vendor, I've been going through this for over a decade.

 

 

 

Another fact: This bullshit story, and it is bullshit, is marketplace economics. Nothing more, nothing less. Get over it.

The story is dieing on the vine. Your brother-in-law worked for Delphi? The UAW went in to bankruptcy court, and objected up one side and down the other over executive compensation packages, including retention bonuses. Delphi's response was "We need to do this to attract and retain executive talent.' Sound a lot like what Ford's PR department told Steve Wilson? The bankruptcy court, which has held off ditching the unions contract, agreed on this point with Delphi management.

 

 

 

This is a standard business practice and the fucking story is a non-issue and a nonevent. Period.

You have brought up some good points, Len, and for the most part, that's reality. I do however think that Steve Wilson was in his rights to do what he did, though. Being that you are a vendor, you know how shitty and sometimes unethical business practices can be, especially if you are one of the parties getting shit on. As for the union not moving at all on a previous post, no surprise there. All one has to do is look at the concessions and givebacks we have done at Ford, on the present contract. When the contract expires next Sept, my guess is that the guillatine blade is going to drop BIG TIME. By then, I won't be there, hopefully early retired as of Jan 1, 2007. Just waiting for them to confirm that and NoMo here will be gone............

Edited November 21, 2006 by NoMoVisteon

[fishinguy]

I have my answer to that one, Pioneer, they(management)WON"T!!! Simple as that. Just my thoughts after seeing that WXYZ Ch-7 report by Steve Wilson. Now here's another question that I have not heard anything about at all, what does the UAW International have to say about Steve Wilson's report? You'd think they would be raising all kinds of fucking hell wouldn't you? Back a few decades ago, the union would be in lock n' load mode...................... :gang: :slug:

 

 

You said it............"A few DECADES ago they would have.............thats 30 tears ago... (I meen years ago)

[plan b]

Then you're missing some good stuff. Broadcast networks have a few good shows, as does cable.

 

Cable sucks ass, satellite all the way.

[xr7g428]

Can't you guys figure this out? This is red herring, and you have been had.

 

Quotes from Steves own story:

 

To be clear, Fields weekly commute flights to Florida are permitted by his employment contract

 

... the free flights are part of his compensation package, written into his employment contract, and part of a Ford policy designed to attract, motivate and retain key leadership talent.

The use of the plane is in Fields contract. It is a part of his compensation. He could have asked for more money and flown commercial. (If Ford would even allow it.) He could have asked for an allowance for a second household in Michigan. He could have asked for extra donuts... It is between Ford and Mr. Fields.

 

Steve Wilson knows this. If he had written that Fields was over compensated, that would be one thing, HIS OPINION. And nobody would have cared.

 

But he didn't do that, instead he chose to present two unrelated facts in such a way as to spool up the auto workers. He spun up a story that equated the cost of air travel to the lost wages of a Ford hourly employee. The idea was to make you guys feel cheated. Seems like it worked.

 

At any rate, it certainly could be the cost of one worker’s job every week Fields flies home.

 

So lets say that you spend some of your earnings on a boat. In Steve's world, he could write a story that you were wasting Ford money on weekend boat trips. I mean after all, if you can afford a boat, you must be over paid.

 

By the way, benefits like this are taxable, it is just a part of his total compensation package.

 

The reason that no one else is picking this up is because there is no story.

Edited November 21, 2006 by xr7g428

[xr7g428]

Pioneer, I will try to make it a little more simple. If a company gave you a company car and a gas credit card, and told you to use it for what ever purpose you wished, and of course added the value of the car to your W2, it would be a really attractive piece of your compensation. You would not have to buy a car. Fields doesn't need to buy a plane.

 

I could have used a more clear example, but the point is, all Steve Wilson cared about was creating a sensational news report. He succeeded.

[NoMoVisteon]

You said it............"A few DECADES ago they would have.............thats 30 tears ago... (I meen years ago)

You got that right about "30 Tears Ago". Back then a Union WAS a union. Today? What? Where? I sure don't see it now, it's just a shadow of what it once WAS............... :fan: :heartbreaker: :beatdeadhorse: Yeah, I know, I going to get flamed for saying it, but it's hard to ignore the truth and one other thing, being I've been a long time unionized Ford employee, don't think it doesn't hurt to see this today, it does.

[WixomRealityCheck]

Are you seriously comparing a car and a gas card, with a private Lear jet and a flight crew? That must be one hell of a car if it costs upward of $70,000 a week.

 

Oh wait a minute. I forgot the gas card. Maybe it will compare if he fills it up with premium. :rolleyes:

[triton-boy]

as someone who had 35 years in at the company i can see no good coming out of this article.if anything its insulting.not every one is a screw up at fords the majority of us are hard working GOD fearing people but you made us all look like dirt bags. any where you go in any job you will get cling-ons low lifes that live off honest people but remember this what you do..........say... and live will bite you on the ass 7 fold...........but this article does nothing but cause pain for the majority of folks that have honest values working for fords.....but builts channel 7 ratings up,,,

[xr7g428]

Are you seriously comparing a car and a gas card, with a private Lear jet and a flight crew? That must be one hell of a car if it costs upward of $70,000 a week.

 

Oh wait a minute. I forgot the gas card. Maybe it will compare if he fills it up with premium. :rolleyes:

 

Yes premium... LOL!

 

It is also surprising that no one has questioned the math... According to the article, the total for all Ford executives that receive this form of COMPENSATION is around $700,000. This would amount to only ten of these $70K trips.... Not to mention the fact that there are at least two others (Bill Ford and Allen Mullaly) also using these planes.

 

A quick Google search shows that RENTAL (more expensive that ownership) of a fueled equipped, and crewed large private jet would be in the $4000 per hour range. Please note that there is no dead head charge, so there is no additional cost for the crew to hang around. Now think clearly, what is the most expensive hotel room per night? $2000 night? Do the math, you still can't make it all add up to $70K. He just picked the number to make it hit home... Pure sensationalism.

 

I am really sorry that he did this. He created a lot of pain for absolutely no gain, other than a boost in the ratings at your expense. If you want to know who cheated you, take a look at Steve...

[Len_A]

Yes premium... LOL!

 

It is also surprising that no one has questioned the math... According to the article, the total for all Ford executives that receive this form of COMPENSATION is around $700,000. This would amount to only ten of these $70K trips.... Not to mention the fact that there are at least two others (Bill Ford and Allen Mullaly) also using these planes.

 

A quick Google search shows that RENTAL (more expensive that ownership) of a fueled equipped, and crewed large private jet would be in the $4000 per hour range. Please note that there is no dead head charge, so there is no additional cost for the crew to hang around. Now think clearly, what is the most expensive hotel room per night? $2000 night? Do the math, you still can't make it all add up to $70K. He just picked the number to make it hit home... Pure sensationalism.

 

I am really sorry that he did this. He created a lot of pain for absolutely no gain, other than a boost in the ratings at your expense. If you want to know who cheated you, take a look at Steve...

well said. Not to mention that this is a very common perk for executives: CareerJournal | Company Planes Are Used As CEOs' Private Golf Shuttles - note that the date of this story (bottom of the page) is from October of LAST YEAR.

 

Steve Wilson's story is a lot of noise about nothing.

Edited November 21, 2006 by Len_A